The Phantasma

[SnazzyZ]

18 minutes ago, (XB1)GearsMatrix301 said:

Look man, we’ve been getting a lot of shotguns lately. It’s nice to get one that’s different.

An amprex with a shotgun skin, very different indeed. Perhaps it should have been stated to be a beam, and modeled to not look like a flak cannon, flak cannons are also something we haven’t gotten a new one of in a while. 

[(XBOX)GearsMatrix301]

20 minutes ago, PolarFall said:

An amprex with a shotgun skin, very different indeed. Perhaps it should have been stated to be a beam, and modeled to not look like a flak cannon, flak cannons are also something we haven’t gotten a new one of in a while. 

Amprex chains between enemies, this gun clearly doesn’t.

[SnazzyZ]

15 minutes ago, (XB1)GearsMatrix301 said:

Amprex chains between enemies, this gun clearly doesn’t.

then as a beam weapon why not use literally any other beam weapon? if it's just single target like that then it doesnt have much going for it in comparison to other beams.

[SnazzyZ]

1 hour ago, Loza03 said:

The whole beam thing I don't really care about. Yeah it's a little samey, but whatever, I'm not the one actually designing the weapon. We have 'beam shotguns', and regardless of how that whole bedazzle goes together, it's not worth splitting hairs over. It's a beam weapon that uses shotgun mods. Whatever. But I can't let go of the fact that, yes, this thing has 2-9 barrels depending on how you decide to classify them, and yet the beam doesn't look anything like what should be coming out of a gun like that.

It doesn't FEEL right, and feel is very important in a video game.

If they just changed the fire animation to something like a volley of energy shots in succession it would function almost (if not exactly) the same, but feel way better then the current beam, since the eidolon teralyst uses a gun similar to that very thing.

[(XBOX)GearsMatrix301]

I’m still confused why this is such a big deal for you, if you don’t like the weapon, don’t use it

[SnazzyZ]

Because I passionately care about this bundle as a whole being great, the sentient theme has been my favorite ever since second dream came out, and I know DE is capable of doing completely breathtaking frame bundle releases, they did it especially with Octavia and Harrow as their weapons felt thematically perfect and also were very new experiences. Phantasma does not fit thematically to me, nor does it strike me as impressive or new in the slightest. 

[(XBOX)GearsMatrix301]

10 minutes ago, PolarFall said:

Because I passionately care about this bundle as a whole being great, the sentient theme has been my favorite ever since second dream came out, and I know DE is capable of doing completely breathtaking frame bundle releases, they did it especially with Octavia and Harrow as their weapons felt thematically perfect and also were very new experiences. Phantasma does not fit thematically to me, nor does it strike me as impressive or new in the slightest. 

I mean technically the giant Nikana was supposed to be the the big draw of his weapons.

[Guest]

Is it just me or all laser shotguns have ammo issues? From watching Reb play, it did seem like the Phantasma had to reload quite often.

Phage and Convectrix eat through a magazine in no time. When Phage was considered a rifle, it never had those issues.

Edited August 18, 2018 by Guest

[Robolaser]

I'm quite disappointed too after seeing it in action, tbh. There's so many aesthetic possibilities for an energy/laser/plasma/whatever shotgun, and they just chose to make it look like it's shooting low pressure colored water 😞

That feels weak, not very shotgun-ey, and indeed as others pointed out, doesn't match the gun's design (which i like a lot) AT ALL. Needs some visual improvement to make it more fitting and punchy imo, if not a completely different shooting mechanism.

Edited August 18, 2018 by Robolaser

[SnazzyZ]

21 minutes ago, (XB1)GearsMatrix301 said:

I mean technically the giant Nikana was supposed to be the the big draw of his weapons.

I don’t see that as any reason to give such little attention to his gun, in other releases the entire bundles have been very appealing. Harrow had scourge and knel which were both wonderful and drew in people while fitting his theme and design. Nidus had Hema and Hirudo and etc, there’s no reason to justify a weapon being lack luster for that reason and with the katana not shipping with revenant it’s even more important that the gun be able to hold up without it. 

[(XBOX)GearsMatrix301]

27 minutes ago, PolarFall said:

I don’t see that as any reason to give such little attention to his gun, in other releases the entire bundles have been very appealing. Harrow had scourge and knel which were both wonderful and drew in people while fitting his theme and design. Nidus had Hema and Hirudo and etc, there’s no reason to justify a weapon being lack luster for that reason and with the katana not shipping with revenant it’s even more important that the gun be able to hold up without it. 

Scourge wasn’t that great. I want my giant sword. Discussion over.

[SnazzyZ]

36 minutes ago, (XB1)GearsMatrix301 said:

Scourge wasn’t that great. I want my giant sword. Discussion over.

It synergized with knel and harrow amazingly, and by itself is a grineer melter and incredible support weapon with its status. I’ll still be here listening to what more people have to say on the matter, have a good day. 

[SnazzyZ]

3 hours ago, Robolaser said:

I'm quite disappointed too after seeing it in action, tbh. There's so many aesthetic possibilities for an energy/laser/plasma/whatever shotgun, and they just chose to make it look like it's shooting low pressure colored water 😞

That feels weak, not very shotgun-ey, and indeed as others pointed out, doesn't match the gun's design (which i like a lot) AT ALL. Needs some visual improvement to make it more fitting and punchy imo, if not a completely different shooting mechanism.

They could honestly recycle the sounds and projectile from the teralysts arm cannon as a placeholder if changing it in a week fully is too much, that way it could still drop next and then be visually updated like they did helminth chargers 

[SnazzyZ]

Having it function and use the same sound effects and scaled down projectiles like this would fit it WAY better, and honestly would be a complete blast to use.

[SnazzyZ]

An additional thought to a better way it could function, could be that when you hold down LMB you begin charging, and when you let go it fires a flak style scatter if you simply click and release and when you fully charge it will condense them all into a single larger more accurate blast.

[ExcaliburUmbra]

I’m trying to withhold judgement until I have the weapon in my grubby Tenno mitts but I still kinda agree with you OP. The effects shown on the Phantasma seem underwhelming in comparison to the weaponry the Eidolon sentients have showcased. I would have preferred a burst of Teralyst arm cannon styled projectiles, or maybe a rotating cone of Gantulyst styled laser beams. 

[SnazzyZ]

9 minutes ago, OmegaZero633 said:

I’m trying to withhold judgement until I have the weapon in my grubby Tenno mitts but I still kinda agree with you OP. The effects shown on the Phantasma seem underwhelming in comparison to the weaponry the Eidolon sentients have showcased. I would have preferred a burst of Teralyst arm cannon styled projectiles, or maybe a rotating cone of Gantulyst styled laser beams. 

Given how unlikely it is for the gun to have major changes like this AFTER release, is why I’m passionately trying to give these opinions now, it just doesn’t give any indication of being all that enjoyable since it’s basically ignis 2.0 from what we’ve seen. Eidolon cannon would be something new and hype to play around with. 

[--RV--arm4geddon-117]

All my hype went poof as soon as i saw that gun in action i can get along with how the ignis and atomos etc work due to their nature, but on a shotgun that firing mode is a big no no, i like pellets or plasma bursts, not beams on a shotgun.

beside that i wish that gun wasn't even a shotgun but a rifle firing plasma rounds or stuff like that...

such a pity

 

[SnazzyZ]

2 minutes ago, arm4geddon-117 said:

All my hype went poof as soon as i saw that gun in action i can get along with how the ignis and atomos etc work due to their nature, but on a shotgun that firing mode is a big no no, i like pellets or plasma bursts, not beams on a shotgun.

beside that i wish that gun wasn't even a shotgun but a rifle firing plasma rounds or stuff like that...

such a pity

 

Same, when I saw the model at tennocon and the description of it as “revenant shotgun” I expected something so much more exciting, I expect an eidolon themed shotgun to have at least some kind of “kick” to it, where simply firing the thing makes you feel good about it regardless of stats, not feel like I turned on the microwave with a more wispy ignis/atomos beam (that’s what the sound reminded me of) 

[Almighty_Jado]

For some reason I was expecting the Phantasma to be a burst fire shotgun.

Imagine: pull the trigger and unleash 3 volleys of laser bolts in a typical shotgun spread pattern. That’d Be pretty cool to watch and use..

[BloodAppraiser]

Imao I really think we should judge how phantasma works after we've got our hands on it. The footage shown to us on the stream did not reveal the build they're using (It might even be unmodded, muwhahaha). So we don't really know how effective it actually is against high level content. Who knows? It might be OP as hell (I hope), but we'll have to wait and see.

[Loza03]

1 hour ago, BloodAppraiser said:

Imao I really think we should judge how phantasma works after we've got our hands on it. The footage shown to us on the stream did not reveal the build they're using (It might even be unmodded, muwhahaha). So we don't really know how effective it actually is against high level content. Who knows? It might be OP as hell (I hope), but we'll have to wait and see.

It's not the effectiveness we're upset about.

It's the feel. It's a plasma cloud that doesn't even come out of most of the barrels (2-9 depending on what you count as a 'barrel' on a laser weapon) on a weapon themed to a group of enemies known for big, punchy attacks that they mostly have to physically stop and wind up to do. This weapon doesn't even have recoil. Obviously, most ideas can't have that same level of punch as an Eidolon's attack, but not having any of the same feel is a disappointment.

It also has little, if anything, to do with Vampires either, so it can't even go there.

Edit: it could even fire one bullet of an Eidolon gun at a time that explodes on impact using similar mechanics to the Astilla. But more powerful and with slower fire rate, semi-auto instead of full auto and with higher recoil. Those two guns are from opposite sides of the same conflict, the same battle - it'd be thematic and extremely cool that the two weapons would be similar, but opposed.

Edited August 24, 2018 by Loza03
Addition.

[ExcaliburUmbra]

1 hour ago, BloodAppraiser said:

Imao I really think we should judge how phantasma works after we've got our hands on it. The footage shown to us on the stream did not reveal the build they're using (It might even be unmodded, muwhahaha). So we don't really know how effective it actually is against high level content. Who knows? It might be OP as hell (I hope), but we'll have to wait and see.

Even if it ends up being the strongest primary in the game, I doubt I’ll use it if it only has the mechanics shown in the devstream. My issue stems from the fact that it is an Eidolon-inspired shotgun yet DE chose to make it a fairly standard-looking status beam weapon. You look at enemies, pull the trigger and do your damage-ticks. Sure beam weapons are strong but I find them among some of the most boring weapons to use due to their mechanics and effects.

If the Phantasma ends up having a neat alt-fire or gameplay mechanic besides the above then I will happily eat my crow, but until then I will assume the worst while hoping for something better.

[LightningsVengance]

I think a way to make some more people happy would be to have the center shoot a beam and then alt fire to shoot a whole, powerful Sentient laser round at once (or something, I could be completely wrong) Alt fire is an answer...

[SnazzyZ]

51 minutes ago, LightningsVengance said:

I think a way to make some more people happy would be to have the center shoot a beam and then alt fire to shoot a whole, powerful Sentient laser round at once (or something, I could be completely wrong) Alt fire is an answer...

They could change the visual effects of the current “cloud” of plasma into more of a plasma beam, and move it over to alt fire as a “use everything left in the mag as a beam” and the main fire be individual shots like the teralyst gun like Loza suggested. So far it doesn’t seem like many people are happy at all with the weapon how it is.