How-to guide: 500-1000 mutagen samples in one mission

[Necronamasal]

Step 1: Orokin derelict defense go to wave 25

Step 2: bring farm frames as in 2 nekros's, 1 hydroid/atlas, 1 speed nova

Step 3: You will gain around 100-125 mu samples per run (200-250 with a booster which i recommend) 

Step 4: Math time, so if you go along with 3 friends in the same clan that's roughly 500-1000 per run so it will roughly take around 5-6 10-12 runs to get 5k

every run takes around 20min so with a booster its around 2hr and without its around 4hr to gain around 5k

 

Step 5: if your alone or in a dead clan i recommend rather recruiting others to the clan or joining another. 

[Necronamasal]

1 minute ago, Irorone said:

The alternative actually primarily focuses on this order

1.  Get three clanmates, if you don't have three clanmates or are a larger clan with less active members get a new clan, no exceptions.  That's literally 3/4s of the "alternative" here.

2.  A booster, a plat item or a login reward, the fact that a pay for item is considered part of the "alternative" should be enough to highlight why people are requoting so much.

3.  Bring multiple farm frames, cuz you're gonna have to squeeze those numbers.

4.  Go to derelict, which is about the only sound advice on getting more samples that doesn't involve any of the three increasingly questionable options listed above.

hello agian 

1.you forgot the 5th option which is to go recruit some tenno to help out in the clan or join another [which you and i have talked about and you don't want to invite anybody to your clan nor want to join another which is just hurting yourself in the long run]

2.you can get all 5k in roughly 12 runs without one {with 3 other people} that takes only around 4hrs straight or like a said to native and dark you can do it daily or however you want.

3."three increasingly questionable options listed above" don't know how bringing farm frames is questionable but ok you do you.

4."Go to derelict" wow we agree on something.

[Irorone]

12 minutes ago, Necronamasal said:

hello agian 

1.you forgot the 5th option which is to go recruit some tenno to help out in the clan or join another [which you and i have talked about and you don't want to invite anybody to your clan nor want to join another which is just hurting yourself in the long run]

2.you can get all 5k in roughly 12 runs without one {with 3 other people} that takes only around 4hrs straight or like a said to native and dark you can do it daily or however you want.

3."three increasingly questionable options listed above" don't know how bringing farm frames is questionable but ok you do you.

4."Go to derelict" wow we agree on something.

The fifth option that involves recruiting for the SOLE purpose of completing ONE research project when it's mathematically an asinine jump in costs?

Which is why I said that it was 3/4 of your "alternative".  If I have to recruit people to my one man clan purely for resource gains that corpus block hat better be an aesthetic unlock.

They're questionable because

a.  Needing three frames literally just to squeeze more mat drops, questionable.

b.  Needing a booster for the 1000 mark of your alternative, stacking on top of the issue of a.

c.  Structuring a clan completely around resource gain, because we're resource extractors not people anymore

d.  I agreed on derelict because it didn't require me whipping out real money, choosing my clanmates on how they can benefit me, or requiring recruiting chat to farm what is supposed to be an uncommon rarity mat that just spiked in demand.

 

Page one looks the way it does for a reason and telling people to be more choosy about their friends and buy a booster really isn't gonna change that core reason.

Edited December 24, 2016 by Irorone

[Irixa]

As much as we appreciate this suggestion, it STILL is hard for mountain clans xD or even smaller clans that aren't full. Plus, as I've pointed out in other threads, there is a big portion of the community that probably doesn't have those warframes. Lastly, you can't bring inactive or hiatus members just for one weapon; and I doubt people who have little time to play want to spend it on a resource that they won't use outside of one weapon they might not even like.

[Irorone]

In all the Hema Madness I've read these points.

All mutagen sample researchs prior to Hema come up to about 450 samples at ghost clan levels.  Hema is literally ten times more expensive than the rest of the Bio Lab combined.  Closer to 100x more if you compare research to research.  Again not including clan size/participation issues that stack multiplicatively on top of that.

There are ways to get more samples, but the difference of resource gain vs. reasonable expectation has brought DE's competency and intentions into suspicion.

The people who still defend Hema's costs do so on three "points"

1.  Git Gud

2.  It's supposed to be a "community" goal.

3.  You just want everything instantly.

Edited December 24, 2016 by Irorone

[dEjAvU5566]

16 minutes ago, Irorone said:

In all the Hema Madness I've read these points.

All mutagen sample researchs prior to Hema come up to about 450 samples at ghost clan levels.  Hema is literally ten times more expensive than the rest of the Bio Lab combined.  Closer to 100x more if you compare research to research.  Again not including clan size/participation issues that stack multiplicatively on top of that.

There are ways to get more samples, but the difference of resource gain vs. reasonable expectation has brought DE's competency and intentions into suspicion.

The people who still defend Hema's costs do so on three "points"

1.  Git Gud

2.  It's supposed to be a "community" goal.

3.  You just want everything instantly.

That's what she said

[(XBOX)SweatyPick3L]

Guess ill start mut farming now, man console players are gonna flip out. lol

[cornfed_pig]

or we can just not do that boring S#&$ for hours

[Evanescent]

2 hours ago, Yagamilight123 said:

Not my language pal , when you can write in 3 languages , then call me for little mistakes in one .  . 

Well I speak and write in 3 and English is my 3rd, so yeah I find your English lacking. It's an English speaking forum, you have to at least try for some clarity. Don't hide behind the 'English isn't my first language' excuse. Btw, this isn't me dropping knowledge on how you should write your posts, it's me reminding you of a common sense matter.

 

On topic: DE makes an entire new system to get rid of running the same mission over and over again, DE states that they don't want players to stay in one mission for too long, DE nerfs loot-cave mentality farming methods, and then forces entire clans to do these exact same AFK farms in one mission for hours and hours for a single gun?

What rubs me the wrong way is the hypocrisy of the situation and hilarious statement they issued. I've nothing but love for [DE]Taylor, but I have never viewed DE with as much cynicism and disdain as I have after reading what they had to say.

It's almost as if they are forcing me to believe that DE doesn't actually play the game. 

[_Vortus_]

3 hours ago, Necronamasal said:

Step 1: Orokin derelict defense go to wave 25

Step 2: bring farm frames as in 2 nekros's, 1 hydroid/atlas, 1 speed nova

Step 3: You will gain around 100-125 mu samples per run (200-250 with a booster which i recommend) 

Step 4: Math time, so if you go along with 3 friends in the same clan that's roughly 500-1000 per run so it will roughly take around 5-6 10-12 runs to get 5k

every run takes around 20min so with a booster its around 2hr and without its around 4hr to gain around 5k

 

Step 5: if your alone or in a dead clan i recommend rather recruiting others to the clan or joining another. 

Ssssshhh!   Telling them to work towards a goal?    Shame, shame shame!   Some would rather receive a handout than put in effort.   I mean, its such hard work playing a game.  lol.

 

[(XBOX)Knight Raime]

i guess id be the speed nova since i dont have the others

[Irorone]

48 minutes ago, _Vortus_ said:

Ssssshhh!   Telling them to work towards a goal?    Shame, shame shame!   Some would rather receive a handout than put in effort.   I mean, its such hard work playing a game.  lol.

 

Oh yes expecting a weapon research to not be objectively 100x more expensive than anything comparable before it in samples and 10x as expensive in said mat as literally the rest of the Bio Lab research catalog combined is the expectation of a handout .  Again that's not even including the other logistical issues of clan research prices that compound on that.

 

Also thanks for being points 1 and 3 of one of my previous posts.

Edited December 24, 2016 by Irorone

[LordLokai]

The problem is they are gating a new item behind a MASSIVE nearly unachievable wall unless people are willing to dump time and effort into a very specific setup and combo, and spend HOURS smashing there face into a grind wall from hell, they aren't getting the new gun. All of these methods assume that you are actually BUYING a booster and using it, can get 3 of your clan mates with the right frames to farm it... fact is alot of us have small clans of close friends who arent always around. Up until now my clan has ALWAYS been able to get the materials either by a couple of us banding together and donating, or getting a group and just farming it out. But from what i've seen you can only manage about 1 sample every minute with a nekros in your team which means in reality 1 sample every 2 minutes... assuming you have an EV trinity, a nekros, a hyrdroid with the right mods and everyone running a booster ... SURE you might be able to get 1000 samples in the time frame you laid out... but guess what?

THAT doesn't actually make the fact that this ONE weapon has MORE  mutagen samples required then ALL of the other items COMBINED! ok, no i'm sorry as a founder... as someone that has countless hours devoted to this game this is not ok... and i'll continue to be loud obnoxious and annoying until its fixed...

Edit:

people are also ignoring the bigger issue, which is new clans and new players coming into the game and trying to unlock all the stuff. Only to see this giant wall of mutagen samples... do you really expect them to farm for 100 hours to get this one gun? i mean for this many samples that thing better hit harder then a tonkor per shot... and shoot faster then the soma.

Edited December 24, 2016 by LordLokai

[Obviousclone]

everyone I've seen who's been grinding it out has been using resource boosters

 

wouldn't it make more sense to just use the money you're spending on boosters on just directly buying the rifle?

from what I've seen of other players calculations (of optimal grind conditions), you'd probably save more money/plat doing so.

[LordLokai]

1 minute ago, Obviousclone said:

everyone I've seen who's been grinding it out has been using resource boosters

 

wouldn't it make more sense to just use the money you're spending on boosters on just directly buying the rifle?

from what I've seen of other players calculations (of optimal grind conditions), you'd probably save more money/plat doing so.

you aren't wrong... but the idea is to unlock it for the whole clan, not everyone has that kind of plat laying around to blow. If you farm the samples its unlocked for everyone in your clan. its also sort of achievement thing to have everything in the labs unlocked...

[_Vortus_]

36 minutes ago, Irorone said:

Oh yes expecting a weapon research to not be objectively 100x more expensive than anything comparable before it in samples and 10x as expensive in said mat as literally the rest of the Bio Lab research catalog combined is the expectation of a handout .  Again that's not even including the other logistical issues of clan research prices that compound on that.

 

Also thanks for being points 1 and 3 of one of my previous posts.

And thank you for being one of those expecting a handout.    Not sure where you get "Git Gud" from work harder.  .   But 2 and 3, yeah, I am totally with those two. Wish I had added a part about working together, though, I guess it could be inferred from my referencing the OP.  So sure, ill take some credit for that.  

[_Vortus_]

5 hours ago, -BM-Leonhart said:

Yes, I get it, we all want a reduction of the requirements. However, considering the situation, it is a very real possibility that we may not get one. So, an alternative to that as presented here is the only hope for some.

...or just give up on the weapon, it only one in hundreds after all.

Or just passively farm it, and will get it built sooner or later.

[Ivan_Rid]

17 minutes ago, Obviousclone said:

everyone I've seen who's been grinding it out has been using resource boosters

 

wouldn't it make more sense to just use the money you're spending on boosters on just directly buying the rifle?

from what I've seen of other players calculations (of optimal grind conditions), you'd probably save more money/plat doing so.

No, resource boosters double Kuva and Traces drops and pay for themselves very quickly.

[NativeKiller]

5 minutes ago, _Vortus_ said:

Or just passively farm it, and will get it built sooner or later.

A lot of people who played for 2~3 years/several thousands of hours don't have enough Mutagen samples.

 

Passively playing the game would take quite damned long unless D.E adjusts drop rates and locations.

Edited December 24, 2016 by NativeKiller

[Irorone]

10 minutes ago, _Vortus_ said:

Or just passively farm it, and will get it built sooner or later.

So any amount of grind is okay as long as it's a finite number?  Welcome to trollville population you.

12 minutes ago, _Vortus_ said:

And thank you for being one of those expecting a handout.    Not sure where you get "Git Gud" from work harder.  .   But 2 and 3, yeah, I am totally with those two. Wish I had added a part about working together, though, I guess it could be inferred from my referencing the OP.  So sure, ill take some credit for that.  

Because "work harder" in this case is a 100x increase before you count that I'm a one man clan with the resource expectations of a ten man clan.  **** off.

Edited December 24, 2016 by Irorone

[Hesyol]

Can't we just ignore 1 weapon? If this game will become "buy boosters or buy weapons with plat" I'll quit it. Don't support this way of doing business 

[PGDraxos]

5 hours ago, Irorone said:

The alternative actually primarily focuses on this order

1.  Get three clanmates, if you don't have three clanmates or are a larger clan with less active members get a new clan, no exceptions.  That's literally 3/4s of the "alternative" here.

2.  A booster, a plat item or a login reward, the fact that a pay for item is considered part of the "alternative" should be enough to highlight why people are requoting so much.

3.  Bring multiple farm frames, cuz you're gonna have to squeeze those numbers.

4.  Go to derelict, which is about the only sound advice on getting more samples that doesn't involve any of the three increasingly questionable options listed above.

5.  DE just actually fixes a jump in numbers that literally went from a ten percent acceptable active clan participation to the entire clan.

1 How is having 3 clanmates or people from the recruiting channel problematic? I feel like this is very easy.

2 getting recourse drop boosters isn't uncommon and its a very common purchase by the playerbase since it helps farm void traces, plastids and oxium

3 while most people are going to have a nekros I admit this can be unrealistic to expect.

4 I actually didnt consider the derelict and was using Eris to little effect so this has helped me

5 yes DE should by all rights change the cost. However if they intend on doing so after winter exodus is a whole other matter. the fact is this is the situation we have and trying to find a way to deal with it as is shouldn't be discouraged or degraded.

[Irorone]

40 minutes ago, PGDraxos said:

1 How is having 3 clanmates or people from the recruiting channel problematic? I feel like this is very easy.

2 getting recourse drop boosters isn't uncommon and its a very common purchase by the playerbase since it helps farm void traces, plastids and oxium

3 while most people are going to have a nekros I admit this can be unrealistic to expect.

4 I actually didnt consider the derelict and was using Eris to little effect so this has helped me

5 yes DE should by all rights change the cost. However if they intend on doing so after winter exodus is a whole other matter. the fact is this is the situation we have and trying to find a way to deal with it as is shouldn't be discouraged or degraded.

1.  Because clan activity fluctuates heavily.  I.e. the first clan I was apart of literally died and I completed all the research at the time solo faster than the last project I was involved on by itself.  If I HAVE to have clanmates to get individual weapons in anything resembling a timely fashion, it's not a good thing.

2.  A common purchase maybe, but I shouldn't HAVE to fork over cash to avoid a 100x increased resource hike.

3.  I can get optimizing a team.  But when optimizing a team isn't done for the sake of pushing legitimately more difficult content but purely for the sake of being a better farmer that's when questions start to get raised.

4.  Yeah it's another case of information that isn't exactly readily available and usually requires a trip to the wiki or some other third party.

5.  The reason people have had issues with the proposed workaround was threefold.  It required real money purchases in a FTP game to hit the 1k mark.  It required heavily restructuring many existing clans for the sake of content regardless of any social conditions in place.  Assumed that just because under "optimal" conditions the research can be met by a four man group in 6 1/2 hours that any margin of issue due to NOT being optimal was said clan's own fault and is in no way a result of DE's number bloat.

They increased the costs 100x even at a clan rank that can have 1-10 members.  Even under the most ideal circumstances that means they expect the individual to contribute ten times more and if you're in a less than optimal clan expect that expectation to get another zero or more.  That translates to similar increases in required time investment.

Long story short, the reason the most voted post on this thread is what it is is because we can either do a 3-4 step workaround that includes spending cash and picking friends based on how much resources they can bring or DE can actually register that they made a mistake with these numbers and actually tweak it to something reasonable.

Edited December 24, 2016 by Irorone

[BiomiZ]

8 hours ago, -BM-Leonhart said:

How exactly is 10 waves faster? 

Sorry, meant 20, not 10. We all make mistakes. 

9 hours ago, -BM-Leonhart said:

 They should be like lvl 50-60 by wave 25. 

If you plan to run with a Pilfering Hydroid, then i recommend not exceeding beyond 20 waves unless you have a buffer (Rhino), instead of a Speed Nova. Although, I haven't farmed since the previous double resource weekend so, I'm uncertain whether Nekros's change has any affects.

9 hours ago, -BM-Leonhart said:

If that is not easy, then perhaps you should build the standard gear properly and think about new stuff like Hema at a latter time.

That was sarcasm right?  I can't tell whether you're actually trying to give me advice or not. I mean, i'm pretty certain I've built all Warframes with the addition of all formad 4-5 times after investing a total of 3.2k hours. 

 

A simple solution to this problem would really be reducing the resource requirement for the Hema research, rather than listening to jokes such as yourself.  

 

Personally, I really don't care about the weapon. I merely see it as another MR Fodder but, that's no excuse for its' absurd cost. 

 

[morningstar999]

11 hours ago, Necronamasal said:

Step 1: Orokin derelict defense go to wave 25

Step 2: bring farm frames as in 2 nekros's, 1 hydroid/atlas, 1 speed nova

Step 3: You will gain around 100-125 mu samples per run (200-250 with a booster which i recommend) 

Step 4: Math time, so if you go along with 3 friends in the same clan that's roughly 500-1000 per run so it will roughly take around 5-6 10-12 runs to get 5k

every run takes around 20min so with a booster its around 2hr and without its around 4hr to gain around 5k

 

Step 5: if your alone or in a dead clan i recommend rather recruiting others to the clan or joining another. 

step one: do a 30 min mission

step 2:  wait till your friends are free /have the right frames/ or sit in the recruit chat 20 minutes.

step 3: give DE plat for a booster, because their grind is incredibly high and this is what they want you to do -give them money.

step 4: do like 170-380 minutes of the same mission over and over. assuming all 4 people want to do this you'll get what you want, possibly.

step 5: not all of us want to abandon the clan we put hours and hours of time, money and resources in. nor do we want to chuck friends that will want to come back to the clan at a later date.

 

Edited December 24, 2016 by morningstar999

[Dusklite]

Sure, I'll just split myself into four players to do the research for my Ghost tier clan.

 

How about DE just reconsiders what must be the GotY 2017 (grind of the year), which was delivered before the holiday season so they can flee the backlash which was sure to come. I mean, it's important to recuperate, but making their fans really upset beforehand might come back to bite them in the nether regions in the new year.