Achlevius Posted October 3, 2022 Share Posted October 3, 2022 10 hours ago, (NSW)AegisFifi said: This proves that from the very beginning the AoE fits better the game and make farm/grind easier. I'm not disputing that it makes it easier; I'm disputing that it makes it faster. 10 hours ago, (NSW)AegisFifi said: Some people can have fun with, but a great number will use the META only for its efficiency. If the meta isn't fun, then why are so many upset at its shake-up? 10 hours ago, (NSW)AegisFifi said: Amesha is the most OP archwing ever Players keep saying this, but I'm not sure I understand why. Outside of its use in Thermia Farming, what is so OP about the Amesha? What content does it trivialize? 10 hours ago, (NSW)AegisFifi said: I don't think the Devs nerf stuff when they get popular or fun. ... Rubico Prime is much more used than many AoE weapons (Eidolon hunts are the reason) and it never get nerfed : curiously, nobody see the overuse of Rubico Prime on Eidolon hunts as a problem... I'm genuinely confused as to the argument you are making here. You say devs don't (necessarily?) nerf stuff when they become popular, but then you lament that a bunch of popular metas have been untouched. Why would you expect the devs to nerf the Rubico / Volt if "devs don't nerf popular stuff"? 10 hours ago, (NSW)AegisFifi said: A group ? What for ? A single AoE does it better. This is one point I will grant you: doing solo Disruption with an AoE and activating 3 - 4 nodes at the same time definitely requires MORE effort and engagement than playing in a group... 😅 ...Which is why I find it weird that you bring it up in the context of "AoE is necessary to make grinds easier / faster". 10 hours ago, (NSW)AegisFifi said: And the great grinders want the relics for them, not for the others. ...But everyone gets the relic at the end of a round. I don't understand why this point was even thrown in, unless you are intentionally trying to make it sound like "great grinders" are a bunch of selfish a******s. 😅 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skaleek Posted October 3, 2022 Share Posted October 3, 2022 On 2022-10-01 at 8:30 AM, EDM774 said: In all the years of this game's life it's been a repeating cycle over and over again. This is so painfully true of Warframe. In more than just the buff/nerf cycles. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zimzala Posted October 3, 2022 Share Posted October 3, 2022 10 hours ago, Achlevius said: On the other hand, they did just that when they fixed Styanax's Final Stand a week after release, and a ton of players complained. It seems like the devs will get hate no matter what they do. 😅 To me, this is the primary reason all of the discussion and argument that occurs on these forums is just noise from the people that like to talk about things and has no real bearing on what the direction the game actually takes. DE will do what DE does, using stats from the game, tea leaves, twitter and YT talking heads, possibly the occasional sacrificed goat or chicken, etc., make a change, and then get lambasted by the masses that love to complain, no matter what DE does or does not do. Trying to say this or that is the reason people complain and leave is silly, because no matter DE does or does not do, people complain and leave and the forums just have more or less noise based on how long ago a change was mode, it has very little to do, ever, with how the changes actually impact the game. Been watching this cycle on game forums for two decades. It's THE reason I do not argue about the minutiae of the numerical changes made in these games and stick to the outlooks and motives of those trying to tell others how to play games, because the noise just keeps on coming, no matter what, no matter the changes. IMO, after all the angst, hate, and temper tantrums thrown, it's a primary driver for me to never get into creating computer games, even though the opportunity has been there, it's just easier to deal with code gamers don't really see. I don't envy game makers, and I think they are saints for putting up with what they do from their self-described 'faithful customer base' and yet still keep making games for us to play. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
(XBOX)zThulsaDoomz Posted October 3, 2022 Share Posted October 3, 2022 On 2022-10-02 at 1:44 AM, Marvelous_A said: Have some players been sleeping under a rock for the past 9 years when DE killed and changed meta multiple times? Not the first time AoE took a major hit and it isn't even the worst time AoE has ever been. Say it again for the people in the back Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
(PSN)GEN-Son_17 Posted October 3, 2022 Share Posted October 3, 2022 5 hours ago, Drachnyn said: Ah so when attenuation fails to do what it is designed to achieve then you like it. Hmmmm, I'm sure people one shotting archons with a kuva hek dont mind it all that much either. But those are where the system fails to do what it is meant to do. At a fundamental level it tries to invalidate modding. And that's bad for a game all about modding. No, I learned and adapted to attenuation and patiently began to time my shots. My high fire rate, phase kitgun also did a great job taking out Nira. When the damage numbers began to dwindle too much, I simply stopped shooting, checked on the team's health (I use Vazarin), repositioned myself and then began blasting again when the attenuation dropped. It's just a little puzzle to solve in a boss fight dude. I don't have to like, love or hate it. I just need to learn how to overcome it. I'm not understanding why that is so hard. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mieo_Mio Posted October 4, 2022 Share Posted October 4, 2022 Trying to create engagement to keep the company not only alive but profitable on a shifting platform where constant content is undeniably king, I can see how it takes it's toll. How many adjustment knobs does DE have at it's disposal? How many staff members have access to those controls? I suppose we could all guess, and I'm willing to wager we'll all guess too low on all counts. Playing Jenga on a subway comes to mind. Trying to out guess DE when we don't have the facts is a waste of time. If you're tired of playing on a shifting platform, take a break for a while. While it may be disguised with modding with Loki, this post feels like hypertext AoE ranting. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
(PSN)Cargan2016 Posted October 4, 2022 Share Posted October 4, 2022 12 hours ago, Maen3 said: ST weapons will never be a viable alternative unless every AOE weapon is useless, Completely wrong My Felarx and Latum both put most of my AOE weapons to shame and i have them all min maxed as well as i can without spending a ludicrus ammount of plat on a riven. I can last a full hour and half longer on SP survivial with either of those than I can with the best AOE weapons in game Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AegidiusF Posted October 4, 2022 Share Posted October 4, 2022 Il y a 13 heures, Achlevius a dit : If the meta isn't fun, then why are so many upset at its shake-up? Because of the META problems present on many games and Pablo made a Tweet about that these days : players tend to get the stuff that let them be the most effective in the game, no matter if it's fun or not. They no more play a game, but they get a second work. This is something more present on F2P games, but it's a widespread phenomenon. The causes of this META "disease" are not very well known, but it's perhaps the competition, or perhaps the will to be on the top tier player. People were upset because they were not more efficient : it was like losing a job for some players, : everyday, almost like an obligation, they farmed, thay played, they tried to get stuff and now their method is just gone. For others it was like if your boss changed your main work software and now you have to adapt to the new one. Il y a 13 heures, Achlevius a dit : Players keep saying this, but I'm not sure I understand why. Outside of its use in Thermia Farming, what is so OP about the Amesha? What content does it trivialize? This Archwing has a huge CC, anti-status, damage to energy conversion (like a innate Hunter Adrenaline), healing abilities negating damage inside its CC area. With Amesha you can easily finish every single archwing mission (damage will come from other OP Archguns, like the Larkspur or another one). It's often used on Eidolon hunts to negate the Eidolon magnetic wave (no more need of Arcane Nullifier) and heal the lures (no more need of a healing frame or of Vazarin focus). Great protection and survivability for the whole squad on Eidolon hunts (even to the lures). Il y a 13 heures, Achlevius a dit : I'm genuinely confused as to the argument you are making here. You say devs don't (necessarily?) nerf stuff when they become popular, but then you lament that a bunch of popular metas have been untouched. Why would you expect the devs to nerf the Rubico / Volt if "devs don't nerf popular stuff"? What I wanted to say is that it's not because of "popular or fun" in itself, but because of the impact that it has on the game. Volt is very popular, but he is very used for Eidolon Hunts, not for Grind/Farm (I used him like that though, and it's possible to use Volt to quickly complete relic runs). I don't expect the Devs to nerf Volt or Rubico (in general, I'm always against nerfs, there are only a very few exceptions that are more a slight balance than a nerf) : I just said that they are very used, and they are not going to get nerfed. AoE -> popular -> nerfed Volt (and Rubico) -> popular -> not nerfed Ember -> popular -> nerfed Nyx -> not popular -> nerfed Trinity -> not popular -> nerfed Being popular does not really mean that the weapon or warframe will get nerfed, it depends on the way that spectific weapon or warframe affects the game. Il y a 14 heures, Achlevius a dit : This is one point I will grant you: doing solo Disruption with an AoE and activating 3 - 4 nodes at the same time definitely requires MORE effort and engagement than playing in a group... 😅 ...Which is why I find it weird that you bring it up in the context of "AoE is necessary to make grinds easier / faster". I find it much easier : you activate some conduits, you let them get destroyed (depending on the rotation you want) and you deal with the only one that matters (usually the one tied to the "energy drain debuff) with AoE (just one shot). And AoE makes key frop faster, you don't even need to search for the heavy unit (or other key holder), just fire at the mobs. Il y a 14 heures, Achlevius a dit : ...But everyone gets the relic at the end of a round. I don't understand why this point was even thrown in, unless you are intentionally trying to make it sound like "great grinders" are a bunch of selfish a******s. 😅 Everyone gets the relic, if you are in a squad. Many grinders don't play on squads (at least not on open squads). They play solo or, if they accept a squad, it is composed by clan mates or friends. They are not selfish : most of the time they are people that do not put money inte the game, so their only way to get plat is selling things : if they get other players with them, they will give for free the parts they are searching for. Trading is part of the game and players that use the META to farm and get plat are OK. They spend a lot of time in the game to farm/grind for others : like I said before, it's like their work and you don't give the fruit of your labor for free. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maen3 Posted October 4, 2022 Share Posted October 4, 2022 5 hours ago, (PSN)Cargan2016 said: Completely wrong My Felarx and Latum both put most of my AOE weapons to shame and i have them all min maxed as well as i can without spending a ludicrus ammount of plat on a riven. I can last a full hour and half longer on SP survivial with either of those than I can with the best AOE weapons in game The laetum has a small aoe effect, and in my experience the vast majority of warframe players rarely if ever go past 20-30 min in endless modes. Try telling warframe players that ST weapons shine(at least a few of the top ones) when you stay for a few hours in SP survival. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
(PSN)Cargan2016 Posted October 4, 2022 Share Posted October 4, 2022 5 hours ago, Maen3 said: The laetum has a small aoe effect, and in my experience the vast majority of warframe players rarely if ever go past 20-30 min in endless modes. Try telling warframe players that ST weapons shine(at least a few of the top ones) when you stay for a few hours in SP survival. not really big enough to really be called aoe its not big enough to hit mulitple targets its just enough to still it if miss by inch or so byt hit ground right next to target and only in incarnen mode. its still effectively a ST weapon even then Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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