Differences between primes and Umbra [spoilers]

[puppycorpse]

5 minutes ago, AtoKitsune said:

So basically "I'm angry that this amazing thing is being given to everyone including me even though it hasn't infringed on any previous agreements presented by the developers."

Sure you are a founder. Founders kept the game alive and they have the mark to show for it. Excalibur Prime has been yours for half a decade now, and he will remain that way forever. Not to mention Lato and Skana Prime. The people who play Warframe and keep it alive in the present deserve something, too. Without today's players, this game couldn't exist. Excalibur Prime isn't about being the best, he's about being there.

Literally what I said. Founder salt. I find it funny. Ik this was gonna a happen when umbra came out. Thought it be alittle faster though.

Edited June 15, 2018 by puppycorpse

[Axacution]

Just now, Vladimir said:

Would like to be able to use his frame skin on umbra and also keep my scarf.

The fact that you make the point of using Excalibur Prime's skin on Excalibur Umbra is redundant. No warframe is backwards compatible with the skin of the prime on the basic frame. Its the point of the Prime. If you want to keep your fancy little skin, go for it. The literal only difference between Excal Prime and Excal Umbra's appearance is the circle is missing on the face, there's a scarf, and you got some fancy little decorations on his arms. You guys got what you want. An exclusive frame no one else in the game can have because it was for the founders. DE never stated that they would not make a frame of the Excalibur line equal to or better than your prime. You're all content and happy gloating on the throne with your exclusive frame thats better than the other but as soon as you get one-upped in the community because DE wants to add a new frame, a new story, and a new experience you guys get more twisted than anyone in this community. You got what you paid for all those years ago and DE decided to make something to contend with it that everyone can have. Suck it up. Its a frame. If you dont like it, dont play it. No ones forcing you to like or use him but accept the fact that DE's minds change over time. You guys have a special place in the game for founding it, no ones denying that. But just because you threw some money at the game to get it running like so many people spend money on the game now which helps keep it running, doesn't mean that DE is going to cater to your every whim and way when you whine that something doesn't go your way.

[Eldnacpeek]

3 hours ago, Vladimir said:

Would like to be able to use his frame skin on umbra and also keep my scarf.

 

Yeah, odd that everything can be interchanged except Prime's stuff.

[Cleesus]

Please remember to remain respectful and do not flame bait. 

[Axacution]

Just now, LazerSkink said:

 

Yeah, odd that everything can be interchanged except Prime's stuff.

No its really not. Primed accessories (Helmets and bodies) are meant to be prime specific because they are special. Allowing them to go on any frame is ridiculous in any form or fashion. Personally, I keep all my frames but because I have the primes with better health, shield, armor, etc... I run that because in the overall scheme of the game that is more viable. Its like the "a square is a rectangle but a rectangle is not a square" phrase most of us were taught in school. Excalibur is the branch upon which each limb grows. Umbra being one branch, Prime being another branch. You can't equip Umbra on Excal Base, you can't equip Prime on Base, you can't equip Umbra on Prime or Prime on Umbra. You can however fit base onto both prime and umbra because that's the main branch or the square in this case. The rectangles don't fit (Umbra and Prime) because of the fact that they were made for a specific purpose in mind and cannot be compatible. Yes, the frame in essence is the same but the details in the frame change the accessories you can throw on it.

[Eldnacpeek]

3 hours ago, Axacution said:

No its really not. Primed accessories (Helmets and bodies) are meant to be prime specific because they are special. Allowing them to go on any frame is ridiculous in any form or fashion. Personally, I keep all my frames but because I have the primes with better health, shield, armor, etc... I run that because in the overall scheme of the game that is more viable. Its like the "a square is a rectangle but a rectangle is not a square" phrase most of us were taught in school. Excalibur is the branch upon which each limb grows. Umbra being one branch, Prime being another branch. You can't equip Umbra on Excal Base, you can't equip Prime on Base, you can't equip Umbra on Prime or Prime on Umbra. You can however fit base onto both prime and umbra because that's the main branch or the square in this case. The rectangles don't fit (Umbra and Prime) because of the fact that they were made for a specific purpose in mind and cannot be compatible. Yes, the frame in essence is the same but the details in the frame change the accessories you can throw on it.

 

Not really your call though (not saying you said that). Founders have access to the exclusive variant, so they should be able interchange their cosmetics between all 3, it's perfectly reasonable.

[Evil]

I really don't care about anything other than being able to put my Prime head on Umbra. As long as they let me do this, I have no regrets.

[Mana_Caldaria]

29 minutes ago, Vladimir said:

I played it. That is also not the problem, the problem is that all prime frames are now 2nd tier compared to umbra. I will have to reforma everything

Let's not pretend DE are going to pump out another Umbra frame every week (which would still be enough for you to grab all the Forma you need).

This is a non-issue.

[Axacution]

14 minutes ago, LazerSkink said:

 

Not really your call though (not saying you said that). Founders have access to the exclusive variant, so they should be able interchange their cosmetics between all 3, it's perfectly reasonable.

Ill agree its not my call. But founders were given a frame, a few weapons, some glyphs, and other things dependant upon package choice. DE didnt say it would be cross compatible but it could have been a nice touch. And again, if you have the prime which is already better than the base frame, why are you using the base frame? It provides you no advantage in terms of gameplay and the only thing you might do with it is flex on some newbies with primed gear on the basic excal. They were meant to be special upon release and they are. They were created to be upgrades worth of desire and something to obtain. Not to get and use them on the basic frame. Im not saying that what youre saying is inherently incorrect but there is a logistical reason for how DE made the game how they did. They didnt make they backwards compatible for a reason and they feel it was the right decision so why take a beautiful update that came out with an amazing frame, great UI update, and really nice cosmetics to suggest a new perk to a program they ended over 4 years ago? Appreciate the update for what it is, what it means to and for the community, and give DE the pat on the back they rightfully deserve instead of just trashing them for a small detail you feel needs added or that the new frame contends with Excalibir Prime.

Edited June 15, 2018 by Axacution

[Eldnacpeek]

3 hours ago, Axacution said:

 

 

I don't really see anyone trashing it though.

I just feel Excalibur Prime's status of never returning isn't a reason to ignore him (they only buffed his armor). Regardless of what anyone says, he's not going to make a return, but that's not a reason to allow those who own him to have their customization a bit restricted. Only me though, you're free to have your own opinion (obviously)

[Axacution]

8 minutes ago, LazerSkink said:

 

I don't really see anyone trashing it though.

I just feel Excalibur Prime's status of never returning isn't a reason to ignore him (they only buffed his armor). Regardless of what anyone says, he's not going to make a return, but that's not a reason to allow those who own him to have their customization a bit restricted. Only me though, you're free to have your own opinion (obviously)

He wasnt ignored tho. As you said yourself they paid attention and buffed the armor. Its not ignorance. Founders have a special exclusive frame which is what they were promised. DE has given everyone the same customization access as founders. If they did implement a cross compatibility im pretty sure theyd also be asked to do it for prime access packs which are available for a limited time with specific packs giving plat, gear, and accessories. Yes founders kept the game alive but there you have the same principle where founders ask for another leg up to flex on those who didnt get the chance all those years ago. You arent being thrown under the bus in any way

[OniDax]

Honestly, I like Excal Prime better than Umbra. But Umbra visually looks better. If I could use Umbra's attachments on my Excal Prime, I wouldn't use Umbra.

[LazyBlissIV]

aren't eidolons sentient? do the umbra mods/frames let you damage eidolons w powers?

[ShogunGunshow]

Umbra's passive is so amazing that I wish it was on every frame. 

S'a cool quest. I'm gonna be kinda disgruntled, though, if Umbras are just a straight upgrade on Primes (as if this game needed more tiers).

(Also a minor amount of salt about Excal Prime becoming abjectly inferior, but hey, he's had a good run.)

[Lholland]

I see him more as a side-grqde due to his second ability being different than Excalibur Prime's. Also, this passive could be a blessing or a curse depending on whether enemies one-shot him or not.

Edited June 15, 2018 by Lholland

[Eldnacpeek]

3 hours ago, ShogunGunshow said:

Umbra's passive is so amazing that I wish it was on every frame. 

S'a cool quest. I'm gonna be kinda disgruntled, though, if Umbras are just a straight upgrade on Primes (as if this game needed more tiers).

(Also a minor amount of salt about Excal Prime becoming abjectly inferior, but hey, he's had a good run.)

 

Just pray they don't throw up an Umbra frame every few months and we'll be fine.

[The_Lunatic_]

Hopefully now that the people crying about Excalibur Prime have been appeased he get the buffs and appearance overhaul he woefully needs.

[Midas]

2 minutes ago, The_Lunatic_ said:

Hopefully now that the people crying about Excalibur Prime have been appeased he get the buffs and appearance overhaul he woefully needs.

all primes should get a difference.

[Midas]

18 minutes ago, ShogunGunshow said:

Umbra's passive is so amazing that I wish it was on every frame. 

S'a cool quest. I'm gonna be kinda disgruntled, though, if Umbras are just a straight upgrade on Primes (as if this game needed more tiers).

(Also a minor amount of salt about Excal Prime becoming abjectly inferior, but hey, he's had a good run.)

Mate if your umbra dies in sorties or high end missions you die and have to use a revive.

[The_Lunatic_]

1 minute ago, Vladimir said:

all primes should get a difference.

Yeah, the power difference between New Primes and Old Primes is kinda nuts.

Visual changes too. I do wish DE would take the time to go back and ensure they're all on the same level.

[OoKeNnEtHoO]

1 hour ago, The_Lunatic_ said:

Yeah, the power difference between New Primes and Old Primes is kinda nuts.

Visual changes too. I do wish DE would take the time to go back and ensure they're all on the same level.

Yeah, Frost Prime is definitely one of them.

Same for Excal Prime.

The new buffs to stats are good but the visuals..😧

Edited June 15, 2018 by OoKeNnEtHoO

[Sk3iter]

I'm not even a founder and i'm just disappointed never been a fan of excal when they said they'll release umbra i was thinking it would be a MR fodder then they said it'll have different abilities which doesn't it's just one abilities that has different animation and same function i guess umbra will still be a MR fodder for me.

[(PSN)vl_Monarch_lv]

If his mods are maxed, Umbra is far superior to Excalibur Prime.

[OoKeNnEtHoO]

2 hours ago, Vladimir said:

Mate if your umbra dies in sorties or high end missions you die and have to use a revive.

That's something easily solvable by asking and begging DE as long as there is enough support from majority.

Edited June 15, 2018 by OoKeNnEtHoO

[IggySnow]

I dont really care that umbra is flat out better than prime, my main disappointment is that Umbra is basically just another excal.

I mean this is umbra excal were talking about, we all waited 3 years for this frame and they didn't do anything special with him besides the fact that he can walk around on his own when using your operator. But lets be honest here, how often do people go into operator mode? anything besides eidolon hunts and its pretty much never.

DE could have taken this opportunity to do something really unique with the umbra variant, like make their powers even slightly different from the regular versions, but they didn't. 

So much potential just wasted