Survival is a joke

[lylathewicked]

I did a 60 minute run with some people the other day. Its all about camping and having frame synergy to be honest. Sonar Banshee, volt, desecrate nekros and vortex vauban was the party i was in

[(PSN)Kawai-Senpai]

4 hours ago, (Xbox One)FCastle74 said:

I'll still do an hour on most tilsets in fissures, just not corpus..at 45min the nullys, bursas, and ospreys that spawn are stupid beyond ridiculous. 

Omg yes I hate corpus

[Heatnix.]

This is what pretty much made me stop playing. I just can't find a party to actually play fun, extensive runs. On the void key system we HAD to stay and work toward the chance of getting some items. We got rewarded for effort and endurance. On the new relic system people has no need to stay and often it's easier to just restart and go for a new item. People get rewarded for repetition and speed.

All in all I feel like both systems are opposite of each other and I just found myself not playing anymore because... well, as the title says, survival became a joke.

Whatever the matter a lot of people are really happy with the quick and easy relic system (especially after they removed the incredibly ludicrous and ridiculous "pick void balls and throw them in the portal lololol" minigame) so there's really no way to complain or get much attention on that matter. I'm just lurking around poking at things waiting for DE to inexorably change the system again in a few years since their game director is either being replaced every month or simply can't make up his damn mind about anything in regards to this game.

[Insane-Mana]

7 hours ago, PakkiTheDog said:

Seriously, what is survival now if not a joke. People leaving at 5-10 min, if you get to 20 you can be happy. In the good old days everybody was cheap, you had one key and you made sure you got the most of it. I like that they have reduced the grind with the new system and that they have added the endless credit/affinity boosters and relics to make survival relevant but people prefer to restart when the enemies get challenging. 

And i know, recruiting channel? Oh boy, instead of 20 min we gonna do 30, wow!

Man i feel ya!

To add to this i want to say that i think that most of the players that play 5 or 10 minutes or 5 or 10 waves are the same players that struggle for resources. I mean you get better rewards staying in longer and obviously farm more stuff that way. I did some testing on farming stuff, and found that staying longer is always more efficient.

This all being said i find that simply asking players ( in pubs ) to plz stay for at least 30 minutes works. Also when i : H 30 waves or more defense /survival i get allot of players asking to inv. So we are not alone! 

But i also think there more info on this to "new" players as i find most players dont even know about rotations and how they work. Maybe Lotus msg should change to some thing like : The longer you fight the better your chances of good rewards.

[Insane-Mana]

7 hours ago, (Xbox One)FCastle74 said:

I'll still do an hour on most tilsets in fissures, just not corpus..at 45min the nullys, bursas, and ospreys that spawn are stupid beyond ridiculous. 

Yes Some corpus units need to be looked at. For example i can go to lvl 130 grineer and just tank the bombards with my Inaros, vs some lvl 80 corpus it takes 1 or 2 shots and bye bye 5k + hp

[(XBOX)SweatyPick3L]

7 minutes ago, xXxBeasTxXx said:

Yes Some corpus units need to be looked at. For example i can go to lvl 130 grineer and just tank the bombards with my Inaros, vs some lvl 80 corpus it takes 1 or 2 shots and bye bye 5k + hp

Not only that but nullys pop out of fissures as well, the amount of  on your screen at once is ridiculously  to much. Its not even fun. It's another reason I won't do fissure defense past 20 waves on corpus or void tilsets 

Edited March 6, 2017 by (XB1)FCastle74

[(PSN)robotwars7]

I can relate to OP, whenever there's been no groups on Hieracon I've tried Sechura (after Banshee relics ofc!), and I always got stuck with Credit Farmers who just wanted to do 5 waves, grab 24k credits and leave, even though nearly all the new relics can drop there. but of course, people have reasons for leaving, some more important than others.

this is why I want individual extraction to become a thing, so that if I have to AFK for what could be a while, or if I don't want to stay as long as the rest of the group I can leave of my own accord and keep what I've earned up until that point. why such a simple feature hasn't yet been implemented is truly baffling.

[Obviousclone]

7 hours ago, (Xbox One)CannyJack said:

Most people play survival for the rewards, I think, and not the adrenaline. I've personally never had an adrenaline moment in a Survival game - the stakes aren't that high since you can just leave whenever after 5 minutes. And when you hit the point where you start having "oh crap" moments, that's when you leave.

Defense has been the only endless mission that ever gave me a heart-pounding "good lord that was close" feeling, and that's mostly because you're locked in for a specific amount of time, and you may not have chosen wisely. It only happened once- most defenses are trivial - but it's the only time in the game where I ever felt like something was really on the line. 

that's cause survival as a game mode sucks

 

there's this dumb and terrible life support system that makes no sense and makes it feel like "how do I game the system to get more life support drops" rather than a fight for your life. This usually involves either camping a room in such a way that many enemies funnel in for mass slaughter or bringing loot frames.

[(PSN)leduanjohan]

15 hours ago, 1tsyB1tsyN1nj4 said:

There is your answer. It's your favorite, not necessarily everyone else'. For me, and it looks like a lot of other people here, survival gets boring and repetitive after 20-25 minutes, make that 10 if RNG is being a $&*^. Speaking of, the rewards are highly random, so you can get screwed over and waste 15 or more minutes of your life if RNG decides it is so. Around the 25 minute mark, or even 20 or less depending on the level, is when heavy enemies get annoyingly bullet spongy anyway.

You're in mainly for the rewards. OP plays them for the fighting experience, rewards are a bonus. And I think the opposite of what you say is true. It's actually boring and repetitive for the first 30 minutes as enemies hardly scale in level during that time.

I mean, even the first 50-60 minutes can be pretty boring depending on the warframe or squad you take. I'm of the opinion that we shouldn't have to wait that long to fight tough enemies. Say, once you complete the node another option becomes available in which enemies scale more crazily and rapidly or make enemies deal more damage like they do on Mot in the void.

[1tsyB1tsyN1nj4]

1 hour ago, (PS4)leduanjohan said:

You're in mainly for the rewards.

Actually I rarely play Survival at all. If I wanted rewards I'd play Sabotage and find the caches or Spy for some better rewards, or Exterminate for guaranteed rewards and loot all the lockers I can find.

[Genesis7000]

I play mostly solo because public matchmaking sucks and i don´t want to sit for every match in recruiting chat.

[PakkiTheDog]

3 hours ago, The_Splentforcer said:

WHY DONT YOU PREMADE AND STOP PUKING YOUR FRUSTRATED MOANINGS ?

Have you ever tried to get 3 people for a survival run longer than 30 min? There aren't many volunteers so you'll need to spend a lot of time finding 3 players and usually they start getting downed at 30 min mark or want to leave early. Not worth the time and frustration for every time you want to do a run.

[CrazyCatLad]

40 mins is usually my limit though I rarely go over 20. It gets so damn boring.

[fatpig84]

I usually ask how long are we going before I continue. It's basic courtesy.
For basically any endless mode.

Try asking next time.

[Zeclem]

23 hours ago, PakkiTheDog said:

Really? Defend and interception better than survival? Being forced to pick certain frames (not those that you wish), camping and getting bored of long waves or slow capture progress? And getting a squad for a longer run for those...HA. For excavation i would agree if rewards were better (don't need relics). 

When i say challenging i'm talking about your skills. Aim, movement, knowing how to use your frame in the best way.... 

 

If you play survival like defend missions than no wonder you are bored, when is camping in a game ever fun? Camping is waiting for time to pass, recasting your abilities and watching Friends on half of the screen in defend/interception missions.

Like i wrote before, i play them like exterminate missions. Run around from one part of the map to another, power-weapon killing combos, last min escapes/revives, close up with mobs, getting that "holy S#&$" moment and running away and taking them in smaller numbers. That's what keeps the blood pumping, and i hate it when someone in premade long run group says we'll be hiding in frosts bubble, recasting our abilities.

i didnt say better, i said easier. youre not forced to pick frames any more than survival as well. i mean can you solo survival with a paperframe? no.

how is survival takes more aiming or movement or w/e than any other modes actually? i geniunely wanna know. it just doesnt.

if you play survival like exterminate missions it doesnt make it any harder, not necesarrily. fact it makes it easier in some cases since you just haul yourself out when stuff gets hectic. if you want proper challenge in survival you stand your ground and watch as those bombards and gunners overrun your cover spots when you try to take them out. in other endless missions you got objectives to take care of instead of just yourself, and you cant always get out whenever you want. this is not an arguable thing its simply a fact.

[PakkiTheDog]

44 minutes ago, Zeclem said:

i didnt say better, i said easier. youre not forced to pick frames any more than survival as well. i mean can you solo survival with a paperframe? no.

In defens sooner or later enemies deal such amount of dmg that no amount of skill can save your pod. Meaning that there is more chance that the pod will be destroyed than you getting downed. Therefore your chose of frames is limited while in survival you can take pretty much every frame (5 frames i don't use in long survival runs).

 

44 minutes ago, Zeclem said:

how is survival takes more aiming or movement or w/e than any other modes actually? i geniunely wanna know. it just doesnt.

Camping=less moving=less improvisation (same map, no changes) 

 

44 minutes ago, Zeclem said:

if you want proper challenge in survival you stand your ground and watch as those bombards and gunners overrun your cover spots when you try to take them out.

Now how does this make sense? Stand your ground against bombards? That is plain stupid. That is not challenging, that is taking, again, specific frames that can take a hit...in other words camping. And again, with specific frames you can camp for as long as you wish but that is not fun and offers very little challenge to your skills.

 

Sure, you can evac whenever you want in survival, but i get a rush from almost getting downed.

Running from one side of the map to another, headshots in the air, taking down mobs of enemies and running away seconds before getting downed.

 

I agree, you can fail the mission much faster in defens, especially with bad frames, but that doesn't offer the same amount of challenge/difficulty as survival.

Edited March 7, 2017 by PakkiTheDog

[Zeclem]

20 hours ago, PakkiTheDog said:

In defens sooner or later enemies deal such amount of dmg that no amount of skill can save your pod. Meaning that there is more chance that the pod will be destroyed than you getting downed. Therefore your chose of frames is limited while in survival you can take pretty much every frame (5 frames i don't use in long survival runs).

 

Camping=less moving=less improvisation (same map, no changes) 

 

Now how does this make sense? Stand your ground against bombards? That is plain stupid. That is not challenging, that is taking, again, specific frames that can take a hit...in other words camping. And again, with specific frames you can camp for as long as you wish but that is not fun and offers very little challenge to your skills.

 

Sure, you can evac whenever you want in survival, but i get a rush from almost getting downed.

Running from one side of the map to another, headshots in the air, taking down mobs of enemies and running away seconds before getting downed.

 

I agree, you can fail the mission much faster in defens, especially with bad frames, but that doesn't offer the same amount of challenge/difficulty as survival.

so defense being harder makes it less harder somehow? since u know you might as well stop the enemy before they get to your pod. so no, your choices arent limited as you claim to be.

thats just bs. theres no improvisation in running around. hell theres no improvisation in this game like that. we dont have evironmental threats, nor anything else that can actually make a different gameplay than these options:meleeing, shooting, using abilities. theres no room for "improvisation" with these in missions, only between missions via using different loadouts/builds.

where did i say about only using frames that can take hits? in group play youre not limited to anything, in solo play you are limited to tank frames in any mode.

YOU get a rush from doing it doesnt make it any more "challenging" as you claim it to be. everything you said can be done in any endless mission, not just in survival, and they dont make them any more challening at all.

soooo again, being harder doesnt make it harder. gotcha. but then idk what i was expecting from a guy that thinks people should follow his agenda on pub runs or thinks there isnt people asking for long runs at all in recruitment chat. my mistake.

[PakkiTheDog]

1 hour ago, Zeclem said:

so defense being harder makes it less harder somehow? since u know you might as well stop the enemy before they get to your pod. so no, your choices arent limited as you claim to be.

If enemies auto lock on the pod how is that a thread to your own survivability? Yesterdays defens sortie enemies didn't down me once and were no challenge to me personally because they were to concentrated at the hostage/pod than me. In survival they lock on to you, you are their only target. So on one hand you have a group of enemies that half of the time don't even notice you, and on the other hand you have a group of enemies that notice you immediately you are in the same room as they. That is my point. And btw, how high lvl defens missions are you doing? 

 

1 hour ago, Zeclem said:

theres no improvisation in running around. hell theres no improvisation in this game like that. we dont have evironmental threats, nor anything else that can actually make a different gameplay than these options:meleeing, shooting, using abilities. theres no room for "improvisation" with these in missions, only between missions via using different loadouts/builds.

Really? Warframe no movement and combat improvisation? Is your only way of playing this game to camp? Free running+obstacles+enemies+melee/sec/powers and you say there is no improvisation? Improvisation is last minute decisions, which you make when you bump into an unsuspected enemy mob/when you decide to run and hide because you are to injured-or try to kill them instead/when you are free running and evading obstacles and enemies.... So again, no improvisation in this game?

 

1 hour ago, Zeclem said:

where did i say about only using frames that can take hits? in group play youre not limited to anything, in solo play you are limited to tank frames in any mode.

 You said that the proper way to play survival is to camp (for "real" challenge). This demands certain types of frames. Either tanks or cc frames. Today twice i went into survival with randoms between MR 15-21 and they were getting downed constantly. For 15 min my job was to revive those players with my squishy lvl-ing banshee, having all my team downed. This is where movement and weapon-power combo comes in place, this is the way to survive. Not just to dig in in every game mode, sometimes it is better to avoid a hit.

 

1 hour ago, Zeclem said:

YOU get a rush from doing it doesnt make it any more "challenging" as you claim it to be. everything you said can be done in any endless mission, not just in survival, and they dont make them any more challening at all.

Again, you have one map, less improvisation, less fire on you and lesser chose of frames (otherwise you insta fail). Interception on the other hand is very hard, but the problem here is that you are chained to the tower therefore your focus is not as much on evading but more on dmg-or cc. So again you are forced to pick certain frames.

 

1 hour ago, Zeclem said:

idk what i was expecting from a guy that thinks people should follow his agenda on pub runs or thinks there isnt people asking for long runs at all in recruitment chat. my mistake.

My point here, as the title suggest, is that survival now, as most players play it is pointless and absolute. The fact that people go into survival, and can't make it to 5 min without constantly dying. If you want to do a quick relic run you do capture/exterminate/sabotage, survival is intended for long runs. Don't want the game to become soft.

And like i mentioned before, tried recruiting chat, told you my experience about it now believe what you want. 

Edited March 8, 2017 by PakkiTheDog

[kgptzac]

I think the real joke here is a meta complain thread got moved to suggestion forum.  The game mode isn't that bad.  I like for what it is compare to other things in this game.  There is nothing constructive coming out of voicing your utter distaste of how other players choose to play the game within acceptable boundary.  Next time try something constructive, for example, make an actual suggestion to DE on something like server browser and give host the ability to set minimum wave before squad can extract, etc.

[DatDarkOne]

8 hours ago, Zeclem said:

in solo play you are limited to tank frames in any mode.

Ah hmmmm.  You do know that the frame that has the longest times solo in Endless type missions isn't a tank, right.  The current record holder for at least two endless type missions is Ivara.  No where near a tank frame is she.  :D

Edited March 8, 2017 by DatDarkOne
spelling

[The_Splentforcer]

7 hours ago, kgptzac said:

I think the real joke here is a meta complain thread got moved to suggestion forum.  The game mode isn't that bad.  I like for what it is compare to other things in this game.  There is nothing constructive coming out of voicing your utter distaste of how other players choose to play the game within acceptable boundary.  Next time try something constructive, for example, make an actual suggestion to DE on something like server browser and give host the ability to set minimum wave before squad can extract, etc.

the hardest part would actually to be highlighted by DE.....and it is really hard to make a suggestion where DE will care about.....but who doesn't try won't get anything I guess. You better have to take extremely good arguments 

for my part i prefer avoiding pointing deep rooted problems like Darthmuffin did......and you know what happened: banned