[22.20.5] Spores Revisited Feedback MEGATHREAD

[(PSN)big_eviljak]

4 minutes ago, (PS4)Kairu_Aname said:

Then you can only say she's fine as is.

Say that and leave, because that is your opinion and that's all you're going to say and then insult other people who have a different opinion. 

Good job on the feedback

Everyone has a different opinion... Ur the only one throwing a tantrum.

Saryn as is, is beautiful. Like God tier in my opinion.

Edited June 10, 2018 by (PS4)big_eviljak

[(PSN)Kairu_Aname]

Just now, (PS4)big_eviljak said:

Everyone has a different opinion... Ur the only one throwing a tantrum.

Saryn as is, is beautiful. Like God tier in my opinion.

That's your opinion, and is a good one. Insulting people isn't opinion. Neither is it helpful

[(PSN)big_eviljak]

Just now, (PS4)Kairu_Aname said:

That's your opinion, and is a good one. Insulting people isn't opinion. Neither is it helpful

Your the one insulting people... Let people have their opinion and dont get ur feelings hurt so easily. 

 

[(PSN)Kairu_Aname]

I am letting them have their opinion. I am also proving a point. 

[(PSN)big_eviljak]

Just now, (PS4)Kairu_Aname said:

I am letting them have their opinion. I am also proving a point. 

What point are you attempting to prove?

[(PSN)Kairu_Aname]

4 minutes ago, (PS4)big_eviljak said:

What point are you attempting to prove?

That he can do it without insulting people. 

Properly said,

   "I like (insert thing here)"

The version we got from him,

   "I like (insert thing here) and you shouldn't expect otherwise, get over it. it's not going to change from your whining."

[MasaJin]

Where does anyone find enemies level 150 other than the simulacrum (which isn't real gameplay) saryn as she is now has no real function with her abilities in normal missions. So far with her skills the way they are is not satisfying.

Her 1 leaves me with the feeling i waste my time cus of the hard reset and with no spread you put more work than you get out because in a normal star chart mission it gets up there spreads kills everything(i have a high range build) and before anything reaches me again all that damg is basicly gone (still miss the viral cus it was cheaper and i never really fight anything with insane armor cus those high lv endless levels have nothing to offer).

A lower damg and uncaping the damg per spore with spread on death would mean slower climb so slow it cant kill anything unless its been alive for a good few mins would make it feel really rewarding for gardening the spores

Her 2 even with that fake iron skin added to it dies as fast as i can cast it and the speed boost i cant figure any good use for it (feels so tacked on like the absorbing damg thing)

Giving it more aggro draw and scaling armor to power strength would make it worth something other than my heal button

Her 3 is the best thing imo of this rework no real issues with it

Her 4 im glad it finally procs something but it feels like a bad cc that i never use cus the cast time feels bad considering all her skills are cast on the go

I always wanted real miasma maybe a cloud that cause enemies to choke in it and maybe a accuracy debuff and the cloud comes off saryn so it follows her as she moves from place to place similar to Equinox but lingers a bit when she leaves its in a room spores could still pop if mobs are affected by miasma

[(PSN)Radehx]

45 minutes ago, MasaJin said:

Where does anyone find enemies level 150 other than the simulacrum (which isn't real gameplay) saryn as she is now has no real function with her abilities in normal missions. So far with her skills the way they are is not satisfying.

Her 1 leaves me with the feeling i waste my time cus of the hard reset and with no spread you put more work than you get out because in a normal star chart mission it gets up there spreads kills everything(i have a high range build) and before anything reaches me again all that damg is basicly gone (still miss the viral cus it was cheaper and i never really fight anything with insane armor cus those high lv endless levels have nothing to offer).

A lower damg and uncaping the damg per spore with spread on death would mean slower climb so slow it cant kill anything unless its been alive for a good few mins would make it feel really rewarding for gardening the spores

Her 2 even with that fake iron skin added to it dies as fast as i can cast it and the speed boost i cant figure any good use for it (feels so tacked on like the absorbing damg thing)

Giving it more aggro draw and scaling armor to power strength would make it worth something other than my heal button

Her 3 is the best thing imo of this rework no real issues with it

Her 4 im glad it finally procs something but it feels like a bad cc that i never use cus the cast time feels bad considering all her skills are cast on the go

I always wanted real miasma maybe a cloud that cause enemies to choke in it and maybe a accuracy debuff and the cloud comes off saryn so it follows her as she moves from place to place similar to Equinox but lingers a bit when she leaves its in a room spores could still pop if mobs are affected by miasma

22

Imo the issue isn't her abilities, it's how you use them. I'll explain:

Her 1 is there to debuff enemies by stripping armor and boosting damage. This is only really needed at higher levels, because her damage output is already good enough without that at lower levels up to around 35 for armored units and 50 for non-armored ones. Below those levels, you do not need the extra damage or debuff and you'll just continually waste your 25 energy...so don't use spores. 

This goes for other frames too. Ash can strip armor with his 1. But at lower levels, it's a total waste of energy. Just because that ability exists, doesn't mean using it is always a great strategy. Oberon can strip armor too, but why on earth would you waste energy on doint that at levels where you don't need the debuff?

Her 2 now survives a lot better, but you have to place it correctly for it to correctly pull aggro. If you do that, it does so very reliably now. You want to place it between you and enemies. Sometimes, that means you have to place it and then quickly get out of the way...and the speed boost helps with that. I can drop it and instantly zoom away, letting enemies refocus their attention to molt. You can also jump and drop it in the air a bit so melee units can't reach it. They'll still be attracted to it, just not damage it. You want as much damage on it in the first few seconds, because that'll determine how strong it is. Took me a while in the sim to figure out how it works, but it definitely survives much longer now than before. 

Her 3 is awesome. At low & mid levels this is all you really need. Just keep it up and all the things will die. If you are even somewhat decent at parkour and maybe once in a while sprinkle in molt, you will easily deal with all low & mid level content using mostly this skill. You'll one-shot everything with decent weapons. Pick your favorite weapon and it's now god tier.

Her 4 is the one ability I don't think is "great". It's a good ability though given the viral procs and its ability to quickly spread spores. It's the ability I use the least unless for the first few Hydron waves. The duration of the stun should be impacted by your duration stat imo. As it stands, my weapons can easily give me viral procs already and the damage isn't worth it after level 30 or so. Making the stun longer by linking it to duration would make me use the ability more. For all I care, they can even nerf damage a bit as long as they keep the viral procs. I'm fine with its energy usage though. Even at 100 efficiency, I hardly ever run out of energy even when I spam this every once in a while...because there really is no need to spam it more often. 

In short, I'm fine with the changes of her 1-3 abilities. Her 4 is "ok" but it would be cool if the CC aspect could be boosted a bit. Not expecting another "radial blind", just a tiny boost. Link the stun to duration and let me get my 8-10sec stun instead of 6.

Imo her scaling while going through levels works like this:

Low levels => toxic lash at 50 energy every minute or so, super energy efficient, amazing damage...and if you use molt, that's another 50 energy per minute...which is super easy to maintain

Mid levels => toxic lash, molt and miasma when faced with a larger mob...which is easy to maintain as long as you don't waste miasma when faced with only 3 enemies like an idiot

High levels => toxic lash, molt, spores and selectively miasma but only to spread spores or for quick CC. 

If you play like this, energy is easy to maintain and you'll always have enough damage to deal with whatever you are faced. The only thing required is that you adapt and don't expect that spamming all abilities at all times is the way to go. 

She has amazing scalability which is great. She can strip armor and halve health very effectively all in one frame. You don't need to use all abilities in all situations. If you're invited to a go-cart race, don't show up in an F1 car...adapt, switch to a go-cart, it's still fun and effective for the task given.

Edited June 10, 2018 by (PS4)Radehx

[MasaJin]

29 minutes ago, (PS4)Radehx said:

Imo the issue isn't her abilities, it's how you use them. I'll explain:

Her 1 is there to debuff enemies by stripping armor and boosting damage. This is only really needed at higher levels, because her damage output is already good enough without that at lower levels up to around 35 for armored units and 50 for non-armored ones. Below those levels, you do not need the extra damage or debuff and you'll just continually waste your 25 energy...so don't use spores. 

This goes for other frames too. Ash can strip armor with his 1. But at lower levels, it's a total waste of energy. Just because that ability exists, doesn't mean using it is always a great strategy. 

Her 2 now survives a lot better, but you have to place it correctly for it to correctly pull aggro. If you do that, it does so very reliably now. You want to place it between you and enemies. Sometimes, that means you have to place it and then quickly get out of the way...and the speed boost helps with that. I can drop it and instantly zoom away, letting enemies refocus their attention to molt. You can also jump and drop it in the air a bit so melee units can't reach it. They'll still be attracted to it, just not damage it. You want as much damage on it in the first few seconds, because that'll determine how strong it is. Took me a while in the sim to figure out how it works, but it definitely survives much longer now than before. 

Her 3 is awesome. At low & mid levels this is all you really need. Just keep it up and all the things will die. If you are even somewhat decent at parkour and maybe once in a while sprinkle in molt, you will easily deal with all low & mid level content using mostly this skill. You'll one-shot everything with decent weapons.

Her 4 is the one ability I don't think is "great". It's a good ability though given the viral procs and its ability to quickly spread spores. It's the ability I use the least unless for the first few Hydron waves. The duration of the stun should be impacted by your duration stat imo. As it stands, my weapons can easily give me viral procs already and the damage isn't worth it after level 30 or so. Making the stun longer by linking it to duration would make me use the ability more. For all I care, they can even nerf damage a bit as long as they keep the viral procs. I'm fine with its energy usage though. Even at 100 efficiency, I hardly ever run out of energy even when I spam this every once in a while...because there really is no need to spam it more often. 

In short, I'm fine with the changes of her 1-3 abilities. Her 4 is "ok" but it would be cool if the CC aspect could be boosted a bit. Not expecting another "radial blind", just a tiny boost. Link the stun to duration and let me get my 8-10sec stun instead of 6.

Imo her scaling while going through levels works like this:

Low levels => toxic lash at 50 energy every minute or so, super energy efficient, amazing damage...and if you use molt, that's another 50 energy per minute...which is super easy to maintain

Mid levels => toxic lash, molt and miasma when faced with a larger mob...which is easy to maintain as long as you don't waste miasma when faced with only 3 enemies like an idiot

High levels => toxic lash, molt, spores and selectively miasma but only to spread spores or for quick CC. 

If you play like this, energy is easy to maintain and you'll always have enough damage to deal with whatever you are faced. The only thing required is that you adapt and don't expect that spamming all abilities at all times is the way to go. 

She has amazing scalability which is great. She can strip armor and halve health very effectively all in one frame. You don't need to use all abilities in all situations. If you're invited to a go-cart race, don't show up in an F1 car...adapt, switch to a go-cart, it's still fun and effective for the task given.

1 y would a skill asked to not be used for most part of the game

2 high lv mobs can aim and molt is paper

3 dont tell me how to play what ive been playing 

Im not struggling its just my feedback 

Edited June 10, 2018 by MasaJin

[(PSN)Radehx]

17 minutes ago, MasaJin said:

1 y would a skill asked to kot be used for most part of the game

2 high lv mobs can aim and mob is paper

3 dont tell me how to play what ive been playing 

Im not struggling its just my feedback 

If your molt doesn't survive now, it's on you. It does pull aggro reliably for long enough to be useful...and yes, even at higher levels. 

As for spores not being needed for all levels...like I said, the same is true for many abilities of other frames too. Why should it?

And apparently, you ARE struggling if your molt dies too quickly. And that's not an attack, it's based on your own words.

If you don't like this playstyle, maybe the frame simply isn't for you. But that doesn't make it a bad frame. I don't particularly like Mesa, but that doesn't mean she's a bad frame...she's great. I really wanted to like Gara, but I don't...but I don't just refuse to adapt to the playstyle Gara's abilities requires. If I don't like like that playstyle, it doesn't mean Gara is bad.

The issues you list make it sound like you are trying to cross a desert in a sailboat. That doesn't make sailboats bad, it simply means you aren't exactly using it in the right way. And I don't mean this as an attack. Again, you are entitled to not liking this playstyle. Doesn't make the frame bad though. 

Edited June 10, 2018 by (PS4)Radehx

[MasaJin]

5 minutes ago, (PS4)Radehx said:

If your molt doesn't survive now, it's on you. It does pull aggro reliable for long enough to be useful...and yes, even at higher levels. 

As for spores not being needed for all levels...like I said, the same is true for many abilities of other frames too. Why should it?

And apparently, you ARE struggling if your molt dies too quickly. And that's not an attack, it's based on your own words.

If you don't like this playstyle, maybe the frame simply isn't for you. But that doesn't make it a bad frame. I don't particularly like Mesa, but that doesn't mean she's a bad frame...she's great. I really wanted to like Gara, but I don't...but I don't just refuse to adapt to the playstyle Gara's abilities requires. If I don't like like that playstyle, it doesn't mean Gara is bad.

Molt does survive for a lot of people its not just me if its a bad skills its a bad skill i don't use it for a distraction cus of that i usually blow it up myself repeatedly for cheap toxic damg

And every ability of every frame can be used in every lv that ash example u used was a augment not all augments get play

My ability to play any frame is not up to question i play every frame and i dont dislike any of them and if you don't know how a feedback thread works leave it 

[Reclaimer2448]

3 hours ago, Ikusias said:

There were better ways to go at this, anything thatn nuking the place from orbit and than admitting dissatifaction like [DE]Pablo did, check his answer halfpage down https://old.reddit.com/r/Warframe/comments/8mp03f/pablos_plan_opinion_about_saryn_35_compiled_from/  

Wow, uh... this hits me really hard. Specifically the "if you don't enjoy her, find a different frame" part. I've tried just about every frame in the game (I've got like 3 I haven't gotten yet), and I'm not going to say none others were fun, but no other was fun the way Saryn was. I used her basically daily, and for hours on end.

4 hours ago, Ikusias said:

I've invested plat and time in a frame that's been drastically altered in ways that I strongly dislike.

I bought her Prime Access and it's the happiest I've been from Warframe to date, so I understand completely. Although, I honestly only dislike one thing about her current version. That one thing is the spores spreading on kills, and it's removal isn't worth all the buffs in the world. And before anyone says anything about adapting and all that,

4 hours ago, Ikusias said:

i won't be using Saryn anymore because she isn't Saryn anymore.

this here is why adapting won't matter. Sure I can adapt to achieve better results, but that doesn't equate to enjoying her. This is why most of my suggestions have been nerfs to Spores to justify regaining that element of spread. That being said, I am still open to other ideas. Someone earlier mentioned a spore could idea. Something to the effect of "when a spore kills someone, a spore cloud floats there for a while and infects those who touch it."

4 hours ago, Ikusias said:

I take this as a big "XXXXXXX you" to players from DE and from Pablo, all for that crap mode that is Onslaught.

I'm sure they weren't trying to make any of us sad, angry, or displeased. At least I'd sure hope not, that's not good for the business of making enjoyable games or just being a decent person. Onslaught I actually like tho, because it's like "here, have enemies in absurd concentrations you can't find anywhere else so you can see how fast you can murder everyone!"

[DjKaplis]

20 hours ago, Konachibi said:

The thing is there's more people who hate the Saryn rework compared to the people who like it.  The "this was a good rework" crowd is only a tiny handful compared to the mass of people who liked her during her 2.0 days and hate her now.

I liked her during her 2.0 and like her now even more (although I was sceptical before rework as I thought they could make her bad). Saryn right now is my most used warframe as I played her in her 2.0 version a lot and I definitely will continue playing her. And so will many others, she is just overall stronger now even if you don't really like changes to her spores, molt and toxic lash and even miasma increased duration and slightly better base stats (armor) make up for it. 

18 hours ago, SyBuhr said:

Another text wall.

Dude I get that you have a lot to say but I'm just not interested to read through all that text if you can't express your opinion in a more concentrated manner. And I for sure am not quoting that text as then others would have to fight through my post too.

The reason why I posted that video is because it very well explains how she is stronger now (molt for survivability, new toxic lash applies to guns, spores helping with damage and armor stripping, excellent suggestion to use viral instead of corrosive on her weapons now...). And what's giving this guy credibility in his videos is the fact that he doesn't just go into simulacrum to kill a few enemies like most youtubers but instead tests things in long survivals where enemies scale up much higher than usual sortie, simulacrum or ESO enemies. If his weapon and warframe setups work against such high level enemies then usual content definitely is not a problem.

 

And in the end just going to say again what I said on my first reply to this thread - personally I like Saryn in her current state very much, I feel like there is a good reason to use all of her abilities now and everything seems to work great. Good job DE.

[DjKaplis]

19 hours ago, SyBuhr said:

Actually read the text wall now just for fun.

And now I understand that indeed I was right not to read your text walls 😄

I could agree on some points that you made that she can be too strong sometimes and make teammates feel less useful. But at the same time if you really aren't sefish as you pretend to be, you can work together with team just fine.

But other arguments like the implication that I should ever balance my Saryn around corrosive projection (I hate that aura, if you don't fight high lvl enemies you don't need it and if you fight high lvl enemies there are more creative ways to deal with armor) or god damn Ignis (there are dozens of other weapons that I like using more).

You want to just debuff? High efficiency, duration and range and Miasma, done.

There are now actually even more possible ways to build her than at her 2.0. Maybe the problem for some of people is the fact that you have to actually figure out new builds and test them now and you are too lazy to do that unless someone else already gives you a build? (Like corrosive projection, ignis, atterax setup, how original, I wonder how so many people figured out to use those things).

 

For all of you complaining - please use your minds a bit to figure out new and creative builds for her current version or if you aren't capable of that then ask some more creative friends or clan mates if they have some fun setups for the new Saryn. She hasn't actually changed that much but there are certainly many new opportunities for her now.

 

 

[SyBuhr]

21 hours ago, Unktena said:

Just pointing things out as I see them.
When there is CPs. People should be bringing Viral. Just simple math. Saryn 2.0 "Debuff" frame was just Viral Procs. Sure that's great and all, but nothing too fancy viral procs aren't too hard to get and you only need one every 6 seconds. I personally prefer the Corrosive proc because people don't always bring 4 CPs and armor is a lot of DR. I can generally feel when I'm the only CP even in level 40 or 50 missions. Also it lets me run different Auras. The rework as a whole I prefer a lot. The molt is guaranteed to last for a couple of seconds which makes regenerative molt be usable past level 40. Like I said earlier Viral procs only need one every 6 seconds and you need a good deal of Corrosive procs to strip armor, so I prefer the elements as they are.Her Toxic Lash applying to all weapons is also a nice change I didn't like feeling "restricted" in my weapon use.

Another of your points was how Saryns compete with other frames, and other Saryns. I have 2 points for this: The First is that Saryn 2.0 conflicted, maybe there was a change that I missed but if another Saryn had spores on an enemy you couldn't apply spores to them. Nova has a similar issue with her molecular prime. The Second point is that all kill frames reduce the effectiveness of other kill frames people just don't seem to say anything. If you have 2 Mesas in a room one of them is going have less kills. In fact that works just shooting.

I'm probably losing coherency, but I felt like I should address the viral issue. You need 1 energy orb every 2 casts of Miasma 112m Diameter the proc is going to last for 18 seconds per cast. Doesn't seem too hard to pull off.
 

Closing Issues with your post:
Saryn 1.0(?) Negative Duration increasing Miasma's damage I haven't seen spam anywhere near that tier from any frame, other than old nekros and desecrate.
Viral while nice, isn't anywhere near the end all be all and I see plenty of people who don't use CP.
I still have a Debuff Saryn build. Well, Range and Duration.
They changed launchers (Ignis included) to need to be aimed at a spore. So it still uses Lash.
People like DPS frames, when was the last time you saw a Debuff Equinox.
Anyone can decide not to revive you, "I could lose my bloodrush stacks."
Maybe I'm lucky, but I haven't had a group disband because I was Saryn.
Nidus is worse off than Saryn. If you can't build spores don't. I generally have no troubles reaching about 600 or 700 damage and while that isn't very high it is almost instantly killing things. But . . . I'm not always trying to spread them.
This might sound weird, but good frames trivialize content. I can AFK if I see a loki in many missions, same with mesa or frost in defense. I've even solo'd defenses and the like as Excal.

TL:DR DPS Frames compete for kills; there is no way around that. You can choose to only care about spores, but you still have a good kit and very little was taken away from the first rework to this iteration (Mostly just the elemental swap on 1&4). Saryns competing for spores is an old issue, maybe it wasn't noticed because no one was playing Saryn.
Hopefully the things I said made some sense.
I originally came here to see if there was any confirmation on how things like Energy Conversion work with her longer Duration abilities, but I felt like I needed to give an opinion as someone who likes the new Saryn

Awesome response, Love it. I am glad you like Saryn, and are able to expound on that. I'm not going to go super into detail on why I disagree with your points, but I'll leave this here as food-for-thought on how I've been working with her.

The one thing I will state is that, earlier I did mention that all DPS frames will be competing, and when the market for that sort-of-designed frame is already inundated, did we really need another rework focusing a good frame into that DPS field? Saryn's design was always to be Debuff First, Kill Second. Now it is Mark target for death, kill or pop spores as quick as possible, move on. She lost energy regains on Toxic lash, Molt has no synergies, so I am not sure why you think this rework took very little from her. She's lost her efficient avenue for Debuffing, and spamming Miasma is meant to be moved away from (one because it isn't efficient, and 2 it isn't fun).

A few questions I'll pose for you is: How often do you find yourself using certain abilities, and in what order? Are you playing predominantly in PUGs, Squads (with comms), or Solo?

I find personally I cast Spore first, because it makes sense design wise, then Miasma. I rarely, if ever use my other two abilities now, and I sometimes don't even use Miasma. Is this the sign of a good kit, or a well-designed frame? I do this for every type of match I am in, be it PUG, Squad, or Solo. I personally do not think this is a healthy design route for the frame, because it will pave the way for much harsher nerfs in the future, with no mitigation from potential "Quality of Life" improvements. I've tried Duration, Range, Power, and Efficiency builds, and they all end the same way. This is not a good indication, to me, that no matter how I try to build my Saryn, I find myself pushed consistently to Spores, because those are truly the only things that matter for her.

 

3 hours ago, DjKaplis said:

😄 

Didn't bother to read, because you don't have a Youtube channel with a lot of followers. See how that works out, when you put that as a standard?

[MasaJin]

4 hours ago, DjKaplis said:

For all of you complaining - please use your minds a bit to figure out new and creative builds for her current version or if you aren't capable of that then ask some more creative friends or clan mates if they have some fun setups for the new Saryn. She hasn't actually changed that much but there are certainly many new opportunities for her now.

you should spend more time reading no one is complaining about builds.

This is a feedback thread to say how you feel about the changes and give ideas and constuctive feedback just cus you like it doesn't make you or anyone who does right, but either does people who dislike her everyone has the right to say what they please about her its not about being creative or changing builds everyone plays differently

[DjKaplis]

38 minutes ago, SyBuhr said:

Didn't bother to read, because you don't have a Youtube channel with a lot of followers. See how that works out, when you put that as a standard?

Thanks for the reasonably short answer :) It's ok somehow you still managed to guess what I wrote in my comment.

As for your response to Unktena's post that you only use spore and sometimes miasma now - I would recommend at least using toxic lash as well as it works with all weapons now. Just so you know.

39 minutes ago, MasaJin said:

you should spend more time reading no one is complaining about builds.

This is a feedback thread to say how you feel about the changes and give ideas and constuctive feedback just cus you like it doesn't make you or anyone who does right, but either does people who dislike her everyone has the right to say what they please about her its not about being creative or changing builds everyone plays differently

You are right. The comment wasn't meant to offend, just a suggestion. Although from some people's feedback it does look like they have only been playing her a certain way. Maybe coming up with a fun build would help some players to like her more. 

[(PSN)Kairu_Aname]

   ●Spores

Make spore spread regardless of circumstance. Probably keep it half to 1/4 range. 

Change the damage mechanic to only apply built up damage to spores spread by saryn herself, and only half the damage built up to spores spread by allies.

Spores that spread by themselves deal base damage.

Make spores have an allotment of "slots" on an enemy based on how many saryn's there are in a squad. There's around 10 slots per enemy atm, but only one saryn's spores can be on them at any point in time, and currently(to my knowledge) only 3 of that saryn's spores can be on that enemy. 

Don't remove spores from enemies when saryn dies, just reset the damage. It feels better if they still keep the spores.

No other changes from current spores mechanics. Not even the drain. 

   ●Molt.

Combine the augment with it and make her heal base. Make the augment strip status changes from saryn. Frees up a generally put "required" mod. Makes it an optional one. 

No other changes

   ●Toxic lash. 

Give some kind of energy refund because saryn is energy hungry on all but like 5 build variations and it would alleviate that to an astonishing degree even if it was just one energy. It would reward actually using toxic lash. Reason being as many times it was said in this very thread, "just use her miasma to spread spores and kill enemies" isn't fun. It's not diversified gameplay.

Ignis wouldn't feel like it's the best option for spores when you have little energy on most builds

No other changes

   ●Miasma. (They reduced the cost of it because she WAS ACTUALLY having energy issues and made this the Avenue by which people spread spores)

To keep people from spamming it constantly, make it have 10 base damage, but double its damage every second it's active after cast initial cast and reset if it's recast.

10 damage at start, then 20, then 40 etc.

Make base duration 8 seconds.

No other changes

 

These suggested changes wouldn't force people into only playing one way, and instead encourage her to use abilities as a "caster" that she is supposed to be now. It doesn't encourage "lazy" playstyles and basically satisfies just about every requirement that DE wants here

[sehafoc]

I like the Saryn changes for the most part, building for the damage scaling on spores is a bit weird though.  it seems like if you build her too strong things at lower levels die too fast making her have to cast more,  and if you build her too weak the build doesn't scale well enough.

Thank you very much for removing the single cast mechanic,  As I thought, chasing down the last enemies to keep the strain going was a big pain.  I guess removing the spread on spore death is an okay compromise for that.

Overall though,  as a complete package,  I'm having more fun with the 3.0 Saryn than the 2.0 one.  Most of the previous interactive play styles survived and got a notable buff.  

[GPrime96]

Gave another go with Saryn in the Simulacrum and the ESO and against higher level enemies, She's a Monster. lvl 110s in the Simulacrum was dying like if they were paper and her kill speed is high in the ESO. I need to get the Augment for Molt because to me, she's Squishy still. I used a CO/BR Plague Zaw for those tests. Even if the spores wasn't killing the lvl 110s, the Armor from them would be completely removed which allows me to one shot them with the Zaw if I used Miasma with the Spores. So DE, She's now a Armor Stripping, Murderous Glass Cannon of a frame. But in the low levels, she don't seem to be that much of a Monster. So her Scaling is pretty Noticeable.

[(PSN)big_eviljak]

21 hours ago, MasaJin said:

Where does anyone find enemies level 150 other than the simulacrum (which isn't real gameplay) saryn as she is now has no real function with her abilities in normal missions. So far with her skills the way they are is not satisfying.

Her 1 leaves me with the feeling i waste my time cus of the hard reset and with no spread you put more work than you get out because in a normal star chart mission it gets up there spreads kills everything(i have a high range build) and before anything reaches me again all that damg is basicly gone (still miss the viral cus it was cheaper and i never really fight anything with insane armor cus those high lv endless levels have nothing to offer).

A lower damg and uncaping the damg per spore with spread on death would mean slower climb so slow it cant kill anything unless its been alive for a good few mins would make it feel really rewarding for gardening the spores

Her 2 even with that fake iron skin added to it dies as fast as i can cast it and the speed boost i cant figure any good use for it (feels so tacked on like the absorbing damg thing)

Giving it more aggro draw and scaling armor to power strength would make it worth something other than my heal button

Her 3 is the best thing imo of this rework no real issues with it

Her 4 im glad it finally procs something but it feels like a bad cc that i never use cus the cast time feels bad considering all her skills are cast on the go

I always wanted real miasma maybe a cloud that cause enemies to choke in it and maybe a accuracy debuff and the cloud comes off saryn so it follows her as she moves from place to place similar to Equinox but lingers a bit when she leaves its in a room spores could still pop if mobs are affected by miasma

Just hangout in the void survival or defense for 60+ mins... Enemies scale wonderfully. Its where i test most of my builds after i get the specifics in the simulcrum.

[Reclaimer2448]

3 hours ago, (PS4)Kairu_Aname said:

●Spores

Make spore spread regardless of circumstance. Probably keep it half to 1/4 range. 

Change the damage mechanic to only apply built up damage to spores spread by saryn herself, and only half the damage built up to spores spread by allies.

Spores that spread by themselves deal base damage.

Make spores have an allotment of "slots" on an enemy based on how many saryn's there are in a squad. There's around 10 slots per enemy atm, but only one saryn's spores can be on them at any point in time, and currently(to my knowledge) only 3 of that saryn's spores can be on that enemy. 

Don't remove spores from enemies when saryn dies, just reset the damage. It feels better if they still keep the spores.

No other changes from current spores mechanics. Not even the drain. 

   ●Molt.

All of this sounds fun and reasonable.

3 hours ago, (PS4)Kairu_Aname said:

●Molt. 

Combine the augment with it and make her heal base. Make the augment strip status changes from saryn. Frees up a generally put "required" mod. Makes it an optional one. 

No other changes

It is a nice idea, but I don't think "Rejuvenating Molt" is a fitting name for something that removes status procs. Do they rename augments that they change the function of?

3 hours ago, (PS4)Kairu_Aname said:

●Toxic lash. 

Give some kind of energy refund because saryn is energy hungry on all but like 5 build variations and it would alleviate that to an astonishing degree even if it was just one energy. It would reward actually using toxic lash. Reason being as many times it was said in this very thread, "just use her miasma to spread spores and kill enemies" isn't fun. It's not diversified gameplay.

Ignis wouldn't feel like it's the best option for spores when you have little energy on most builds

No other changes

As much as I liked the energy refund, I do see a pretty big problem with this, and I think Ignis would be the best option to gain energy back. You could totally just glide over everyone and shoot them all, and I think that would quite possibly reward too much energy even if it is just 1. Maybe it should be 1 energy back per infected enemy hit, but with a cap of somewhere from 2-5 per second?

 

3 hours ago, (PS4)Kairu_Aname said:

●Miasma. (They reduced the cost of it because she WAS ACTUALLY having energy issues and made this the Avenue by which people spread spores)

To keep people from spamming it constantly, make it have 10 base damage, but double its damage every second it's active after cast initial cast and reset if it's recast.

10 damage at start, then 20, then 40 etc.

Make base duration 8 seconds.

No other changes

This idea I much enjoy: growing damage as their health decays. Absolutely brilliant, Kairu.

[MasaJin]

30 minutes ago, (PS4)big_eviljak said:

Just hangout in the void survival or defense for 60+ mins... Enemies scale wonderfully. Its where i test most of my builds after i get the specifics in the simulcrum.

I do never seen anything that high 

[SyBuhr]

11 hours ago, DjKaplis said:

As for your response to Unktena's post that you only use spore and sometimes miasma now - I would recommend at least using toxic lash as well as it works with all weapons now. Just so you know.

Toxic lash is pointless when Ignis pops all the spores, free of charge. I've used her abilities pretty thoroughly for the past few weeks, through all star-chart. I've recently moved to miasma, because it is just way more effective in general for what you get out of it, compared to her lash.

[(PSN)big_eviljak]

29 minutes ago, MasaJin said:

I do never seen anything that high 

Ive never seen enemies over lvl 244 but by that time i have to urinate so bad im ready to go xb.