Mobile Defense - Not new player friendly.

[polarity]

I've been playing Eurasia a lot over the last few days (levelling unforma'd, unpotatoed, MR fodder gear), and you would not believe the number of times I've logged into a mission that's underway, with the datamass at the start, and new players trying to activate consoles without it.  One even asked how to play the mission type, as he'd had to abort previous attempts.

Would it really be too much to ask for either a message that plays when you try and activate a console when you aren't carrying a datamass, or better yet, when the datamass is still in the first map tile, but all the players have left it?

Ignoring waypoints and the minimap seems to be a problem common to new players, probably because at no point are the icons explained.  Perhaps some additional audio could be played while players are still at a very low MR, along the lines of "I've added (a) yellow waypoint(s) to your map, to mark the objective", or "You'll find the extraction point at the green waypoint on your map".

[[DE]Momaw]

Since we just got an "Intro to Index" along with the The Index, perhaps it would be worth having a script trigger added for other game modes.  So the first time you try to start a Mobile Defense mission, the game opens up the codex tutorial on Mobile Defense.

[Extroah]

Been a long time since my first MD mission, but isnt this somewhat explained anyways? Like Lotus telling you what to do? I could swear that i remember something like this from way back in the days, dont know if that still is in the game though.

[KirukaChan]

I like Momaw's idea. I had a similar issue with Capture when I played it for the very first time. Lotus said, "Remember, we need the subject brought back alive." This made me think that I wasn't actually supposed to deplete the target's HP all the way, and that I was just supposed to weaken them and then I'd get an opportunity to capture them after. Eventually I decided to just try killing them as a "trial and error" thing, and discovered that that was what I was supposed to do all along.

[(XBOX)ATLongshot]

Doesn't the Lotus have a little intro for mobile defense that briefly summerizing what needs to be done?  Or is that too vague for new players and need a more blow by blow description is needed. 

[k05h]

I can sympathize with new players. Seasoned players may not notice it anymore but Warframe has quite a number of different game modes on top of the visual overload, running & gunning and hiding for shield recharge (yes low level players do that from time to time). And if someone just came out of exterminate or defense missions he may be confused as to why the veterans do not kill any enemies on their rush to the first mobile defense target. 

Similar issues can be seen with new players approach to excavation. New players are not aware that the percent of energy correlates with the timer to complete extraction. It is not explained properly and a really good example how to not present a game mode for a game design class. 

It is a general problem in Warframe that the new player experience is subpar. Warframe is really overwhelming because it is not only the different game modes but also tons of other stuff left barely explained. That leads to confusion and frustration. 

If you look at steaminfo you find that the median time of Warframe players is less than five hours. That means a that 50% of players give up on Warframe after less than 5 hours. The avarage playtime with 64 hours does also count in heavy gamers with hundreds or thousends of hours. From the avarage and median I would guess (really just a guess) that Warframe looses more than 90% of new players after less than 10 hours playtime. - I really hope for better tutorials.

[polarity]

Quote

"This is a mobile defense mission.

You must deliver payloads and defend a number of locations while I break into the network."

Payloads (plural) does not match up in an obvious way to the one datamass at the beginning, and players all too often ignore voice cues in games, so you have to make sure to repeat things, or convey the same information through several methods.

[SoanoS]

Warframe in general is not new-player friendly, still. Heck, even as a veteran with thousands of hours and MR21 I am sometimes completely confused as to what DE is trying to say, or what to do in the new gameplay additions. I usually manage to get hang of things after a few tries trough trial and error, but for new players with limited resources, no prior knowledge of the gameplay in general or the slightest idea on how to mod their weapons and frames in a way they can make most out of them, this will feel like a massive, incoherent fluttersuck.

Personally I think DE should put up a website with a comprehensive Tenno Field Manual with instructions, gameplay guides and advice. A link could be added into the game launcher, or even make it a proper part of the Codex. Also, the tutorial in the beginning is very limited that only covers things like movement and abilities and then just shoves the player in the middle of everything.

[(PSN)HSomDevil]

On 24.10.2016 at 5:07 PM, k05h said:

If you look at steaminfo you find that the median time of Warframe players is less than five hours. That means a that 50% of players give up on Warframe after less than 5 hours. The avarage playtime with 64 hours does also count in heavy gamers with hundreds or thousends of hours. From the avarage and median I would guess (really just a guess) that Warframe looses more than 90% of new players after less than 10 hours playtime. - I really hope for better tutorials.

I'd say that's a pretty accurate guess.

Then again, this is also true for most (if not all) 60$ AAA games. I looked through some achievements on my consoles and looks like about 50% of people barely started the games they bought.

And that I find baffling.

[polarity]

I think in the first few hours, the game has two glaring issues, the seond stemming from the first.

1. Weapon Power.

Without mods the starting weapons are woefully underpowered, meaning that for a new player, time-to-kill is hugely out of proportion to what is experienced throughout the rest of the game, short of endgame-endless.  I think this could be because the weapons' power gained from mods is scaled linearly to correspond to enemy health.  However, this does not take into account that a new player also has a skill penalty, due to lack of familiarity with the game.  They will have poorer aim, and they will not have sufficient understanding of the modding system to get the most out of their equipment with the few mods that they have.

Because of this a new player is even further at a disadvantage compared to anyone they may group up with, meaning they could be half way through their magazine before they can down an enemy, that a better geared player then kills in one shot.  Being made to feel useless does not inspire players to continue playing the game.  Getting 'boosted' is a boring grind.


2. Unengaging / overwhelming content.

The very first few missions suffer greatly from either having sections where there are scant few enemies to fight, or far too many to handle (the Everest excavation being a prime example).  Swinging between the tedium of trying to find something to shoot at (especially with a higher levelled player present one-shotting entire crowds, while running through the map at full speed), and being overwhelmed by sheer numbers you have no hope of killing, should you find yourself separated from the group, causes the kind of frustration that will see players quit in anger.

The lack of enemies in some places extends from the need to balance them to the long time-to-kill with unmodded starter weapons, while the large numbers that show up in groups reflects the need to provide enough enemies for everyone to have something to shoot at, when you have a good chance that there is one high levelled player in the group killing almost everything.

 

Solution

For at least the first few hours of content, rebalance weapons so that they feel more powerful, and a new player's time-to-kill (on a single target at least) is a lot closer to anyone else who may show up with better gear.  Maybe not one-shotting but not the magazine emptying needed at present.  That at least will let them feel that they are doing something, and that they aren't completely neutered in comparison to better geared/more experienced players.

You can take away some of their power later (once they have gained some more skill at aiming/dodging in the game), and it won't be a problem.  What is a problem is having too high a difficulty curve right at the start to get past.  Not everyone who starts playing has a huge amount of F/TPS experience to fall back on.  Early game balance should favor the inexperienced.  Those with experience expect the game to be a bit easy at the start.

 

As an example of how bad just one starter weapon is, I soloed Eurasia using nothing but a Lato (after the MR 0 who started it aborted right after I joined, once again, datamass being at the start, us being at a terminal).  Unlike a new player, mine had a fully ranked Hornet Strike on it, giving me +220% damage.

It allowed me to kill most enemies with 2 headshots, and while at times combat became hectic, I managed to complete the mission.  I though it a good level of power for the weapon to have, at that level of mission, with that maxed-mod.

I'm a founder so I have much more skill than a new player, I also had a fully modded max rank warframe to soak up damage, and at times it was still hard work.  Now imagine you've run out of ammo on your primary (or there are just too many enemies to handle with a bow, or you're having to carry a datamass/power cell), and you're a new player, with an unmodded Lato, and you have a fraction of the health I did.  Your time-to-kill is going to be far too high for the number of enemies, you're going to get overwhelmed, and die, repeatedly (Of course that's only if you can work out what to do with the datamass, to start the enemy spawns at the terminals).  Remember, new players won't have ranked up their frames enough to have unlocked all their abilities, and a lot of them forget to use them.

Of all the weapons in the game that need rebalancing, it is the starter weapons.  They should all be viable, because at that point, players are not going to be informed about which oned are.

Meanwhile the earliest of enemies need to have their health and damage values pulled down compared to those later on, and their numbers increased, so that the first experience of the game that inexperienced players see, is a better reflection of the overpowered tenno vs hoard shooter that eventually gets players hooked.

Edited October 26, 2016 by polarity

[Chipputer]

On 10/24/2016 at 9:18 AM, polarity said:

Payloads (plural) does not match up in an obvious way to the one datamass at the beginning, and players all too often ignore voice cues in games, so you have to make sure to repeat things, or convey the same information through several methods.

True or not, there's a very obvious mark on the Datamass that a player who is actually paying any amount of attention would investigate.

[Chewarette]

Well, there is a codex entry for each type of mission with a description...

I think that the first thing DE needs to do is presenting the Codex to the newcomers. It explains a lot of things but few people know about its existence.

[polarity]

After a lot more mobile defense on Eurasia, I've got a couple of different ideas on how to solve this problem (and seen plenty more examples of it).

 

The datamass only has an in-viewport icon when you are within 30 meters of it.  Considering the huge number of fresh players who sprint off as soon as they spawn, ignoring what's at their feet, that leaves the minimap as the only thing on screen that shows that it exists, but that doesn't give them any idea what the icon represents (so even if they read the text on a terminal, they have no idea where in the map to find it.  Not everyone has a good enough memory to find their way back to the start, even if they think to do that).

Meanwhile if I put a waypoint on certain items, not only does the icon show, even when you are the other side of the map, but that icon has text above it, to say what it is.

So long as the datamass is not being carried it should have a persistently visible waypoint in the viewport, with a title on it.  Also, when it is located behind the player, the icon should remain on screen, with an arrow next to it to indicate that it is behind the player.  When in an MD mission, a new player should never be unaware that there is a datamass present, and where it can be found.

 

Another problem I've seen a few new players have is that even when they are carrying the datamass, it isn't immediately obvious how to use it.  They carry it up to the terminal, and spend some time bumping up against it, with nothing happening, before running off to try one of the other terminals.  This is because the area in which the terminals can be activated (and in which the descriptive text which says you need a datamass) is set too far back.  Players do not operate terminals with the tip of their melee weapon, so they expect that they need to be standing next to them for them to do something.

Also the text reads 'HACK INTO TERMINAL (Expend DATAMASS)'  It should say 'Insert' as expend implies that the datamass will be consumed on use.  I'm guessing from the fact that some players run off leaving the datamass all over again, that they thing subsequent terminals won't need it once they've started hacking.

[Chipputer]

3 hours ago, polarity said:

Considering the huge number of fresh players who sprint off as soon as they spawn, ignoring what's at their feet,

This is a player habit that they need to fix on a personal level.

[polarity]

2 hours ago, Chipputer said:

This is a player habit that they need to fix on a personal level.

You couldn't be more wrong, and clearly don't understand how game design works in this area.

If players aren't playing the game as intended, and are regularly missing something vital, then it is absolutely the fault of the designers.  Why else do you think Tomb Raider has white paint on every ledge, The Last of Us has yellow streamers marking the direction you should be heading, and innumerable other games have things marked out with flashing lights, spotlights, flares, or huge great icons in the HUD.

How about instead of blaming new players for any problems they have, that are completely reasonable, you actually learn a little about game design.  Start with the Portal developer commentary, as that game is the text-book case study for how new players should be treated:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2TBIfsPGeQ0&t=3m32s

 

And then go on to articles on gamasutra.com like for example:

" The real treasure from the first year of this process was the establishment of the most basic mistakes a designer can do. By requiring Usability Testing, the designers learned very quickly that teaching players how to play is more important than trying to show how cool how the game is..... because players give up playing games they couldn't understand. "

http://www.gamasutra.com/blogs/HilmyRahim/20161110/285214/How_Design_Students_are_Taught_to_Prototype_on_their_Own.php
 

 

Edited November 10, 2016 by polarity

[Callback]

Just a blinking message on the HUD saying "Grab the datamass" would be fine, and even be a helpful reminder for those times you finish one point and simply forget to pick it up as you run to the next.