Differences between primes and Umbra [spoilers]

[corallein]

18 minutes ago, (XB1)Evilpricetag said:

Yea streamer I was watching didn't realize the could add P Pressur point with the new mod. I didn't realize until last devstream that Charged Chamber and Primed Chamber work this way aswell. So I kinda assumed this for these mods.

You can't use both Sacrificial Pressure and (Primed) Pressure Point. The Sacrificial Umbra mods are replacements for the similarly-named mods. And while Sacrificial Steel is superior to True Steel, Sacrificial Pressure is just barely better than regular Pressure Point and worse than Primed PP.

[The_Lunatic_]

15 minutes ago, (PS4)lagrue said:

In regards to Excal P. if they rework his whole model it's a can of worms and non-founders rage.

It's similar to how they still refuse to separate Arcane Helmet stats from the helmet itself. If they were to put any amount of work into doing so, all non-owners of these helmets will get salty.  I've asked for that feature for fashion frame purposes for years and the general community response is the same every time - they don't want DE to expend resources on something that benefits only old timers - and in that regard I do understand.

Frost is a different story - but I don't think they can really justify going back and redoing Excal Prime without unleashing the salty wrath of 4 years of players who don't have it.  

Non-founders have been whining for ages. Nothing is going to change that. Forcing people to miss out on stuff purely due to the whining of a certain group isn't really the way a game should be made.

 

DE should make Excalibur Prime into the Warframe they want him to be, not what some upset kids demand he be.

[(PSN)N7_Dredgen]

1 minute ago, The_Lunatic_ said:

Non-founders have been whining for ages. Nothing is going to change that. Forcing people to miss out on stuff purely due to the whining of a certain group isn't really the way a game should be made.

DE should make Excalibur Prime into the Warframe they want him to be, not what some upset kids demand he be.

Likewise continuing to expend time and resources on something that benefits the smallest possible fraction of the playerbase also isn't how games should be developed.  Pick your poison.    

He was made the Warframe they wanted them to be - it's you Founders who want that to change.  

Edited June 15, 2018 by (PS4)lagrue

[The_Lunatic_]

4 minutes ago, (PS4)lagrue said:

Likewise continuing to expend time and resources on something that benefits the smallest possible fraction of the playerbase also isn't how games should be developed.  Pick your poison.    

He was made the Warframe they wanted them to be - it's you Founders who want that to change.  

So DE should never bother with rare content? All those times they've made time-limited event items, or hard to obtain mods should never have happened?

It's a loot game. The whole point is people getting stuff that only a small fraction of the playbase owns.

 

I very much doubt DE wants to keep a set of assets in the game from 2013. Even Frost Prime has received some cosmetic updates over the years. All I see founders suggesting is updating it to match the rest of the frames. Hell, most of them are even suggesting it be done with all the other frames, so it's not exclusively a bonus to founders.

[(PSN)N7_Dredgen]

1 minute ago, The_Lunatic_ said:

So DE should never bother with rare content?

Rare content =/= exclusive content.

Also not sure what being a loot shooter has to do with something you paid for and didn't have to loot.  lol 

Edited June 15, 2018 by (PS4)lagrue

[(XBOX)Evilpricetag]

4 minutes ago, The_Lunatic_ said:

Non-founders have been whining for ages. Nothing is going to change that. Forcing people to miss out on stuff purely due to the whining of a certain group isn't really the way a game should be made.

 

DE should make Excalibur Prime into the Warframe they want him to be, not what some upset kids demand he be.

 

3 minutes ago, (PS4)lagrue said:

Likewise continuing to expend time and resources on something that benefits the smallest possible fraction of the playerbase also isn't how games should be developed.  Pick your poison.    

He was made the Warframe they wanted them to be - it's you Founders who want that to change.  

You know, I have no evidence, but Icame to the conclusion that DE's most income from Warframe must come from players who impulse buy, then quit. Because as large of an investment as PA is it seems that actions tha show growth in the community such as PoE, drive them to duplicate said content. As many vets disagree even though many of them buy every PA including fouunders who spent the most for a single pack, they will drive profitable content at least a few times. 

I'm not including myself feed me updates I dont care what it is. But these threads were vast after PoE.

[The_Lunatic_]

4 minutes ago, (PS4)lagrue said:

Rare content =/= exclusive content.

So, they should never release updates for Snipetron and Machete?

Or all the times they release Prime Accessories? Is that a waste of effort too?

Edited June 15, 2018 by The_Lunatic_

[(PSN)N7_Dredgen]

3 minutes ago, The_Lunatic_ said:

So, they should never release updates for Snipetron and Machete?

Or all the times they release Prime Accessories? Is that a waste of effort too?

Machete and Snipetron return at various points.  Same with Prime Accesories.

Founders stuff never will be back - the arugment is moot.  

Again
Exclusive Content =/= Rare Content

Edited June 15, 2018 by (PS4)lagrue

[The_Lunatic_]

Just now, (PS4)lagrue said:

Machete and Snipetron return at various points.  Same with Prime Accesories.

Founders stuff never will be - the arugment is moot.  

And now Excal Prime is back in the form of Umbra.

[(PSN)N7_Dredgen]

Just now, The_Lunatic_ said:

And now Excal Prime is back in the form of Umbra.

No it's not and that's a stupid thing to say.  You know that they aren't the same thing.  

[The_Lunatic_]

1 minute ago, (PS4)lagrue said:

No it's not and that's a stupid thing to say.  You know that they aren't the same thing.  

They have the exact same stats. Excalibur Prime has gone from a warframe to a skin.

There's plenty of exclusive skins in the game, and over the years far more effort has gone into them than Excalibur Prime.

The only suggestion I see so far is that Excalibur Prime and other Older primes should be updated to match the new aesthetic of Primes being more than just a reskin and a helmet.

Are you really so upset about an exclusive skin?

[Vilemyre]

28 minutes ago, corallein said:

You can't use both Sacrificial Pressure and (Primed) Pressure Point. The Sacrificial Umbra mods are replacements for the similarly-named mods. And while Sacrificial Steel is superior to True Steel, Sacrificial Pressure is just barely better than regular Pressure Point and worse than Primed PP.

Is that including with the scaling buff if you use both mods at the same time? (Both umbras I mean)

Edited June 15, 2018 by Vilemyre

[Xaero]

23 minutes ago, The_Lunatic_ said:

Are you really so upset about an exclusive skin?

Are you?

[The_Lunatic_]

17 minutes ago, Ksaero said:

Are you?

Disappointed. Chance for something new and interesting, instead just got welfare prime.

[Bigamo]

6 hours ago, Vladimir said:

Difference between current prime and umbra:

Exal prime's exalted blade > Umbra's blade stat wise

Excal prime's passive < Umbra passive

Polarities may count as a negative or a positive (should use for future sentient content)

Both have same warframe stats.

Warframes without Exalted weapons in the future may have noticeable stat differences.

Actually Umbra Blade have more damage than Excal prime exalted blade... 

 I wanted to see a new and cool warframe, not one that makes my loved excalibur prime obsolete. 

[Bigamo]

1 hour ago, (PS4)lagrue said:

No it's not and that's a stupid thing to say.  You know that they aren't the same thing.  

true, the umbra is just a better excalibur prime... 😞 

[Xaero]

25 minutes ago, Bigamo said:

Actually Umbra Blade have more damage than Excal prime exalted blade... 

 I wanted to see a new and cool warframe, not one that makes my loved excalibur prime obsolete. 

According to screenshots provided by another founder, EB stats are the same.

[(PSN)ForerunnerKnight]

6 hours ago, Mana_Caldaria said:

Let's not pretend DE are going to pump out another Umbra frame every week (which would still be enough for you to grab all the Forma you need).

This is a non-issue.

Yeah guys dont expect umbra warframes to be a thing now, DE has said multiple times in the past that while this is a “never say never” in regards to more umbra frames situation, they only gave us excal umbra because they A. wanted to give non founders something in place of excal prime and B. Wanted to put umbra in a cinematic quest.

Edited June 15, 2018 by (PS4)ForerunnerKnight

[(PSN)ForerunnerKnight]

1 hour ago, The_Lunatic_ said:

Disappointed. Chance for something new and interesting, instead just got welfare prime.

Welfare prime?!?Technically u didnt earn excal and the prime weapons either, you PAID for the package and they were HANDED to you so...What is that charming expression about stones and glass houses?

Edited June 15, 2018 by (PS4)ForerunnerKnight

[Noponis]

From what I can tell, the only differences are the passive and the polarities

While the passive is a sidegrade, due to having the downside of leaving your frame vulnerable, the polarities are too much

The umbral warframe mods are so absurdly superior to their regular counterparts and their drain so sky high, that I find this absolutely unfair

Either let everyone, or at the very least excalibur prime access these new polarities through forma

I don't mind non founders getting something that is effectively the same or a sidegrade. But just straight up powercreeping Excal Prime like this feels like a gut punch

[The_Lunatic_]

43 minutes ago, (PS4)ForerunnerKnight said:

Welfare prime?!?Technically u didnt earn excal and the prime weapons either, you PAID for the package and they were HANDED to you so...What is that charming expression about stones and glass houses?

It was a reward for the trust we put in DE to make Warframe a reality.

Without us, given the state DE was in the time it did the founder package, there's a very real chance Warframe never would have survived a year or so, at least not in its current state.

So, it's not really a fair comparison to compare a reward for a risky investment in an unproven game to being given something for as free welfare to quell the years of whining about something.

[Bigamo]

47 minutes ago, (PS4)ForerunnerKnight said:

Welfare prime?!?Technically u didnt earn excal and the prime weapons either, you PAID for the package and they were HANDED to you so...What is that charming expression about stones and glass houses?

Technically we earned the money :) Its real life quest and stuff. 

[Richtter]

8 minutes ago, The_Lunatic_ said:

It was a reward for the trust we put in DE to make Warframe a reality.

Without us, given the state DE was in the time it did the founder package, there's a very real chance Warframe never would have survived a year or so, at least not in its current state.

So, it's not really a fair comparison to compare a reward for a risky investment in an unproven game to being given something for as free welfare to quell the years of whining about something.

Thank you for risky a tiny investment, but in every bussiness you need to feed the machine all the time. I saw many games die after founder's acess because of this. 

 Who makes warframe a successful actualy is the actual playerbase. I barely find a Founder and I bet less than 1% of founders plays warframe now.

 

Maybe you are triggered because now people will talk things like:

Person A: Hey! Look at that Excal Prime.

Person B: Who cares. I have Excal Umbra.

 

[(XBOX)N7 Sinner]

44 minutes ago, Noponis said:

From what I can tell, the only differences are the passive and the polarities

While the passive is a sidegrade, due to having the downside of leaving your frame vulnerable, the polarities are too much

The umbral warframe mods are so absurdly superior to their regular counterparts and their drain so sky high, that I find this absolutely unfair

Either let everyone, or at the very least excalibur prime access these new polarities through forma

I don't mind non founders getting something that is effectively the same or a sidegrade. But just straight up powercreeping Excal Prime like this feels like a gut punch

No. Just no. If DE gave Excalibur Prime the ability to utilize Umbra polarities as you have suggested here, that would only further divide the community. You paid for your exclusives years ago now. Personally, I couldn't care less about your Founder's items. The fact that you have them is more than enough for anyone who couldn't obtain those items and will NEVER be able to obtain them. That should be more than enough for you.

Now, you are asking for the definitive edge over non-founders by making the Umbral mods cheaper for Excalibur Prime? No. There has to be a better solution than that which benefits EVERY player. Anything less will only fuel the irritations of non-founders further.

[LustyLost-EN-]

Just let everybody use forma on the new polarity and its sort of fixed, I don't really care about Umbra's passive, just let us use the new modes instead of it being just an umbra thing unless you wanna spend 18 cost on each mod.