All Powers Should Have Scale Ability Outright, Augments Should Add To/alter That Scale Ability

[AlphaHorseman]

Augments are an interesting aspect that has been added to WarFrame. On the one hand, they represent a way for players to tailor their powers in a way we have not seen before, allowing for customization that we haven’t seen before with our abilities. On the other hand, some have been used to band aid powers that the community would see reworked/buffed, rather than given an augment as a band aid. Some of these augments called into question were Surging Dash, Ice Wave Impedance, and Pacifying Bolts.

 

What these augments all have in common is that the skills they are applied to were in need of reworks or added mechanics innately, to make them scale able outside of damage output. There are others as well that add to this list. One notable example would be Fire Fright, added to Embers Fireball ability.

 

These powers, and others that have received augments that patch their lack of CC/Utility, necessitate the scale ability of these powers. In later content, it becomes evident that the damage output of powers becomes secondary to their ability to apply CC or have some form of Utility. When these powers do not have such functions, you notice that players tend to shy away from using those powers, and ultimately go towards boosting that one power within a kit that can actually scale. Enemy armor, along with insane growth of shields and health mitigates the effective damage output of any power, but these targets are still affected by CC/Utility. As such, having powers have functionality that isn't solely damage helps to ensure the entirety of a WarFrames power kit is usable in later content.

 

Patch Up Augments:

 

Why are these augments receiving scrutiny? Well, because they have traits that should have been built into the powers they apply to. Why? Because these augments apply a dynamic that allows these powers some type of CC, Utility, or something others would call common sense to be included with this ability that they do not have outright.

 

Fire Fright gives Fireball the ability to not only deal damage, but also to have a chance of removing aggro off of a player through enemies being, in essence, Terrified. It gives it a function outside of damage that is sorely needed for this power to be able to do more than just deal minimal damage.

 

Ice Wave Impedance adds a trait to Ice Wave that allows it to scale through its utility, where Ice Wave had very little without it.

 

Pacifying Bolts gives Psychic Bolts some CC, whereas without it, the skill has no scalability and is a very mitigated damage power.

 

Surging Dash allows Slash Dash to add its melee hits to Excaliburs’ melee hit counter, where many would say that the skill should have done so without the augment, clearly because Excal is hitting enemy units with his melee weapon, and such hits should already count to the melee counter. Without this augment, Slash Dash has no scale ability through utility and/or CC. This power cannot scale through content, rather is trashed in later content for other abilities that do have CC.

 

Individuality of Crowd Control and Utility is Key to Keeping Diversity

 

I believe it was a Dev who said that every power would get a "stagger" affect on enemies to help them "scale". This generalization of power scale ability solved by one mechanic not only barely adds to their scale ability, but kills the individuality of powers.

 

Though this hasn't been the case, scale ability through CC and Utility can be diversified greatly to help powers not only keep their individuality, but make them useful in a plethora of situations.

 

To give an example, giving Frost's Ice Wave a knock back mechanic gives it a function outside of damage output, and isn't necessitated by an augment. Not only that, but now enemies struck by the wave can be hit backwards and away from the area. Thus, it isn't just a stagger, but enemies are hit backwards and knocked to the ground. This gives a player breathing room to take care of targets when damage isn't something they've built for, or if damage isn't doing the job of eliminating targets.

 

Ice Wave is now an ability that can go farther in content than it could before. Players now have the ability to use it and ensure that, although targets are not killed, they are disrupted and easier to deal with than before. The power keeps its uniqueness, and now has a function that makes it workable in later content. Adding this mechanic also synergizes well with Frost's kits ability to provide AoE lockdown, offensively or defensively.

 

Credit goes to ArchWizard for the idea of giving Ice Wave knock back.

 

I hope that we all can agree that we would like our entire abilities kits being solid, not just one power or the other. Such mentality of one power being the go-to, or only useful, is what can help spread the mentality of “Press [insert power key here] to win”. But, I must digress that these augments should not be the thing that makes our entire kit stable, they should add a dynamic to a power, making them more interesting to use, but they should not make the power scale able to use outright.

 

Rules to Follow:

 

So, as a general guideline to augments, I would propose these following aspects for DE to consider when they’re looking at augments and abilities:

 

1. If a power is primarily used as a damage output, meaning that it has little to no Crowd Control, Utility, or Scale Ability, it does not need an augment, the skill in question needs to be reworked/buffed to have these traits added to them.

 

2. If a power completes its function, whatever that may be, with some sense of Crowd Control, Utility, or Scale Ability, then an augment that ADDS something to the ability, or ALTERS it to NOT hinder its Crowd Control, Utility, or Scale Ability, then said augment would be a considerable choice for addition to the game.

a. If the augment in question to which alters and/or takes away from the Crowd Control, Utility, Scale Ability, or functionality of a power [i.e. casting cost of Despoil when compared to its regular counterpart], it would be important to strengthen those areas of Crowd Control, Utility, Scale Ability or functionality that have not been hindered.

 

3. Augments should not add CC, Utility, or Scale Ability that a power should have outright, or a mechanic that makes sense to be built within the power.

 

4. An Augment should not be the defining factor that creates synergy with the powers of a WarFrame. If a WarFrames' kit does not have some semblance of synergy between powers, then powers need to be looked at for reworking/buffing, but not use an augment to create such synergy.

a. Synergy between the augments of a frame would be welcomed, but these augments should not create said synergy themselves.

 

An example of a good augment is Irradiated Disarm. Radial Disarm completes its function well enough, it can scale, has good crowd control, and the utility is evident. Irradiated Disarm adds a dynamic to the power that, although makes for interesting game play, is not necessary for the power to function, scale, have utility, or crowd control, Radial Disarm has that outright.

 

I believe all of us would like the entirety of our kit to be reliable. When damage won’t do it, ensuring that our powers have some sort of Utility, CC, or Scale Ability helps to keep all our powers relevant, not just one. This would help with the mentality of “Press [insert power key here] to win.” Though it wouldn’t solve that mindset, having some diversity on the field when it comes to pressing power keys would be a better alternative than to what we have now.

 

Having all powers be useful, even when damage doesn’t do the trick, is a great level of competence and usability that I think we all can agree is where we want all our frames to be. This should be achievable without augments, not necessitated for some skills through them.

 

As it stands, some augments are good, they add a dynamic to a power that it doesn’t need to scale; Irradiated Disarm is a good example. Yet, others add a mechanic that actually makes the power useful for more than its damage output, Pacifying Bolts and Ice Wave Impedance for examples. The Surging Dash mod, well, that too doesn’t scale well when enemies are too far and you’re up close and personal with high level enemies.

 

Augments should not “fix” these powers’ lack of Scale Ability, CC, or Utility, they should be meant to add interesting mechanics to powers that, although are fun to have, do not outright add needed mechanics to these powers.

 

Should a power be lacking in these fields, it makes sense for these powers to get reworked/buffed, rather than patched with an augment.

 

If any have rules/guidelines to consider, augments to call into question, or feedback on what I’ve written here, please feel free to discuss them below. Ideas for new augments are also welcome!

 

Community Contributions:

 

Listed below are some ideas for power reworks and augment ideas given by the community. All are free to discuss within this thread, and contribute.

 

Ash

 

Augment Idea:

 

Shadow Shuriken - After hitting the initial target(s), shadows of the Shuriken are launched from the target to multiple targets. (1/2/3/4 additional targets, depending on Mod Rank)

 

Or

 

Lasting Shuriken - After hitting the initial target(s), the Shuriken continues to assault the affected target(s). (1/2/3/4 continued hits, depending on Mod Rank)

 

Credit goes to Shy0 for these Ideas.

 

Ember/Ember Prime

Fireball 2.0

 

Fireball is currently a pure damage ability. To help with its scale ability, having the target hit be damaged for a percentage of its health, rather than a flat number, allows Fireball to scale. Percentage scaling only scales off of the primary target hit. Such that target acquisition is also skill based to an extent.

 

I.e. Hitting a runner scales the total damage off of that runners health, rather than an Ancient that may be next to the runner. Thus, the damage to the runner is palpable, but the damage on the Ancient is not as lethal.

 

Augment idea:

 

A blast proc added on-hit that ragdolls said target away from the caster, similar to Sonic Boom. It would be a single target ragdoll and blast effect but the ragdoll could produce physics impact like when a bow kills a target and the corpse hits others. The damage would be minimal for the physics impact but through skillful application it could be used as a modified crowd control to segregate dangerous targets from friendlies and potentially with good map awareness. This adds further scale ability in both the Damage/CC/utility category, and an additional skill component to allow application to the fullest extent.

 

Targets hit with this augmented ability are immune to the knockback effect for 3 seconds, but are not immune to damage inflicted.

 

Credit goes to Geninrising for this idea.

 

Excalibur/Excalibur Prime

Reworked Radial Javelin: Blade Barrier

This ability just feels too out of place in his kit. But, with some tweaks, it can be made to fit his kit much better:

* Now has 2 phases; an initial "blade barrier" phase, and a "blade launch" phase

-- Phase 1)

Upon activation, you get blades spinning around you (the blade barrier phase). These blades do several things:

* They deal damage to nearby enemies (say, 50/75/100/125 slash damage twice per second), and maybe also gives +1 to the melee combo counter each time they strike an enemy!

* They can provide you with some minor protection (either deflecting projectiles here and there, or a plain damage reduction)

* While blocking, the blades are not angled outwards to slash enemies, but instead raised upwards, helping you to block in a 360 degree angle + gives you a certain amount of projectile-reflection (similar to and stacking with the Reflection mod), say 25/50/75/100%, but then they don't deal the spinning slash damage to nearby enemies. Stopping the blocking obviously makes the blades go back to slashing and dealing damage again. Focus on more offense or more defense, your choice!

EDIT: As suggested by WolvenEdge, the block-redirection could also go where you AIM, rather than just going straight back to its source. With that, you could "even make it capable of directing your friends' fire, so that you turn into a bladed lens that points the hurt toward choice targets", as he so nicely put it himself :P

-- Phase 2)

If the first phase's duration runs out, or if you activate the ability again in the middle of the first phase, the second phase will happen, which works similar to the oldest version of radial javelin (aka, launches a limitted amount of blades outwards from Excalibur, in a projectile-like fashion), but with a few tweaks:

* Not only deals damage, it also pushes all hit enemies away in a ragdoll fashion, even if they don't die!

* Damage is boosted by the melee combo multiplier (but does not provide to the counter), thus its base damage is only 450/550/650/750, split evenly among Puncture/Slash/Impact.

* They have very slight punchthrough, enough to hit targets behind thin covers and through Shield Lancer shields.

 

Credit goes for Azamagon for this Idea

 

Excalibur Rework Proposal 2:

 

Excalibur: Named for a legendary sword, this warrior should remain the pinnacle of melee excellence.

 

The first change that I would suggest be implemented is that all of Excalibur's strikes through power use be counted as melee strikes(and thus obtain the damage bonus from melee multiplier). We already know this is a mechanic in game as illustrated by Ash's Blade Storm and I feel this should definitely be an integral part of Excalibur's kit as he is essentially the melee frame. 

 

Slash Dash 2.0

Excalibur Rushes forward damaging all targets in a 8m wide path adding to his combo counter based on the number of enemies struck(damaging range width is not affected by power range to prevent OP slash dash builds that are immortal, in addition only slash dash has this mechanic, RJ does not). Melee combo counter would increase the damage dealt. This would incentivize players to utilize this ability often and cement Excal's role as the melee frame.

 

Surging Dash 2.0

At the end of Slash Dash Excalibur produces a pulse of energy knocking all targets back from him to a range of 10 meters. Enemies knocked away will deal a small amount of physics damage to other enemies also pushing them back to the maximum range(range of the pulse is not affected by power range). Considering the damage dealt would be minimal I see no issue with providing the combo counter damage bonus here as well.

 

 

I feel Super Jump should be removed from Excal's kit entirely and be implemented as a sort of charged jump to every frames kit. Allow players to expend X amount of stamina in order to charge a jump that will increase it's height and speed.

 

Excal's new 3.

Empowered strikes

for 50 energy Excalibur gains double scaling on all additions to his melee combo counter for 20 seconds(affected by duration)in addition Excalibur gains a bonus 20% damage to all melee hits. I thought about adding power str scaling to this as well but thought that with the combined 2x combo multiplier it would be insanely strong, as it stands it would be more than worthwhile addition to his kit whereas Super Jump is continually criticized as one of the most useless skills in game.

 

Augment: Stunning Strikes

While Empowered strikes is active Excalibur's attacks will stun a target for 2 second thus allowing him to allow melee in extremely dangerous situations if tactically applied to high threat targets.

 

Furious Javelin 2.0

Excalibur's RJ ability now provides him with a short duration spherical shielding made of blades, equal to the damage a RJ does(a single javelin not the total damage of all hits) with feature the shield can be further scaled with a larger combo multiplier and in addition teammate buffs such as Roar can increase this further since Roar will increase RJ's damage. This ability behaves akin to IS(scales from melee combo multiplier not pwr str) except it provides no immunity to cc or procs. Through careful use of his combo multiplier Excal gains a significant source of shielding that allows him to close ranks  with even the most dangerous targets.

 

Through careful synergetic use of these abilities Excalibur is able to always ensure that his entire kit is viable and truly impactful throughout the entire game.

 

 

Credit for this work goes to Geninrising, haku360, and mrhawk1000

 

Radial Javelin 2.0

Upon casting Radial Javelin, enemy units hit with Javelins are ragdolled into the direction to which the Javelin is fired. Enemies hit by the ragdolled target are knocked down and take Impact Damage. Should enemies survive the Radial Javelin, they are pinned to the terrain to which they were fired towards for a Duration (affected by Mods). Recasting Radial Javelin unpins surviving targets and launches the next volley of Javelins into the effective Radius of Radial Javelin.

 

Thus, enemy units can be thrown outwards from the effective area of Radial Javelin and helps to give a squad/player breathing room to recover. This also helps with giving Radial Javelin some workable CC/Utility outside of its somewhat weaker damage output when compared to other ultimate abilities.

 

Credit goes to AlphaHorseman for this idea.

 

Frost/Frost Prime

Frost's Freeze 2.0

 

Freeze now applies current damage in a 10m aoe on up to 10 targets at point of impact INSTANTANEOUSLY!(let's remove that ignorant "flight time" mechanic) Aoe range is unaffected by power range mods to ensure that Frost's ability to use it is not reliant on ranged builds that do not play well with certain snowglobe builds.

Additionally for every target under 10 the damage that would have been done to each of the 10 targets is split and dealt to the actual targets struck by this ability. The reason for this is attributed to IRL affects of cold. IRL if a person is subjected to a certain degree of coldness the effects of that coldness will be lessened with more bodies huddled together. In game we could simulate this through this effect.

 

This would allow Freeze to scale much better than currently in many situations and add somewhat to the thematic of Frost being our very own Jack Frost.

 

Augment Freeze Force 2.0

Instead of buffing teammates Frost now creates an area of Frozen Ground around point of impact. This Frozen ground causes all enemies that attempt to traverse it to fall to the ground and are required to get back up after a 1 second stun effect. Enemies that have slipped in this way area immune to said effect for 5 seconds but will walk much slower on said AOE. I feel this effect would also go quite well on the current iteration of Icewave Impedence to bring it in line with Frost's overall thematic.

 

It would be seriously fun and useful to be able to knock our current bullet sponges down for a round of ground finishers rather than the lackluster buff we have now or the slow mechanic present on Icewave Impedence.

 

Credit goes to Geninrising for this idea

 

Mag/Mag Prime

Crush. Absolutely lackluster. Make it good baseline, like this:

* 50/50 of damage is now Magnetic and Puncture (makes way more sense)

* Once reaching the end of the ability, all enemies are slammed together in front of Mag. For each unit lifted, all targets suffer an additional 40 Impact damage (corpses also contribute!). That further emphasizes Mag's role as a "Reverser", using the power of the enemies to her advantage, here taking advantage of their numbers, their horde-powers.

* Once all enemies are slammed together, they lay on the ground for up to 4 seconds, still crushed together (think: Ragdolled). Affected by Power Duration.

 

Now you have a very solid Ultimate!

 

Augment Ideas:

 

What could the Augments do then? Some random ideas:

 

Augment 1) Railgun Crush - After enemies are slammed together, they are then launched in the direction Mag is aiming and anything colliding suffers X Impact damage (corpses also count).

Augment 2) Sadistic Crush - After enemies are slammed together, enemies are still held together in the air, suffering constant Magnetic damage, but Mag now also starts draining energy over time. Let's go by casting it again, or if all enemies die.

Augment 3) Forcefield Crush - While the animation lasts, Mag also projects a magnetic forcefield. This forcefield stops all gunfire from hitting Mag (maybe even launch the projectiles back?) and greatly slows down any unit that enters, which wasn't lifted.

 

Credit goes to Aazmagon for this idea

 

Rhino/Rhino Prime

Augment Ideas:

 

Iron Bulwark :

 

Rhino now gains TOTAL damage mitigation in a 180 degree arc in front of him for the lifetime of IS. The damage mitigation also extends to include any source of AOE damage and shields for 2m on either side of him to allow him to actually block for teammates in need. Additionally while active Rhino's attacks aggro opponents for 5 seconds This shield allows Rhino to fearlessly engage heavy threat targets however it requires he think carefully about how he approaches combat. It is necessary that Rhino be aware of his surroundings and react accordingly to ensure he can survive a situation where enemy damage can exceed his IS total.

You want face tanking you got it.

...

Explosive Stomp:

 

Upon Stomping Rhino's affected targets fly away from him in a 360 degree arc. Opponents hit by enemies tossed away like this receive physics impact damage and are momentarily confused for 4 seconds attacking targets that knocked them down. This Augment is aimed at allowing Rhino to further mitigate damage from targets outside his normal stomp range, thus allowing him a greater measure of security when trying to revive fallen allies or guard objectives without allies being immediately available. Through application of this augment players will receive a more viable Ultimate ability where simply lifting a few for a few seconds will not help. Additionally this augment would remove the duration locking mechanism that Stomp currently suffers from due to the length of time enemies are suspended...This could actually be quite viable on a CC focused Tank and could potentially help bring Rhino to endgame with a vengeance.

 

Credit goes to Geninrising for these ideas.

 

Trinity

Augment Ideas:

 

Well of Life

 

Pool Of Life: Creates a Link between the friendly target and the Trinity transferring a percentage of damage received to the Trinity as well as sharing excess health/energy gain between the two and any other Linked allies.  Increased base duration.  Pool Of Life Link disengages if the Trinity suffers damage through the link that would kill her, ignoring the would-be fatal damage transfer.

 

Or

 

Pool of Death: Enemies affected by Well of Life no longer provide healing, instead, damage received is transferred to nearby enemies in pulses.  If target dies, all damage not expelled through a pulse is sent through one final pulse.

 

Or

 

When cast upon allies, buffs allies total health.

 

Credit goes to KnotOfMetal for this idea

 

Vauban

Tesla 2.0

 

Tesla orbs now chain to three targets near the primary struck target doing equal damage to all targets and stunning for 3 seconds. Vauban's primary schtick is CC on all of his abilities whether it be bouncing enemies around, lifting them up, or sucking them into his very own black hole.

Currently his #1 completely ignores his overall thematic and should be brought into line. The reason for the arcing to other targets is, the effect is a guaranteed electric proc and universally an electric proc leaps to other targets. I stated the same damage to all targets because it is a small enough amount of damage no matter how he is modded as to have no chance at being OP or broken.

 

Tesla Link 2.0

 

Tesla links produce a damaging line of energy that also cannot be bypassed without destroying it first to proceed. It's destruction should require a minimum of 2 hits to ensure that enemies do not just swipe it once and ignore it. Basically just a QoL mechanic.

 

Credit goes to Geninrising for this idea

 

Augments:

 

Augment: Critical Vortex

 

Increase of critical chance for the number of enemies within the Vortex. Increases to Crit Chance based on the number of enemies currently residing inside the vortex (with possibility to take enemy HP/Armor/Shield stats into consideration as part of the calculation to the increases).

 

Augment: Linked Vortex

 

Placing two Vortexes creates a link between these Vortexes. Enemies that are ensnared by one vortex are teleported to the second vortex, and vice versa.

 

The first has great synergy with the utility that Vortex is typically used for and would be well used helping add a little more to scale ability.  The second would allow Vauban to really excel with the way that he manipulates the flow of mobs for some very unique results.  It also has great synergy possibilities with his other abilities such as bounce or bastille depending on where each vortex were cast.

 

Credit goes to Jax_Cavalera and others within the Design Council for these ideas.

 

Augment: Linked Bounce

 

Teleport was suggested for Vortex though I think could be of more use on Bounce as it doesn't have a lot of strong uses right now and this would boost that department.

 

Mechanic

 

1.  First bounce is thrown down and this one is the Destination point

 

2.  All future bouncers that are placed will teleport enemies to the location of the Destination bouncer.

 

3.  If Vauban or any squad member use the original Destination pad 4 times so it vanishes, then all other active bouncers are removed allowing the player to re-cast the ability again setting a new Destination point.

                 a. Players can activate Linked Bounce by pressing "X" when standing on a Bounce pad.

 

4.  Enemies that walk over the Destination pad ignore it as it is simply a Destination point that throws them up into the air on arrival.

 

The reason for this change in flow would be that if you are running away from an angry mob of enemies, you would throw down 1 bouncer and keep running.

 

mobs ignore it as it's the first one you have thrown and then you start to throw down more and each enemy that lands on them is teleported away so it can be used as a defensive ability

 

-  Mobs that walk onto an active bounce plate are teleported to the location of the most recently placed bouncer.  On arrival, they are thrown up into the air

 

-  Each Rank of the Augment Mod boosts the number of enemies that can teleport through a single Bouncer Plate before it vanishes.  x1, x2, x3, x4

 

The multiplier is based on the number of times a Plate can normally bounce a mob before it vanishes so if a regular bounce plate can be used 4 times then the max rank of this augment would enable 16 entities (players/enemies) to be teleported before the plate would vanish.

 

-  Uses are only counted by Departing entities (players or enemies that arrive at the most recent plate would not consume any "uses" from that bounce plate.

 

-  Entities that stand on the most recently deployed bounce plate will not do anything as it is a delivery gateway and only becomes "active" when a new bounce plate is thrown down.

 

 

 

Credit goes to Jax_Cavalera for this idea.

 

Augment: Linked Bounce (Alternate)

 

After casting two Bounces, these Bounces become linked. Entities that step onto the pad are launched from one pad to the other. Enemies that are launched can hit the environment/other units and receive/deal impact damage. Allies that are launched can use Bounce as a reliable mobility tool.

 

Bounce now becomes a tool to redirect mobs and allow for faster travel.

 

Credit goes to AlphaHorseman for this idea.

Edited April 8, 2015 by AlphaHorseman

[Xeo_Nespydonum]

Exactly.  Many of the augments just do things the power itself should already do.

[Drazhar14]

Very well said, OP. 

[CaveCricket48]

Agreed.

 

Jet Stream and Irradiating Disarm, off the top of my head, are good augments. The abilities themselves are good, and the augments provide a neat, useful addition (though Irradiating Disarm might be a little too good, depending on who you ask).

[Lukap99]

Completely agree OP.

[Drunken_Child]

Agreed.

 

Jet Stream and Irradiating Disarm, off the top of my head, are good augments. The abilities themselves are good, and the augments provide a neat, useful addition (though Irradiating Disarm might be a little too good, depending on who you ask).

Dont forget Resonance, its arguable one of thee most op thngs in game.

[Sormaran]

Excellent point, cant find anything to disagree with.

[Archistopheles]

Maybe ability and weapon augment mods are DE's way of getting us to pay to test changes they are considering!

/tinfoil_hat

[AlphaHorseman]

Maybe ability and weapon augment mods are DE's way of getting us to pay to test changes they are considering!

/tinfoil_hat

Could you elaborate on this? I feel as though I'm not getting your point.

[BaronessBlacksilk]

I will agree here as well. Regenerative molt and Shield Transference are my 2 highest rated augments personally. Always happy to see someone state their ideas and opinions in a very well thought out manner rather than just complaining. Huge +1 from me.

[castem]

I conpletely agree with the OP.

I feel one of the biggest offenders of 'bandaid fix augments' is Pool of Life. Even augmented, Well of Life remains a greatly overshadowed power (so much so that it's almost always not worth using) that needs looked at, rather than slapping a syndicate augment on it and calling it a day.

[letir]

This is a "new" (actually, very old) DE's method of "fixing" things.

 

Bandaid mods.

 

Before it was only aids like Handspring, anti-knockdown mods or S#&$ like Maglev. Now they can just fix every damn thing with new mods.

 

Physical mods are weak? Let's introduce new, event-limited physical mods, this will fix the problem.

Status mods are weak? Let's introduce new status mods, this will fix the problem.

 

Abiltites are weak? Frames are bad? Let's introduce new mods, which can actually make ability viable (like Pacifying Bolts).

Edited December 31, 2014 by letir

[Heidrek]

It's a giant band aid for a New type of grind. STUPID, but know how is DE going to undo their decision?

I can only see they pay a mass crapload of plat to the players that actually grind their way into syndicates and bought the mods they offered, and take away all augmentation mods.

[Xana_Skullsunder]

This is a "new" (actually, very old) DE's method of "fixing" things.

 

Bandaid mods.

 

Before it was only aids like Handspring, anti-knockdown mods or S#&$ like Maglev. Now they can just fix every damn thing with new mods.

 

Physical mods are weak? Let's introduce new, event-limited physical mods, this will fix the problem.

Status mods are weak? Let's introduce new status mods, this will fix the problem.

 

Abiltites are weak? Frames are bad? Let's introduce new mods, which can actually make ability viable (like Pacifying Bolts).

 

Sadly, I feel this is what DE is doing. Because it means more grind, which to them means the players will stay longer.

[Heidrek]

This is a "new" (actually, very old) DE's method of "fixing" things.

 

Bandaid mods.

 

Before it was only aids like Handspring, anti-knockdown mods or S#&$ like Maglev. Now they can just fix every damn thing with new mods.

 

Physical mods are weak? Let's introduce new, event-limited physical mods, this will fix the problem.

Status mods are weak? Let's introduce new status mods, this will fix the problem.

 

Abiltites are weak? Frames are bad? Let's introduce new mods, which can actually make ability viable (like Pacifying Bolts).

I feel that some of these mods like handspring and such should even be a thing. You got took close to the enemy? too bad punishment 

Physical mods and status mods? WTF BALANCE THEM OUT. DON'T make it event to win or even WALLET WARRIOR TO WIN. Raise the normal ICP mods dmg and give the event ones a hybrid affect or something. 

Sadly, I feel this is what DE is doing. Because it means more grind, which to them means the players will stay longer.

yeah mike akamikeb and my whole clan. Now my clan is dead..

[TrinityPrime]

I was just... really hoping that the Trinity Link Augment mod changed the ability into a toggle ability.  But no.

[CY13ERPUNK]

+1 OP

[(PSN)STARSIDE_DESTINY]

I completely agree. Syndicate mods are no excuse for useless powers like Ice Wave, especially considering how hard they are to obtain. I also agree with letir that event mods shouldn't replace older mods because of their limited quantity and giant advantage over their traditional counterparts (i.e. Fanged Fusillade compared to Sawtooth Clip), since DE doesn't seem to be in much of a rush to make them re-accessible again.

[TrinityPrime]

It's almost like there's two dev teams dealing with the same problems.

 

New stuff team: adds new stuff to make things interesting.

 

Balance team: with two modes (Nerf) and (Nope)

[Azamagon]

Completely agreed OP, I have even talked about this before.

 

The thing is, Augment mods have TREMENDOUS potential (like all things in Warframe, heh). Take an ability, and make it worthwhile baseline. Now add at least 2 different augment mods for said skill (only one is equippable per ability). Example:

 

Crush. Absolutely lackluster. Make it good baseline, like this:

* 50/50 of damage is now Magnetic and Puncture (makes way more sense)

* Once reaching the end of the ability, all enemies are slammed together in front of Mag. For each unit lifted, all targets suffer an additional 40 Impact damage (corpses also contribute!). That further emphasizes Mag's role as a "Reverser", using the power of the enemies to her advantage, here taking advantage of their numbers, their horde-powers.

* Once all enemies are slammed together, they lay on the ground for up to 4 seconds, still crushed together (think: Ragdolled). Affected by Power Duration.

 

Now you have a very solid Ultimate! What could the Augments do then? Some random ideas:

 

Augment 1) Railgun Crush - After enemies are slammed together, they are then launched in the direction Mag is aiming and anything colliding suffers X Impact damage (corpses also count).

Augment 2) Sadistic Crush - After enemies are slammed together, enemies are still held together in the air, suffering constant Magnetic damage, but Mag now also starts draining energy over time. Let's go by casting it again, or if all enemies die.

Augment 3) Forcefield Crush - While the animation lasts, Mag also projects a magnetic forcefield. This forcefield stops all gunfire from hitting Mag (maybe even launch the projectiles back?) and greatly slows down any unit that enters, which wasn't lifted.

 

See? A viable ability now can be augmented to further awesomeness. How do you want to augment it? Launching CC and added damage? Use Augment 1. Lasting CC and added damage? Then use Augment 2. More defense? Then use Augment 3.

 

Augments... it could be so much fun. But like all things in Warframe, they fail in their execution and due to their extreme lack of polish...

Edited January 1, 2015 by Azamagon

[AlphaHorseman]

Completely agreed OP, I have even talked about this before.

 

The thing is, Augment mods have TREMENDOUS potential (like all things in Warframe, heh). Take an ability, and make it worthwhile baseline. Now add at least 2 different augment mods for said skill (only one is equippable per ability). Example:

 

Crush. Absolutely lackluster. Make it good baseline, like this:

* 50/50 of damage is now Magnetic and Puncture (makes way more sense)

* Once reaching the end of the ability, all enemies are slammed together in front of Mag. For each unit lifted, all targets suffer an additional 40 Impact damage (corpses also contribute!). That further emphasizes Mag's role as a "Reverser", using the power of the enemies to her advantage, here taking advantage of their numbers, their horde-powers.

* Once all enemies are slammed together, they lay on the ground for up to 4 seconds, still crushed together (think: Ragdolled). Affected by Power Duration.

 

Now you have a very solid Ultimate! What could the Augments do then? Some random ideas:

 

Augment 1) Railgun Crush - After enemies are slammed together, they are then launched in the direction Mag is aiming and anything colliding suffers X Impact damage (corpses also count).

Augment 2) Sadistic Crush - After enemies are slammed together, enemies are still held together in the air, suffering constant Magnetic damage, but Mag now also starts draining energy over time. Let's go by casting it again, or if all enemies die.

Augment 3) Forcefield Crush - While the animation lasts, Mag also projects a magnetic forcefield. This forcefield stops all gunfire from hitting Mag (maybe even launch the projectiles back?) and greatly slows down any unit that enters, which wasn't lifted.

 

See? A viable ability now can be augmented to further awesomeness. How do you want to augment it? Launching CC and added damage? Use Augment 1. Lasting CC and added damage? Then use Augment 2. More defense? Then use Augment 3.

 

Augments... it could be so much fun. But like all things in Warframe, they fail in their execution and due to their extreme lack of polish...

Haha, I like your ideas, solid abilities that function quite well on their own, and augments that add dynamics that make the power interesting to use. I too see this as a potential to expand and build on our powers, but only if our abilities have a strong enough foundation to ensure that the system is stable building upwards and outwards. Such stability can only exist if our powers are solid on their own.

[Azamagon]

Haha, I like your ideas, solid abilities that function quite well on their own, and augments that add dynamics that make the power interesting to use. I too see this as a potential to expand and build on our powers, but only if our abilities have a strong enough foundation to ensure that the system is stable building upwards and outwards. Such stability can only exist if our powers are solid on their own.

Yup. Augments were simply added too early. A LOT of abilities still need a whole bunch of improvement and polishing before augments even comes into question.

[AlphaHorseman]

This is a "new" (actually, very old) DE's method of "fixing" things.

 

Bandaid mods.

 

Before it was only aids like Handspring, anti-knockdown mods or S#&$ like Maglev. Now they can just fix every damn thing with new mods.

 

Physical mods are weak? Let's introduce new, event-limited physical mods, this will fix the problem.

Status mods are weak? Let's introduce new status mods, this will fix the problem.

 

Abiltites are weak? Frames are bad? Let's introduce new mods, which can actually make ability viable (like Pacifying Bolts).

It seems we have a new symptom that has become another source as well.  I would have thought such characteristics and utility mods like Maglev would be integrated into the frames themselves, or at the very least buffed.

[GideonG]

Completely agreed. 

 

I think so many of the ability mods we have now should just be folded into the abilities themselves. Far too many of them take a "meh" power and make it slightly more useful (Looking at you, elemental damage single-target mods). Far too few justify actually using them over another mod.

[AlphaHorseman]

Completely agreed. 

 

I think so many of the ability mods we have now should just be folded into the abilities themselves. Far too many of them take a "meh" power and make it slightly more useful (Looking at you, elemental damage single-target mods). Far too few justify actually using them over another mod.

Any you would say specifically? I'm trying to see what other augments others within the community feel are lackluster and/or are traits that should be built into the powers.