Mk1 Furis Op [Megathread]

[Shin]

I've seen ak lato's fire as fast as a soma on Xbox one, some people are legit others arnt

I mean you have break your fingers and your controller to achieve that fire rate. Its unnatural. Also Macros should be a bannable offense or DE should limit their fire rate. 

 

On a side note, lato's are pretty damn strong too, wonder why noone really uses them. Guess when Furis or puncture weapons get nerfed we'll see them more.

[rockscl]

Wrong. Take Dex Furis and MK1 Furis for example. If both were to spraying at each other, MK1 Furis would murder instantly supression means nothing in the face of immediate death.

 

I cant really talk for Vasto Prime but Akvasto's are pretty broken when people use macros. I've seen pretty abnormal shooting speeds or maybe im seeing things.

 

not sure what is your point, but put front to front the difference is this

 

 

mk1 dps = 304

dex dps = 300

 

 

vasto = 400

 

accordingly with your idea, magazine and pool doesnt matter, and vasto should be meta, but its not, just proves my point, mk1 furis is used over dex furis and vasto not for dps, but for ammo efficiency/time in fight/supressing power

Edited November 2, 2015 by rockscl

[Shin]

accordingly with your idea, magazine and pool doesnt matter, and vasto should be meta, but its not, just proves my point, mk1 furis is used over dex furis and vasto not for dps, but for ammo efficiency/time in fight/supressing power

Im not entirely disregarding mag and ammo pool but the damage difference between single bullets makes the fights different. Their dps doesnt really mirror the pvp. 74 Headshot damage to 100 armor frames makes the fights horrendously easy while using Furis, you cant tell me that noone panics after dropping that much hp in one bullet. I managed to get like 4-5 kills with Furis clip because accuracy and damage of the weapon is unreasonably high. When i take the Dex furis, i couldnt achieve the same thing because it doesnt generate the same pressure as the Furis even if their dps values are similar. 

 

Also there's the caution factor, While dodging, you are going to take much more damage from Furis while Dex is going to eat 2 to 3 more bullets to achive it. Overall, Furis is much more efficient than Dex furis. 

 

As for Vasto P and Akvasto. Vasto P is like a shotgun. Its more or less unuseable in medium range as there are better weapons for that and it requires near perfect aim to use. Your avarage Conclave player wont achieve much with it while the person who likes it and uses it religiously will wreck your face should you go against him(Seriously there was a guy who used it and he was beastly with it) and there are people who uses macros for Akvastos but i havent seen one for a while.

 

Anyway it all boils down to the same point. Easy usage.

 

AR's and smg types are easy to use and has high damage types. Reason we dont get to see different metas is just simple as this. So long as spray and pray weapons dont get different mechanics to balance them out (spread patterns, removing hitscan, setting bullet velocity values for each weapon etc) this situation will continue, be it with Furis, Karak or oncoming weapons but thats for another topic.

[rockscl]

probably an smg like furis needs drastic damage fallof to justify its low recoil compared with heavy caliber pistols, i think it was pythadragon the one who brought the values from battlefield, i dont know where it was, but basically furis should lose its power in mid range. Such mechanical exception is out of the current PVE - PVP conversion`s paradigm 

[Pythadragon]

probably an smg like furis needs drastic damage fallof to justify its low recoil compared with heavy caliber pistols, i think it was pythadragon the one who brought the values from battlefield, i dont know where it was, but basically furis should lose its power in mid range. Such mechanical exception is out of the current PVE - PVP conversion`s paradigm 

 

(battle field 4 falloff implementation)

https://forums.warframe.com/index.php?/topic/547848-10-firerate-autos-are-far-too-powerful-in-every-situation-and-are-completely-overtaking-every-game-they-are-used-in/?p=6165632

[Shin]

Such mechanical exception is out of the current PVE - PVP conversion`s paradigm 

Sooner or later, something has to be done about the current weapon balance. Even if things were to be fine today, its going to blow up at some point because with each update, we get weapons and they get implemented into Conclaves immediately. 

 

Maybe not today but surely we will need a weapon definition balance like this. Just tweaking the damage types and numbers wont be enough.

[Phasedragon]

probably an smg like furis needs drastic damage fallof to justify its low recoil compared with heavy caliber pistols, i think it was pythadragon the one who brought the values from battlefield, i dont know where it was, but basically furis should lose its power in mid range. Such mechanical exception is out of the current PVE - PVP conversion`s paradigm

Simple - reduce damage, give mod that increases damage at close range for assault rifles. Basically exactly what they did to vectis. Edited November 2, 2015 by PhaseShifted

[rockscl]

Simple - reduce damage, give mod that increases damage at close range for assault rifles. Basically exactly what they did to vectis.

 

that leads to a mandatory mod, but sounds viable after all

[Shin]

Simple - reduce damage, give mod that increases damage at close range for assault rifles. Basically exactly what they did to vectis.

So. Another bandaid? Sure it sounds promising for now but are we going to keep pumping mods to fix an open wound?

 

I dont mind them adding mods like this but they need to do something about the whole thing after a while.

[Phasedragon]

So. Another bandaid? Sure it sounds promising for now but are we going to keep pumping mods to fix an open wound?

I dont mind them adding mods like this but they need to do something about the whole thing after a while.

That would not be a bandaid mod. Vectis was because it was implemented well after the Vectis was put at such low damage. If this nerf and subsequent mod was implemented at the same time, it would be a change, not a fix or a bandaid. It could also solve most current problems. -50% damage, +25% damage under 30 meters, +25% more under 20 meters would be about right I think. The only problem is that it might not be common knowledge, so those without it would be worthless. Of course this is the same problem with snipers, but barely anyone uses those anyway.

Perhaps that could be the advantage of mk1 weapons - lower damage, but effective at all ranges as they are now and unable to use the range mods.

Edited November 2, 2015 by PhaseShifted

[Shin]

That would not be a bandaid mod. Vectis was because it was implemented well after the Vectis was put at such low damage. If this nerf and subsequent mod was implemented at the same time, it would be a change, not a fix or a bandaid. It could also solve most current problems. -50% damage, +25% damage under 30 meters, +25% more under 20 meters would be about right I think. The only problem is that it might not be common knowledge, so those without it would be worthless. Of course this is the same problem with snipers, but barely anyone uses those anyway.

Perhaps that could be the advantage of mk1 weapons - lower damage, but effective at all ranges as they are now and unable to use the range mods.

Im not a fan of keep adding changes as Mods. Some mods are going to be like todays Serration and Multishot mods if this goes like that.

 

I rather see changes instead of seeing them added as mods.

[S3EK3R]

Just played a game with increased secondary damage. Mk1 Furis was 3 shotting me while I had to shoot my enemy 5 times with my AkMagnus. And it was even less accurate. What a damned joke.

[Phasedragon]

Im not a fan of keep adding changes as Mods. Some mods are going to be like todays Serration and Multishot mods if this goes like that.

I rather see changes instead of seeing them added as mods.

Well, they've said in the past that they are not going to change anything except damage (which, quite frankly, is BS,) so making mandatory mods is basically the best way around that. They've already demonstrated how willing they are to do that, so I figured the best way to state suggestions would be in the form of mods. However, If they could, it would be far better to just make these properties innate in each weapon. Double tap, triple tap, spring loaded broadhead, lie in wait, etc. Should all just be a part of the weapon. This does, however, bring up how they would handle taking away those mods, especially the valuable ones. Edited November 2, 2015 by PhaseShifted

[Pythadragon]

Well, they've said in the past that they are not going to change anything except damage (which, quite frankly, is BS,) so making mandatory mods is basically the best way around that. They've already demonstrated how willing they are to do that, so I figured the best way to state suggestions would be in the form of mods. However, If they could, it would be far better to just make these properties innate in each weapon. Double tap, triple tap, spring loaded broadhead, lie in wait, etc. Should all just be a part of the weapon. This does, however, bring up how they would handle taking away those mods, especially the valuable ones.

 

The PVP team has changed things for weapons that are not damage:

 

1. Synoid Simulor AOE radius was decreased (probably other aoe guns as well).

2. They changed a multiplier on an entire damage type, puncture damage multiplier vs shields from -0.15 to -0.2.

3. Radical changes to reserve ammo capacities on a per weapon basis

 

I'm sure they'll get the 'go ahead' to balance weapons in other ways as well in the future, especially given the recent changes to bullet jump speed to vary with frame tankiness.

 

Edit: Fixed puncture value change.

Edited November 3, 2015 by Pythadragon

[-InV-igo95862]

 

2. They changed a multiplier on an entire damage type, puncture damage multiplier vs shields from -0.25 to -0.2 (why was it buffed? nobody knows..)

 

It was -0.15 before. Changed to -0.2 but across PvP and PvE.

[(XBOX)Master4733]

I mean you have break your fingers and your controller to achieve that fire rate. Its unnatural. Also Macros should be a bannable offense or DE should limit their fire rate.

On a side note, lato's are pretty damn strong too, wonder why noone really uses them. Guess when Furis or puncture weapons get nerfed we'll see them more.

Sad part is the guy who fires that fast is usually melee only like meXD he thinks guns are stupid and limiting

[Pythadragon]

-CM-igo95862, on 02 Nov 2015 - 11:27 AM, said:

It was -0.15 before. Changed to -0.2 but across PvP and PvE.

Right- I keep forgetting that the wiki was wrong, and continues to be wrong...

http://warframe.wikia.com/wiki/Damage_2.0

Still lists puncture at -0.25 vs shields.

I still wonder if this was meant to be a pvp only change because it was listed under "Conclave Changes and Additions:"

• Shield resistance to puncture damage has been increased slightly.

https://forums.warframe.com/index.php?/topic/498793-update-17-echoes-of-the-sentient/

I'm surprised there hasn't been more of an uproar from the pve crowd.

Edited November 3, 2015 by Pythadragon

[Jigokudayu]

I've just watched this vid with almost crippling terror.

 

I hope I will never encounter this tenno in conclave or anywhere else.

 

I'm wondering how modded it is...

 

[Husla]

Let's be honest here, it's conclave. Ain't no tennoskoom, got time for that.

[Yurugani]

k THEN

[Forblaze]

I actually did conclave for the first time and noticed pretty quickly how strong the Furis was. It seemed to be killing me in as many hits as I was taking to kill people with my Tigris.

[-AR.D2]

You can probably do just as well with an unmodded MK-1 Furis, so it doesn't really matter how well modded it is.

 

This is kind of a common misconception about conclave, mods are no where near as important as it is in PvE.

[Kaotyke]

>Mk-1 Furis is a "monster"

>Shows Conclave

>Is afraid of the player in PvP

>Wonders how it is modded

 

OP has no idea of what he is talking about.

Edited November 3, 2015 by Kao-Snake

[Nayroy]

I wonder how he would fair with people who know how to PvP.

[Heliopata]

How it compares to the normal furis? It seems to hit heavier.