Braton Prime > Synoid Gammacor

[JustAn0ther]

I think you're SEVERELY underestimating Synoid Gammacor's raw damage output. And if you're staying long enough to the point where your damage will eventually stop instantly murdering everything, you either already have 4x Corrosive Projection or don't know how to plan ahead. Yes, if you're fighting level 200 enemies with no Corrosive Projections then Braton Prime will be by far the superior gun, but there's just no situation where Synoid Gammacor's damage starts falling off and you haven't already planned out your build to accommodate that.

 

It's like saying Dread is inferior to Braton Prime because it doesn't proc as often in a given amount of time. Does it need to?

Edited March 15, 2015 by JustAn0ther

[TheGuyver]

I'm not using some secret build lol

Use

Serration

Heavy cal

Split

Shred

4 element event mods

You'll have a 88.5 percent proc chance and you'll proc corrosive/viral and slash like crazy so you'll be able to debuff the hell out of lv 100+ enemies

 

As much as I like the braton prime, there's no real "secret builds" and sticking four elemental events on something doesn't make it uberfantasticalamazeballs. There's numerous guns out that benefit from the raw status rather than the four status mods on them. That's the only real thing I have to disagree with you on.

Edited March 15, 2015 by TheGuyverOne

[HibikiGanaha]

I think this thread illustrates perfectly how completely game breaking Corrosive Projection stacking is and DE should nerf it into the ground.

 

That seems to be the only argument against the OP.

[vaugahn]

Braton Prime does not have good ammo economy at higher levels, and IPS means you get a lot of useless procs. 

 

Synoid has fantastic ammo efficiency and can be built with better elementals can Braton Prime. It also has access to pistol mods, which are far better than rifle mods. 

 

That's not even taking damage into consideration.

 

The Braton Prime is definitely a top-tier weapon, but it can't compete with the sheer killing power of the Synoid. The Synoid is strong enough to kill through armor that the Braton Prime would have to strip away first.

[Acos]

About Viral: 

 

Any new proc of viral on an already proc'd enemy should "refresh" the amount of time they spend... viral'd. If the viral proc wears off before you kill the enemy, they actually recover the lost hit points. I have a thread about this (with pictures), as I was trying to confirm whether or not this was the intended behavior of the proc (it conflicts with what is stated on the wiki). As such, I do still consider a high proc rate important for Viral as having it wear off before you can kill the enemy effectively means it never occurred.  

 

The Synoid Gammacor and the Braton Prime will both proc often enough that the Viral Proc should be able to remain for the duration that the enemy is alive, meaning that it is once again a damage per second race. As such, the Synoid Gammacor should win against the Braton Prime, assuming that they both began striking the target at the same time. 

The biggest draw back to the Synoid Gammacor is that it is a "short-range" weapon at 25m (which is about 7.5 stories high. So you know, "short"). Braton Prime and other Hit-Scan weapons do not have an effective range fall-off, so if you are in an open area with enemies who are far away you can actually out damage the Synoid Gammacor by simply killing enemies it can't hit yet. 

 

This is especially pronounced in lower level missions where both weapons are quite capable of one-shotting enemies. At that point it's the mechanics of the gun, and the user operating the weapon, that make the most difference in which is contributing towards the overall damage done by the squad. In lower level missions I've out-damaged Boltor Prime and Synoid Gammacor users alike with something benign (like a normal Braton) by just being a better shot than them. 

Edited March 16, 2015 by Acos

[HibikiGanaha]

The biggest draw back to the Synoid Gammacor is that it is a "short-range" weapon at 25m (which is about 7.5 stories high. So you know, "short"). Braton Prime and other Hit-Scan weapons do not have an effective range fall-off, so if you are in an open area with enemies who are far away you can actually out damage the Synoid Gammacor by simply killing enemies it can't hit yet. 

 

This is especially pronounced in lower level missions where both weapons are quite capable of one-shotting enemies. At that point it's the mechanics of the gun, and the user operating the weapon, that make the most difference in which is contributing towards the overall damage done by the squad. In lower level missions I've out-damaged Boltor Prime and Synoid Gammacor users alike with something benign (like a normal Braton) by just being a better shot than them. 

I have been trying to get this point across to people in another thread but they absolutely refuse to acknowledge it.  Thank you for this post.

[Pizzarugi]

I think this thread illustrates perfectly how completely game breaking Corrosive Projection stacking is and DE should nerf it into the ground.

 

That seems to be the only argument against the OP.

You and me think differently then.

This thread is more about proving that infinitely scaling armor on higher levels is stupidly broken and forces us to resort to these methods to work around it.

Enemies just need a flat armor level, let everything else scale.

Edited March 15, 2015 by Pizzarugi

[VikingHelm]

Just goes to show you how simple minded the general community is with posts like this.

Seriously is it that hard to understand that armor scaling never stops?

Is it that hard to understand reducing armor will net you more DMG than anything in endless play?

Seriously you're sad and I can't wait to post a video next time I play at least 50 mins of t4s and I honestly find it comical that I even have to do that.

IF YOU USE 4 CP THEN USE VIRAL FFS PPL

 

TL;DR we're waiting for the video.

[(PSN)TheArrowOfGod]

You can't outkill us even if you're right because while you're out of ammo running around for more we'll still be truckin'

Edited March 15, 2015 by (PS4)TheArrowOfGod

[onemoonlight]

you mistyped grakata

[Llyssa]

About Viral: 

 

Any new proc of viral on an already proc'd enemy should "refresh" the amount of time they spend... viral'd. If the viral proc wears off before you kill the enemy, they actually recover the lost hit points. I have a thread about this (with pictures), as I was trying to confirm whether or not this was the intended behavior of the proc (it conflicts with what is stated on the wiki). As such, I do still consider a high proc rate important for Viral as having it wear off before you can kill the enemy effectively means it never occurred.  

 

The Synoid Gammacor and the Braton Prime will both proc often enough that the Viral Proc should be able to remain for the duration that the enemy is alive, meaning that it is once again a damage per second race. As such, the Synoid Gammacor should win against the Braton Prime, assuming that they both began striking the target at the same time. 

The biggest draw back to the Synoid Gammacor is that it is a "short-range" weapon at 25m (which is about 7.5 stories high. So you know, "short"). Braton Prime and other Hit-Scan weapons do not have an effective range fall-off, so if you are in an open area with enemies who are far away you can actually out damage the Synoid Gammacor by simply killing enemies it can't hit yet. 

 

This is especially pronounced in lower level missions where both weapons are quite capable of one-shotting enemies. At that point it's the mechanics of the gun, and the user operating the weapon, that make the most difference in which is contributing towards the overall damage done by the squad. In lower level missions I've out-damaged Boltor Prime and Synoid Gammacor users alike with something benign (like a normal Braton) by just being a better shot than them. 

Viral was fixed a while back because 100% proc weapons with rapid fire could effectively kill an enemy through max shields without inflicting any damage.

[Neogeo]

Why can't you just use Bolor Prime instead? The slash damage on the weapon had nothing to do with the chance to proc. Bolor Prime can also proc bleeding damage, viral or corrosive. Your argument is void

[Inarticulate]

The biggest draw back to the Synoid Gammacor is that it is a "short-range" weapon at 25m (which is about 7.5 stories high. So you know, "short"). Braton Prime and other Hit-Scan weapons do not have an effective range fall-off, so if you are in an open area with enemies who are far away you can actually out damage the Synoid Gammacor by simply killing enemies it can't hit yet. 

25 meters is a bit less than the distance from my balcony to the front door of my apartment building and isn't really that far. Or about twice the length of my living room.

 

 

Anyways, a status build with the Braton Prime (4 status elementals + Shred) hits 68% status chance per bullet, fires 12.48 shots per second with 1.9 bullets per shot for a total of 23.7 bullets per second, and can sustain fire for 3.16 seconds before needing to reload. Assuming all status procs have an equal probability, there is a 13.6% chance of any one status proccing per bullet, which results in:

- a 58.0% chance one particular status procs in the first quarter second

- an 82.3% chance one particular status procs in the first half second

- a 96.9% chance one particular status procs in the first second.

This means that for a status that you only need to proc once, like Radiation or Viral, you're virtually guaranteed a proc if the target isn't already dead.

 

With a 13.6% chance of a particular status proccing per bullet and a total of 23.7 bullets per second, you have an expected value of proccing that status 3.2 times per second. This particular build does 150.5 base damage per bullet, which results in 52.7 damage per Slash tick for 7 ticks for a total of 369 damage. Assuming your target never dies, that's mathematically equivalent to all of the Slash proc damage being dealt at the moment it procs, so that's effectively an increase to its DPS by 1.2k while the weapon is firing, or 700 sustained DPS. 

 

This Braton Prime build therefore has a sustained DPS of 10.5k, but because a Viral proc is virtually guaranteed, this is effectively a sustained DPS of 20.9k.

 

This is still only half the sustained DPS of a Synoid Gammacor modded for raw damage, assuming 4 Corrosive Projections.

 

Without Corrosive Projection, I'm not going to bother doing the math because I don't know the armor numbers for enemies with levels in the hundreds, but I'm going to make a guess that the constant Corrosive procs from the Braton Prime are actually going to close the gap between them (even though that means without Viral, your raw DPS is only a quarter that of the Synoid Gammacor).

Edited March 15, 2015 by Inarticulate

[TheGuyver]

Why can't you just use Bolor Prime instead? The slash damage on the weapon had nothing to do with the chance to proc. Bolor Prime can also proc bleeding damage, viral or corrosive. Your argument is void

 

I don't recall this being the "i love boltor prime thread". Saying boltor is better because it can proc and telling people their argument is void isn't really a good way to win an argument either, and some people like using other guns.

[Neogeo]

I don't recall this being the "i love boltor prime thread". Saying boltor is better because it can proc and telling people their argument is void isn't really a good way to win an argument either, and some people like using other guns.

I used Boltor Prime because its one of the highest DPS automatic weapon. Other weapon work too as long as they can reach more than 50% status chance. Braton Prime is a weak example as the DPS is too low. I hate it when people like you just can't wait to show your hatred everytime Boltor Prime was mentioned. FFS, if you hate the weapon so much, just don't use it.

[TheGuyver]

. FFS, if you hate the weapon so much, just don't use it.

 

If you love the weapon so much, don't come into other peoples threads and shove it down their throat if they prefer to use something. I also never said I hated the gun, so don't put words in my mouth because you want to get your point across because all that does is make you look ignorant. It's one of my top weapons, I'm not just fond of using the same gun over and over again like it was the holy grail of warframe guns.

 

If you don't have anything to actually contribute other than trying to twist peoples words and shove the boltor prime on them, then don't try and derail the thread anymore than you already have.

Edited March 15, 2015 by TheGuyverOne

[DrBorris]

You know Synoid is a status cannon too, right?

[Nira]

 

Tysis outperforms them all.

 

 

This guy gets it.

[Genoscythe]

What OP didnt consider is that there is corrosive projection...

[KyrosQF]

So against lv 80+ enemies the braton prime deals higher DPs than the synoid gammacor.

Why you ask? Well enemy stats are theoretically limitless as you play endless missions and such foes will get to a certain point where debuffing them will allow you to deal more DMG.

Due to braton primes ability to stack corrosive procs or viral if using 4 CP, along with its ridiculous slash procs, this gun will reverse scale and end up dealing more DMG than even the syngam thanks to debuffing the OP armor of warframe enemies.

Also the SynGam procs per second which is IMO why the gun really falls off against lv 100+ enemies much more than guns that proc per bullet rather than second.

Seriously all you little kids that check out paper DPs have no idea that braton prime is arguably the best gun in the game in terms of endless play.

 

idk my 222% fire rate Hikou Prime gets over 40 status procs per second...primary reason why it absolutely destroys despair which has virtually no crit/status. And yes, I have both weapons fully modded.

 

At some point the status procs are too high, so I just retain the 60% Fire Rate / 60% multishot and can still apply far more procs per second than any other weapon.

 

But here's the problem with comparing it to Synoid Gammacor....running against void or grineer a group can go 4 corrosive projection which removes the need for corrosive procs. Also guess how many times viral needs to proc to be viable on a target? Just once. Apparently it used to be stackable, not so much anymore RIP.

[direcyphre]

What the OP has not considered is how single-damage type weapons are wholly superior as status weapons than ones with physical damage. By which I'm referring to guns that fire only magnetic, only electric, or any singular elemental damage type. When physical damage types are involved, you are even less likely to get the 'useful' procs you are really after with your elemental damage types. Even if you proc 88% of the time, it is split between Impact, Puncture, and Slashing besides your chosen elemental types.

 

That's not to say they are bad, but you aren't going to infinitely stack Corrosive procs no matter how hard you try.

 

Nevermind the fact that people already use Corrosive most of the time. Braton Prime is nice, but it is by no means the top of the heap. That, and anyone intending to do super high wave missions would already equip corrosive projection, and you certainly wouldn't be trying it with randoms. The abilities to proc or otherwise 'strip armor from the enemy' are not at all confined to Braton Prime.

[(PSN)TheArrowOfGod]

I always wanted to say this...INB4LOCK

[Grulos]

OP completely ignores 4x CP. It is the same as proccing corrosive 4 times. Except on ALL enemies at the same time.

 

0 enemy armor means every weapon with more damage than braton prime deals more damage than braton prime.

 

Period.

Edited March 15, 2015 by Grulos

[(PSN)JiggaJazz]

25 meters is a bit less than the distance from my balcony to the front door of my apartment building and isn't really that far. Or about twice the length of my living room.

Anyways, a status build with the Braton Prime (4 status elementals + Shred) hits 68% status chance per bullet, fires 12.48 shots per second with 1.9 bullets per shot for a total of 23.7 bullets per second, and can sustain fire for 3.16 seconds before needing to reload. Assuming all status procs have an equal probability, there is a 13.6% chance of any one status proccing per bullet, which results in:

- a 58.0% chance one particular status procs in the first quarter second

- an 82.3% chance one particular status procs in the first half second

- a 96.9% chance one particular status procs in the first second.

This means that for a status that you only need to proc once, like Radiation or Viral, you're virtually guaranteed a proc if the target isn't already dead.

With a 13.6% chance of a particular status proccing per bullet and a total of 23.7 bullets per second, you have an expected value of proccing that status 3.2 times per second. This particular build does 150.5 base damage per bullet, which results in 52.7 damage per Slash tick for 7 ticks for a total of 369 damage. Assuming your target never dies, that's mathematically equivalent to all of the Slash proc damage being dealt at the moment it procs, so that's effectively an increase to its DPS by 1.2k while the weapon is firing, or 700 sustained DPS.

This Braton Prime build therefore has a sustained DPS of 10.5k, but because a Viral proc is virtually guaranteed, this is effectively a sustained DPS of 20.9k.

This is still only half the sustained DPS of a Synoid Gammacor modded for raw damage, assuming 4 Corrosive Projections.

Without Corrosive Projection, I'm not going to bother doing the math because I don't know the armor numbers for enemies with levels in the hundreds, but I'm going to make a guess that the constant Corrosive procs from the Braton Prime are actually going to close the gap between them (even though that means without Viral, your raw DPS is only a quarter that of the Synoid Gammacor).

You didn't add split chamber into your entire equation which is pretty important lol

Status should be 88.5% with 4 event mods and split

And lol @ the kid that said play boltor prime because it can bleed proc too. I suppose he never used the boltor prime before as it doesn't not have any slash DMG and therefore is impossible to proc bleeding with boltor prime.

OP completely ignores 4x CP. It is the same as proccing corrosive 4 times. Except on ALL enemies at the same time.

0 enemy armor means every weapon with more damage than braton prime deals more damage than braton prime.

Period.

Yes yes yes

Agreed

[shut]

Why can't you just use Bolor Prime instead? The slash damage on the weapon had nothing to do with the chance to proc. Bolor Prime can also proc bleeding damage, viral or corrosive. Your argument is void

 

A weapon that deals 0 slash damage is capable of producing slash procs? This is news to me.