Riven Mods hurting the science of modding

[Skiddybike81273]

When I first got these mods I was super interested in how they may work but after learning tat they are totally RNG I'm very disappointed as it destroys all balance related to weapons. I have started this thread to as the community to help come up with a more balanced alternative to this new system as warframe has always been a game about consistent numbers now  these mods throw it all out the window and puts RNG in a place it should not be, I personally feel this is not a healthy direction for the game and player base as effects more than just the damage system but also trade chat and player progression through the game. Please let us come together as a community to help fix this issue as the longer it stays in the game the worse it will get.

[chofranc]

They are restricted to a single weapon and its variant so that doesn't unbalance the game, in fact, its help to fix some weapons that no one uses, i use more the dera vandal since i got a mod for this weapon.

[pauli133]

Throwing a wrench in the minmaxing works isn't a bad thing.

[Skiddybike81273]

I disagree as this role on the tonkor proves

[sekushiiandee]

3 minutes ago, chofranc said:

They are restricted to a single weapon and its variant so that doesn't unbalance the game, in fact, its help to fix some weapons that no one uses, i use more the dera vandal since i got a mod for this weapon.

^in theory yes....but you know for a fact that the majority of the people will keep rerolling until they either get something REALLY good....or they find the weapon they want it for with minor setbacks
 

I like the idea of riven mods....I just dont like how its an RNG wall behind an RNG wall behind a time wall behind another RNG wall.......

placing it in sorties was a good idea...but they need to effin get rid of the ENDO because theres way too much RNG involved

Edited November 14, 2016 by sekushiiandee

[Skiddybike81273]

At max rank

[S0V3REiGN]

I am not sure what "science" of mod building you are talking about. There was always a weapon meta and the status quo was "slam as much damage into a weapon as possible." That has not changed. This only hurts the guys that must absolutely minimax everything and now they can't and/or can't afford to do so. Everyone else takes it as it comes.

[trunks013]

4 minutes ago, Skiddybike81273 said:

At max rank

Oh my god thats just ... Wow

[NinjaKitsune56]

6 minutes ago, sekushiiandee said:

in theory yes....but you know for a fact that the majority of the people will keep rerolling until they either get something REALLY good....or they find the weapon they want it for with minor setbacks

If they want to burn, literally, thousands of Kuva, and have to unveil it every single time, just for their better stats, more power to them. Even the initial reroll is going to cost you 900 Kuva... and it only increases with every reroll on the mod in question.

[sekushiiandee]

1 minute ago, S0V3REiGN said:

I am not sure what "science" of mod building you are talking about. There was always a weapon meta and the status quo was "slam as much damage into a weapon as possible." That has not changed. This only hurts the guys that must absolutely minimax everything and now they can't and/or can't afford to do so. Everyone else takes it as it comes.

^well that just widens the divide between players....i personally do not think that its necessarily fair that one person puts in the same amount of work and gets something less than another....hell even sometimes more work than the other person...and they just happened to be luckier because RNG said so

DE made the system so that there is more fairness in loot...yet they add something like this that is WAY different.  (fairness in loot referring to relics)

but I do understand the frustration behind it all....hell i accidentally sold my riven mod so im S#&$ out of luck cause its near impossible to get one from sorties

[Skiddybike81273]

Keep in mind that you can gets stats that make your weapons worse and then you have to urn kuva to r role it and it can still be worse than before

[sekushiiandee]

Just now, NinjaKitsune56 said:

If they want to burn, literally, thousands of Kuva, and have to unveil it every single time, just for their better stats, more power to them. Even the initial reroll is going to cost you 900 Kuva... and it only increases with every reroll on the mod in question.

^with a game based on grind....i wouldnt be surprised lol and that is already happening right now....i have alliance mates that have rolled 10+ times

[Lost_Cartographer]

6 minutes ago, sekushiiandee said:

placing it in sorties was a good idea...but they need to effin get rid of the ENDO because theres way too much RNG involved

I disagree.  A system this RNG based needs to be more readily available to smack our heads against over and over and over, especially when the pool opens up to secondaries, shotguns, snipers(+bows,) melee, and warframes.

[NinjaKitsune56]

Just now, sekushiiandee said:

^with a game based on grind....i wouldnt be surprised lol and that is already happening right now....i have alliance mates that have rolled 10+ times

And they're pretty much grinding Kuva Siphons every step of the way... they give out a decent chunk of Kuva, true... but when you're spending Kuva equal to ten or more siphons... well, that's their problem.

[sekushiiandee]

Just now, Littleman88 said:

I disagree.  A system this RNG based needs to be more readily available to smack our heads against over and over and over, especially when the pool opens up to secondaries, shotguns, snipers(+bows,) melee, and warframes.

sarcasm or being serious? once it opens up to other weapons (and i hope only weapons because it definitely screws with the game when its added to warframes) it would be a giant shtstorm....

endo is just getting in the way of sorties as this point

[NinjaKitsune56]

3 minutes ago, Skiddybike81273 said:

Keep in mind that you can gets stats that make your weapons worse and then you have to urn kuva to r role it and it can still be worse than before

This is very true... My initial Riven had +Toxin, + Crit Chance and +Fire Rate for the Hind... rerolled for a hefty status chance boost, a decent Toxin boost and -86% damage... second reroll landed me +Electric, +something else... and +Crit Damage...

Overall, Rivens are just as likely to troll you as help you.

[Firetempest]

Just now, Skiddybike81273 said:

Keep in mind that you can gets stats that make your weapons worse and then you have to urn kuva to r role it and it can still be worse than before

Thats a trivial wall in the long run. Once you get a good set of RNG, that will be your go to gun tell the next good Riven on a better gun. It's not like content is getting harder. perhaps twitchier. where one hit kills on either side. Is that good gameplay?

[Mastikator2]

There was no balance to destroy in the first place. If they were to introduce balance into the weapons I bet a lot of players would be very salty that their favorite builds have been destroyed.

I'm more concerned about riven mods that are completely useless, riven mods that have a higher mastery requirement than the player possesses and challenges that are insurmountable to the player. The random nature of the mod make it a wildcard that is unlikely to make anything OP for anything more than a single player.

[Skiddybike81273]

I just want to say that the reason that I don't agree with this system is that we as players have no control over what the mod give us also it rewards luck not skill or time invested

[NinjaKitsune56]

Just now, Skiddybike81273 said:

I just want to say that the reason that I don't agree with this system is that we as players have no control over what the mod give us also it rewards luck not skill or time invested

I dunno... you've got to invest a chunk of time to get the mod in the first place... plus the fact you need to invest more time to get Kuva if you plan to reroll it.

[armedpoop]

I cant see how people can still use the "weaker weapons become viable now" argument  when Riven mods exist for top tier weapons like Tonkor. Its like you are just ignoring that broken Tonkor mod up there lol

 

Riven mods are bad. I quit playing Borderlands due to this kind of BS getting old extremely quickly. 

Edited November 14, 2016 by armedpoop

[sekushiiandee]

4 minutes ago, NinjaKitsune56 said:

I dunno... you've got to invest a chunk of time to get the mod in the first place... plus the fact you need to invest more time to get Kuva if you plan to reroll it.

^if this is what DE considers end game....i think i might be done with this game x_x

sortie grind just to keep getting endo....and then kuva grind just to hope for something that will help with this ridiculous scaling? yeah......

off-point: the new system they put in for endless is just a way for us to burn all our relics and find a way to fight against scaling mobs....which leads to more grind to get useless relics in hopes to hit 5 intervals and use 25 relics...then having to farm 25 more relics to do the same stuff over again xD

Edited November 14, 2016 by sekushiiandee

[Lost_Cartographer]

Just now, sekushiiandee said:

sarcasm or being serious? once it opens up to other weapons (and i hope only weapons because it definitely screws with the game when its added to warframes) it would be a giant shtstorm....

endo is just getting in the way of sorties as this point

Serious.  Though not all Riven mods are created equal.  Some only come with two okay stats, some come with 3 okay stats, some 2 great and one bad, other 3 great and one very detrimental.  It's not like there isn't room to spread them out based on quality and while yes, most people will one "the one" for the big boom boom of FotM weaponry, they can still only carry so many, and still only place ONE on a weapon.  The whole system seems built to demand One to grab them and cycle through a bunch until they get the ones they want, then Kuva the crap out of it in hopes to get a roll they're actually happy with.

But then they go and put them behind an RNG timegate that is more of a chore unless you cheese the f*** out of it with super power weaponry and warframe builds, when all I want to do is collect a good Riven mod for my GD Karak because I happen to like it.  When it comes to secondaries, I'd love for a good Magnus riven mod that increases magazine capacity and reduces reload speed.  If it unveiled for the Lex, I'll take a loss in damage for more magazine capacity, fire rate, and reload speed.  I want to make a Lato MKII here.

But instead, they're shoving it behind something I imagine was easily losing interest with folks because until now, the only thing of actual value were the lenses, and only the truly hardcore are really going to get greater lenses onto ALL of their Warframes.  Besides that, there IS the market, but it's still a cesspool DE doesn't want to make any more efficient because of their beliefs.

Honestly, the only reason they can pull this crap off is because this game has literally zero competition, and they have a better grasp of the skinner's box than even Blizzard.

[sekushiiandee]

2 minutes ago, armedpoop said:

I cant see how people can still use the "weaker weapons become viable now" when Riven mods exist for top tier weapons like Tonkor. Its like you are just ignoring that broken Tonkor mod up there lol

 

Riven mods are bad. I quit playing Borderlands due to this kind of BS getting old extremely quickly. 

^agreed....that is exactly how i saw it...because people will constantly go for the top tier weapon mods regardless because its what they are used to

especially when you see other people with those mods...it makes it more appealing to keep striving for it...there is no real way to incentivize the weaker weapons if the stronger weapons get the same treatment for riven mods

[Xekrin]

25 minutes ago, Skiddybike81273 said:

Please let us come together as a community to help fix this issue as the longer it stays in the game the worse it will get.

Since they've been out literally only 4 days and we've yet to see a hotfix for this week I think we should have maybe the smallest iota of patience to see what happens from that whopping four days of feedback before freaking out.

Regardless, you aren't the only one who has made a thread about the balance of these mods and the randomness and so on and on and on.   Kinda wish a mod would gather them all up into a MEGATHREAD so bits of good feedback here and there doesn't get lost.