Can Someone Explain Why Others Keyshare?

[Makya]

Also incorrect, because that would mean gimme loot

 

making sure the board is finished is contribution enough tyvm

You are disagreeing with yourself. On page one you were saying helping complete the mission was good enough, which is 'Lemme run for free'. 'Gimmie loot' would be 'Lemme run for free' + Going AFK and not actually running the mission.

[blackflashcannon]

Then why complain?

for the others who cant get keys

[Austerity]

TL;DR all I saw was...

 

QQ people won't give me a free ride to the VOID. 

 

SOLUTION: Suck it up and go farm some keys or purchase platinum and buy key pack in market.

[blackflashcannon]

Just so everyone is clear, this isnt a gimme loot thread

[reltats]

Just so everyone is clear, this isnt a gimme loot thread

 

Your right, its a "Give lazy people loot (and by extension me)"

[Makya]

Just so everyone is clear, this isnt a gimme loot thread

 

It's a 'Lemme run for free' thread

Edited December 19, 2014 by Makya

[blackflashcannon]

Congratulations everyone who contributed into derailing this thread. This was not me saying i was looking for void runs, keys or anything. I will not be reading this thread from now on

[Watlok]

People keyshare because in the time it takes to get 1 key you get to use 4. It's 300% more efficient than not key sharing if the time it takes to get keys is the limiting factor.  

 

If you can't be bothered to get 1 key why should other people bring you along for their keys? Especially when doing this sort of harms people who do farm keys, because it's one less person to keyshare with. This thread makes no sense. 

 

It took me 16 keys to get a mesa, I farmed 5 keys (8 now I think), I'm pretty sure you can't even make 16 keys with every single alad v coord that has dropped since its introduction. Maybe you can, but you'd have to be waking up to do invasions and/or not have a job. Due to keysharing, I used 4 whole keys. 

 

No one key shares for rep keys or things they have an excess of because you can get like 40 keys per day from rep. DE also intentionally didn't put much new stuff in the rep keys as a result. The less likely you are to have a surplus of keys, the more time it takes to farm a key, the more likely it is that people will attempt to keyshare instead of just hosting a game with the key. 

 

Keyshare has risks, people scam all the time in them, but it's worth the risk because the alternative is to blow one key for one run instead of a few runs. It's not about hoarding. It's about maximizing your time doing something enjoyable (playing the keyed mission) and minimizing your time waiting for/farming a key.

Edited December 19, 2014 by Watlok

[ArbitUHM]

Honestly the point of this thread seems to be to see how long blackflashcannon can troll people with basic logical fallacies

 

bfc: I am against freeloading, so what I am suggesting people do cannot be freeloading

forum: But what you're saying people should be able to do is basically a textbook definition of freeloading

bfc: *quotes self saying he is against freeloading and therefore it cannot be freeloading*

forum: ...

[SquirmyBurrito]

where did i say LF nova farms? at all

 

in ANY form

 

Where did I claim you were asking for Nova farm runs? Where did I specifically claim you said "LF nova farms"? Don't put words in my metaphorical mouth.

 

for the others who cant get keys

 

Sure you are... *rolls eyes* This is just as bad as those people who ask questions with embarassing implications and then claim it is about a friend. There is no way you went through all this effort just because some other people (who aren't making threads) might not like something. And that is ignoring the fact that several of your posts heavily implied that you were having trouble finding keys. I'd say 'nice try' but it wasn't nice. I give you a 2/10 purely because you got so many people to respond to your posts.

[Taranis49]

 

for the others who cant get keys

 

Sorry, but that's the nature of the game. It sucks, and I sympathize with such people, but if you're going to argue they should be subsidized by others, then atleast be consistent about it because that kind of things happens to damn near everybody with something in the game. Whether it's the one dude has four copies of a mod that another guy hasn't been able to get to drop for months on end, the guy who keeps missing Uncle Vau alerts, or the guy who has to run half-a-dozen 40 min Void survivals to get a single Argon drop (I'd be the latter).

 

Rather than gripe about the lack of handouts, maybe you should ask for a reliable, non-RNG method that enables a player to actually work for the keys they want.

 

SOLUTION: Suck it up and go farm some keys or purchase platinum and buy key pack in market.

 

In fairness, the drops are apparently borked to the point where they can be effectively unattainable for some players, given the apparent (and definitely artificial) scarcity of sabotage keys, for example. I've been able to get a few over the past couple days, but quite a few guys I've spoken to in my clan have never seen one. In the case of T4 keys in general (nevermind T4 Sab keys), I'm not even sure those come in the market packs; they only ever guaranteed a T3 key.

 

That said, I don't agree with him on anything else. While I'm personally not a "screw you, got mine" kinda guy, someone has every right to do with their keys as they want - they have zero obligation to compensate for somebody else's RNG woes.

Edited December 20, 2014 by Taranis49

[Kelevera]

hey look, would you tell your friends to pay for a ride?

 

Well the thing is; you're not my friend.

 

This is probably one of the most ridiculous things I've read in a long time. And yesterday I read about a monkey getting stun gunned by the police after a chocolate fueled rampage.

Edited December 20, 2014 by Kelevera

[Koloricsi]

After reading through 6 pages, i successfully came to the conclusion that the OP is either ridiculously $&*&*#(%&, or absolutely naive.

[Mysteryman2000]

After reading through 6 pages, i successfully came to the conclusion that the OP is either ridiculously $&*&*#(%&, or absolutely naive.

It is ok, the troll who does not understand how to toll is gone.

[fatpig84]

Because 4 keys are better than 1.

If you are too lazy to earn just 1 key, the issue is on you.

Really.

[Kitzun]

This topic is one of the crassest I've ever read on these forums, because of the single-mindedness of both sides.

 

It would please me intensely if DE could make it so every member of a group have to spend a key at the start of a void mission.

This way:

-the "leeches" would have no way to leech;

-the "stingy" would not have 3 free rides for the price of 1.

 

It would be glorious, really.

 

 

Now the only people here who are leeched off are the plat buyers, understood ?

Thought so.

Edited December 20, 2014 by Kitzun

[Azur_Fenix]

Funny how the term "leeching" only gained this negative connotation it now has, and has also recently become a 'problem' (hint:it's not a problem) ever since Mesa came out.

 

Before the triple grind/RNG wall necessary to acquire Mesa was a thing, "leeching" was a term that wasn't used very often on these forums. The most anyone saw it used was back in U13 when everyone was trying to get Hydroid, since that was one of the larger "keyshare" fevers that plagued the community.

 

Throughout all of U13 and U14, and half of U15, keysharing void keys wasn't seen very often and a lot of void mission lobbies were run by one guy with keys. We saw an increase in keysharing when T4 keys came out, but it still wasn't a problem if people didn't have a key. It's only been very recently that people have become very strict about other players having keys, and annoyingly getting unnecessarily upset about others not having keys and playing the game with them.

This.

 

Its a damn game. Stop being A****** and basically going "Nah nah nah boo boo go get a key" WTF is the CoD? Did the player base of WARFRAME suddenly turn into a bunch of children. S#&$ who CARES if someone has a key or not? You earn your keep by HELPING THE HOST COMPLETE THE MISSION.

 

S#&$ i just did 10 damn runs using keys to farm nova, and i got my parts and so did the others i brought with me. Not once did i give a damn if they had a key or not. Know why? Because the point in co-op a game is to give and recive help from others to complete the game. Or in this point to farm prime parts.

 

Being a $&*^ and calling other "leeches" because they dont have a key or can't get one is $&*&*#(%&. Some of you in here defending void key sharing are just plain stupid >.> Stop being A******s and help your fellow Tenno. 

Edited December 21, 2014 by Azur_Fenix

[SquirmyBurrito]

This.

 

Its a damn game. Stop being A****** and basically going "Nah nah nah boo boo go get a key" WTF is the CoD? Did the player base of WARFRAME suddenly turn into a bunch of children. S#&$ who CARES if someone has a key or not? You earn your keep by HELPING THE HOST COMPLETE THE MISSION.

 

S#&$ i just did 10 damn runs using keys to farm nova, and i got my parts and so did the others i brought with me. Not once did i give a damn if they had a key or not. Know why? Because the point in co-op a game is to give and recive help from others to complete the game. Or in this point to farm prime parts.

 

Being a $&*^ and calling other "leeches" because they dont have a key or can't get one is $&*&*#(%&. Some of you in here defending void key sharing are just plain stupid >.> Stop being A******s and help your fellow Tenno. 

 

I'll provide leeches with free runs when you start providing all the pedestrians in your area with free rides to wherever it is they're heading.

[Snipehunter67]

While I'm not fond of some of the effects that keysharing seems to have on the game, some of the keys are a real pain to get.  If this wasn't the case no doubt everyone would have plenty of keys and this topic wouldn't exist.

 

Blackflash, lets assume that you're an honest soul that farms keys and hosts groups to the best of your abilities.  Then we can assume that you expect other similarly fair folks to do likewise so that you have karma roll around and get you the runs you need hosted by someone else.

 

Perhaps I'm a pessimist, but it sure seems to me that there are more leeches out there than generous and fair folks.  Yes it's hard to quantify this data, but my experience trends to make me believe that way.  When there are people generous enough to host runs with no strings attached, there will be plenty of folks ready to take advantage. 

 

Keysharing is pretty much a method of dealing with both scarce keys and a preponderance of players that don't want to, or can't get keys for themselves.

 

If you don't like keysharing runs, don't do em.

 

For the sake of my curiosity, what is it about keyshares that you don't like?  I waded through this entire thread and you were surprisingly unclear. You asked a legitimate question to start with and then every answer that shows up you seem to attack on general principles instead of trying to respond or rebut in a useful way. 

 

BTW I'm not posting tons of quotes and making fun of them cause that seems to be your kick, and all you're accomplishing with the kneejerk responses is more people wondering if you're a troll.  If you actually have a coherent point of view, spit it out clearly and stop ridiculing the people that take you seriously enough to honestly answer you.

[Thaumatos]

It's simple.

 

People keyshare because they want to know that they're getting something in return for hosting a game.

 

This is what you get when you require only one member of the group to put up the time and effort to open the mission.

 

All keys should work as the Orokin Derelict keys do (permanent blueprint, specific resource requirements), and then each individual should require a key to join the missions.  This isn't hard to fix...DE just hasn't for whatever reason.

[xethier]

-snip-

 

All keys should work as the Orokin Derelict keys do (permanent blueprint, specific resource requirements), and then each individual should require a key to join the missions.  This isn't hard to fix...DE just hasn't for whatever reason.

 

if this were the way it was done, there would be a new "rare" resource in various places (or given as mission rewards) that would be required as part of the recipe for crafting the key. unlike nav coordinates, these would actually be scarce.

 

all this would mean is that you have the ability to craft the specific key you needed instead of randomly receiving them.

 

at least, if i were DE that's how i'd go about it. 

 

honestly, given the preponderance of new keys. (sabotage / t4) and the dilution that is starting to become so prevalent, it seems that this is an idea who's time is very much upon us.

 

additionally, these could be put into rare resource containers. (giving us a reason to actually hunt them beyond credits and the occasional booster that isn't worth the effort due to it's extremely short duration)

 

you wouldn't need to "gate" every player. (requiring a key for every player) in fact, long-term that's a bad plan. currently, it's fairly easy to get a group together. but if every player has to craft that item (spending credits and resources) then the quick group assembly starts to lag, and groups would be harder to assemble.

 

in times of high-demand. (like now) it's fine, but in times of low-demand (say... 3-4 weeks from now) you'd be hard pressed to find enough people quickly to setup runs. (i know i'm not going to bother crafting random stuff so i can be "on the ball" -- i'd just craft them as i needed them, and if i didn't need to run the mission specifically, why would i bother?) -- currently i don't have to, i can just "run a random void" whenever i want to by seeing who needs backup.

[Thaumatos]

 

if this were the way it was done, there would be a new "rare" resource in various places (or given as mission rewards) that would be required as part of the recipe for crafting the key. unlike nav coordinates, these would actually be scarce.

 

all this would mean is that you have the ability to craft the specific key you needed instead of randomly receiving them.

 

at least, if i were DE that's how i'd go about it. 

And unlike how keys work now, you'd be able to reliably make them, use them, and form groups for those missions when you need them.

 

That's a much better situation than what we have right now.

 

honestly, given the preponderance of new keys. (sabotage / t4) and the dilution that is starting to become so prevalent, it seems that this is an idea who's time is very much upon us.

 

additionally, these could be put into rare resource containers. (giving us a reason to actually hunt them beyond credits and the occasional booster that isn't worth the effort due to it's extremely short duration)

That'd be excellent.  There needs to be more of a reason not to literally hop, skip, and jump your way from start to finish on every last map.

 

you wouldn't need to "gate" every player. (requiring a key for every player) in fact, long-term that's a bad plan. currently, it's fairly easy to get a group together. but if every player has to craft that item (spending credits and resources) then the quick group assembly starts to lag, and groups would be harder to assemble.

 

in times of high-demand. (like now) it's fine, but in times of low-demand (say... 3-4 weeks from now) you'd be hard pressed to find enough people quickly to setup runs. (i know i'm not going to bother crafting random stuff so i can be "on the ball" -- i'd just craft them as i needed them, and if i didn't need to run the mission specifically, why would i bother?) -- currently i don't have to, i can just "run a random void" whenever i want to by seeing who needs backup.

 

Requiring each player to have a key gets rid of the feeling of "exclusivity" that these key sharing runs are creating.  That would be the overall goal.

 

With either a saturated or sparse community of individuals running missions, you would still only bother making/getting the keys you want to do the missions you want to do.  That's the way it is now...unless you're a leech and you want to let others do the work for you.  For most of us, the number of players running the void has no bearing on whether or not we want a particular item from a particular mission.

 

The only point I would have to concede on is that less people having less keys would mean less full groups.  But if you have a permanent blueprint and your 'key resource', pardon the pun, is being found while you play anywhere, it'd be like any other resource.  If you don't use it for a while, you'll start to stockpile it.  Once that happens, if you want to run a key mission with a friend just to help on a whim, you'll have the resources to build said key for mission.

[xethier]

-snip-

 

Requiring each player to have a key gets rid of the feeling of "exclusivity" that these key sharing runs are creating.  That would be the overall goal.

 

With either a saturated or sparse community of individuals running missions, you would still only bother making/getting the keys you want to do the missions you want to do.  That's the way it is now...unless you're a leech and you want to let others do the work for you.  For most of us, the number of players running the void has no bearing on whether or not we want a particular item from a particular mission.

 

The only point I would have to concede on is that less people having less keys would mean less full groups.  But if you have a permanent blueprint and your 'key resource', pardon the pun, is being found while you play anywhere, it'd be like any other resource.  If you don't use it for a while, you'll start to stockpile it.  Once that happens, if you want to run a key mission with a friend just to help on a whim, you'll have the resources to build said key for mission.

 

 

By requiring each player to have a key, you've just blown away any opportunity to help new players within your guild. You've made the entire system "exclusive" by virtue of the fact that everybody has to be building the items before they have access. You can't just grab random folks. 

You've removed a large chunk of folks who allow others to run with them using their spare keys as credit farms.

 

I have hundreds of spare keys. As a crap host (limited upload bandwidth) for a year before the system was altered to allow the non-host to use their keys, i have a HUGE reserve stockpile and frequently burn my key on PUG's because i have so many. I really don't care about this "leech" crap. Because it's just that, Crap. It's disingenuous. The players are helping you finish the mission. Are they sitting in a corner, crying and hiding from the enemies, allowing you to do all the work for the reward? Yeah, at that point they're leeches. Otherwise, they just ran a dungeon with you. 

 

If you gate every player to have access, requiring a key from every player, you've made the entire system FAR less flexible so that a sub-set of players can feel like they're not being "taken advantage of" or somesuch egotistical, self-centered horseS#&$.

[blackflashcannon]

For the sake of my curiosity, what is it about keyshares that you don't like?  I waded through this entire thread and you were surprisingly unclear. You asked a legitimate question to start with and then every answer that shows up you seem to attack on general principles instead of trying to respond or rebut in a useful way. 

i apologize if my anger boiled over on my posts, i was a little upset when every person who was saying "H T3 (insert mission)" i spot this and think, ooohh, i might get some argon on this run as well as some parts to trade to others. so i message them asking them if they have room, and all 3 hosts message back "you need a key" to summarize what they say. i undestand it takes time to find keys, but its not like its life or death to must have a key to play this with me. yes, it gives more chances to the diluted rng. ask them to throw in a key to help back then, i just dont like the ones who demand a key in return, not keysharing period.

[Watlok]

If specific keys were easier to farm for then people wouldn't keyshare, but t3 keys especially aren't falling from the sky and are tedious to get. 

 

I'd gladly watch movies and farm keys like the xini days where you get 1 or 2 specific keys in reward rotation, but you get a bunch of garbage keys like the t4 rep keys or the t2e keys you have 40 of or the t2s keys you have 50 of because they used to be t2 raid which were much more useful.

Edited December 31, 2014 by Watlok