Please Stop With That Stupid Damage Cap.

[DietEbolaCola]

Tenno,

 

Here is your priority target. Your favorite sniper rifle may have issues. I recommend using a weapon designed to take it out instead.

 

 

- Lotus -

 

 

[LeshJaeThiHah]

For how long will you continue slaughtering sniper rifles and shotguns, DE? 

you know i was doing this event in friday i believe. i was running with Dual Zorens at that moment. And i was quite disappointed with the fact that i can only hit behemoth with 2k damage per strike of my zorens.

 

We do have another mob - which have this damage cap mechanics, however only behemoth of dark seed tac alers triggered this massive annoyance in me. And this annoyance is not about actual behemoth, but rather damage cap mechanics by itself.

 

According to warframe-builder my akboltos do have some 54k burst dps (don't jump on numbers here guys, please), but what is the point of having such a sidearm when all its damage is gimped to a level of 2k per hit?

 

What is the point in allowing us, players, to have doomsday weapons on our belts, only to gimp them down to a level of peashooter? I just don't understand the logic behind it. And yes i understand that if not for damage cap - we would probably oneshot this new mob. I get it. I really do, but such a cheap approach to this problem as to implement damage cap is not the way to go.

 

It's not about... sniper rifles or bows or whatever you think has been threated badly by damage cap mechanics. It's about damage mechanics in general.

Edited June 6, 2015 by LeshJaeThiHah

[Vance.Stubbs]

Tenno,

 

Here is your priority target. Your favorite sniper rifle may have issues. I recommend using a weapon designed to take it out instead.

 

 

- Lotus -

 

 

 

 

You are right, man, can't tell the diffirence between those two pics.

[NN13]

Tenno,

 

Here is your priority target. Your favorite sniper rifle may have issues. I recommend using a weapon designed to take it out instead.

 

 

- Lotus -

 

 

 

Fair enough. Snipers are useless. But so are SMGs and ARs.

 

But what happens it a soldier peeks out of the top door(or whatever it is called, not really an army guy here)?

This situation is similar to Juggernaut revealing its weakspot.

 

Sniper takes him out. Assault Rifles might struggle a bit, because of less accuracy.

This is real life scenario, seeing as you are using a real life vehicle.

 

What happens in Warframe is that Snipers take one shot,reducing its health by 1/4th while ARs take 20 shots, reducing its health by 3/4th.

 

Moreover, the designed weapon to take it out is RPG. And when we use something similar to RPG in warframe (read : Opticor,laser RPG I suppose), we don't get the desired result.

Edited June 6, 2015 by NN13

[Autongnosis]

Also, grenade launchers (which are actually DESIGNED to kill armour) are way less effective than SMGs and ARs. Also, tell me exactly how an AR or an SMG should be more effective at taking out a tank than a sniper rifle.

 

So, next time you use a supposedly witty pic to explain a concept, make sure it's related in at least some ways, or at least informed, unless your aim is just to add clutter to the discussion.

Edited June 6, 2015 by Autongnosis

[lightini]

And OP is infact saying that it is the problem of the game mechanics and not the weapon class. Because other that these damage-capping units, Single-shots weapons do just fine. Except that the Sniper class needs a buff. Bows and Opticors are fine against others. I am not an avid Shotgun user, so I will refrain from commenting on those.

 

A better mechanism for the juggernaut would have been complete damage negation from all sources on its armor and huge damage on weakspots. Huge as in about 20 shots from Boltor Prime and Soma Prime and 5-6 shots from Dread, Opticor and the likes on a level 50 Juggernaut.

 

Something similar to Lephantis.

The problem with lephantis is complete damage negation, you don't feel like you are doign anything unless you shoot the weakspots. difference with juggernaut is you know you are doing damage, but not enough. i feel like i'm really working out a way to deal more damage, wheras lephantis, you just wait and shoot, rinse and repeat.

 

And OP was saying Stop the supid damage weapon cap, slaughtering shotguns and snipers, mixing manics nullifiers and juggernaut together when they clearly have different mechanics at hand, wich is not what we are discussing right now, and tried to make a point.

[NN13]

The problem with lephantis is complete damage negation, you don't feel like you are doign anything unless you shoot the weakspots. difference with juggernaut is you know you are doing damage, but not enough. i feel like i'm really working out a way to deal more damage, wheras lephantis, you just wait and shoot, rinse and repeat.

 

And OP was saying Stop the supid damage weapon cap, slaughtering shotguns and snipers, mixing manics nullifiers and juggernaut together when they clearly have different mechanics at hand, wich is not what we are discussing right now, and tried to make a point.

Lephantis vs Juggernaut. I suppose thats a personal choice. I like the Lephantis mechanism more, because it is equally fair to all weapons. But its okay if you like Juggernaut machanism, so I will not argue on that.

 

As for OP, I think you got it wrong. I agree that OP's wording might be cinfusing, but clearly, he is fed up of enemy units rendering single-shot weapons useless.

 

Though Nullifiers, juggernauts and Manics use different types of damage-cap techniques, they are effectively make single-shot weapons useless. So, they are related in that sense.

[DietEbolaCola]

I did notice something with Juggernaut.. the damage cap doesn't seem to scale to enemy level.. which I think the damage cap mechanic should..

 

I was doing the same amount of damage per hit on Juggernaut when he was at level 50 as he was at level 75.

 

BTW, I solo'd him with my Daikyu bow a few times from a perch out of his attack range. It took a lot of ammo restores and timed shots.

 

My high ROF weapon was doing 4 damage per hit and 89 on weak spots. My slowfire bow was doing 100 per hit and 400 on weak spots. So in that regard, the bow had a stronger advantage for taking it down.

 

I don't think the damage cap should be removed completely, just reworked..

 

1. Damage cap should increase as enemy level increases (just as its other stats increase). It's mostly a psychological thing. I love seeing bigger numbers on bigger baddies.

 

2. Create a sniper & bow mod that has a chance of bypassing the damage cap (or gives a multiplier to the damage cap). Do another one for launcher weapons. Give us the option to build for that.

[lightini]

Lephantis vs Juggernaut. I suppose thats a personal choice. I like the Lephantis mechanism more, because it is equally fair to all weapons. But its okay if you like Juggernaut machanism, so I will not argue on that.

 

As for OP, I think you got it wrong. I agree that OP's wording might be cinfusing, but clearly, he is fed up of enemy units rendering single-shot weapons useless.

 

Though Nullifiers, juggernauts and Manics use different types of damage-cap techniques, they are effectively make single-shot weapons useless. So, they are related in that sense.

 

And this wording led more than one into the false path.

The nullifier has bad mechanism i agree 100%,

the manic is meh, there's only one or two at a time, so we can kite him away, i never gave him much thought.

Lephantis is good, balanced, his health is scaling good, nothing to add about him.

Juggernaut is clumsy, his mechanic is not well balanced with his armor and health, but the concept is for me (personnal preference of course) the best out of three. and can be well polished with the right tweaking.

 

It is my position on this matter, and as a HOT topic, it SHOULD be discussed very carefully, wordings or else we got a melting pot af everyone talking left and right and the discussion is not constructive.

[CapedBaldy]

My high ROF weapon was doing 4 damage per hit and 89 on weak spots. My slowfire bow was doing 100 per hit and 400 on weak spots. So in that regard, the bow had a stronger advantage for taking it down.

Your low RoF weapon does not have an advantage. Your high RoF weapon will slug in more than 10 bullets at that time if we included multishot.

Edited June 6, 2015 by CapedBaldy

[Autongnosis]

Your low RoF weapon does not have an advantage. Your high RoF weapon will slug in more than 10 bullets at that time if we included multishot.

Nailed. It.

[DSpite]

I just did it with a team and he was level 75. I had a 4 Forma Braton Prime (Corrosive/Cold), and I was doing 6 damage per round normally, and 29 when doing crits on the weak spots.

 

I think I burned enough Ammo Restores to refill a small army base, and we were all generally taking so long that 2 people ran out of revives then quit, and in the last 5 minutes, me and a Rhino got a "slow bug" where no matter where we were on the level (even on the opposite side of the map from the Juggie) we were "Tar slowed" 90% of the time, everywhere.

 

After he dropped I got taken out for the first time and had to burn a revive because I got the "Tar slowness" on the way out, but it stopped happening after the revive so I ran to extraction.

 

For the record, in the last 5-10 minutes - in a battle that seemed to go for like 30+ minutes - we all ended up on a high ledge sharing my Ammo Restores and doing constant fire, and still one guy fell off :) - anyway, the damage cap seems a little too high.

[EvilChaosKnight]

I just did it with a team and he was level 75. I had a 4 Forma Braton Prime (Corrosive/Cold), and I was doing 6 damage per round normally, and 29 when doing crits on the weak spots.

 

I think I burned enough Ammo Restores to refill a small army base, and we were all generally taking so long that 2 people ran out of revives then quit, and in the last 5 minutes, me and a Rhino got a "slow bug" where no matter where we were on the level (even on the opposite side of the map from the Juggie) we were "Tar slowed" 90% of the time, everywhere.

 

After he dropped I got taken out for the first time and had to burn a revive because I got the "Tar slowness" on the way out, but it stopped happening after the revive so I ran to extraction.

 

For the record, in the last 5-10 minutes - in a battle that seemed to go for like 30+ minutes - we all ended up on a high ledge sharing my Ammo Restores and doing constant fire, and still one guy fell off :) - anyway, the damage cap seems a little too high.

This seem to confirm my suspicion that Jugg is simply BUGGED right now

- Unranked Atomos had numbers like 40-60 popping up when shooting armored bits

- Psychic bolts (I was bored) do like 63 DMG per hit on armor (won't lock on weakspots) with like 50% power strength

- Crits don't seem to increase damage for some weapons. Opticor was doing exactly the same DMG in crit and non-crit hits.

[(PSN)Mazda_07_]

I'm assuming balance.

[(XBOX)BluAina]

Maybe it's the juggernaut yall got, but one shot weps work fine over here on sex box

[TheBrsrkr]

I just did it, my 5 Forma Braton Prime doing 167 damage on weakpoints and 8 otherwise. Had a Corrosive/Blast build with Heavy cal. Ol' Juggy got trapped in some stairs, so it was easy to test. Scindo Prime did `200 per hit though, wich was weird.

[rockscl]

"The Juggernaut however possesses several weakspots that will take increased damage cap of 2,000 damage from weapons fire, which include large sacs on its head and back that appears when using its ranged attacks, and its belly when performing a standing ground stomp."

[jjpdn]

"DE this is too easy. Buff him"

 

"DE this is not easy enough now."

 

'nough said.

 

Now, if only DE can buff the rewards too...

 

Warface anyone?

Edited June 7, 2015 by jjpdn

[Swailwort]

For how long will you continue slaughtering sniper rifles and shotguns, DE?

First Nulifiers, then Manics, then Juggernaut. Why should I bring high-damage single shot weapons, when I can't just kill an enemy, even when I do enough damage due to that damage cap. That makes high-dps full auto weapons more effective vs BOTH trash mobs and elite ones.

Seriously, please remove damage cap at all, or at least for snipers and shotgun weapons.

Nulifiers...I agree. It's ridicoulous.

Manics..... I just one shot one with the Opticor today. No Trouble at all.

Juggernaut......Well, it has like 90% damage reduction. Yet..Peacemaker seems to completely ignore armor...huh?

[5h1n0k4m1]

I understand that your parents didn't bother with your education so you can't read or even undestand basic texts properly, but I will have to explain one more time for just you.

 

(Also love the irony in your post: calling me a whiner when whining about OP weapons/power in the game. Hypocrisy and human stupidity at it's finest :) )

couldn't say better :)

[RIOT]

yes, please stop.
i'd rather have a boss with massive health pool then capping my damage on my 5 forma dread.

Edited June 8, 2015 by RIOTx

[Kalvorax]

Its called "balance"

then "balance" the enemies so WE dont get one shotted :|

[Grom-84]

Its called "balance"

Balance 2.0!

[DoomFruit]

Damage caps and timed perfect invulnerability phases are a horrifically stupid idea and need to die. Painfully. If I spend 6 formas making my Opticor into an anti-tank godslayer capable of boring through 1.5 metres of solid rock, I expect it to slay tanks and gods. I do not expect the beam to be stopped dead by 20 centimetres of leather (Lephantis, Juggernaut) or 5 centimetres of hinged iron flaps (Sargas Ruk).

[Vance.Stubbs]

Manics..... I just one shot one with the Opticor today. No Trouble at all.

 

How? I just shot half-HP manic with my 4 forma Daikyu on Vex Armor Chroma, but he just took some damage and teleported away.