rapt0rman Posted July 11, 2015 Share Posted July 11, 2015 damn, now you made me remind this song... The moment I heard the voice my hand flew out and punched an infant, sorry Hypernaut1, hope it wasn't yours >.> Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
arche Posted July 11, 2015 Share Posted July 11, 2015 We aren't the good guys. Even when I play this game, I sometimes wondered, if there is really a need for me to kill everyone on the ship. Lotus used to say "Something is wrong, I sense heavy units incoming" and I tend to say to myself,"There is nothing wrong with that, we are the ones invading and killing all their friends we see." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
(PSN)PillarOfWar Posted July 11, 2015 Share Posted July 11, 2015 The Tenno work to "Preserve The Balance".Propaganda !!!The Tenno. The Grineer The Infestation. All Orokin bio weapons. The war is over. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
(PSN)JemBrothers Posted July 11, 2015 Share Posted July 11, 2015 we aren't safe in the relays O.o balor formorian ftw! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sloan441 Posted July 11, 2015 Share Posted July 11, 2015 Good...bad...I'm the tenno with the gun. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chaosdreamer Posted July 11, 2015 Share Posted July 11, 2015 He later saw me at the relay and asked me if the bad guys were going to come there to kill people Nop ,They won't join to kill people , but they will explode it from really far time to time ,does this count like the last some big lazor destroyed our relay? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coryphaus Posted July 11, 2015 Share Posted July 11, 2015 Look, we are the bad guys, plain and simple, I slaughter millions of Grineer to gain loot and save my comrades to create the balance of war and then I steal from profiteers like nef anyo. I destroy genetic research all in the name of getting more stuff to upgrade loot and help out those who have given a better weapon. I spend most of my time Solo'ing the Infestation on Eris hives :o Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
(PSN)WiiConquered Posted July 11, 2015 Share Posted July 11, 2015 The issue is that you're there for story reasons, but that they don't come after you directly for every mission is game mechanics (or lackthereof). We've SEEN retaliation before - Eyes of Blight, anyone? - so we know they do it, the game just isn't geared towards us having an assassin on us for EVERY little mission - now, Invasions, on the other hand... This is a self-defeating argument. If retaliation is enough to prove they're the bad guys, why aren't we STILL the bad guys for the same reason? Put it this way: if DE is trying to paint a picture of us being the good guys they aren't doing a great job, as we've only seen them be brutal towards us and our allies (and the Corpus and theirs), as is normal in war. But if DE is trying to show us as the misled villains, they're actually doing a great job--despite being told we're protecting people, we never see them. We work with smugglers like Darvo, terrorists like the Red Veil, genocidal maniacs like New Loka, and the people who work with them despite their mindset. We support groups who will kill our fellows just to get more mods. We directly battled over the chance to tax each other for quite some time. Our guide, Lotus, isn't trusted by Teshin, is called out for hiding information by Simaris, and yet is our only source that we're in the right. And we resolve everything by violence and only violence. Corpus dealing arms? Kill them all. Maroo doesn't want to come with us? Put some lead into her and drag her body along anyway. Even though the last time we did a mass extermination it wiped out all order and brought chaos, we do it again and apparently expect something different to follow. In these circumstances, is it surprising the Grineer would try to blow our bases up? That the Corpus would treat us as sub-human? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
(PSN)Lowk721 Posted July 11, 2015 Share Posted July 11, 2015 Sometimes you need a bad guy to take on another bad guy cuz the good guys are outmatched. If anything, Tenno tread the line of anti-hero & anti-villain. It's like if someone cloned the Punisher several times and something went kind of wrong.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kethus Posted July 11, 2015 Share Posted July 11, 2015 i told him that they dont really come after us Except when they do (Vor seeking out the cryopods, the Corpus taking hold of tenno during the Gradivus Dilemma, enemies searching for you once the alarms have been activated in a mission). "nah, we're pretty safe here" Except when we're not (Eyes of Blight, more than half of he relays went boom). Didn't you show him any rescue missions btw? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
(PSN)ATreidezz Posted July 11, 2015 Share Posted July 11, 2015 You die a hero or live long enough to see yourself become a villain.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Soju. Posted July 11, 2015 Share Posted July 11, 2015 Well I don't think your son knows anything else about the game, and he's just too quick to judge, probably just like any other kids in his age. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tikka_Qrow Posted July 11, 2015 Share Posted July 11, 2015 "The Lotus seduced the Tenno. Led them on a complacent path like oxen." - Teshin, Conclave Master "The Tenno were not stoic and silent. They were waiting. They were poised. I tried to call out but only a strangled whisper escaped. When the ninth beat rang a torrent of blood filled the stadium, loosed by Tenno blades. The drums, the Empire, fell silent forever." - The Stalker I think the Lotus is the real bad guy; someone that got control over the Tenno and felled the Orokin Empire, and then afterwards uses the Tenno to keep all of Sol system in perpetual chaos for millennia+^_^+ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
(PSN)DesecratedFlame Posted July 11, 2015 Share Posted July 11, 2015 I thought this was an interesting point of view from a child. He saw me playing today and ask me "Why cant you just let the bad guys be? theyre in their own home" I tried to explain to him that they had "something" that i needed and i was protecting it. he didnt look convinced and asked "so if you dont kill them they come after you?" i told him that they dont really come after us, but we need to go after them. All in all, it was a pretty interesting exchange to where he question why i was endlessly slaughtering legions of these supposed "bad guys" even though it looked like i was the provocateur. He later saw me at the relay and asked me if the bad guys were going to come there to kill people, to which i responded "nah, we're pretty safe here"- tl:dr- my son thinks im playing a game about genocidal maniacs with vague objectives. I know there is more to the story than it seems, i just thought it was interesting to hear the viewpoint of an outsider looking in. He is right. 10o kill for money. They are soldiers of fortune that get paid in blood money. You even work for your so called enemies if the pay well enough. At least they believe in something. Ruk had it right, as did your kid. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SicSlaver Posted July 11, 2015 Share Posted July 11, 2015 I thought this was an interesting point of view from a child. He saw me playing today and ask me "Why cant you just let the bad guys be? theyre in their own home" I tried to explain to him that they had "something" that i needed and i was protecting it. he didnt look convinced and asked "so if you dont kill them they come after you?" i told him that they dont really come after us, but we need to go after them. All in all, it was a pretty interesting exchange to where he question why i was endlessly slaughtering legions of these supposed "bad guys" even though it looked like i was the provocateur. He later saw me at the relay and asked me if the bad guys were going to come there to kill people, to which i responded "nah, we're pretty safe here"- tl:dr- my son thinks im playing a game about genocidal maniacs with vague objectives. I know there is more to the story than it seems, i just thought it was interesting to hear the viewpoint of an outsider looking in. Your son is smarter than most people! Even yourself! You should have just admitted to being a bad guy and reflected on your actions! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kalenath Posted July 11, 2015 Share Posted July 11, 2015 (edited) Good, bad or indifferent... The universe of Warframe is FILLED with bad. EVERYONE is bad. The Corpus are profiteering scum, The Grineer are butchering scum. The Infested are animals with a taste for flesh, maybe with some form of intelligence, maybe not. The Tenno are working to curb all of the menaces in system. Does this make them good guys? No. It makes them the only hope for the system. Good guys need not apply. They might get their white hats dirty in the muck that has to be shoveled. Edited July 11, 2015 by Kalenath Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheGrimCorsair Posted July 11, 2015 Share Posted July 11, 2015 I thought this was an interesting point of view from a child. He saw me playing today and ask me "Why cant you just let the bad guys be? theyre in their own home" I tried to explain to him that they had "something" that i needed and i was protecting it. he didnt look convinced and asked "so if you dont kill them they come after you?" i told him that they dont really come after us, but we need to go after them. All in all, it was a pretty interesting exchange to where he question why i was endlessly slaughtering legions of these supposed "bad guys" even though it looked like i was the provocateur. He later saw me at the relay and asked me if the bad guys were going to come there to kill people, to which i responded "nah, we're pretty safe here"- tl:dr- my son thinks im playing a game about genocidal maniacs with vague objectives. I know there is more to the story than it seems, i just thought it was interesting to hear the viewpoint of an outsider looking in. You're son's quite perceptive. The Tenno aren't really more than occasionally shades of good. A lot of the "why" of what we do is provided by the Lotus and filled out by the actions and dialogue of our foes. Both sources of information are fairly unreliable, and it's been hinted in more than a few places that the Lotus is hardly providing the full story of what's up and why. Plainly, we *are* playing warriors that engage in "maintaining the balance" by bloodshed with very little explanation of what the balance is, at least at this point in time. Our motives are "the Lotus says kill, we kill." Often for shinies. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StonedMakak Posted July 11, 2015 Share Posted July 11, 2015 (edited) This is a self-defeating argument. If retaliation is enough to prove they're the bad guys, why aren't we STILL the bad guys for the same reason? Put it this way: if DE is trying to paint a picture of us being the good guys they aren't doing a great job, as we've only seen them be brutal towards us and our allies (and the Corpus and theirs), as is normal in war. But if DE is trying to show us as the misled villains, they're actually doing a great job--despite being told we're protecting people, we never see them. We work with smugglers like Darvo, terrorists like the Red Veil, genocidal maniacs like New Loka, and the people who work with them despite their mindset. We support groups who will kill our fellows just to get more mods. We directly battled over the chance to tax each other for quite some time. Our guide, Lotus, isn't trusted by Teshin, is called out for hiding information by Simaris, and yet is our only source that we're in the right. And we resolve everything by violence and only violence. Corpus dealing arms? Kill them all. Maroo doesn't want to come with us? Put some lead into her and drag her body along anyway. Even though the last time we did a mass extermination it wiped out all order and brought chaos, we do it again and apparently expect something different to follow. In these circumstances, is it surprising the Grineer would try to blow our bases up? That the Corpus would treat us as sub-human? He does have a point thought. There is always certain discrepancy between the lore and actual game mechanics, and it's easy to confuse one for the other. For example many claim that we are mercenaries because we receive credits for completed missions. Well, this is online F2P, it needs some currency system as a part of in-game economy, and overall player progression. Credits, gold, lucky charms, fluffy bunnies... Makes no difference really. Same applies to mods, guns, items etc. you just need character progression. You mention relays, ask yourself, from real life perspective: Would anyone bother with it if there were no rewards involved, just pure lore? A handful maybe. Civilians thanking us for our help? That would require resources in developing new models, animations, assets perhaps a location of some neutral settlement. Not a priority compered to things like Parkour 2.0. Killing is the only thing we do, because this is a shooter not an RPG. Implementing not-violent mission would mean designing an entirely different game from ground up. And we kill millions only because grind, another game mechanic that takes precedence before the lore. My point is: Lore is never a perfect reflection of what happens in the actual gameplay, same as a CGI trailer is not a reflection of the actual gameplay. It's a matter of suspending your disbelief. Edited July 11, 2015 by tisdfogg Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
-CM-Valen Posted July 11, 2015 Share Posted July 11, 2015 Your kid got a good heart. Upz! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lunamaniac Posted July 11, 2015 Share Posted July 11, 2015 Tenno are evil, I mean even if the corpus as a whole are evil - you realize that the corpus the tenno fight are being exploited by other, richer, corpus. We're killing the corpus at the bottom of their own society, who act as meat shields for their elite minority. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blackout751 Posted July 11, 2015 Share Posted July 11, 2015 We're short-term villains to be long-term heroes. In the space of 40 minutes Survival is a genocide, but in long-term lore this could prevent a civilian colony from being enslaved, or prevent a Tenno elsewhere in the ship from being caught, tortured and eventually killed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EmptyDevil Posted July 11, 2015 Share Posted July 11, 2015 (edited) He is too young to fully understand the situation of Warframe. Tenno are not the bad guys at all, some Tenno could be but overall they aren't evil. He would probably think/feel the same way if he saw a soldier going to assassinate a terrorist that was preparing a massive bomb in his lab/home. Edited July 11, 2015 by EmptyDevil Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DiabolicalHamSandwich Posted July 11, 2015 Share Posted July 11, 2015 Issue is I think too many people are confusing all our game time with the actual lore of the game. Playing the same mission over and over should be thought of as one time. How many times can you assassinate the same boss? We aren't really killing legions and scores as that one time mission is technically it. Even if you factor in the fact that multiple players=multiple tenno running the mission you still have the fact that you can only kill something once. How many times can you really destroy a facility? How many times can you really disrupt something at the same place right afterwards? Vor isn't a clone like the rest of the grinner and neither is ruk. Corpus can't clone themselves and most of the mechanical bosses are prototypes. Then again even though they can be rebuilt, if there was really more then one then i'm sure our mission of stopping it's production would be moot. Corpus are war mongers selling tech to whoever has the biggest wallet. Grineer are set on pure and utter domination not giving two squirts about who stand in their way. For the most part a lot of us players are simply fodder just there. Nobody is going on a genocide spree and we are actually upholding balance and trying to keep all in check. A lot of us both exist (for gaming sake) and don't exist (story sake) so us being bad for the most part is only there for "us" Least that's the way I see it~ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Latronico Posted July 11, 2015 Share Posted July 11, 2015 I thought this was an interesting point of view from a child. He saw me playing today and ask me "Why cant you just let the bad guys be? theyre in their own home" I tried to explain to him that they had "something" that i needed and i was protecting it. he didnt look convinced and asked "so if you dont kill them they come after you?" i told him that they dont really come after us, but we need to go after them. All in all, it was a pretty interesting exchange to where he question why i was endlessly slaughtering legions of these supposed "bad guys" even though it looked like i was the provocateur. He later saw me at the relay and asked me if the bad guys were going to come there to kill people, to which i responded "nah, we're pretty safe here"- tl:dr- my son thinks im playing a game about genocidal maniacs with vague objectives. I know there is more to the story than it seems, i just thought it was interesting to hear the viewpoint of an outsider looking in. Wrong, and I'll explain you why. Grineer started the war in the Origin System, and they're a sort of futuristic Third Reich. That's why Lotus awoke us. Grineer come after us, every time they can. Vor had this exact kind of objective: kill Tenno in their cryopods. Grineer subjugate everything they can, and put the Origin System at risk. That's why we fight and kill them in every way we can. Corpus could seems to be innocuous, but they're obsessed with Void and Orokin and they are a threat too for Tenno (the old Sgt. Nef Anyo used to search and sell Warframe intact cryopods, and Corpus in general are interested in buy or however control Warframe and Tenno). So, at the end, we're not really the 'bad guys'. We're the ones who bring balance, even if it's not really correct. We should just smash Grineer Empire and Corpus guilds entirely. They don't deserve to keep living. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Volinus7 Posted July 11, 2015 Share Posted July 11, 2015 War deterrents are always good guys. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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