Totalbiscuit Quit Warframe Over The U14 Ui.

[Sev7n]

Okay. How do I counter the simulation sickness. I just did the mods for Mirage, and I quit out the game and feeling ill after that.

 

 

Rakshal - Please don't talk nonsense. The only thing which can cause simulation sickness in the game is hud movement relative to the screen, and that's both far lesser of an issue than the menus/ship, and you can *switch it off*.

Not sure how someone gets motion sickness from the ui. And not during the intense combat situations.

[SoulEchelon]

While I do value his opinions, I don't blindly follow each and every one of them. He's not the "holy messiah" of gaming, and he himself states pretty constantly that his opinions are exactly that - HIS OPINIONS. Though I'm sad he didn't take time to learn how the UI works (Because seriously, the new UI is not confusing. at all), I'm not going to change my own opinion about it.

Edited August 15, 2014 by SoulEchelon

[Loswaith]

...

Why couldn't he have just asked people? It's not like the UI was turned 180 degrees or flipped upside-down.

...

If you have to ask people how to use a UI, then it fundementially fails as a UI.  Thats simple UI design 101.

 

The devs shot this down in a stream.

Not exactly, they mentioned that it is easier to adjust a keyboard and mouse to work with controller designed interface than making a controller work with a keyboard and mouse desiged interface.

So sure while they said it wasnt specifically designed for consols, the primary input system for a consol is a controller where for PC it is a mouse and keyboard.

All in all it really isnt that difficuilt to cater to both control systems within the seperation.  They also hardcoded some keyboard controls (that many people customise to their own style, and have yet to fix that) so take what you will of their PC control system support.

Edited August 15, 2014 by Loswaith

[SoulEchelon]

If you have to ask people how to use a UI, then it fundementially fails as a UI.  Thats simple UI design 101.

 

Though I agree in a general sense, I disagree that this UI is complicated enough for people to have to ask about it. Not sure if you were insinuating it was or if you were just answering the other poster in a blunt, but agreeable way.

[Loswaith]

Though I agree in a general sense, I disagree that this UI is complicated enough for people to have to ask about it. Not sure if you were insinuating it was or if you were just answering the other poster in a blunt, but agreeable way.

More the notion that asking how to use even the basic features of a UI should of been something that was even considered by a user (look at how many people ask where even just the inventory is now compared to previously). 

If you have preconcieved notions of how a UI works it will take adjustment time (but it should be intuative enough you dont have to ask people how to use it).  People coming back to the game have the preconcieved notion of how the UI should work, they have to effectivly unlearn the old UI, new players dont have that unlearning to do (effectivly leveling the playing field so to speak).

 

Neither the previous UI nor the current one could ever be considered complicated.

 

The simple fact is that most of the information given about how the new UI from an existing user perspective (skip or do the tutorial) was in a forum post not actually ingame. 

This is a big divergence; most people posting are those that do frequent the forums and likely read the instructions given here so the new UI was "easy" to adjust to, those that dont read the forums (I have frineds and clanmates that dont) found it much harder and far less intuative to use even if taken from the perspective of coming at it as if it was a completly new game.

Edited August 15, 2014 by Loswaith

[vaugahn]

This is a big divergence; most people posting are those that do frequent the forums and likely read the instructions given here so the new UI was "easy" to adjust to, those that dont read the forums (I have frineds and clanmates that dont) found it much harder and far less intuative to use even if taken from the perspective of coming at it as if it was a completly new game.

 

That's pretty much correct. This UI seems to be very easy for people who joined post-U14, which is understandable but still not optimal. It's clear they wanted to use it to bring new players to the game (which it has) but it still needs clarity for returning players.

 

Giving the inventory a physical location in the ship, un-nesting the quick menu, and putting all mod functions on a single page would be an easy first step at clearing it up IMO

[SoulEchelon]

I'm gonna have to disagree.

 

I made sure to do the tutorial (which is completely mandatory for all new players) and it showed me exactly where everything was while at the same time directly inputting me into the act of placing each "UI Menu" into my ship. My guess is that TB opted out of doing the tutorial as well as those that commented about how confused they were, because it held your hand just enough to show you exactly where everything was without making you feel like an idiot.

[KvotheTheArcane1]

You would get motion sickness in game if you get it on the ship, and the new UI is just as good if not better than the old one.

No, the UI causes motion sickness because it has that sway to it.

 

And objectively, the new UI SUCKS. It requires more clicks to do the same task as the previous UI. That's just plain bad UI design. UI design should focus on being simple, fast, and have prettiness/form follow second ("form follows function").

Edited August 15, 2014 by KvotheTheArcane1

[Loswaith]

I'm gonna have to disagree.

 

I made sure to do the tutorial (which is completely mandatory for all new players) and it showed me exactly where everything was while at the same time directly inputting me into the act of placing each "UI Menu" into my ship. My guess is that TB opted out of doing the tutorial as well as those that commented about how confused they were, because it held your hand just enough to show you exactly where everything was without making you feel like an idiot.

While it showed you where everything was it didnt really tell you anything about it or what its overall function within the game (aspects a new players need to know).

 

There are many important aspects it fails to tell you as well, like the inventory (where all your gear is stored), chat (where you interact with the other players in this multi-player game, dispite you restoring a communications station) and the mail system (where major ingame information is passed to the player).

 

While a tutorial should be completly unneeded for someone who already knows how to play the game. If the UI is intuative enough its just not needed.  Plenty of people figured out how to use the previous one without a tutorial at all.

Edited August 15, 2014 by Loswaith

[Methanoid]

just because someone "understands" the new UI doesnt mean we should blindly accept it, i fully understood the new UI, i just hated it over the speed and ease of use over the previous incarnation, so much so that i havent bothered logging in either.

 

i mean seriously, ive got nearly all frames and all wpns that matter, theres no endgame to speak of (forums/chat) and if the UI only serves to annoy me why would i bother logging in, im not exactly missing much?

 

i think far too many ppl see the shiney new pretty visuals and just blindly accept all the bad points just because it all looks glossy and flash, its no good saying "ittl be fixed in time" because its been said aloud already that only minor issues will be addressed, sweeping changes to make the UI similar to U13 has been firmly rejected.

 

plus were all entitled to our own opinions as is TB, whats good for some ppl isnt good for us all, beyond fanboyism or raw dedication warframe has nothing to hold your interest over time, so if TB decided to bail then thats fair game.  (until endgame shows up or something similar)

[Methanoid]

i suppose i should add that im an old fart whos been weened on C16/Spectrum 8k/C64/Amiga etc, so to me Visuals have never been top priority, its always been form/function and visuals are simply a welcome addition after that, warframe to me is no different, i couldnt care less if the visuals were good/bad, tho U14 has made a large attempt to improve the visuals, only at the cost of making everything else harder to do, less intuitive etc, so much so that i can easily just not bother to use it.

 

im sure others are the same, many preferring the visuals first and accepting function last and ppl like me preferring functionality first and visuals as icing on the cake, weve been told we cant have it both ways so all we have to do is make an easy choice, shut up and put up, or walk, pretty simple choices.

[vaugahn]

Uh...you haven't been told you can't have it both ways. This UI can be just as functional as the old one with fixes, there's no need to "make it similar" to the old UI (which was far from perfect) just to get that.

[Methanoid]

Uh...you haven't been told you can't have it both ways. This UI can be just as functional as the old one with fixes, there's no need to "make it similar" to the old UI (which was far from perfect) just to get that.

the changes mentioned are all minor stuff like the recent adding of planet names to the planets whereas ppl like myself didnt want names shoehorned into the circle of painted snooker balls, some of us much preferred the old solar map design which could have been visually improved instead, it was already functionally sound.

 

minor stuff will appear but sweeping changes in U13's direction/format/flavour have been rejected, improving something that was already quite good is a lot different than improving something that doesnt even match up to what it replaced.

Edited August 15, 2014 by Methanoid

[Aramanth]

He's some guy from Youtube, not the lead singer of Aerosmith!  What difference does it make if he or Markiplier or the Game Grumps, or even MasaeAnela, give their approval?

 

 

....Well, maybe if Masae gives approval....

 

Look, I was one of the many people who hated the UI.  I still do, it's a stupid concept.  You can't have third person menus without your character blocking your view somewhat.  I have screenshots of it, and even after the fix it's still not that good when playing a fat frame like Rhino.  But, and this is the important part, I've gotten used to it.  Yes, I miss the old star system, but I've gotten used to it.  Yes, the old menus were superior, but I've gotten used to it.  I've learned to deal with it and just accept the change like everyone else should.  DE might make a few tweaks here and there to make it better, but they're not going to revert back to the way it was or even add an option to give us the old UI.

[Malikon]

Totalbiscuit is kind of a tool.  WF is a better place without him.

 

Edit:

Sometimes I get a little excited and click post before I actually post something resembling an opinon or something with worth (at least to me).  Sorry about that, but the man really is a tool.

 

Anyway, the UI works well enough that my 6 year old had no problems using it (and has fun playing with it to boot, keeping her happy and quiet while i make food or get a soda) that has to say something.  I'm fairly unconcerned with the UI as it does it's job no better or worse (in my opinon) than the old one.

Edited August 15, 2014 by Malikon

[DawnFalcon]

Not sure how someone gets motion sickness from the ui. And not during the intense combat situations.

 

Simulation sickness. And because it does actually bother some people if the HUD bounces around as their character moves. So...that can be turned off.

 

That's pretty standard, and makes the way they've ignored it for the ship UI more puzzling.

[zergla]

Good thing I don't care much about him then.

[Methanoid]

Good thing I don't care much about him then.

i doubt anyone was meant to care, just note that another player acted on his personal opinion of the UI change, put up and shut up or walk, 2 easy choices we all have, TB is no different to us.

[ArgonTheFox]

Good. Let him go. All youtube directors do is kill online games. They attract underage and undermature audiences, who see them playing a game and flock to it, before killing the community.

[zergla]

i doubt anyone was meant to care, just note that another player acted on his personal opinion of the UI change, put up and shut up or walk, 2 easy choices we all have, TB is no different to us.

Then why does this warrant it's own thread? Not really a question aimed at you in particular.

[Methanoid]

Then why does this warrant it's own thread? Not really a question aimed at you in particular.

he has some followers who may be interested in the thread and many who might not be interested, afaik this is generally how "news" goes regardless of the topic.

[zergla]

he has some followers who may be interested in the thread and many who might not be interested, afaik this is generally how "news" goes regardless of the topic.

Meh, I suppose itmakes sense if you look at this as news.

[vaugahn]

the changes mentioned are all minor stuff like the recent adding of planet names to the planets whereas ppl like myself didnt want names shoehorned into the circle of painted snooker balls, some of us much preferred the old solar map design which could have been visually improved instead, it was already functionally sound.

 

minor stuff will appear but sweeping changes in U13's direction/format/flavour have been rejected, improving something that was already quite good is a lot different than improving something that doesnt even match up to what it replaced.

 

Here, let me repeat it again: the old UI is not the only good UI design in the world

 

I put it in bold and italics so you pay extra attention to it. With improvement the new UI will easily match and surpass the old one. Sadly, that improvement will not be along the lines of making it back into the old one. If you disagree with the UI on an aesthetic level, well, there's really nothing any of us can do about that.

[jwapplephobia]

Why are people even talking about the UI being complicated? It's the exact same thing but spread around a couple rooms at terminals.

[Kestral9999]

Why should I care?