Umbra Warframes (Discussion Thread)

[arch111]

5 minutes ago, LorianTheElderPrince said:

But the mod added the mega thread tag....

And even they didn't, Its had the mega thread tag on it for months and only now they've removed it?

Aha! Umbra is going to be released and this thread had to be "disposed of" to make way for a new Megathread when Umbra is released.

There is no fooling the Tinfoil-syndicate, we see you.

Edited August 7, 2016 by arch111

[Vlada91]

What if the umbra easier to farm if you play with prime frame?   and even easier if you have a prime Excal to your team....

Edited August 7, 2016 by Vlada91

[Yual]

19 minutes ago, Vlada91 said:

What if the umbra easier to farm if you play with prime frame?   and even easier if you have a prime Excal to your team....

Umbra will drop in a quest

[Stormdragon]

40 minutes ago, LorianTheElderPrince said:

If a mod thinks 200+ pages doesn't count as a mega thread he shouldn't be a mod.

I see no need on start attacking our moderators, please remain civil as this kind of comment might only bring more negativity to thread and eventually lead it to a lock. I guess losing the megathread tag is better than getting the thread locked

 

[TheGodofWiFi]

18 minutes ago, -----LegioN----- said:

I see no need on start attacking our moderators, please remain civil as this kind of comment might only bring more negativity to thread and eventually lead it to a lock. I guess losing the megathread tag is better than getting the thread locked

 

It was a joke. 

[(XBOX)MK Ultra K11]

1 hour ago, Vlada91 said:

What if the umbra easier to farm if you play with prime frame?   and even easier if you have a prime Excal to your team....

Then consoles are ducked.

[Apoc001]

7 hours ago, H2K3 said:

Technically, it is. It's just called something else.

no it is not, that which defines something an Umbra is not yet in the game, therefore it is not an Umbra

it is using the Umbra model, and has Umbra in its name, but Chinas Umbra Prime is really Excalibur Prime using the Umbra model

[Arxfiend]

19 minutes ago, Apoc001 said:

no it is not, that which defines something an Umbra is not yet in the game, therefore it is not an Umbra

it is using the Umbra model, and has Umbra in its name, but Chinas Umbra Prime is really Excalibur Prime using the Umbra model

"In the Chinese Build, Excalibur Umbra originated as part of their Founder's pack exclusive, named as Excalibur Umbra Prime." -Wikia, Excalibur/Umbra

Excalibur Umbra exists in the Chinese build as Excalibur Umbra Prime. They are the same, but with a name change.

[Apoc001]

1 minute ago, H2K3 said:

"In the Chinese Build, Excalibur Umbra originated as part of their Founder's pack exclusive, named as Excalibur Umbra Prime." -Wikia, Excalibur/Umbra

Excalibur Umbra exists in the Chinese build as Excalibur Umbra Prime. They are the same, but with a name change.

they would be the same, if we had our Umbra to compare to Umbra Prime, they look the same, but we have no idea of the mechanics of what makes an Umbra an "Umbra"

so once again, technically, Umbra Prime is not an "Umbra" as summarized by the devs, it is Excalibur Prime, that looks different

p.s. that edit from the wiki has been changed many times, and will continue to change the more time passes, don't use it to strengthen your argument

[Arxfiend]

2 minutes ago, Apoc001 said:

they would be the same, if we had our Umbra to compare to Umbra Prime, they look the same, but we have no idea of the mechanics of what makes an Umbra an "Umbra"

so once again, technically, Umbra Prime is not an "Umbra" as summarized by the devs, it is Excalibur Prime, that looks different

p.s. that edit from the wiki has been changed many times, and will continue to change the more time passes, don't use it to strengthen your argument

Probably the mechanics that keep the special-snowflake-founders from *@##$ing about its release.

And it is not the same as Excalibur Prime. The stats are superior. It is an upgrade from Excalibur, even his prime.

PS: You should probably see the rest of it. I haven't seen that line change since it was added, aside from the spelling errors.

[Apoc001]

5 minutes ago, H2K3 said:

And it is not the same as Excalibur Prime. The stats are superior. It is an upgrade from Excalibur, even his prime.

that's because China doesn't have the problems that global has when it comes to Excalibur Prime, they don't have a screaming community saying that if Excalibur Prime gets a decent buff over the non-prime it would be unfair, that's why DE only gave EP 25 more armor, which is a pathetic 2-3% damage mitigation

once our Umbra is released, EP will likely get that extra energy like Chinas, since we will now have an alternative upgrade to Excalibur

 

[Arxfiend]

13 minutes ago, Apoc001 said:

that's because China doesn't have the problems that global has when it comes to Excalibur Prime, they don't have a screaming community saying that if Excalibur Prime gets a decent buff over the non-prime it would be unfair, that's why DE only gave EP 25 more armor, which is a pathetic 2-3% damage mitigation

once our Umbra is released, EP will likely get that extra energy like Chinas, since we will now have an alternative upgrade to Excalibur

 

I legitimately would like to see that. Also, all of two or three people is screaming on the public forums about that. DE didn't buff the Lato or Skana when their sidegrades were released.

Excalibur Umbra is what he is in the Chinese build, presented as Excalibur Umbra Prime like it or not.

Edited August 8, 2016 by H2K3

[Apoc001]

4 minutes ago, H2K3 said:

Excalibur Umbra is what he is in the Chinese build, presented as Excalibur Umbra Prime like it or not.

Umbra Prime is filling in Excalibur Primes role, it has EPs statistics and mechanics

if Umbra Prime it to be Chinas true Umbra, then it is currently in a placeholder state, functioning as Excalibur Prime, since the "Umbra" class does not exist yet, the lore to explain what and why of Umbra does not exist yet, therefore nothing can be a real Umbra

Excalibur Umbra Prime is Chinas Excalibur Prime, like it or not

[Arxfiend]

10 minutes ago, Apoc001 said:

Umbra Prime is filling in Excalibur Primes role, it has EPs statistics and mechanics

if Umbra Prime it to be Chinas true Umbra, then it is currently in a placeholder state, functioning as Excalibur Prime, since the "Umbra" class does not exist yet, the lore to explain what and why of Umbra does not exist yet, therefore nothing can be a real Umbra

Excalibur Umbra Prime is Chinas Excalibur Prime, like it or not

Excalibur Umbra Prime is our Excalibur Umbra, and the first of the Umbra Warframes. By the logic you are using, Spira Prime is their Lato Prime, and Nikana Prime is their Skana Prime.
 

And, It Excalibur Umbra Prime also has Excalibur's Mechanics. It is simply an upgrade to Excalibur in it's current state.

[Apoc001]

3 minutes ago, H2K3 said:

Excalibur Umbra Prime is our Excalibur Umbra

visually

Excalibur Umbra will be the first Umbra variant frame to be released in WARFRAME - Wiki

"will be" as in "is not yet"

Global is the story teller build, it was through Global that Tenno were revealed to be the zaramin children, which was then transferred to China, if Umbra does not exist in Global build yet, it does not exist in China, all they got was what our Umbra will look like, but not what represents Umbra in the lore, or the mechanics, and it is through the lore and mechanics that will separate an Umbra from a Prime

"Umbra Prime" is not canon to Global, we will not get an "Umbra Prime", Excalibur Umbra Prime is both Excalibur Prime, and Excalibur Umbra, but Umbra doesn't exist, so it it only a Prime, if after we get Umbra and everything that defines an Umbra, and China gets it, then and only then will it be an Umbra, not before

[Arxfiend]

32 minutes ago, Apoc001 said:

visually

Excalibur Umbra will be the first Umbra variant frame to be released in WARFRAME - Wiki

"will be" as in "is not yet"

Global is the story teller build, it was through Global that Tenno were revealed to be the zaramin children, which was then transferred to China, if Umbra does not exist in Global build yet, it does not exist in China, all they got was what our Umbra will look like, but not what represents Umbra in the lore, or the mechanics, and it is through the lore and mechanics that will separate an Umbra from a Prime

"Umbra Prime" is not canon to Global, we will not get an "Umbra Prime", Excalibur Umbra Prime is both Excalibur Prime, and Excalibur Umbra, but Umbra doesn't exist, so it it only a Prime, if after we get Umbra and everything that defines an Umbra, and China gets it, then and only then will it be an Umbra, not before

No no no. You seem to be twisting my point and yours into the lore.

Excalibur Umbra is Excalibur Umbra Prime. You can go into the fact that we have no Umbra lore, but they are the same thing nonetheless. The Chinese build is not going to get Excalibur Umbra. Excalibur Umbra Prime is not Excalibur Prime. Excalibur Prime already exists. Excalibur Umbra Prime is their founders' equivalent to Excalibur Prime, but it is not just an Excalibur Prime. Just because there is no lore on Umbra, doesn't mean that Umbra doesn't exist. That's like saying Excalibur Prime was just a different textured Excalibur because Prime was only a name when it was released.

Excalibur Umbra Prime represents what Excalibur Umbra is in the gameplay. Prime is just its added name. We simply have no lore on the difference. That doesn't mean Excalibur Umbra Prime isn't the first Umbra Warframe. It is simply a name difference.

The whole "will be" is simply referring to the global build. I see a lot of "will be"s that are actually "has been"s in terms of the development.

Edited August 8, 2016 by H2K3

[Apoc001]

Quote

Excalibur Umbra is Excalibur Umbra Prime.

visually

9 minutes ago, H2K3 said:

That's like saying Excalibur Prime was just a different textured Excalibur because Prime was only a name when it was released.

it was, nobody knew what "Prime" meant, everyone simply thought it was a founder exclusive name

9 minutes ago, H2K3 said:

That doesn't mean Excalibur Umbra Prime isn't the first Umbra Warframe.

yes it does

there is no true Umbra yet, we simply call Umbra Prime one, because we have nothing else

Edited August 8, 2016 by Apoc001

[Arxfiend]

19 minutes ago, Apoc001 said:

visually

it was, nobody knew what "Prime" meant, everyone simply thought it was a founder exclusive name

yes it does

there is no true Umbra yet, we simply call Umbra Prime one, because we have nothing else

And mechanics
No, it was still a Prime Warframe. Your logic is highly faulty. Did the atom not exist until we discovered it?
And, there is an Umbra. We call Umbra Prime one because it is.
 

[Apoc001]

1 minute ago, H2K3 said:

And mechanics
No, it was still a Prime Warframe. Your logic is highly faulty. Did the atom not exist until we discovered it?
And, there is an Umbra. We call Umbra Prime one because it is.
 

there was no mechanics difference when EP was released, the death orb passive was when Frost Prime came out, it was then that DE defined what a Prime was

Umbra Prime is not an Umbra, it is Umbra in its name, and it looks like Umbra, but that does not make it an Umbra

[Stormdragon]

All of this talk about umbra and umbra prime has made me think. If the chinese already have Umbra Prime Excalibur, and our Excalibur Umbra is supposed to be the basically the same, just without "Prime" in the name (as per Steve's Twitter, 94% the same) and obtained in an important quest (probably the war within, maybe later, we don't know yet). And given that the chinese are currently getting the second dream (not sure about it, but most likely with the operator and focus system) 

What will they get once they reach the point where we get our Umbra?, keep in mind that both, our Umbra and their Umbra Prime are supposed to be the same, at least in appearance.

Also keep in mind that they can't get Umbra since that would be like DE making a quest to get excal prime in our build. It can't be excal prime because of the promise to our founders, reason why "originators" are getting umbra prime in his place.

[Arxfiend]

33 minutes ago, Apoc001 said:

there was no mechanics difference when EP was released, the death orb passive was when Frost Prime came out, it was then that DE defined what a Prime was

Umbra Prime is not an Umbra, it is Umbra in its name, and it looks like Umbra, but that does not make it an Umbra

EP has, and always had, an extra polarity slot.

Excalibur Umbra Prime is an Umbra. It is the first umbra warframe obtainable in any build of the game. Saying that the name and difference doesn't count is ignorance on your part.

Edited August 8, 2016 by H2K3

[Apoc001]

3 minutes ago, H2K3 said:

EP has, and always had, an extra polarity slot.

thats not mechanics

3 minutes ago, H2K3 said:

Excalibur Umbra Prime is an Umbra. It is the first umbra warframe obtainable in any build of the game. Saying that the name and difference doesn't count is ignorance on your part.

saying Umbra Prime is an Umbra is ignorance on your part, since you, nor anyone else can define what makes a frame an "Umbra"

Edited August 8, 2016 by Apoc001

[Apoc001]

19 minutes ago, -----LegioN----- said:

Also keep in mind that they can't get Umbra

we don't know that

they may not get any Umbras, or maybe they will get "Excalibur Umbra" as their true Umbra, and have 2 visually identical frames, just 1 is acting as a prime, and the other as an umbra, it's whatever China wants to do...or...they get an altered quest

[ChaoSoldier1986]

3 hours ago, Apoc001 said:

that's because China doesn't have the problems that global has when it comes to Excalibur Prime, they don't have a screaming community saying that if Excalibur Prime gets a decent buff over the non-prime it would be unfair, that's why DE only gave EP 25 more armor, which is a pathetic 2-3% damage mitigation

once our Umbra is released, EP will likely get that extra energy like Chinas, since we will now have an alternative upgrade to Excalibur

 

 

3 hours ago, H2K3 said:

I legitimately would like to see that. Also, all of two or three people is screaming on the public forums about that. DE didn't buff the Lato or Skana when their sidegrades were released.
 

No! No! A thousand times No! Founders will have to learn that their stuff must be no better than what we are allowed to get to ensure the only difference is Fashionframe and nothing else.

[Jicematoro]

7 minutes ago, ChaoSoldier1986 said:

No! No! A thousand times No! Founders will have to learn that their stuff must be no better than what we are allowed to get to ensure the only difference is Fashionframe and nothing else.

The founders deserve good stuff, they paid a lot for it (and no, just because they're exclusive, doens't mean they got their Money's worth, I'm sure you wouldn't pay +100$ for an exclusive Prova Prime, if it was just a recolor). Lato and Skana are, let's admit it, pretty bad weapons, and Excalibur Prime is barely better than the normal Excalibur (like, 25 armor difference + Prime Passive, which is pretty much meaningless now that the Void doesn't reward the player), the founders complaining is reasonable, they paid for that stuff in an early state of the game (when maybe those were playable) and now, they can't bring them to missions without handicapping themselves and their team. Their stuff doesn't need to be Broken, it just needs to be good...