Strun headshots inconsistent for Incarnon conditions [resolved probably]

[Tiltskillet]

[edit: see my second post.  It's not a Strun problem, it's just the way the game handles multishot.]

Anybody have intermittent issues getting Strun's Incarnon meter filled up?  According to the wiki, it only requires 20 headshots, which does count individual pellets.  I've got 45 multi at base, 60 once Galvanized Hell stacks are up.  In the Simulacrum it's easy to get a full meter with one shot and it never takes more than two.  Out in the wild, the majority of the time it's just as easy.  But sometimes, even with enemies  locked into place for clear headshots with Condemn, the meter will barely move on each trigger pull. 

Strun P is fairly accurate for a shotgun, but no doubt some pellets are missing heads even close-up.  Still, I expect more than one or two hits with each shot.  My accuracy isn't that bad. :P   And like I said, it's really easy

I've got no trouble activating Deadhead or Consequence with the weapon.  Just Incarnon, and that only sometimes.

Anyone have similar experiences?

Edited June 12, 2023 by Tiltskillet

[Ryme]

Are you playing solo or coop? If you're playing with others, it could be due to a poor connection to the host. I've often noticed bad hit registration when playing with a bad host connection.

[Tiltskillet]

Welp, think I already figured it out, lol.   I forgot that Warframe actually handles multishot damage instances consecutively rather than simultaneously.    So when I'm hitting strong enemies, more pellets have a chance to register.  When I'm hitting weak enemies, they might die from only one pellet in the extreme case, with the rest never registering.  Which means only one Incarnon charge.

[Tiltskillet]

3 minutes ago, Ryme said:

Are you playing solo or coop? If you're playing with others, it could be due to a poor connection to the host. I've often noticed bad hit registration when playing with a bad host connection.

A client-host issue was my first thought, but I've seen it happen plenty solo.  No, it's just the way the game handles multi.  See my second post above...

[(PSN)haphazardlynamed]

4 minutes ago, Tiltskillet said:

Welp, think I already figured it out, lol.   I forgot that Warframe actually handles multishot damage instances consecutively rather than simultaneously.    So when I'm hitting strong enemies, more pellets have a chance to register.  When I'm hitting weak enemies, they might die from only one pellet in the extreme case, with the rest never registering.  Which means only one Incarnon charge.

I Suspect

that if you're Client, it counts them consecutively

but if you're Host, it counts them simultaneously

 

vs Weak Enemies, my incarnon gauge fills up much faster if I'm Host.

(and similarly the buff meters for things like Knell, Arca Scisco) -much more obvious on these, since rather than an analog gauge they actually have 3 tick marks

 

So, I'd call it a long running glitch. Host/Client should be fixed to evaluate multi pellets the same way.

[CosoMalvadoNG]

hace 1 hora, Tiltskillet dijo:

Anybody have intermittent issues getting Strun's Incarnon meter filled up?  According to the wiki, it only requires 20 headshots, which does count individual pellets.  I've got 45 multi at base, 60 once Galvanized Hell stacks are up.  In the Simulacrum it's easy to get a full meter with one shot and it never takes more than two.  Out in the wild, the majority of the time it's just as easy.  But sometimes, even with enemies  locked into place for clear headshots with Condemn, the meter will barely move on each trigger pull. 

Strun P is fairly accurate for a shotgun, but no doubt some pellets are missing heads even close-up.  Still, I expect more than one or two hits with each shot.  My accuracy isn't that bad. :P   And like I said, it's really easy

I've got no trouble activating Deadhead or Consequence with the weapon.  Just Incarnon, and that only sometimes.

Anyone have similar experiences?

It's weird but it's easy.  You just need to place the pointer in a certain position where only 3-5 pellet hit the head.


 

 

Edited June 9, 2023 by CosoMalvadoNG

[Tiltskillet]

4 hours ago, (PSN)haphazardlynamed said:

I Suspect

that if you're Client, it counts them consecutively

but if you're Host, it counts them simultaneously

 

vs Weak Enemies, my incarnon gauge fills up much faster if I'm Host.

(and similarly the buff meters for things like Knell, Arca Scisco) -much more obvious on these, since rather than an analog gauge they actually have 3 tick marks

 

So, I'd call it a long running glitch. Host/Client should be fixed to evaluate multi pellets the same way.

If there's a difference between host and client, it's too subtle for me to tell.  I do know I'm experiencing the issue both in squad and solo.   Less often in SP, more often in sorties, and most often in some low level syndicate alerts I do.    The last are always solo, so naturally as client.

I'm quite satisfied that in the Sim, the game is not dealing with multishot simultaneously.   If I set the enemy level low there, not only does the Incarnon meter fill very slowly, but I'll only see 1-4 damage popups on an enemy killed by one trigger pull, rather than the dozens of popups that I'll get with  a less modded Strun on a higher level enemy.

[baked]

5 hours ago, Tiltskillet said:

The last are always solo, so naturally as client.

Host?

[Tiltskillet]

1 hour ago, baked said:

Host?

Yah, that.

[(PSN)Joylesstuna]

This still hasn't been addressed and is a huge annoyance if not on sp. I could be wrong but it seems if the target dies, one pellet or two fills incarnon meter instead of all pellets hence why this is less of an issue on sp.

[Tiltskillet]

22 hours ago, (PSN)Joylesstuna said:

This still hasn't been addressed and is a huge annoyance if not on sp. I could be wrong but it seems if the target dies, one pellet or two fills incarnon meter instead of all pellets hence why this is less of an issue on sp.

It would surprise me if it does get addressed soon, if it ever does.  It's been the way multishot has worked probably forever, and at least since I started paying attention to game mechanics.  It's just not relevant 99% of the time.

The reason I became aware of it in the first place (before forgetting about it again) was because of inconsistent stealth affinity bonuses.   For a while I even  had a few stealth affinity spec'd  ranged weapons without multishot to get around the issue. 

 

[(PSN)Joylesstuna]

1 hour ago, Tiltskillet said:

It would surprise me if it does get addressed soon, if it ever does.  It's been the way multishot has worked probably forever, and at least since I started paying attention to game mechanics.  It's just not relevant 99% of the time.

The reason I became aware of it in the first place (before forgetting about it again) was because of inconsistent stealth affinity bonuses.   For a while I even  had a few stealth affinity spec'd  ranged weapons without multishot to get around the issue. 

 

Felarx doesn't have the same issue despite being a shotgun too so not sure it's just the way multishot is.

[Tiltskillet]

10 minutes ago, (PSN)Joylesstuna said:

Felarx doesn't have the same issue . . .

Looks like it does.  In the Sim against level 185 gunners a Hell's Chamber VArm build with lots of damage needs 3 shots to fill the meter.  Against level 10 it barely moves. 

[(PSN)Joylesstuna]

44 minutes ago, Tiltskillet said:

Looks like it does.  In the Sim against level 185 gunners a Hell's Chamber VArm build with lots of damage needs 3 shots to fill the meter.  Against level 10 it barely moves. 

I just tested it on mercury and I stand corrected, you are right.

[Tiltskillet]

16 minutes ago, (PSN)Joylesstuna said:

I just tested it on mercury and I stand corrected, you are right.

Cool,  it's good to check in mission too. 

I didn't mention it, but I also checked the stealth affinity thing earlier, 0 multi Daikyu vs  ridiculous ~60 multi Twin Rogga.  Both one shot everything, but the Daikyu had no trouble getting and building the affinity buff, and the Rogga was pretty hopeless at it.  Even though it has about 4x the damage up close.

[(PSN)FunyFlyBoy]

I had notice this issue and chalked it up to a stray bullet hitting the shoulder, or body instead of the head when going against the small fry. It sucks, is what it is. Usually end up running my Dual Toxocyst instead for low maps/sortie over my Strun Prime. 

Edited June 12, 2023 by (PSN)FunyFlyBoy

[Vryheid]

This issue affects all multishot incarnon weapons, not just the Strun. Super weak enemies in general are a huge pain to build up the incarnon meter on because you're never getting more than one multi-shot projectile at a time to count. Part of why I generally don't bother with incarnon weapons in anything outside of steel path or high level Zariman content is because you end up wasting so much time trying to set up an incarnon weapon that you'd do more damage just using a normal gun.