Volt Rework Feedback [Post Update 18.13]

[Aquasurge]

8 hours ago, ElectronX_Core said:

YESSSSS!!! THIS MAN RIGHT HERE IS RIGHT!!!

Still, nice job with the rework so far, D.E.. Loving the new Volt.

same though i may not be able to frequently post as often as i do now due to computer issues which may involve a cracked screen. keep the fight up guys! i will be back on the forums this weekend though (hopefully maybe from time to time over the week). and kudos to the guy who thought up the idea to regen energy while running. kind of fixes volt's energy efficiency. 

Edited May 30, 2016 by Aquasurge

[ElectronX_Core]

Can we all universally agree than Discharge's damage cap and delay before the enemy damages itself should be removed?

Also, what is the point of the Discharge's teslas doing half damage if the damage ticks 2 times per second, which means the dps is still the same anyways?

And to ANYONE AND EVERYONE that wants the old Overload back, NO. JUST NO. The damage was crap and it only worked once.

Edited May 30, 2016 by ElectronX_Core

[chofranc]

I totally disagree with Discharge as a CC skill, the stun doesn't last long when you fight with crowds that have little defense, it last like 1-3 seconds, i tested it, it las long with enemies that have high defense like grineers, maybe increase the ¿base health of the skill or something?, and another problem with the stun is that the stun doesn't reset while you do multiple cast.

His 1 maybe need a buff, maybe more base power or more range? or that scale a little more with strength and the chain with range?

Please for god sake, change the description of the warframe even with the rework Volt still not is "a potent alternative to gunplay" he indeed "potency the gunplay".

Edited May 31, 2016 by chofranc

[Sir.X]

1. The amount of people chained on shocks should increase with either strength or range.

2. The energy drain for picking up Volt's shield is way too high combined with Speed.

3. Discharge would be more effective if enemies stayed stun until the duration ended, and if the range was a little higher.

If the passive was only for his abilities and not for every attack you do, that would be great. 

[YagoXiten]

3 hours ago, ElectronX_Core said:

Can we all universally agree than Discharge's damage cap and delay before the enemy damages itself should be removed?

Also, what is the point of the Discharge's teslas doing half damage if the damage ticks 2 times per second, which means the dps is still the same anyways?

And to ANYONE AND EVERYONE that wants the old Overload back, NO. JUST NO. The damage was crap and it only worked once.

The damage cap being removed would be a very, very, very scary thing. 240% Power Strength would be 1080 DPS per target to each target in range. That might not sound particularly great, but five enemies clustered would deal 25k DPS. Ten targets clustered would deal 108k DPS. Twenty targets would deal 432k DPS.  That said, the delay before self-damag being removed would be nice, as would making the CC not end so abruptly when the damage cap has been hit. It can currently swing wildly between doing a lot of CC or a lot of damage based upon what targets are near each other, and that's a rather difficult thing to account for whilst playing.

It's fairly common for damage over times to deal damage in half second ticks. It feels better for immediate feedback.
 

 

2 hours ago, chofranc said:

I totally disagree with Discharge as a CC skill, the stun doesn't last long when you fight with crowds that have little defense, it last like 1-3 seconds, i tested it, it las long with enemies that have high defense like grineers, maybe increase the ¿base health of the skill or something?, and another problem with the stun is that the stun doesn't reset while you do multiple cast.

I think that volt maybe need something that return to him a little energy when do something with one of his abilities, because you need to cast a lot to do some damage with his abilities to try to make him "a potent alternative to gunplay", this is what make his first ability a waste of energy too, i personally don't use his first ability because it does to little damage, the electricity stun is to short, maybe if you potent his first ability with more base damage.

Please for god sake, change the description of the warframe even with the rework Volt still not is "a potent alternative to gunplay" he indeed "potency the gunplay".

Volt's description is outdated and misleading. The intention with the rework was to address and buff Volt as he is, and not Volt as an archaic single-sentence description.

Volt doesn't need a way to regain Energy, he mostly just needs to have the drain on the Riot Electric Shield removed. The skill scales with Duration for the time it lasts, and the Energy cost, and Efficiency effects the two Energy drains. This is where almost all of his costs come from.

 

30 minutes ago, shadow18715 said:

1. The amount of people chained on shocks should increase with either strength or range.

2. The energy drain for picking up Volt's shield is way too high combined with Speed.

3. Discharge would be more effective if enemies stayed stun until the duration ended, and if the range was a little higher.

If the passive was only for his abilities and not for every attack you do, that would be great. 

Actually, improving Shock's number of targets with Strength and making Discharge's range based upon Duration like Molecular Prime or Polarize would be a step in the right direction, highlighting Range and/or Efficiency as Volt's dump stats. Along with drastically lowering and removing that excessive slow and drain on picking up Electric Shield.
 

[Necior]

I would agree:

1.Shock number o targets scaling with strength would be nice option, but not to strong.

2.Speed buff  I like, but mechanic of sharing it with team isn't this what it should be, maybe marking buff spot on minimap would help and taking up this should give full duration, not actual could help somehow.

3. I understand why they capped number of shields to 4, Im ok with that, it could do sick situations, but like everyone said, energy drain is waaaaay to high, you had said that Volt should be mobile, passive is for mobility, but two ways of energy drain of shield bringing him to point where moving is a opponent. Speed deacrease... okey... but maybe not that much slowing. And what about synergy with beam weapons which you removed and said that, you will do something with this ASAP.

4.Discharge have problems little bit like old Ember World of Fire, it is blocked by every stat. When you build high duration or low and cast ability near many mobs there no difference, it stay very short, due to duration cap, or health cap. Also this 4 second delay between self damaging is pushing to build to have at least 4sec standing Discharge. If you want to this 4seconds stay someway, maybe remove this from begining of ability to end of it, but working otherway. In these last 4sec of ability mob dealing self damage, but it wont be calculated with damage cap, and stun will sty to end of ability. Will try show it on example. Discharge have 8sec of duration, in  first 4seconds mob working only like tesla coil and can damage nearest mobs like it is, if healt cap is reached he is still stunned. When there are last 4 seconds of ability mob starting self damaging, if health cap wasn't reached he also still working like tesla coil until reaching cap. And maybe turn tesla coil to not number damage but health %, but constant like 20%, it will scale with mobs lvl but wont be one cast to kill ability on high lvls.

Also before rework many players was feeling that 4th ability range should scale with duration, not range, and nowits the same.

[Aquasurge]

20 hours ago, DaedricToast666 said:

I think the devs should capitalize on the held Electric Shield idea, they should really sell that volt could be like a lancer or something. He runs to front lines with his shield in hand and a pistol or melee weapon mowing down enemies throws a lightning bolt like frickin Zeus every now and again. Cool stuff right there.

On the Feedback side, I think when Volt picks up his shield it should have like 1/4 of the drain it has now and only be a small drain every few seconds instead of being time and distance based. Speed is wonderful (especially that reload buff thank you), I don't really mind the pickup thing because I play Volt a lot and I'm sure my friends and clan mates are tired of always being sped up.

Shock should be looked at I think and maybe instead of zapping (zapping seems kinda weak as much as I like shock while reloading) make shock one of those powers people really like using because it makes them feel like a god. Maybe something along the lines of Volt creating a lightning bolt in his hand quickly and lobbing it into an enemy, and just like now it would chain off that enemy into the few bad guys around it.

"When a bolt of lightning does strike a human frame, very bad things happen. In addition to the 300kV of energy coursing through you, the power of the strike heats the surrounding air to 50,000 degrees F, causing third degree burns at the bolt's entry and exit points. The heat and force can singe and shred clothing. Lightning strikes have blown people clear out of their shoes," got this little explanation off of gizmodo. Even though electric damage is kinda meh maybe by working heat damage or possibly a lot of blast damage into Discharge or Shock you could get massive amounts of CC and the Abilities would probably be better off because of that. Think if Volt hit a giant group of enemies with Discharge and it shocks them and blasts them away. But that's just a concept.

Tl;dr Make Volt more like Zeus and add Blast damage to his Damage skills for insane CC potential.

Signed

     A Volt enthusiast

that has to be one of the best ideas for shock i have ever heard of but it should also leave scorch marks. this idea also surprisingly fits volt prime's codex entry. "A glorious warrior from the past, Volt Prime features the same abilities as Volt, but with unique mod polarities for greater customization". I am all for more realistic lightning physics for volt in this game and overrral a more interesting and fun 1st ability. #forthespartangods

30 minutes ago, Necior said:

I would agree:

1.Shock number o targets scaling with strength would be nice option, but not to strong.

2.Speed buff  I like, but mechanic of sharing it with team isn't this what it should be, maybe marking buff spot on minimap would help and taking up this should give full duration, not actual could help somehow.

3. I understand why they capped number of shields to 4, Im ok with that, it could do sick situations, but like everyone said, energy drain is waaaaay to high, you had said that Volt should be mobile, passive is for mobility, but two ways of energy drain of shield bringing him to point where moving is a opponent. Speed deacrease... okey... but maybe not that much slowing. And what about synergy with beam weapons which you removed and said that, you will do something with this ASAP.

4.Discharge have problems little bit like old Ember World of Fire, it is blocked by every stat. When you build high duration or low and cast ability near many mobs there no difference, it stay very short, due to duration cap, or health cap. Also this 4 second delay between self damaging is pushing to build to have at least 4sec standing Discharge. If you want to this 4seconds stay someway, maybe remove this from begining of ability to end of it, but working otherway. In these last 4sec of ability mob dealing self damage, but it wont be calculated with damage cap, and stun will sty to end of ability. Will try show it on example. Discharge have 8sec of duration, in  first 4seconds mob working only like tesla coil and can damage nearest mobs like it is, if healt cap is reached he is still stunned. When there are last 4 seconds of ability mob starting self damaging, if health cap wasn't reached he also still working like tesla coil until reaching cap. And maybe turn tesla coil to not number damage but health %, but constant like 20%, it will scale with mobs lvl but wont be one cast to kill ability on high lvls.

Also before rework many players was feeling that 4th ability range should scale with duration, not range, and nowits the same.

agree with everything about discharge.

Edited May 30, 2016 by Aquasurge

[Wolfnrun]

9 hours ago, ElectronX_Core said:

YESSSSS!!! THIS MAN RIGHT HERE IS RIGHT!!!

Still, nice job with the rework so far, D.E.. Loving the new Volt.

I mean it's ok but there's still some issues that persists

[Wolfnrun]

5 hours ago, Aquasurge said:

same though i may not be able to frequently post as often as i do now due to computer issues which may involve a cracked screen. keep the fight up guys! i will be back on the forums this weekend though (hopefully maybe from time to time over the week). and kudos to the guy who thought up the idea to regen energy while running. kind of fixes volt's energy efficiency.

Alrighty! Will do! see you later #StormRiders  

Edited May 30, 2016 by Wolfnrun

[Necior]

And I forgot to say, shocked shield could deal electricity proc on enemies touching it, only once per enemy, but still nice feature. Decreasing energy drain  can be removal energy drain per distans, drain per sec can stay to not be shield helding to easy.

[Toramaru]

Still no signs of the rework of the rework?

Additionally to all the suggestions I have made I'd like to ask for higher sprint speed! What I see in need of improvements aside from the base sprint speed is:

1 - moddable stun time on Shock

2 - buff to Speed mechanics (recastability and the delay before it kicks in gone) and current numbers (duration is the # in mind...)

3 - carrying the ES is extremely bizarre. I can relate to the concern behind limiting weapon usage, even though only using melee, but the slow/drain is waaaaaay too exaggerated.

4 - now this is a rework. I liked Discharge. Don't mind the damage, but low CC time on it, could be more.

Passive - tbh, quite useless as it is. Too much distance needed to build a charge and once you do, it's 1,000 damage.

[Wolfnrun]

51 minutes ago, Toramaru said:

Still no signs of the rework of the rework?

Additionally to all the suggestions I have made I'd like to ask for higher sprint speed! What I see in need of improvements aside from the base sprint speed is:

1 - moddable stun time on Shock

2 - buff to Speed mechanics (recastability and the delay before it kicks in gone) and current numbers (duration is the # in mind...)

3 - carrying the ES is extremely bizarre. I can relate to the concern behind limiting weapon usage, even though only using melee, but the slow/drain is waaaaaay too exaggerated.

4 - now this is a rework. I liked Discharge. Don't mind the damage, but low CC time on it, could be more.

Passive - tbh, quite useless as it is. Too much distance needed to build a charge and once you do, it's 1,000 damage.

"Rework of the rework" That made me chuckle, none the less I agree with you, Shock and speed need to do more, ES problems are obvious. Passive needs to store damage and unleashes a portion of it so you have extra damage to store instead of always reaching the cap to fill it up for your next attack  

[Toramaru]

34 minutes ago, Wolfnrun said:

"Rework of the rework" That made me chuckle, none the less I agree with you, Shock and speed need to do more, ES problems are obvious. Passive needs to store damage and unleashes a portion of it so you have extra damage to store instead of always reaching the cap to fill it up for your next attack  

Sir, your idea to store higher values and discharge, for instance, 10% of total storage is indeed really good, but as the storage ratio stands it is not sufficient.

We have to do laps before reaching the 1k mark.

The walk to get energy is well melee oriented, quite a fan of that as well.

[Wolfnrun]

13 minutes ago, Toramaru said:

Sir, your idea to store higher values and discharge, for instance, 10% of total storage is indeed really good, but as the storage ratio stands it is not sufficient.

We have to do laps before reaching the 1k mark.

The walk to get energy is well melee oriented, quite a fan of that as well.

Wow! My ideas are getting lots of support!  Hmmm so how to fill it up faster...+25 damage for every meter you move??? How does that sound? 

Edited May 30, 2016 by Wolfnrun

[(PSN)Silverback73]

12 minutes ago, Wolfnrun said:

Wow! My ideas are getting lots of support!  Hmmm so how to fill it up faster...+25 damage for every meter you move??? How does that sound? 

It would be nice to know DE is noting suggestions and concerns via response.  :)

[Wolfnrun]

Just now, (PS4)Silverback73 said:

It would be nice to know DE is noting suggestions and concerns via response.  :)

Would be neat! And we would know that the community is not getting neglected. I feel very strongly for my ideas! Also, I think someone has a clipboard and is noting everything that's being said in this thread... 

[Voidwielder]

Might I have some ideas about how his abilities should be changed:

Shock: Give it an additional effect like: enemy weapon (except melee) will be malfunction, machinary enemy type also will be incapacitated for a duration (maybe 4/6/8/10s) if the enemy isn't dead (unlike disarm, enemy won't turn into melee mode).

Speed: I think it's good.

Shield: No energy drain per meter (distance), instead, disable zenurik effect like other channeling abilities.

Discharge: I have something in mind: First of all, make it's able to cast mid air activate immediately when touch the ground, it will form a electrical sphere around you, deflect incoming damage, stun nearby enemy. Then, it should work like this: Hold the ability button to burn your energy (20/15/10/5 energy point, fix number) dealing (100/200/300/400) damage on health, alive enemy will turn into a tesla coil that zap nearby enemy (1/2/3/4 times).

Passive: Make it usable when fully charged. Or change it to: Enemy kill by volt wil have 25% chance to drop an energy orb.

Hope you consider it :)

Edited May 30, 2016 by Voidwielder

[YagoXiten]

59 minutes ago, Wolfnrun said:

Would be neat! And we would know that the community is not getting neglected. I feel very strongly for my ideas! Also, I think someone has a clipboard and is noting everything that's being said in this thread... 

I've read every page on this thread and have kept up with it. I'm sure many of DE's staff have done so for themselves, personally. And I'm sure the main team has done so, professionally.

 

56 minutes ago, Voidwielder said:

Discharge: I have something in mind: First of all, make it's able to cast mid air activate immediately when touch the ground, it will form a electrical sphere around you, deflect incoming damage, stun nearby enemy. Then, it should work like this: Hold the ability button to burn your energy (20/15/10/5 energy point, fix number) dealing (100/200/300/400) damage on health, alive enemy will turn into a tesla coil that zap nearby enemy (1/2/3/4 times).

 

 

Keep in mind that such massive reworks aren't going to happen, especially not after a big rework having just been done. To do so would require an immense amount of programming to be redone, not to mention art assets, rebalancing, internal playtesting, etc. It really isn't feasible for them to do much more than change values or make minor mechanical tweaks which include things like: adding status chance, basing Discharge expansion range on Duration, adding Energy refund for casting Shock on Electric Shield, etc. Keep your feet on the ground, and your head out of the clouds. I'm not saying this to stifle creative spirit, just to remind everyone to focus on providing feedback that they can use in the present.

Edited May 30, 2016 by YagoXiten

[Voidwielder]

4 minutes ago, YagoXiten said:

I've read every page on this thread and have kept up with it. I'm sure many of DE's staff have done so for themselves, personally. And I'm sure the main team has done so, professionally.

 

Keep in mind that such massive reworks aren't going to happen, especially not after a big rework having just been done. To do so would require an immense amount of programming to be redone, not to mention art assets, rebalancing, internal playtesting, etc. It really isn't feasible for them to do much more than change values or minor mechanical tweaks which include things like: adding status chance, basing Discharge expansion range on Duration, adding Energy refund for casting Shock on Electric Shield, etc. Keep your feet on the ground, and your head out of the clouds. I'm not saying this to stifle creative spirit, just to remind everyone to focus on providing feedback that they can use in the present.

I didn't mean them to fix it now, just a suggestion if they ever think about give him a second rework on 1 ability :)

[YagoXiten]

Just now, Voidwielder said:

I didn't mean them to fix it now, just a suggestion if they ever think about give him a second rework on 1 ability :)

I know, and it's always nice to see the creative endeavors of other players. That said, this is the thread for Volt players addressing his state at this moment, and such posts are somewhat off topic.

[weezedog]

Shock should chain to other shields if they are close by, no reason to have to shock 3-4 shields separately when they are right next to each other. 

Volt should revive teammates faster while under the effect of speed. 

Edited May 30, 2016 by weezedog

[Domaik]

Ok here is my 2 cents as one of the players that has pushed the issue of Volt rework the most in the past 3 years. I love Electric powers and I want volt to be decent!

Let's keep it simple, here is my opinion and feedback:

The good things

The new FX effects animation and sounds

The concept of the new skills

The synergy between the skills

The concept of the passive

The bad things (that make this rework a nerf)

STATS, STATS, STATS. STATS (repeat xInfinite times)

     -Max power strength or not, skilsl still do no damage at all. Anything over level 40 barely takes damage. Go past 45 the damage is non-existent...

     -Discharge and the damage cap that makes his CC unreliable.

     -Charged Electric shield seems to do no damage what-so-ever, it doesn't proc shock status either when hitting enemies...what is the point of this cool synergy then?

     -Still not understanding what DE is trying to mean by alternative to gun-play. Also last time I checked Codex said: HIGH DAMAGE WARFRAME.

 

 

Overall, Volt rework concept is amazing. The FX upgrade was much needed and it's amazing but there are tons of other warframes that can fill his role in the party much easier and doing more things at the same time, ultimately making him useless and unreliable. The lack of damage and confusing CC length makes Volt quite undesirable.

 

Edited May 30, 2016 by Domaik

[Faeduin]

 After carefully watching this thread evolve, I'd have to say everyone coming into here to either post or catch up should seriously consider reading everything YagoXiten has posted on the topic and upvoting it if you agree. It echoes a lot of the feedback, albeit more concisely and eloquently, that I've seen from the majority of people posting, myself included.

 Let's get this seen so we aren't right back here next week after the inevitable hotfixing. 

My only addition to whats been said already is about the passive, which I highlighted in my own post way back on page 4. I do not personally like that it actively discourages you from being airborne or performing parkour and it's excuse follows scientific theory that is no longer up to date. The current theory is that friction only increases the effect of a static charge but can be generated regardless, Static Electricity by LiveScience. So I'm sure for the sake of gameplay this could be altered in a way that both makes sense and is fun if by only from the simple change of accumulating it while in any motion. 

 

Edited May 30, 2016 by Kedai

[Cytobel]

So, after all this playtesting this weekend, I've got a Volt that works.  He lacks the survivability or scaling elements to go for any length at sortie levels, and he is not able to support the silly carry cost for the shields (meaning I can't make use of the only thing I've seen that COULD let him Sortie or Raid, MAYBE), but this works.

The build:

Spoiler

http://screencast.com/t/d1tqurKU

Please note:  Arcane Storm Helmet.  If you don't have Arcane helmets, you're not gonna get that last bit of power strength.  Personally, I'm not too sure it's that critical, but it is what it is.

I'm still suffering the issues caused by very poor synergy between Speed, the passive, and everything else he does.  If that passive added power strength, it'd be PERFECT for Speed, and I think it MIGHT pull him together.  With that and a no-drain or VERY LOW drain to carry Riot Shield, Volt would have what he REQUIRES to survive at higher levels without Arcane Grace (insert extremely salty comment about old arcane helmets and new helmet/syandana arcanes here).

I've been up for around 24 hours now, a solid portion of that messing with Volt.  I'm burned out.  Good sleep time to all.

[Cryone]

1 hour ago, Kedai said:

 After carefully watching this thread evolve, I'd have to say everyone coming into here to either post or catch up should seriously consider reading everything YagoXiten has posted on the topic and upvoting it if you agree. It echoes a lot of the feedback, albeit more concisely and eloquently, that I've seen from the majority of people posting, myself included.

 Let's get this seen so we aren't right back here next week after the inevitable hotfixing. 

My only addition to whats been said already is about the passive, which I highlighted in my own post way back on page 4. I do not personally like that it actively discourages you from being airborne or performing parkour and it's excuse follows scientific theory that is no longer up to date. The current theory is that friction only increases the effect of a static charge but can be generated regardless, Static Electricity by LiveScience. So I'm sure for the sake of gameplay this could be altered in a way that both makes sense and is fun if by only from the simple change of accumulating it while in any motion. 

 

bump, totally agree with passive accumulating in any motion. Like I said in my post: "WE ARE GROUNDED!"

Edited May 30, 2016 by Cryone