What do you think about those salty traders who thinks you're scamming them?

[Aaryl]

I'm not expecting to listen to only sweet words, so please be free to express your thoughts about it!

So, from time to time, I face couple of people who are really rude and salty when I offer them 'high' prices that they don't like it. That's cool, because my price can't simply be perfect for every single players.

What upsets me is that they do forget (in my opinion) is that price vary from people from people, and the price is NEVER fixed no matter what unlike Darvo's Market, etc. From what I understand, people's view of valuing items vary a lot, hence varying the prices from people to people, and it can be haggle to adjust the price if necessary.

For example, say people are selling Corrosive Projection for 20? etc like that, but I value its preciousness due to its popularity and rarity and plan to sell it for 35 or so. Would this be considered as a 'scam'?

Also, am I FORCING them to buy/sell from/to me? like I'm the only source of certain item? One can simply politely refuse the deal and look for it from somebody else. Why make the atmosphere unnecessarily unpleasant?

Trading in Warframe is a privilege, not a right. Once a person enters a trade chat, Player is expected to be aware of their goal price for obtaining items, and expect to haggle and face non-optimal prices from others....

Considering others' price high may be an opinion for that person. Is there really need of reporting, throwing salty words to them about it in free market?

I see offers with price out of my thoughts range everyday. Should I report all of them? No, but to just ignore them and continue with my search.

Edited May 1, 2016 by --Q--Aaryl

[Delasire]

People are going to be rude no matter what. It's a free market like you said, they're free to buy your stuff as well as they're free to ignore your offer. Probably you just met someone who had a bad day or didn't hit puberty yet. Put your prices and don't feel threatened by rude people, as you're only giving them satisfaction!

[(PSN)robotwars7]

4 minutes ago, --Q--Aaryl said:

free market?

that's your problem right there. you wouldn't go into a Wal-Mart and insult the cashier because your biscuits are too expensive. but on a free market, where you haggle over an unfixed, fluctuating market value, the rule book is thrown in the dirt.

I REALLY hate it when you put a price forward and they don't respond. I won't get offended if you say no, but I would appreciate it if you make a counter offer for me to consider. if I say no to that, then we don't trade and we move on. at least have the decency to not leave me hanging.

[Norbac-]

Those ''scammers'' trigger me a LOT. Although I do not flame them, report them or anything innapropiate, just ignore and move on.

[ashrah]

i am lawayes very well informed....i spent a lot time in trade and scam i smell before its start...if someone post some crazy price i just close tab....its a lot cool ppl in trade also....who are very kind

[Alcoholism]

I find trading in this game to be a little bit of a steep learning curve especially for new players - hence why I assume other players think that someone selling something at a price much higher than others is "scamming".

The best way I can explain it is, not everyone has the time to sit and watch trade chat AND attempt to haggle and barter with other players in order to get a good "average" on the price of something.

I also see a lot of references to Warframe.market - I actually see that website as a good indicator but not a 100% accurate pricing system.
What people need to understand is that if someone is firm on selling something for a price higher than the norm or trying to buy for a price lower than the norm, then just say "no worries, but thanks any way" and move on.
Instead what I tend to see is people getting quite rude, in fact I've put multiple people on ignore due to this reason alone.

Trading is and always will be a steep learning curve with massive fluctuations in a game where there is no 100% accurate price on something.
As you guys have said above, the biggest problem is the sheer amount of people being rude and some not even bothering to reply to a person who is clearly going out of their way to make an offer or even attempt to barter and haggle (which imo is the fun part of trading).

The line does seem to be blurred though (I can see why these sorts of people would be called "scammers") when there are some traders who flood the chat with the same thing day in and day out mostly to buy parts for cheap and sell sets for way more than the sum of their parts. What people need to do is just simply put those people on ignore and not deal with them, it will free up trade chat and you can avoid feeling "scammed". It's really that simple.

[-Amaterasu-]

When I sell things I always price on the higher side and expect to be talked down and honestly it amazes me how few people are willing to do that now since that was pretty common in trading a while ago.

12 minutes ago, (PS4)robotwars7 said:

I REALLY hate it when you put a price forward and they don't respond. I won't get offended if you say no, but I would appreciate it if you make a counter offer for me to consider. if I say no to that, then we don't trade and we move on. at least have the decency to not leave me hanging.

This is also something I notice a lot, nobody ever seems to have the decency to tell you what they want you to pay for something they just say make an offer and end up ignoring you without ever saying what their price range was

[DuskLegendary]

I've ran into this a few times. As you yourself said, since there's no set price on anything, we the player base decide what prices to put on items, we ourselves determine the worth of said items. I've been selling my Loki Prime sets for 200 Platium each lately, even though he only goes for about 100. Why do I do this? Because not only are the systems a pain to get (21 T3 Sabo missions and counting, still no systems) but he's next in line to be vaulted. To me, he's not worth just 100 Platinum. People are free to argue this as they wish and are free not to buy from me, that's fine.

What I'm saying is, since there are no set prices on anything, we ourselves decide the prices. You go on to Warframe Market and you check the lowest prices, and this is what people use to argue that X item is worth this much, but what would happen if the person that set the lowest price were to change his/her prices to an even higher value, and everyone else followed accordingly? Then, that would be the new lowest price, and this is what the item would be trending at. 

Don't be angry about the salty people in trade chat who don't have any manners, it happens. I want to buy Legendary Cores for 400 Platinum, but I don't go cussing, reporting, and blocking everyone who don't bend to my price expectations, that's just wrong. Sell your items for whatever you want OP, it's your right as a player, trading is a privlege.

Edited May 1, 2016 by DuskLegendary

[Cydro_]

Maroo's Bazaar is a first step to better trading. A good first step. Though I guarantee it would be far more effective if you didn't need to go through a loading screen to access it 

[Fionntan]

1 minute ago, -Amaterasu- said:

When I sell things I always price on the higher side and expect to be talked down and honestly it amazes me how few people are willing to do that now since that was pretty common in trading a while ago.

This is also something I notice a lot, nobody ever seems to have the decency to tell you what they want you to pay for something they just say make an offer and end up ignoring you without ever saying what their price range was

Yea, it happens more than I can count with my hands and feet. It's very easy just say no :/ So I just close tab after few seconds and move on.

Sometimes, rarely, they give a witty remark and /ignore me. Fine. Not like I'd trade with them anyways  

On the bright side I felt nice today and decided give away Skana Prime for Med Ray  

2 minutes ago, Cydro_ said:

Maroo's Bazaar is a first step to better trading. A good first step. Though I guarantee it would be far more effective if you didn't need to go through a loading screen to access it 

Wonder if they ever fixed UI Shops from freezing.... Cuz I really like the idea leave shop open to trade.

[Alcoholism]

In regards to Maroo's Bazaar as well, I'd like it if we could open up shop and put prices on items - then just go afk.
We come back maybe a few hours later and someone may have bought your items, maybe not.
It somewhat eliminates the need to sit there in trade chat spamming and people can browse your "shop" without having to go to a trading interface where the seller has to be physically there to trade you.

I've seen examples of this in other MMOs and I found it to be quite fun and useful to go through and browse everyone's shop, checking how much they want for each item and you can have say 10 items in your shop with a price next to each one and if someone wants it for that price, they buy it, no waiting for the other person to accept trade or anything like that.

[Soulden]

3 minutes ago, Alcoholism said:

In regards to Maroo's Bazaar as well, I'd like it if we could open up shop and put prices on items - then just go afk.
We come back maybe a few hours later and someone may have bought your items, maybe not.
It somewhat eliminates the need to sit there in trade chat spamming and people can browse your "shop" without having to go to a trading interface where the seller has to be physically there to trade you.

I've seen examples of this in other MMOs and I found it to be quite fun and useful to go through and browse everyone's shop, checking how much they want for each item and you can have say 10 items in your shop with a price next to each one and if someone wants it for that price, they buy it, no waiting for the other person to accept trade or anything like that.

Until there is so many players selling on same relay that nobody can go in to buy.

Then what?

[Alcoholism]

Just now, Souldend78 said:

Until there is so many players selling on same relay that nobody can go in to buy.

Then what?

Well there are multiple channels each relay has, just like when Baro comes and the relay he's on has multiple channels to fit the sheer amount of players getting into the relay.
Basically just switch between channels on the relay. Might seem like a pain to leave relay and come back to go to a different channel but you're going to be saving time any way browsing shops instead of physically talking to the seller.

[Ayoshi]

7 minutes ago, Alcoholism said:

I've seen examples of this in other MMOs and I found it to be quite fun and useful to go through and browse everyone's shop, checking how much they want for each item and you can have say 10 items in your shop with a price next to each one and if someone wants it for that price, they buy it, no waiting for the other person to accept trade or anything like that.

Hey guys, remember Ragnarok's market? I miss that.

[Soulden]

6 minutes ago, Alcoholism said:

Well there are multiple channels each relay has, just like when Baro comes and the relay he's on has multiple channels to fit the sheer amount of players getting into the relay.
Basically just switch between channels on the relay. Might seem like a pain to leave relay and come back to go to a different channel but you're going to be saving time any way browsing shops instead of physically talking to the seller.

Baro as an NPC can be set anywhere on multiple instances, we players cannot.

If you are afk, how would you guess the channel you set your shop initially is full by days end?

Wasted a day away, come back and sold nothing?

 

[Hemmo67]

yesterday i was trying to sell buzzkill me myself was hoping for 150 because of how good the mod is and the facts it's been time since baro dropped it upons us but i got offered 50 for it :|

so i was expecting in the lines of something like....."fu** off scammer (this person is ignoring you)" but to my suprises he took it very understandingly.

^ that's how all trades should go, both present their price, try negotiate and move on from that

example of how it shouldn't go is

seller: offer?

me: 100?

seller: ignored

makes my cry each time :'(

[Joel_The_Jackle]

The ones that get me going are the ones who agree to a price in chat, get you to invite them to the dojo and then put in half the agreed plat, say they don't have any more than that and can't I sell it at that price.....dafuq....if you wanted to haggle we had all the time in the world in chat...I may have even lowered the price if I saw you were a newer player and I was selling you an "essential" mod...I give things like flow and continuity away to random new players I meet in PUGs anyway...but it grinds my gears to no end if you agree, ask for an invite then try to offer half (or less) than the agreed ammount, then call me a scammer for asking the agreed upon price and block me.....

[Soulden]

When it comes to selling this is a tricky subject as per "Free Market".

Seriously, you already know there is only 2 types of buyers, those who will buy at your set price and those who will try to play you out.

I don't depend on trade often, so I watch the average price offers on both sides and go from there, usually saves me a lot of trouble.

So I thank you all that min/max your prices, you make me a lot of plat from someone who barely plays the game.

[Azrael]

Getting salty at all about anything that isn't some kind of genuine harm that's been done to you is just poor attitude. I once had someone put me on his ignore list because I offered less for his wares than he wanted. That one made me laugh, I can tell you.

Whenever there's a mismatch, it just means we disagree about the value of something. Sometimes people just can't handle anyone disagreeing with them.

It DOES bother me a little when people consistently undervalue things. They forget that I put a lot of my own time and effort -- as well as resources and expertise -- into getting it, and that I'm putting a price on ALL of that, not just the mod or weapon. So no, I won't sell that primed mod for less than 90p, because I worked to get the ducats to buy it and I value my time.

Also sometimes I genuinely don't know what something is worth right now, and so I might offer too little or ask for too much out of ignorance. Getting offended by that is just plain dumb.

*edit: apparently this getting-ignored-over-prices thing is way more common than I realized. Jeez, I guess I've been lucky to not have encountered it that much? Anyway, I'd like to say to any future idiots that if you're THAT angry about my offer then please do ignore me. I don't want to trade with you anyway.

Edited May 1, 2016 by Lord_Azrael

[Alcoholism]

41 minutes ago, Souldend78 said:

Baro as an NPC can be set anywhere on multiple instances, we players cannot.

If you are afk, how would you guess the channel you set your shop initially is full by days end?

Wasted a day away, come back and sold nothing?

 

Well you wouldn't technically have wasted a day if you're afk - it's just an option for people who do not have the time to sit in trade chat all day. If you're actively playing the game, then why set up an afk shop? Just do trade the usual way.
Also from my understanding instances in special cases such as these could be set up like:

• Max instance size (let's just say 20 shops per instance for argument sake)
• When max shop count has been reached players attempting to make a new shop are moved to the next relay instance
• Allow for 20 players per instance to be in the relay without actually setting up shop in order to browse player shops
• Therefore maximum player size of 40 per instance (20 browsing, 20 with open shops)
• Relay could have like 10 instances on the one relay, that's 200 different shops.
  • They could even optimize this by making a UI feature to swap between instances easier

These are just some examples - I'm no developer but I'm sure they could cook something up obviously much better and more refined.
One of the reasons they haven't is because players wanted trade to be social (i.e. no auction house, grand exchange etc.)

Also that question you pose in regards to how many players would participate and fill up the instances with afk shops or browse all the instances is more of a game dynamic than a mechanic - that's not something I or anyone can really know the answer to. Maybe Warframe's lead game designer could help with that.

I was simply saying that if players are starting to "dislike" the way trading is done, that there are other options DE could explore if the community had second thoughts on social trading.

[-KoreanPotato-]

If the trade hasn't went through, it isn't a scam. If there are no set prices, it isn't a scam. Tell him that next time and put him on your ignore list. They made it for a reason. That's really it. Forget and move on, its the internet afterall

[kirune]

The main problem here is LACK of EDUCATION. (not in this thread :P)

Some people are just rude, and sometimes plainly offensive. I've been sent a private message just to rant over a price I posted on trading channel. These trolls I just blacklist them.

As stated above, you can be pricier than average market, it can be on purpose or by mistake. In both cases good manner can solve the "conflict".

[Vali]

There is no 'scamming' unless people are trying to trick you out of your money. (Asking for gifts in exchange for items, Excal Prime promises, lying about mod effects etc.)

 

If people are overpricing, they're over pricing.

Edited May 1, 2016 by Agentawesome

[ranks21]

there is no set price for anything other than what DE has selling in the market at their prices stated  albeit if a seller is selling an item  low or high its their  choice and it is also the buyer's choice to purchase it<<< what isn't a reference and has no affiliation with DE's staff/office are the sites like warframe trader etc that players use as a measuring stick and thinks this is normal and exact, totally far from it.

 if you read any of the games description of the market you should know that 1 its free, 2 its an open market, and 3 it's player controlled prices.

those who don't like what another person is willing to part with their items for  xxx price can just go do the hunting themselves there is no over pricing or under pricing of any item not controlled or sold in the game's official market place by DE.

 Auction house>> see forums where players list items for sale/bid>>> don't know how effective that is.

overall  it is what it is if you don't like the way its going then move along youre not the only person in this big open world.

[Sonos]

If they are contacting you then the want the item.  I always make an exception to my price for the people ugly about it and raise it.  Just for them.  The additional salt is just extra salt on the cake as they say.

Edited May 1, 2016 by Sonos