--collstro-- Posted January 10, 2014 Share Posted January 10, 2014 (edited) This letter is in no means speaking on behalf of all veteran players and not even all the veterans who I have been actively discussing these issues with over the past weeks. In time more of them will post their own letters outlying their concerns, but I assure you that many of the concerns listed below are shared by all.Grind and Drop RatesBeginning with Update 8 and the dojo resources, through the grind associated with obtaining the Burston Prime, (10 hours 50 minutes in my case,) and the yet too be obtained Detron, the grind in this game has increased to the point where even people such as myself who aren't opposed to grinding have already; or are very close to throwing in the towel. Your justification for encrypting the drop tables was that the codex would provide, in game what the data mined drop tables provided to players through third party websites. Sadly this is not the case.The codex does not tell us which mods drop from which survival or defense mission or from which tier or faction. Data mined information did. The codex does not tell us which void mission type and tier requires to be played to get each Prime component. Data mined information did. The codex does not provide drop rates for anything. Data mined information did.We require that you do as you said you would and have the codex provide us with the same information that was previously available to us. This way we can determine by the drop rates whether or not the item(s) we seek are worth the grind involved, and would permit the player base to give you feedback if it overwhelmingly believes the drop rates are too low. If you instist on maintaining that this game is still in Beta after you have over 4.5 million user accounts on PC alone, and have inked contracts with Sony, then treat us like Beta testers and give us enough information so we can give you informed feedbackSystemic ChangesSystemic changes like those to the damage and stamina systems need to be announced in detail prior to them being put into the game. This would have saved you from having to scramble to undo most of the changes to the stamina system when it was changed in ways no one in the player base expected and virtually no one likedWhen introducing systemic changes like those to mods, damage, stamina, credits and the upcoming melee system, please do not release them too early. Please wait until Q&A has had adequate time to test them to be certain that they function better than the existing systems they are to replace. Continued tweaking of new systems is to be expected, but having the new system not functioning at least as well as the one it replaces does not benefit anyone.LoreYou have been talking about adding lore into the game for nearly a year now. In the minds of most I've spoken to, 'lore' does not consist of stringing together a number of event descriptions and a couple of codex entries. Lore consists of a detailed and compelling story, whether it be a written story or a story campaign; of how the Tenno and their enemies (allies?) came to where we are now, and character development, so we are able to relate in some fashion to the characters we play as, and those who we fight againstCommunicationFor a studio who claims to want listen and talk to their players, evidenced by 1 to 2 live streams per week; we feel extremely underinformed when it comes to things like when the upcoming event will start and what the objectives of that event will be when it does. Cicero began at Midnight EST without any prior notice. For competitive players and clans this kind of lack of communication only fosters frustration and resentment towards DE when none need exist.Before you make sweeping changes to the game like removing Infested from the Star Chart or putting Mutagen Samples only in the Derelict Void, you need to communicate your plans to the player base in some detail before doing so.Patch notes need to be complete. At best they only contain 75% of the changes in each major patchWhen discussing or previewing new additions to the game on the forums or on a Live Stream, please only discuss things that are going to be added to the game in a timely manner, (e.g. within the next two updates,) otherwise don't discuss or preview them publicly until they are. It only fosters frustration and resentment by the player base when you preview something and 6, 8, 10 months later it has yet to be added to the game.EventsCompetitive events (i.e. those with leaderboards,) need to be announced and thoroughly described several days before they start, so competitive clans and players can be prepared.Competitive events need to last no longer than 3-4 days so the players who are competing don't risk their health by grinding too long. Individual rewards should require no more than 3 hours of game play during the event to qualify for, so that non-competitive players have ample time over the course of the event to play enough to receive them.End Game ContentAt this time the only end game content that exists in the game are Survival and Defense endurance missions lasting multiple hours where lag and drop in frame rate renders the game nearly unplayable. We need more challenging end game content that doesn't require sitting around for hours until it becomes challenging. I will leave it to others to outline what it could be, because I've heard many good ideas. But whatever it ends up being, something is desperately needed.Whatever that content may be, it must be rewarding, but not in a way that you have to complete it in order to obtain a reward that can only be obtained by completing it. (i.e. Don't make it yet another excruciating grind.)I write this letter because, I and many other veterans; some of whom have direct and regular contact with DE developers have repeatedly voiced our concerns on these issues, yet nothing has ever come of it. In fact, things have gotten worse than they were before.Many veteran players have already left, and many, many more are on the verge of leaving if these issues aren't finally addressed. And if you read this and are thinking 'good riddance, we don't need them anyway,' then you're sorely mistaken. It's the veterans who run prominent clans, and teach the newer players about game mechanics like mod fusion, (nothing in game does,) how to play and proper etiquette while playing, and a host of other things. And if you intend to keep this game alive you want to retain all the veterans you can, and have as many new players in this game play long enough that they too become veterans, since the longer someone plays, the more chances you have to get them to spend money.Thanks in advance for your time and consideration,--collstro-- (Co-Founder of clans 'Spectres N7' and 'X Spectres')________________________________________________________________The following veterans agree in part or in full with this letter, and have given their consent to be listed as co-signers.Knoth (Co-Founder of clan 'Spectres N7)Lynches (Warlord of clan 'Six Feet Under' and Co-Founder/Manager of www.OrokinTech.com ) https://forums.warframe.com/index.php?/topic/161764-an-open-letter-to-de-from-your-veterans-the-megathread/?p=1904556Rasputin29 (Warlord of clan 'Hattori') https://forums.warframe.com/index.php?/topic/161764-an-open-letter-to-de-from-your-veterans-the-megathread/?p=1911589-Bellum- (Overlord of clan 'Hattori')------Eliminator_One----- (Warlord of clan 'Iron Death Squad')Bishuu (Kill LeaderBoard veteran of clan 'FTG')Althix (Kill LeaderBoard veteran of clan 'Test Clan Please Ignore') https://forums.warframe.com/index.php?/topic/161764-an-open-letter-to-de-from-your-veterans-the-megathread/?p=1916159Redragon309 (Warlord of clans 'AsurO')Evangelyte (Warlord of clan 'Coup de Grace')SwaggerMeistress (Veteran player of clan 'Coup De Grace') https://forums.warframe.com/index.php?/topic/161764-an-open-letter-to-de-from-your-veterans-the-megathread/?p=1904993VegetableBasket (Overlord of clan 'Neuro')AceViper (Winner of the Gradivus Event)ThatDamnLobster (Warlord of clan 'Children of the Lotus')KvotheTheArcane1 (Veteran of clan 'The Praetorii') https://forums.warframe.com/index.php?/topic/161764-an-open-letter-to-de-from-your-veterans-the-megathread/?p=1916838Derclaw (Veteran player of clan 'DarkVector')10er (Warlord of clan '1 Man Army Clan Gizeh')911nsidejob (Co-Founder and Warlord of clan 'Dark Uprising')RevoThornax (Warlord of clan 'Tenno Inc.')Rottae (General of clan 'The Unstable Equation')Zeus154 (Unaffiliated) https://forums.warframe.com/index.php?/topic/161764-an-open-letter-to-de-from-your-veterans-the-megathread/?p=1916195Soulie (Co-Founder of clan 'X Spectres') https://forums.warframe.com/index.php?/topic/161764-an-open-letter-to-de-from-your-veterans-the-megathread/?p=1909369LadyScootaloo (Founder/Representative of clan 'CMC') https://forums.warframe.com/index.php?/topic/161764-an-open-letter-to-de-from-your-veterans-the-megathread/?p=1917093Kinjeto (Co-Leader of clan 'DoggHouse')GhostRider (General of clan 'Full Metal Shinobi' and long time veteran of the Kill LeaderBoard)Valiantz (Founder/Warlord of clan 'Full Metal Shinobi')BraveDude8 (General of clan 'Test Clan Please Ignore')Trainer772 (Kitty of clan 'Test Clan Please Ignore')TDUMP (Veteran player of clan 'Crescent Moon')Matto (Veteran player of clan 'Santaphrax Knights') https://forums.warframe.com/index.php?/topic/146359-de-disclose-the-rewards-now/Exie. (General of clan 'Cutie Mark Crusaders')FireEclipse (Veteran player of clan 'Whispering Tenno')Biquette (Veteran player of clan 'The Semi-Crispy')Nkomo-Sama (Veteran player and Warlord of clan 'Silent Shadow Clan')TDooG (Veteran player and Sage of clan 'Team Collosal')--LTDC--BadLucKWyvern-- (Warlord of clan 'Les Titans du Chaos')Takai (Sheriff of clan 'Lone Rangers') https://forums.warframe.com/index.php?/topic/161764-an-open-letter-to-de-from-your-veterans-the-megathread/?p=1935309RPilcrow (Warlord of clan 'Maximum Comfort')helix.hex (Information Pending)TheMalachai (Information Pending)VoidGhost (Information Pending)Gryphticon (Warlord of clan 'Gryphus Tech Corporation')HandsOfnArtist (Founder of clan 'ASCENDANCE') AngelGuardcc (Currently unaffiliated veteran player) HeadQuarters (WarMaster of clan 'Krov') https://forums.warframe.com/index.php?/topic/161764-an-open-letter-to-de-from-your-veterans-the-megathread/?p=2010320 Edited February 3, 2014 by --collstro-- Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iBread Posted January 10, 2014 Share Posted January 10, 2014 Worth the read...good post, sir Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
_Absolom_ Posted January 10, 2014 Share Posted January 10, 2014 You have a newbie veteran's +1 sir. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thecolin- Posted January 10, 2014 Share Posted January 10, 2014 This might be the first ever "long" post that I read on this forum. good post Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
buriburi Posted January 10, 2014 Share Posted January 10, 2014 (edited) I agree with collstro posts 100%. There is a lot of stuff which needs serious work. It has nothing to do with fun if you do a mission for 70+ times to just get a part to build it. I ran 70+ runs for the Glaive BP. The problem is that isn't the only part where you have to grind to your limits. The Detron is just another example of that. Trying to "summon" Harvester is a rare occasion AND the droprate is just ridicilous. From 30 encounters we got 3 BP's and one receiver. The droprate of dropping something is ridilousy low and the actual droprate is low as well. The fact that getting the parts for the gun is rly bad, but whats worse is that DE is not taking any action. Imo it's not enough to say: "campaigning and discussion ongoing" In the Harvester Sumoming thread you can see how dedicated players are trying to get the Detron. Sending them on a unknown amount of time to grind is not fair. _____ To the communication i can add this. Lot of question in Hotfix or Event-Thread are unanswered. There are so many question, but only selected one are getting answered. Same problem with PM. I PM'ed a couple of dev's. I only got one answer from Rebecca once where she wanted my sugestion. When i replied she didn't even open the PM. Communication takes a lot of time, i know that, but it's crucial in a Relationship, especially in a Beta. _____ The Performance needs so much work. Void/derelict -> massive fps drops I posted so many threads, where i showed my <10FPS, in 1h+ Survival and 100+ wave defense and it still got no fixed. The longer you play one game the more fps drops/lags you get. _____ It's rly depressing sometimes. I rly have a feeling when you are getting 700h+ you are in the category "players who doesnt matter". Edited January 10, 2014 by buriburi Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Luminati07 Posted January 10, 2014 Share Posted January 10, 2014 (edited) Nothing else to say except +1 *Edit* This was my question for the livestream "Are there any actual plans for endgame? I mean actual plans, not just "we know people want endgame". Is there anything actually in the works? Do you have any ideas for endgame?" That's the big one for me. I don't want to hear "Yes, we know players want endgame". I want to know if DE is actually creating anything, if anything is in the works, or if they have some real plans for some actual endgame content. I want them to actually tell us whether or not it is being made. Because, if not, then I can once and for all say that I'm done. I don't want to hear anymore of this vague bullS#&$ like several livestreams ago when they mentioned that they know players want endgame, but they didn't actually tell us whether it was being made or not. I want a final answer, so I can decide whether I will stay or will leave. *Edit* Aaaaand, not even a single mention of Endgame on the livestream. Edited January 12, 2014 by Nugget_ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sunfaiz Posted January 10, 2014 Share Posted January 10, 2014 With almost 500 hours of experience under belt i must be inclined to agree. All points are valid. You have my ear and support fellow tenno Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Penthos Posted January 10, 2014 Share Posted January 10, 2014 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rhoenix Posted January 10, 2014 Share Posted January 10, 2014 Well said, and well put on all points - I agree, and I give the OP my +1. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
se05239 Posted January 10, 2014 Share Posted January 10, 2014 (edited) Good post, I agreed with most. Shame that DE won't probably even read this. They tend to ignore player feedback. Edited January 10, 2014 by se05239 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChaliceSoul Posted January 10, 2014 Share Posted January 10, 2014 Have my + 1, just cause. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DJ_Redwire Posted January 10, 2014 Share Posted January 10, 2014 Have my +1, sir. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deidaku Posted January 10, 2014 Share Posted January 10, 2014 let's hope they will read this :) +1 especially the lore part , we need compelling stories about space rocket ninja honor and tradition Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
knoth Posted January 10, 2014 Share Posted January 10, 2014 This is well written, and points out many issues with extreme clarity that could greatly benefit the game if given even a modicum of attention. It encompasses a great scope. I hope that this fares well with all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BabyKurama Posted January 10, 2014 Share Posted January 10, 2014 Totally agree with you Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
_Absolom_ Posted January 10, 2014 Share Posted January 10, 2014 Notice how mostly Masters and Grand Masters reply with quite q few posts... VETERANS NOT DEAD! I mean uuh... VETERANS NOT DEAD YET! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vandoore Posted January 10, 2014 Share Posted January 10, 2014 I am hoping DE read this, I agree with what the OP has stated and it does contain my number one gripe which is lack of communication. And while most new information is provided in the livestreams, not many people have the time to sit for one or more hours to view them. I think that a written version of said livestreams, even just reiteration of key points, would help improve a lack of communication. +1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Altale Posted January 10, 2014 Share Posted January 10, 2014 wait so you were forced to change your name again? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KatanaWielder Posted January 10, 2014 Share Posted January 10, 2014 Another +1 =). I do think however that this should either be re-posted during DE's daytime, so that it doesn't pass unread/uncommented by the DE staff like many other good threads or that we keep upvoting/commenting until we see some reaction. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CyklonDX Posted January 10, 2014 Share Posted January 10, 2014 I too agree, especially with the last comment. I would also want to mention that when the new golem boss in derelict was released it felt good. Make something like that but don't nerf it, keep it hard and entertaining. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
War_Admiral_Adama Posted January 10, 2014 Share Posted January 10, 2014 In a nutshell, probably the "calmest" way of expressing our thoughts as a whole. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rohver Posted January 10, 2014 Share Posted January 10, 2014 +1. This needs to be read by DE. Pretty much every veteran thinks the same Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Valedrel Posted January 10, 2014 Share Posted January 10, 2014 Large post, i agree with most of it. The backtracking is definitely something that could be deterred by just telling us what they are doing, i mean the design council is a thing but i don't remember ever seeing anything about these major changes. Granted most of the community starts flipping tables when a weapon looses 1 damage point somewhere, it's sometimes a matter of just putting it out there and having people actually experience it. If DE told us about every change, i imagine we would still be on the original mod system that didn't involve cards and RDM. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
-BELLUM- Posted January 10, 2014 Share Posted January 10, 2014 You have my support buddy. Totally agree with keeping the competitive events staying to 3-4 days in duration. Hope this makes some waves. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kaian-a-coel Posted January 10, 2014 Share Posted January 10, 2014 And actually some people are willing to go back to it just to get rid of the RNG... And they make a very compelling demonstration of the advantages of a well done skill tree system. Anyway +1 to collstro. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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