Rhino 8.3: Feedback Thread

[SlowMoMo]

Without speaking of the bugs concerning Iron Skin (shouldn't bypass armor etc), I''d just be disappointed with the of the Roar.

 

Everybody seems to compare it with the Banshee's Sonar (which is not irrelevant) : indeed, these two abilities are useful against foes with a lots of hit points. Now, whether the Roar's boost would be 50% or more if changes applied, I find that an energy cost of 75 is way too much, especially for a non-mage frame. Rhino can't afford such an energy cost. Banshee can go up to 400+ energy points and her Sonar costs 50.  

 

Please make it down to 50 which will make Roar as expensive as Iron Skin, which will place the two abilities on the same step and, with a slight boost of the damages, as used as each other.

 

Anyways, thanks for your concern and job about this warframe. 

i think if they just allow the skill to be affected by focus and continuity, then it would be worth the 75 energy. honestly 50% more damage is helpful, i find myself using it when i feel like im killing too slow. however, changing it to 50 energy is a good way to tweak it. just my suggestions :)

[Phoenix86]

Come on DE, lower Roar's cost to 50 :D

[torngasoak]

I still can not make melee high lvl ...
iron skin vs high lvl lasts 0.7 sec instead of 0.5 ...
For hl does not change anything.
personally I'll stop playing for a while and wait for a change in the games ...

Edited July 8, 2013 by torngasoak

[thecolin-]

Roar down to 50 

God mode back but could be lowered to 30 seconds or smth

 

These are the communities demands and you didn't listen to us at the first time with the Iron Skin issue now YOU SHOULD, DE PLEASE!!!!11!!1!1!!!ONE

Edited July 8, 2013 by ColinMcRaeTR

[Ansheilm]

I believe the energy cost is meant to be 25, 50, 75, 100.

So if there's a drop of Roar to 50, another skill will have to take the 75 cost.

[thecolin-]

ok then make Iron Skin 75 and roar 50 but buff/nerf them accordingly...

[Kracken]

ok then make Iron Skin 75 and roar 50 but buff/nerf them accordingly...

Iron Skin 75 energy - and give us back the ~80-90% of dmg reduction

Roar 50 energy - down to 25% at rang 3 (5%, 11%,18%, 25%)

Edited July 8, 2013 by Cracken

[Phoenix86]

I believe the energy cost is meant to be 25, 50, 75, 100.

So if there's a drop of Roar to 50, another skill will have to take the 75 cost.

 

you wrong, many frames have different skill costs than that... Excalibur, Loki, Banshee for example...

 

Edit:

 

guys... Rhino has changed, it is not what it was before, you'll obviously "fail" if you keep trying to play it like before... it is not gonna work, never. Sadly.

 

Change your playstyle, i assure you Rhino is a beast atm, or change frame... because it aint gonna be the same as before, never.

Edited July 8, 2013 by Phoenix86

[cheukyi6]

you wrong, many frames have different skill costs than that... Excalibur, Loki, Banshee for example...

 

Edit:

 

guys... Rhino has changed, it is not what it was before, you'll obviously "fail" if you keep trying to play it like before... it is not gonna work, never. Sadly.

 

Change your playstyle, i assure you Rhino is a beast atm, or change frame... because it aint gonna be the same as before, never.

Agree, maybe Rhino was a hardcore tank before, but I can tell you that Rhino is a fighter now instead of a tank. Moreover, I don't think the previous Rhino is a good tank for team play, I mean, you Iron Skin yourself but how about the others? Rhino was not beneficial to team before and I think the Rhino now is just perfectly balanced, I think people should really stop getting an inch and take a yard, Rhino is perfectly fine now, don't touch him anymore.

[thunder-fart]

First sorry for my bad english, i hope you can stiill understand what i mean :D

 

I like the new skill "Roar" and that Radial Blast and Rhino Stomp was put together in one skill, but as many people already said the problem with IS is still the bad balance beetween low level and high level. Especially with the recent change that now it lasts until its destroyed( which is good btw), in low level you run basically all the time as silver surfer, while in higher level IS is destroyed way to fast.

 

I think DE should change two things:

 

First, make IS shield strenght also based on Rhinos Base Health, that means that when he activates IS, he gain a shield that absorbs 1x , 2x , 3x, 4x of Rhinos's base health. So, if the Rhino has  100 base health the shield only absorbes 100, 200, 300, 400 damage but on max Rank Rhino has 300 base health and the shield absorbes 300, 600, 900, 1200 damage which is practically the same value as it is now.

 

Then give the shield the damage reduction of 25%, 50%, 75%, 100% of his total armor ( so with steel fiber) wich can be increased witch stretch.

If i calculated it right a Rhino should reach a maximum of 98,67 Damage reduction witch max rank IS, rank 14 steel fiber and rank 9 stretch.

 

I don't know if this is balanced. Maybe a such high damage reduction is a bit OP and should be changed, i cant say it because i haven't fight against  an enemy higher than level 60 yet, but i like the idea especially the scaling with steel fiber. Without it the max possible Damage reduction

is 78%

 

IS could ( its just an idea!) also full regenerate Rhinos health but the shield will be smaller based on how much health IS has regenerate.

So if the player has only 50 life left from 500, IS will regenerate 450 Health in a rate of 50-100 per second for examle and the rest is applied as a shield that is then 1200-450= 750 strong.

 

Since IS now would be very strong, the energy cost could be swapped with roar.

 

Well, these a just ideas i hope for some feedback especially for those who alredy has played a rhino against lvl 100 enemys

[thecolin-]

you wrong, many frames have different skill costs than that... Excalibur, Loki, Banshee for example...

 

Edit:

 

guys... Rhino has changed, it is not what it was before, you'll obviously "fail" if you keep trying to play it like before... it is not gonna work, never. Sadly.

 

Change your playstyle, i assure you Rhino is a beast atm, or change frame... because it aint gonna be the same as before, never.

I understand and respect your point. However, Rhino wasn't broken at the first place, it was just overpowered which, in fact, is easy to deal with a tweak. I will always request for the old Rhino no matter what. If it was the PvP issue (Rhino - unkillable) then tweak him accordingly, don't mess it up in the PvE section. The Blast and Stomp was an success but Iron Skin, imo, doesn't meet the requirement of being a "tank", and should be re-worked again.

[Mhorgul]

I was skeptical at first, since i was a frequent user of radial blast. But it works and gives u a reason to use stomp on anything other than bosses.

I will still miss the radial blast tho, it was so convenient for defence missions being fast and cheap.

 

But the new Roar makes boss killing a breeze. Hek dies in less than half a Boltor clip, and even Kril goes down extremely quick.

 

Iron skin could use some work tho, I rarely use it anymore since it dont last very long on high lvl maps.

I miss the invulnerability, it was so useful when ressing dead teammates.

[thecolin-]

I was skeptical at first, since i was a frequent user of radial blast. But it works and gives u a reason to use stomp on anything other than bosses.

I will still miss the radial blast tho, it was so convenient for defence missions being fast and cheap.

 

But the new Roar makes boss killing a breeze. Hek dies in less than half a Boltor clip, and even Kril goes down extremely quick.

 

Iron skin could use some work tho, I rarely use it anymore since it dont last very long on high lvl maps.

I miss the invulnerability, it was so useful when ressing dead teammates.

This is kind of what I was trying say at page: idk  :D   Other than Iron Skin Rhino hasn't become a bad frame it just needs the tweaks which the makers will never do EVEN TOUGH WE ASK FOR IT.

[JBS_1]

I've been playing a bit, and my thoughts:

Iron Skin: Still useless at high levels, but at low levels the lack of a time limit means you just pop IS at the start of a mission and renew it when it goes down, essentially making you invincible for the length of the mission.  I doubt that's what DE had in mind, because that's worse than the old "God Mode".  I say make IS like Overheat, only have your armor rating factor in somehow.

 

Roar: I haven't found this to be as useful as I'd like. If the effect were doubled to max 100% and have Focus buff it and then I'd have to seriously debate whether to Roar or sprint-n-stomp.

 

Stomp:  Great improvement.  It actually feels like an ult.

[Paydirt]

After playing the Rhino for over 20 hours this past weekend... I am really happy with the updates to the class.  I only use Iron Skin and Rhino Stomp.  I changed the polarity for two of the = polarities because I generally only use two abilities in a run with a given frame.  I think my Rhino has four stars.  I have him where I want him.  To me, the Rhino is a portable bomb.

 

I did several dozen Narcissus runs with my Rhino and when he was max'd I would top the kill chart (even up to 20 waves)... Rhino Stomp may be the top 3 most powerful ability on defense missions now.  Here's why.  It goes through walls and columns, which the Volt AoE does not.  With the particular loadout that I use, I can know where the enemies are by sacrificing a slot for Enemy Sense and also equipping Enemy Radar.  This allows me to pinpoint where I drop AoEs to affect the most foes.  Combined with Rhino Skin, I can place the Rhino in the thick of things, do a Rhino Stomp and then refresh the Iron Skin.  When the Stomp takes out 20-30 enemies at a clip, it doesnt matter that the Iron Skin is slightly wimpy at higher levels.  What is great about the stomp is that the dead enemies from the stomp fall to the ground while the living ones raise up, so you can easily visually pick out which ones were not killed by the Stomp (and need more rounds put in them).  In Narcissus runs, depending on when the mobs spawn, I could place myself in the center of 3 groups of enemies and then set off a Rhino Stomp.

 

I can also easily tell visually when my Iron Skin is up or not.  I use darker colors for my Rhino, so I notice more when my skin goes from White to Purple.  It would be nice if my energy power was the color of the Rhino Skin, but I understand all people wouldn't like that.

 

If I wanted place in the top 100 of the Spy Drone challenge, I could have spent the time to because whenever my map went crazy, I would Rhino Stomp and the damage would go through everything, so I didn't even have to locate the drones.

 

To me, the most valuable frames on the Narcissus map are now Rhino and still Vauban.  Vauban is still necessary if you want to go past Wave 20 and don't want Railgun Moas chain-stunning everyone to death.

Edited July 8, 2013 by Paydirt

[Tatersail]

Also love rhino, thanks for the changes

As a mastery rank 4 frame I think its ok.

 

if it didn't have that, I think its a little too strong.

 

Ironskin damage absorb is too high for anything outside t3 void/20+defense, using ironskin once at the start of any normal mission, removes damage from gameplay, under level 30 its almost impossible to take that much damage.

Stomp has, huge range, Armor ignore, and a crowd control, nothing else compares, Saryn becomes obsolete, Banshee looses alot of value.

Roar is great

Edited July 8, 2013 by Tatersail

[Exodess]

Damage buffs = Rhino Combo opportunities. Very nice! :D

Imagine if Saryn's Contagion was a Group Buff and combined with this and Volt's new Speed. Oh, the humanity!

 

 

Also love rhino, thanks for the changes

As a mastery rank 4 frame I think its ok.

 

if it didn't have that, I think its a little too strong.

 

Ironskin damage absorb is too high for anything outside t3 void/20+defense, using ironskin once at the start of any normal mission, removes damage from gameplay, under level 30 its almost impossible to take that much damage.

Stomp has, huge range, Armor ignore, and a crowd control, nothing else compares, Saryn becomes obsolete, Banshee looses alot of value.

Roar is great

 

Sort of my thoughts, except Saryn's core functionality is arguably less full-on Tank and more distract and DPS with high flexibility against mistakes. If you have your team HP bars up and see someone taking damage, a Saryn can pop Moult to immediately mitigate damage from them - something Rhino lacks against spread-out targets - without placing the Saryn in direct danger. Furthermore, Saryn has a cheap and powerful single-target DoT that can single-handedly end Boss Shield Generation or Regeneration (though actually hitting the spore against groups of weaker enemies is kind of a moot point given how accurate you have to be.) Saryn's ultimate also combines a stun and a powerful DoT effect which stacks with Duration to add even more layers of damage. 

If Saryn needs any changes, I would recommend the following:

 

Venom: Greatly increase hitbox for spore, or make it so volatile that if the enemy dies the spore activates regardless.
Contagion: Currently offers terrible utility benefit for the cost and duration. Make it a group / AoE buff or add an extra effect such as if enemies attempt to melee the player they take toxic damage (sort of an inverse Retribution mod effect.) The latter would make especially useful against Infested.

EDIT: Moult's effects also don't make sense to me. It clearly doesn't look like much but a silhouette of Saryn. If a cloud of dust or something was released around the Moult when used to obscure its image (accompanied by a loud CRACK to draw them into a panic and call their attention towards it), I could find it more likely that a Grineer or Corpus would mistake it the real deal.

Edited July 8, 2013 by Exodess

[Haree]

The Rhino update has made me easily as good as Vauban, I am in love with the frame again however because of the Iron Skin change it has become a pre-emptive skill as well as being reactive like before. This means though that I am constantly walking around looking like I am covered in tin foil.

Really appreciate the buff but please please please find a way to show the Iron Skin buff is active while still looking like the amazing warframe I used to look like. Rhino used to be the best looking frame :(

[RawGritz]

He definitely a tank more now than ever in my opinion. I am using Kogake and going toe-to-toe with level 60 ancients and heavies...me against 5-6 of them in Void III levels. 

 

However some changes could be made..

 

Iron Skin - when it ends/fades it could expel a massive knockdown wave or stagger affect. This would help Rhino a lot...is more tanky doesn't leave him with his pants down when iRon Skin fades. It also gives a visual and practical indicator that Iron Skin is/has ended/ending...

 

Roar - should definitely stagger on initial cast. Or all enemies should stop and hold their ears in pain. But I know that would take new animation programming. But I love the group-wide dmg buff. Fits Rhino that he would encourage the group to stick together and bolster his tanky-ness.

 

Roar + Iron Skin + Rhino Charge should scale dmg-wise. It is a buffed up solid metal mass flying at you top speed. Should hurt more than Rhino charge unbuffed with out Iron Skin.

 

There should be a visual indicator when Roar has ended. I think all the Tenno/Lotus symbols on the warframes should Glow or pulsate for a few seconds to show the buff is ending. Some group dymanic should be done with those anyway.

 

Also please add a way to revert back from Iron Skin. Maybe casting the ability again will end... Right now I just have friends shoot me until it is gone.

Edited July 8, 2013 by RawGritz

[BigSchmexy]

A lot of people don't seem to realize how great roar is and it is worth 75 energy because if you look you'll see with weapons and abilities it gives you 50% after all damage mods are taken into play.

 

Rhino Stomp 800 damage maxed Focus 1040 damage maxed Roar 1560 damage same with your weapons and their damage mods

[RawGritz]

A lot of people don't seem to realize how great roar is and it is worth 75 energy because if you look you'll see with weapons and abilities it gives you 50% after all damage mods are taken into play.

 

Rhino Stomp 800 damage maxed Focus 1040 damage maxed Roar 1560 damage same with your weapons and their damage mods

Roar is awesome!!! great addition

[Paydirt]

Or, you can not do Roar and save the 75 energy for another Stomp ;)

[RawGritz]

Or, you can not do Roar and save the 75 energy for another Stomp ;)

I unequipped stomp. I don't like any of the kill-everything powers. I like to dispatch enemies manually. No world on fire. no Stomp. No bladestorm. No overload... don't like any of them. I poloarize those and change the polarity to something else. That's just me.

[iBread]

Is it just me or roar seems to have 3 seconds duration? or was it intentional?

[Ferriwind]

It seems to be bugged or got a silent nerf in the 8.3.2 update. It's pretty bad right now.