Basilisk1991 Posted November 6, 2015 Share Posted November 6, 2015 (edited) Short and rather incorrect version of Nezhas legend. According to the legend Nezha beat some dragon king dude and his sons. After that his hometown was threatend with destruction if he did not kill himself and so he killed himself. His mother built a shrine for him, his father destroyed it. Nezha was then revived by some dude and Nezha killed his dad for destroying the shrine. Makes a grat skillset right? His skills would probably look like this 1: beat up some guys 2: kill yourself 3: get revived 4: kill your father I'll just leave this here Soo, when are we getting american warframes? Abraham Lincolnframe Edited November 6, 2015 by Basilisk1991 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
(XBOX)a salsa wizard Posted November 6, 2015 Share Posted November 6, 2015 i hate these chinese warframes because they break the lore and trivialize any meaning or story in the game they were not created out of originality or passion, or even community made ideas, their sole purpose was to supplicate chinese consumers to invest in the product they are not real warframes they are basically marketing tools, its beyond lame it would honestly be better if they never shipped the chinese mythology marketing frames to the real warframe international version your just lowering the quality and depth of the original game by bringing every tacky meaningless random thing from chinaframe over I think you are right because it seems that with Wukong it was ok, because DE was celebrating their culture but now they are making another one even though there are hundreds of concepts that the fans have made Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
climatiseur Posted November 6, 2015 Share Posted November 6, 2015 (edited) Even though I'd argue there are some extra personal sentiments being mixed in this China frame discussion, I have to agree that making a frame base on an exact character is kinda odd to find. I hope DE would communicate with changyou about this. Making a frame, then name it with anything is ok, but naming a frame then making the frame according to the name is not what it has been doing for this game. Edited: As for the design, my guess is that DE had talk to them that please stay the style close to the previous warframes without making it too exotic - If you make something utterly different, people would say oh no this is just so not warframe. So they are designing according to the previous frames they can see to make it more in-line. Which as a result now people say they are too much similar with some of the frames. IMO, I have personally mixed up Oberon and Loki before, as well as other similar looking frames. And when Chroma, Equinox and Atlas come out, I think they are quite odd to look at compare to the previous frames but already got used to it. If you look closely to Wukong, you will find out his face area of the helmet is based of traditional Lianpu, but you won't find out if you don't look closely (or refuse to look closely. only trying hard to find the resemblance details with the previous frames to prove your assumption and prejudice) . I kinda like this subtle reference myself. Let not your irrational sentiments affect your judgement, people. Edited November 6, 2015 by climatiseur Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
(XBOX)a salsa wizard Posted November 6, 2015 Share Posted November 6, 2015 It is not the name that bugs me. It's how they designed and came up with the frame that bugs me. The non-China frames other than Excalibur (Radial Blind) are mostly designed revolving a certain theme: Loki was supposed to be the stealth/trickster frame. His kit was designed based on what a stealth/trickery kit would be like then found it appropriate to name the frame Loki because of what the frame DOES. The models of the frames look nothing like how they would be portrayed in their respective mythologies, occasionally there would only be small hints and references. But now suddenly, the China frames are designed revolving an existing character: Wu Kong's abilities are all based on what the Chinese mythological character "Sun Wu Kong" use in his tales. The frame was named Wu Kong because of what the frame IS. There's no theme that fits Wu Kong's abilities, you could argue he could be "The staff master or the monk" but cloud walk...? TBH if they took away cloud walk and made his kit focused on using staffs, I'd be fine with him. Wu Kong's model also has atleast 50% resemblance to how Sun Wu Kong is portrayed to be like in Journey to the West. The same can be said with the leaked info on Nezha. tl;dr I'm comfortable with them making new frames based on a theme instead of a character, like how the upcoming frame has an "Archer" theme and I'm excited to have her. If they decided to name the archer frame something from Chinese mythology, I'd be fine with that. Wukong is acceptable because he was for celebrating China's culture, but anything after him.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Draciusen Posted November 6, 2015 Share Posted November 6, 2015 (edited) I preferred the frames being designed around ideas rather than deities or personalities. Loki is a trickster god, but his abilities are more about deception and tricks. The name goes with the abilities, not the other way around. They could've started off by making abilities related to the heavens, spirits, and other celestial forces; then develop a unique and semi-oriental design for the frame; then finally decide to name it based on a Chinese deity because of how it relates to the concept. Instead, they go with: "Okay we're making Wukong/Nezha. What does he do in the mythology? Let's add that to the game." It severely limits the scope of what they can do in terms of gameplay and character design, because they're trying to mold it to an already established idea rather than developing their own inspired, then choosing an appropriate reference based on what they made. Edited November 6, 2015 by Draciusen Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DameDameNingen Posted November 6, 2015 Share Posted November 6, 2015 (edited) Chinaframes are literally characters turned warframes, no common theme to follow, they are literally designed after their name. What makes people upset is the unoriginality that comes from DE not even trying to at the very least make it seem like the powers have any relation to each other, literally just slapping together comepletely different and unrelated powers and calling it a day. But you could say the same for lots of frames. Ash, for instance, has an infinite supply of shuriken, invisiblity and/or some sort of smoke generation, and teleportation. Literally the only difference is that he's based on an archetype rather than a specific character. Wukong could even be said to have a more consistent theme, since his 1,2, and maybe 4 could all be attributed to some sort of psychokinesis or ki manipulation. Rhino is even worse, his abilities have no unifying theme beyond MANLINESS: he has some sort of supernatural strength or speed, matter manipulation, whatever roar is, maybe limited time control, and an imposing codpiece. By the way, a lot of people in this thread seem to be talking about Nezha's abilities, I thought we didn't have any idea what they are. Edited November 6, 2015 by DameDameNingen Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HAYABU5A Posted November 6, 2015 Share Posted November 6, 2015 But you could say the same for lots of frames. Ash, for instance, has an infinite supply of shuriken, invisiblity and/or some sort of smoke generation, and teleportation. Literally the only difference is that he's based on an archetype rather than a specific character. Wukong could even be said to have a more consistent theme, since his 1,2, and maybe 4 could all be attributed to some sort of psychokinesis or ki manipulation. Rhino is even worse, his abilities have no unifying theme beyond MANLINESS: he has some sort of supernatural strength or speed, matter manipulation, whatever roar is, maybe limited time control, and an imposing codpiece. By the way, a lot of people in this thread seem to be talking about Nezha's abilities, I thought we didn't have any idea what they are. Fire combine with wind Burn a way ahead, and clear the enemies on the road. Fire flywheel Throw a burning flywheel with blade on it, when hit the enemy it will generate cure aura, and absorb to the flywheel's position Golden Halo Set a protective fire halo, terrify the nearby enemies, and cause damage on them. Snake tooth with Purple flame Sharp blades vertical come out of the ground，punch through nearby enemies funny random fact: nezha is actually not chinese origin, hes of indian mythology as nalakuvara, thats how unoriginal he is Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eric1738 Posted November 6, 2015 Share Posted November 6, 2015 I mean this is sorta expected right? No matter what project code they are calling it, as long as Warframe China exists, there will be more "Chinese style" weapons and warframes coming. I am fine with it, unless they are trying to break the overall art style. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
akira_him Posted November 6, 2015 Author Share Posted November 6, 2015 Fire combine with wind Burn a way ahead, and clear the enemies on the road. Fire flywheel Throw a burning flywheel with blade on it, when hit the enemy it will generate cure aura, and absorb to the flywheel's position Golden Halo Set a protective fire halo, terrify the nearby enemies, and cause damage on them. Snake tooth with Purple flame Sharp blades vertical come out of the ground，punch through nearby enemies funny random fact: nezha is actually not chinese origin, hes of indian mythology as nalakuvara, thats how unoriginal he is Exactly the 4 equipment #1: Wind fire wheels #2: Universe ring #3: not exactly Red Armillary Sash but the sash was his protector #4: Fire-tipped Spear Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vilemyre Posted November 6, 2015 Share Posted November 6, 2015 Abraham Lincolnframe His 4th will have a bald eagle come out of his chest Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr.ToastForPresident Posted November 6, 2015 Share Posted November 6, 2015 "These Chinese based frames are unimaginative and lore breaking! Get them out of Warframe because Warframe is not about those themed based frames!" -Most people in this thread. Funny, I thought I had a flashback to 2014 forums where people complained about Mirage, Limbo and Mesa. Oh how things haven't changed at all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fatpig84 Posted November 6, 2015 Share Posted November 6, 2015 Wanna bet if DE releases the Japanese pantheon as Warframes, no one will bat an eyelid cause Warframe are ninjas in spess and so a Japanese frame is fine ? :p Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SeraIngvir Posted November 6, 2015 Share Posted November 6, 2015 (edited) Wanna bet if DE releases the Japanese pantheon as Warframes, no one will bat an eyelid cause Warframe are ninjas in spess and so a Japanese frame is fine ? :p I'm pretty sure most of the salt and hate mentality stems from the sole reason and fact that DE implement these frames based onto catering/promote/marketing towards the Chinese community. (multiplied with delusional hate and brainless bandwagon-ing) Remove that very factor, and I'd bet ya most of the community would be pretty cool if DE dwelled into Asian mythology for inspiration. Edited November 6, 2015 by SeraIngvir Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
(XBOX)Skode Posted November 6, 2015 Share Posted November 6, 2015 I Do not care,These New china lore based frames do not fit that much into our lore expect for umbra Says who? How does Equinox fit the lore for example - most of the frames we have are lore-less and most inspired by mythology... a space dragon ninja not lore breaking but one based on the chinese monkey king does? Robin hood inspired frame next... its exciting seeing all these themes being used and theres too many great concepts yet to be used. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BETAOPTICS Posted November 6, 2015 Share Posted November 6, 2015 (edited) Except all the while the game has been primarily shipped to American/European gamer communities it has had a sizeable portion of names and themes drawn quite blatantly from the relevant mythology. You can try and claim that Loki, Nyx, Oberon and the rest - were purely created out of "originality and passion" - but you are kidding yourself if marketing to the targeted audience wasn't factored in as well. So basically - all your high minded ideals there about keeping the game pure or something - just read like thinly veiled prejudice against the Chinese and their mythology to me. Its doubly laughable when you consider that Asian motifs in general have been a fixture of Warframe since the beginning. No offense but can we ever have a mature discussion without it resulting in this kind of childish name calling, namely trigger happy racism calling? I get both sides of the argument, the fact that the issue is that Chinese Warframes break the design philosophy of Warframes but then I do not personally mind that much. Just that I can understand where people are coming from the other side of the argument. I do not think it makes you any better finger pointer if you start calling other people prejudiced just because you don't like their personal opinion. Oh and you guys know that Equinox theme is based on Dualism which is not exclusive to Taoism, but it is perhaps the most famous example where the concept of Dualism has been used in historical context. Anyway, back to the topic of this thread itself. I do wonder what Warframe that is, if it isn't one of the two that we already know of. Based on the translation though, it does not seem to match neither of these already revealed Warframes so it is likely to be a new one. Can't wait to see what it is and what it does. Edited November 6, 2015 by BETAOPTICS Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rinnolk Posted November 6, 2015 Share Posted November 6, 2015 (edited) For me these new frames are weird in that way that they are more personas than themes, that are less open to interpretations and more strictly defined. Also giving them the names of the heroes of myths while giving them powers directly associated with said heroes makes them harder to percieve as something/one else that those heroes with their personas. Sure you could say the new archer frame is kinda the same in that It takes notes from Robin Hood. But. It won't benamed Robin Hood (pretty damn sure :v) or have all of it's abilities drawn from the legendary bandit. Rather you can choose to perceive the Archer as a representation of the famous archer. Or you can choose to see the frame as a more general archer/thief kind of character. There is more freedom with original frames (maybe not all of them, but most) in how you view the frame within the theme, sort of. This is where the newer chinese frames are lacking. They kinda tell you straight out what they are and what they do, and they feel overdefined if that's a word. Aside from that sentiment that I hope made sense to someone at least, new frames are new frames and their characters (rather than themes I guess) still look interesting. Nicely designed as well, though that is more of a question of taste. Edited November 6, 2015 by Rinnolk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
(PSN)OMGITSNUKERXD Posted November 6, 2015 Share Posted November 6, 2015 I don't mind it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sziklamester Posted November 7, 2015 Share Posted November 7, 2015 There is not lore in stone and all are mostly meaningless and just hint some "future" lore and event. Any frame which have a simple fun factor and good design could be fit into the game environment all is depend the post production. They can hire writers to make lores for these frames and already we have different type of frames in names and in abilities. Like mag is magnet in short or volt also which electricity and have nova again different oberon and loki and excall is weapons and names from other mythology so all is very different so not sure why problem to lend other frames from other mythologies and call them lorebreaking. Nonsense. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vaxillian Posted November 7, 2015 Share Posted November 7, 2015 I have no problems with this seeing how most people don't see that the majority of our frames are based off of historical characters already. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Letter13 Posted November 7, 2015 Share Posted November 7, 2015 (edited) We have a frame modeled after a mystical English sword (Excalibur), we have Fairy Kings (Oberon), a Norse God (Loki), a Ninja-Pirate Squid (Hydroid), a Fire Chicken (Ember), a die-hard ninja (Ash), a super-chill Russian (Frost), a Cowboy/Cowgirl (Mesa), a psychologist (Nyx), a nurse (Trinity), an African/Southeast-Asian Odd-Toed Ungulate (Rhino), a cat (Valkyr) a big-top circus magician (Limbo) and his jester accomplice (Mirage), a (soon to be) Druid/Archer frame... To all of those arguing that frames based on Chinese deities doesn't fit the lore, please, tell me more about how it doesn't fit in with what we have. Really. I'd love to hear how a frame based off a Chinese deity (or two) would fly in the face of the lore we have. In all honesty I'm a little surprised that we haven't already had a frame inspired by a Chinese deity. Edited November 7, 2015 by Letter13 Added cat. Because Valkyr. Thanks for reminding me Judgebanks! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Judgebanks Posted November 7, 2015 Share Posted November 7, 2015 We have a frame modeled after a mystical English sword (Excalibur), we have Fairy Kings (Oberon), a Norse God (Loki), a Ninja-Pirate Squid (Hydroid), a Fire Chicken (Ember), a die-hard ninja (Ash), a super-chill Russian (Frost), a Cowboy/Cowgirl (Mesa), a psychologist (Nyx), a nurse (Trinity), an African/Southeast-Asian Odd-Toed Ungulate (Rhino), a big-top circus magician (Limbo) and his jester accomplice (Mirage), a (soon to be) Druid/Archer frame... To all of those arguing that frames based on Chinese deities doesn't fit the lore, please, tell me more about how it doesn't fit in with what we have. Really. I'd love to hear how a frame based off a Chinese deity (or two) would fly in the face of the lore we have. In all honesty I'm a little surprised that we haven't already had a frame inspired by a Chinese deity. I thought Oberon was Durid. . . Also cat is for fite. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EmptyDevil Posted November 7, 2015 Share Posted November 7, 2015 I thought Oberon was Durid. . . Oberon is literally the name of the fairy king IIRC. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VK4502b Posted November 7, 2015 Share Posted November 7, 2015 By that logic Loki would have 1: Turn into horse 2: Give birth to 8 legged horse (Sleppener, the mount of Odin) 3: be chained at root of the world with own entrails and a serpant dripping venom into his eyes 4: Unleash fimbrulwinter seeing in ragnerok. I have no problems with tapping the chinese mythos for inspiration because unlike the Egyptian, Norse, anf greco-roman myths its a seam that hasn;t been utterly played out to a western audience. I read into Loki to see what you meant by "Give birth to 8 legged horse"... (Not fully) Kind of disturbing that he's a guy, that turned into a female horse and bred with a male horse giving birth to a weird horse. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lightsmith Posted November 7, 2015 Share Posted November 7, 2015 (edited) It's like you entirely missed the point that has been repeated over and over again. A warframe is designed, given a set of abilities and then it's given a reference name based on what it's abilities do. Chinaframes are literally characters turned warframes, no common theme to follow, they are literally designed after their name. What makes people upset is the unoriginality that comes from DE not even trying to at the very least make it seem like the powers have any relation to each other, literally just slapping together comepletely different and unrelated powers and calling it a day. Some posts above you have an answer, reading helps a lot y'know? I didn't know 2 warframes out of the whole (with lots of release time apart) bunch suddendly counted as many. not much time in between. Basically they are back to back as males can be. But that being said, I only express concern if this is a trend. If its one or two that's fine, but more... Oberon is literally the name of the fairy king IIRC.yup, I believe it's Shakespeare's midsummer night's dream. We have a frame modeled after a mystical English sword (Excalibur), we have Fairy Kings (Oberon), a Norse God (Loki), a Ninja-Pirate Squid (Hydroid), a Fire Chicken (Ember), a die-hard ninja (Ash), a super-chill Russian (Frost), a Cowboy/Cowgirl (Mesa), a psychologist (Nyx), a nurse (Trinity), an African/Southeast-Asian Odd-Toed Ungulate (Rhino), a cat (Valkyr) a big-top circus magician (Limbo) and his jester accomplice (Mirage), a (soon to be) Druid/Archer frame... To all of those arguing that frames based on Chinese deities doesn't fit the lore, please, tell me more about how it doesn't fit in with what we have. Really. I'd love to hear how a frame based off a Chinese deity (or two) would fly in the face of the lore we have. In all honesty I'm a little surprised that we haven't already had a frame inspired by a Chinese deity. Frost is Russian, hows that work? Oberon is fan named and the frame has nothing to do with Faeries.The original frames has no "theme" its just names. Edited November 7, 2015 by Lightsmith Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vilemyre Posted November 7, 2015 Share Posted November 7, 2015 (edited) an African/Southeast-Asian Odd-Toed Ungulate (Rhino) What are you talking about rhino is just a guy on creatine/steroids. Edited November 7, 2015 by Makairi Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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