swihart91 Posted February 3, 2015 Share Posted February 3, 2015 Can I ask why you brought this idea up when it's been stated it won't happen? I don't get why this was made at all Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brandr_ Posted February 3, 2015 Share Posted February 3, 2015 No I would leave The moment I saw "You require a subscription" I would quit out, and uninstall the game I've never done that in one stride, normally takes days of deliberation But if I see a subscription button, it's off my computer, and I'm never playing again. Even if they get rid of it. Why? Because they thought to do it and tried Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
havikryan Posted February 3, 2015 Share Posted February 3, 2015 The slogan ninjas play free would die that's not the correct slogan anyways, it's ''ninja's grind for free'' Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
direcyphre Posted February 3, 2015 Share Posted February 3, 2015 How about this plan: Build your own subscription plan! Set aside $10-$20 a month and buy potatoes and cosmetics to your hearts desire! Suddenly that Prime Access even costs $10-$20 less each time it comes up because you set aside those funds! Amazing! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RyojinOrion Posted February 3, 2015 Share Posted February 3, 2015 It would kill the game for it to change to subscription. Partly because it isn't good enough for that, partly because so many people play it because it is free, and partly because subscription models just don't work anymore. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MaverickZero Posted February 3, 2015 Share Posted February 3, 2015 How about this plan: Build your own subscription plan! Set aside $10-$20 a month and buy potatoes and cosmetics to your hearts desire! Suddenly that Prime Access even costs $10-$20 less each time it comes up because you set aside those funds! Amazing! This message is brought to you by: Common Sense Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nickelshark Posted February 3, 2015 Share Posted February 3, 2015 (edited) I would stop playing. I have always avoided games with a monthly subscription *cough* ESO*cough* even if I really wanted to play them. Since gaming can be a really on or off kinda thing for me, I would rather not have to be paying for a game that I don't feel like playing for the month cause then I'm just wasting even more money. The point being, WF is a game in which people frequently take breaks, and since there is no monthly subscription people can do so w/o worrying about wasting money. I feel with a subscription, it would turn into a "I feel like I have to play" vs "I feel like playing WF today", which just kills the fun real quick especially since WF is grindy. Grindy+feeling obligated to play= very sad person. Edited February 3, 2015 by nickelshark Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OverlordMcGeek Posted February 3, 2015 Share Posted February 3, 2015 most of us would quit immediately Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ComfyOlivia Posted February 3, 2015 Share Posted February 3, 2015 (edited) First things first, where are you getting this data? 8 million count playerbase? Where did you get this number from? And how are you sure Warframe will necessarily "step out of beta"? I know that due to certain legal documentations Warframe is considered a beta, but in Warframe's current state, should it really be considered as such? You appear to be making a lot of leaps. Either way, here are some questions I can think of. Has Warframe Gotten To A Point Where Subscriptions Would Properly Uphold DE? No. Absolutely Not. How many standalone games, like Warframe (the developing companies have only worked on that one game), are out there run on the Subscription model and manage to keep their company going? I can't think of any. Past that, even in companies where the subbed game isn't the only game the company depends on, I can only think of one company that has managed to float successfully. And that is Blizzard. Subscriptions models only work when the company has a multiple means of profit, the game can sustain itself, and when the community feels like the game is worth playing. DE only fully meets one of those, and partially meets another. DE does not have multiple means of profit. Warframe is DE's thing. Warframe can kinda sustain itself. After a couple of weeks, though, new content is necessary due to the lack of endgame. And as to whether or not the community feels like the game is worth playing: if Waframe didn't meet this criteria, it'd be dead anyway. Warframe with subscriptions would not be able to sustain DE. On one side, Warframe simply would not make enough. $15 dollars a month from players who decide to stick around, or what they are now making from Prime Access and simple micro transactions? On the other side, Warframe does not have endgame. Once you have played about half the starmap, used all of the frames, and built all non-clan tech weapons, you've basically got the entire Warframe experience. There are no real means of diversely challenging yourself late game. Yes, you can do endless gametypes, but at that point, it's the same thing over and over. Would The Players Be Willing To Pay A Monthly? According to every post in this thread, hell no. You Speak Of A Double Edged Sword, But Is It Present Here? "One flaw with this strategy is obvious...limited and unpredictable funding. The strategy is limited by those who choose whether or not to support DE financially while being unpredictable because of in-game market values, special offers, player demands, etc. While this strategy is ideal for gamers, a free game to play, it can either greatly benefit or hurt it's maker." So this double edged sword is effected by whether or not people decide DE and Waframe are worth supporting? This is also a matter of relevance. Does this double edge even exist as Warframe is right not? How is this double edge even related to Warframe and DE as they are? It seems like you've done some research. You appear to have missed the part that includes the fact that DE is, at the moment, growing. DE recently struck a deal with a couple of Chinese companies. This means money is still coming in. This sword only applies if people are not interested. The current situation is exactly the opposite. The community, the game, and DE are growing each day. The sword simply isn't relevant. I understand why this was a curiosity. The only problem with this curiosity is that it is just wrong. Going from Free To Play to Subscription is what people call regression. Games go TO F2P, not from it. Right now, this is literally one of the worst things DE could do. Edited February 3, 2015 by CoRRh Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
-Ropefish- Posted February 3, 2015 Share Posted February 3, 2015 NOPE Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
geninrising Posted February 3, 2015 Share Posted February 3, 2015 DE cannot afford to implement a subscription base because their game does not offer enough to keep a player paying constantly. We long time players would simply cease to participate between updates that are large due to the fact that we would be essentially paying for nothing at all. Currently the way the game keeps us here is hope for the newer updates. If you added a pay to play aspect it would not be attractive enough. Other MMO's that have pay 2 play have been statistically a failure except for WoW and previous to that Everquest. The reason those games were constantly p2p viable is because they had a never ending stream of activities to engage in whereas WF is a game where you get new stuff occasionally and then have nothing to do. IF Warframe added a full free roam world full of quests and various other things not combat related THEN and only THEN could they potentially make it p2p but I doubt that will happen because statistically in recent years data has shown that f2p games are actually more profitable than subscription based games due to the number of whales (people that spend idiotic amounts of money in a relatively short time). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
(PSN)Rawdoginher Posted February 3, 2015 Author Share Posted February 3, 2015 First things first, where are you getting this data? 8 million count playerbase? Where did you get this number from? And how are you sure Warframe will necessarily "step out of beta"? I know that due to certain legal documentations Warframe is considered a beta, but in Warframe's current state, should it really be considered as such? You appear to be making a lot of leaps. Either way, here are some questions I can think of. Has Warframe Gotten To A Point Where Subscriptions Would Properly Uphold DE? No. Absolutely Not. How many standalone games, like Warframe (the developing companies have only worked on that one game), are out there run on the Subscription model and manage to keep their company going? I can't think of any. Past that, even in companies where the subbed game isn't the only game the company depends on, I can only think of one company that has managed to float successfully. And that is Blizzard. Subscriptions models only work when the company has a multiple means of profit, the game can sustain itself, and when the community feels like the game is worth playing. DE only fully meets one of those, and partially meets another. DE does not have multiple means of profit. Warframe is DE's thing. Warframe can kinda sustain itself. After a couple of weeks, though, new content is necessary due to the lack of endgame. And as to whether or not the community feels like the game is worth playing: if Waframe didn't meet this criteria, it'd be dead anyway. Warframe with subscriptions would not be able to sustain DE. On one side, Warframe simply would not make enough. $15 dollars a month from players who decide to stick around, or what they are now making from Prime Access and simple micro transactions? On the other side, Warframe does not have endgame. Once you have played about half the starmap, used all of the frames, and built all non-clan tech weapons, you've basically got the entire Warframe experience. There are no real means of diversely challenging yourself late game. Yes, you can do endless gametypes, but at that point, it's the same thing over and over. Would The Players Be Willing To Pay A Monthly? According to every post in this thread, hell no. You Speak Of A Double Edged Sword, But Is It Present Here? "One flaw with this strategy is obvious...limited and unpredictable funding. The strategy is limited by those who choose whether or not to support DE financially while being unpredictable because of in-game market values, special offers, player demands, etc. While this strategy is ideal for gamers, a free game to play, it can either greatly benefit or hurt it's maker." So this double edged sword is effected by whether or not people decide DE and Waframe are worth supporting? This is also a matter of relevance. Does this double edge even exist as Warframe is right not? How is this double edge even related to Warframe and DE as they are? It seems like you've done some research. You appear to have missed the part that includes the fact that DE is, at the moment, growing. DE recently struck a deal with a couple of Chinese companies. This means money is still coming in. This sword only applies if people are not interested. The current situation is exactly the opposite. The community, the game, and DE are growing each day. The sword simply isn't relevant. I understand why this was a curiosity. The only problem with this curiosity is that it is just wrong. Going from Free To Play to Subscription is what people call regression. Games go TO F2P, not from it. Right now, this is literally one of the worst things DE could do. I gert me a big one fellers!!! Hold my legs so I don't fall overboard! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rakosta_Kai Posted February 3, 2015 Share Posted February 3, 2015 Popular misconceptions.... Warframe isn't lacking funding... It made considerably more than many of the other AAA MMO's on the market last year. Warframe's current issues wouldn't improve with a forced subscription model... They (the problems) would, if anything, grow exponentially because expectation would be that much higher. A optional subscription model that gave users a certain amount of plat monthly and access to the Prime Access would probably prove rather profitable for them though. Simply put, Warframe has stumbled into being an MMO but is being managed and developed like a console multiplayer mode. Until DE decides to manage and develop the game differently the game won't evolve and grow but is going to continue on its' current path until it stagnates. It's happening even now... Money isn't going to fix that... Only the adoption of new development and troubleshooting methods, creative direction, and monetization initiatives will fix what Warframe is dealing with at this point. For example: MH2015 is also a micro-transaction game that F2P but has a monetization scenario that makes players want to give them money. That's as it should be. Just about everything that isn't a costume item or pack space can be earned. That said, the drop rates for the most valuable items tend to actually be lower... but the game makes sure that even if you spend 5 minutes in the game you have a rewarding game experience and got something worthwhile. The game took player feedback and used it to create a rewarding game experience on every log-in. Comparatively, Warframe's monetization setup is downright predatory... The game now trends toward using successive grindwalls as a means of content and pure chance as a means of progression. Spend 20 minutes grinding to get a key only to spend 40 minutes, on average, grinding the locked area to acquire common junk 90% of the time. The odds of having a rewarding game experience not related to an alert in Warframe are -quite literally- as high as winning a large payout on a slot machine in a Casino. Warframe can not be trusted to offer a rewarding game experience that isn't tied to the Alert system. So, in short, a subscription model won't fix what's presently wrong with Warframe. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Edgedemon Posted February 3, 2015 Share Posted February 3, 2015 what happens when WF steps out of BETA? Just telling you but the game is unlikely to step out of beta in the foreseeable future, that is common within the F2P games where launch usually means a slow in development. Why is there still so much lag? most of the game uses a one of the players in the round as host server for that particular instance so either you or the host have bad internet, DE can't fix that for you... well they can optimize the transfer process but there are limits to what that would improve Why isn't there more content? well it has had an amazing grow rate, if you had been here with us one year ago, you would notice the game is like 2 times bigger... but not always new is good, several of us would rather have them fix the things that have been pilling up.. The list could go on. While there are many answers to these questions, one usually fits the bill...quite literally. That answer is simply funding. While WF is Free-to-Play, in order to enjoy certain aspects of the game, quickly move through ranks, or quickly acquire new and exciting gear, a player must either purchase Platinum (digital currency of WF) or complete enough trades with other players to acquire Platinum. This, in an obvious sense is how DE is able to fund WF and bring excitement to it's fan base. While this method is great for attracting and keeping gamers of all kinds, it is also a double-edged sword. actually F2P games generate several times more money than p2p games because there is a constant "need" to spend money, DE has been seeing an explosive grow, with their current model, they release info now and then if you are interested read into that. Lastly over the last years all p2p games have made a switch into some form of f2p or hybrid model some of them while still in development, (LOTR, RIFT, TERA, AION, SWTOR even Elder Scrolls is already preparing to change) so why would a game that is already in this side of the fence want to go against the current? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sziklamester Posted February 3, 2015 Share Posted February 3, 2015 (edited) I can say a subscription based paying method would be nice for this game if they solve that problem the most of playerbase are freely and doesn't want to pay for better performance. As wow/wildstar/guildwars2 and champions online player I can say the sub based paying not a bad idea because the online games mostly needs huge servers and hundreds of peoples working on them to constantly improve the performance. 10-15 or 20 dollar in a month is not a big deal you can buy a daily meal with this price but you can play how much you can. The most problem here is the current model and the founder program which is almost similar a life time subscriber whom got extras for their money and have a lot of peoples whom not pay any cent for this game. An optional subscription fee system which have in some online games could be nice but still there is a lot of trouble how to implement into this game now the TESO also changed but they wasn't idiots and they kept the subscription fees for those whom want to help the game. Almost all ideas bad whom say the sub fee system bad because of just. Those who say there is no have enough time to play and cry to spend a relatively little sum for an online distribution simply just pfff. Personally I would like some implementation here for those whom want much better performance and not lag fests all the day and I am willingly to pay for it. The free to play idea also not bad in a context it's free and let you choose to pay and play without spending money. This free to play system which we have is just enough only for the current laggy performance and crashy-buggy experience and often need alt+x the game to not lose my progress during play. Once I had a very bad day when I cannot join to any mission and often crashed when I succesfully joined into a game. My pc and net connection is pretty awesome but this game ruin it. My opinion is again an optional sub fee system not bad idea but then the freely dudes will cry the game turned into pay to win. Edited February 3, 2015 by Sziklamester Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
(PSN)MoRockaPDX Posted February 3, 2015 Share Posted February 3, 2015 Probably see the games traffic drop to Star Trek online levels, and it has a free 2 play entry level. SO does DCUO I believe. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Katakuna Posted February 3, 2015 Share Posted February 3, 2015 (edited) I wouldn't have started playing if it launched as P2P, and if it switched to P2P after I started, I'd give up whatever hope I had left of this game actually being great one day. Pay to Play is an outdated system; Free to Play is more profitable, and popular. Edited February 3, 2015 by Katakuna Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ricardo58 Posted February 3, 2015 Share Posted February 3, 2015 The subscription model has come and gone, it's dead now, fact. Many former sub mmo's going F2P or B2P is a good example of this... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Venus-Venera Posted February 3, 2015 Share Posted February 3, 2015 I wouldn't have started playing if it launched as P2P, and if it switched to P2P after I started, I'd give up whatever hope I had left of this game actually being great one day. Pay to Play is an outdated system; Free to Play is more profitable, and popular. there are games that are worth monthly cash. but this game isn't one of them Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OniDax Posted February 3, 2015 Share Posted February 3, 2015 Hey there Tenno! Now I know this subject has most likely already been brought up but I'd like to see what players say about it as of now. Warframe has been growing consistently over the years and has spread across 3 platforms (PC, PS4, and Xbox). With an estimated 8 million player base, Warframe is a title to be reckoned with in the Free-to-Play community. Having this in mind, some questions have ongoing/new questions being asked. For instance: what happens when WF steps out of BETA? Why is there still so much lag? Why isn't there more content? The list could go on. While there are many answers to these questions, one usually fits the bill...quite literally. That answer is simply funding. While WF is Free-to-Play, in order to enjoy certain aspects of the game, quickly move through ranks, or quickly acquire new and exciting gear, a player must either purchase Platinum (digital currency of WF) or complete enough trades with other players to acquire Platinum. This, in an obvious sense is how DE is able to fund WF and bring excitement to it's fan base. While this method is great for attracting and keeping gamers of all kinds, it is also a double-edged sword. One flaw with this strategy is obvious...limited and unpredictable funding. The strategy is limited by those who choose whether or not to support DE financially while being unpredictable because of in-game market values, special offers, player demands, etc. While this strategy is ideal for gamers, a free game to play, it can either greatly benefit or hurt it's maker. Here is what I am asking the entire community of Warframe. What if DE implemented a subscription in order to better fund Warframe? Keep in mind the pros/cons. Possible pros would be more frequently given content, better gaming performance quality, new and exciting concepts able to be brought to light, etc. while cons being Pay-to-Play, a possible drop in fan base, etc. I'm not voting either side. I would like to hear what everyone has to say. I would drop Warframe if DE implemented a required subscription. If it was optional, then I'd be fine with that (however, with a Prime Access every three months, I'd say that financially covers an optional subscription). As well, subscriptions do not guarantee more frequent content, better performance, new concepts, etc. That creativity or lack thereof exists regarless of subscription or funding. The frequency of content depends on the number of personnel that can produce that content. The performance depends on the skill of the coders and the quality of the software. The freshness and newness of concepts depends on the creativity of the devs. None of that is made better with funding. Funding could bring in more people, but money does not equal "better", nor does less money equal "better". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChameleonDude Posted February 3, 2015 Share Posted February 3, 2015 People would just quit playing, simple. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kaisty Posted February 3, 2015 Share Posted February 3, 2015 If Warframe had a subscription? I got three answers for you! 1. NO! 2. NO NO NO!!! 3. See 1 and 2. I have never heard of a game going from "Free to Play" to "Pay to Play" due to the fact that not everyone would want to subscribe in order to play a game. If a game started as Pay to play and stayed like that, it is one thing. If it goes from Pay to Play to Free to Play, that is another. Like many have said before, Free to Play to Pay to Play would be suicide in a business standpoint. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheGuyver Posted February 3, 2015 Share Posted February 3, 2015 Hey there Tenno! Now I know this subject has most likely already been brought up but I'd like to see what players say about it as of now. Warframe has been growing consistently over the years and has spread across 3 platforms (PC, PS4, and Xbox). With an estimated 8 million player base, Warframe is a title to be reckoned with in the Free-to-Play community. Having this in mind, some questions have ongoing/new questions being asked. For instance: what happens when WF steps out of BETA? Why is there still so much lag? Why isn't there more content? The list could go on. While there are many answers to these questions, one usually fits the bill...quite literally. That answer is simply funding. While WF is Free-to-Play, in order to enjoy certain aspects of the game, quickly move through ranks, or quickly acquire new and exciting gear, a player must either purchase Platinum (digital currency of WF) or complete enough trades with other players to acquire Platinum. This, in an obvious sense is how DE is able to fund WF and bring excitement to it's fan base. While this method is great for attracting and keeping gamers of all kinds, it is also a double-edged sword. One flaw with this strategy is obvious...limited and unpredictable funding. The strategy is limited by those who choose whether or not to support DE financially while being unpredictable because of in-game market values, special offers, player demands, etc. While this strategy is ideal for gamers, a free game to play, it can either greatly benefit or hurt it's maker. Here is what I am asking the entire community of Warframe. What if DE implemented a subscription in order to better fund Warframe? Keep in mind the pros/cons. Possible pros would be more frequently given content, better gaming performance quality, new and exciting concepts able to be brought to light, etc. while cons being Pay-to-Play, a possible drop in fan base, etc. I'm not voting either side. I would like to hear what everyone has to say. I have a better question, what if people stopped asking this question and making threads about it four times a week? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Valafor Posted February 3, 2015 Share Posted February 3, 2015 The slogan ninjas play free would die Ninjas play free? More like Ninjas pay fees. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iuki. Posted February 4, 2015 Share Posted February 4, 2015 (edited) If this went sub based or worse a 'premium' sub then that is the day I uninstall WF and never play it again. No ty to sub in a game that proudly proclaims as their motto: Ninjas play for free. Edited February 4, 2015 by fizbit Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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