So, Garuda's Crossbow....

[Nesodos]

17 minutes ago, Padre_Akais said:

Actually, if you want to know the truth, I think of people who chase Metas like you do as serving a much needed function in this game.

People like you min/max an item, use it everywhere, and get it nerfed in the process.

Put simply, You curb powercreep just by doing what you do.

...That doesn't mean you need to ask for powercreep from the get-go though.

Folks want a single shot X-Bow...Got it.

You want a single shot X-Bow with insane crit/ damage and room wipe functionality 'cuz  anything less is Trash and MR fodder and because the Meta crowd needs that.

...And you wonder why I'm calling it Edgy? Really?!?

You run along and play bud...Try not to cut yourself on your keyboard.

Lovely how you jump to conclusions again.

In fact, I use the meta as little as possible as long i don't have to bring enough efficiency to not be dead weight to my team.
Heck, my most used primary weapon is g'damn quanta with 5.6% in roughly 1,4k playtime and that thing never even saw a forma!

I even bet you have more min maxed meta stuff than I do.

[Rakosta_Kai]

29 minutes ago, Nesodos said:

Lovely how you jump to conclusions again.

You keep saying that....I do not think the term"jumping to conclusions" means what you think it does.

See below...

This is you referencing the Zhuge↓

8 hours ago, Nesodos said:

Too bad nobody is using it

This is you referencing the proposed new Crossbow ↓

5 hours ago, Nesodos said:

Give it stats like rubico prime with 1 shot and 1,5 sec reload, a nice alt fire with aoe and its a good addition to the arsenal

This is your stated opinion on the Daikyu, Crossbows, and what you want the new Proposed Crossbow to be↓

5 hours ago, Nesodos said:

Daikyu is trash because of the low crit chance and horrendous rof

We don't have a good crossbow yet, its time for one that can be used along meta builds

...No jumping required.

On Point: 

To @Kerberos-3, My apologies for the de-rail.

I don't take issue with your idea and hope DE considers it in future designs.

Edited October 27, 2018 by Padre_Akais

[Nesodos]

24 minutes ago, Padre_Akais said:

You keep saying that....I do not think the term"jumping to conclusions" means what you think it does.

See below...

This is you referencing the Zhuge↓

This is you referencing the proposed new Crossbow ↓

This is your stated opinion on the Daikyu, Crossbows, and what you want the new Proposed Crossbow to be↓

...No jumping required.

On Point: 

To @Kerberos-3, My apologies for the de-rail.

I don't take issue with your idea and hope DE considers it in future designs.

The fact that you immediately attacked me because i wanted something thats useable for high tier (without offering my soul to the full forma devil) says otherwise

Lets face it; crossbows are currently too clunky to be considered above "it works but if that grineer over there eats one more protein bar then i'm screwed" without a good chunk of forma and a riven and thats why none of them is used for serious endgame content. Daikyu has more punch but is a status bow (quite a paradox considering its the slowest of them all) thats outclassed by many other weapons. No one is using them BECAUSE there is always a more reliable choice thats easier to use with more benefits. They either need a buff or more variety or they will never come out of the dark corner they are hiding in right now

 

And even now after this discussion, its still more likely that YOU use more meta builds than I do... (meaning that your aggressive rant about meta people is ill placed)

[KodokunaSora]

@Nesodos  thats your opinion on things, everyone has a different playstyle, not everything needs to be meta, just something to enjoy and have fun, its that enough?? i know you want to have soemthing high tier  but, for that i did say wait for attica prime and ask that, because it did destroy room for improvemente for a prime and creativity on just raw numbers, numbers are important but arent everything remember that, most ppl just want have fun.

 

Regarding the OP that is a great idea it did feel classy and it would be great addition to warframe something fresh and new to explore ^^

[seprent]

re looking it over on the dev stream its clip is on the under barrel so its a spring clip fed compound cross bow

from seeing rebecca shoot id make a educated guess it has a blend of crit and status maybe 22% on both maybe 25% maybe a basic x2 crit multi with a lean on puncture and slash 

this all just my estimations im probably wrong some where but thats what i see looking over the vod time of the crossbow in action  a little annoyed Steve asked to see the alt fire (implying there is one) and Rebecca didn't do it personally id like to see a charge like the staticor and make it one powerful piercing bolt or a burst fire 

[LordOfScrugging]

I would love a bolt action rifle. not a sybaris or grinlok or anything, like an actual bolt action. 

[spirit_of_76]

10 minutes ago, LordOfScrugging said:

I would love a bolt action rifle. not a sybaris or grinlok or anything, like an actual bolt action. 

the closest this game will have to that is the vectice.  the syberis and grinlock are lever action.  the same goes for their pistol variants but I don't know if they are SBRs or it the primary variants are pistol caliber carbines

[Rakosta_Kai]

47 minutes ago, Nesodos said:

The fact that you immediately attacked me because i wanted something thats useable for high tier (without offering my soul to the full forma devil) says otherwise

1. I haven't attacked you... You opted to take offense and sling insults.

2. If I really wanted to attack you... I could. There's plenty to poke at in your comments. 

I don't see a good reason though...It's simpler to point out the fallacies in your reasoning.

The fact that I found your commentary to be edgy is nothing for you to take offense at...Your commentary is edgy. 

47 minutes ago, Nesodos said:

Lets face it; crossbows are currently too clunky to be considered above "it works but if that grineer over there eats one more protein bar then i'm screwed" without a good chunk of forma and a riven and thats why none of them is used for serious endgame content. Daikyu has more punch but is a status bow (quite a paradox considering its the slowest of them all) thats outclassed by many other weapons. No one is using them BECAUSE there is always a more reliable choice thats easier to use with more benefits. They either need a buff or more variety or they will never come out of the dark corner they are hiding in right now

If we strip the hyperbole off off this we get...

Crossbows are bad. Well, that's just not true...The Zhuge and the Attica are both excellent weapons regardless of the content. It doesn't have to be the highest DPS weapon in the game to be good.

Daikyu is bad. It's a niche weapon. Perhaps you aren't in that niche?

You subscribe to Metas. I, otoh, do not.

47 minutes ago, Nesodos said:

And even now after this discussion, its still more likely that YOU use more meta builds than I do... (meaning that your aggressive rant about meta people is ill placed)

This is now the 2nd time you went to that well and I ignored it the first time because whataboutisms tend to be the sign that the person has nothing pertinent left to say.

But...

Yes, With absolutely no evidence to arrive at this conclusion, I must follow Metas(/s)... Based on what exactly?

If you decided to go poking around in my profile, you'd have found my most used frame being Rhino...What you wouldn't see is that my most forma'd weapon is the Strun.

Not the Strun Wraith...The Strun.

_{Hint: I don't follow Metas.}

[DatDarkOne]

8 hours ago, Nesodos said:

Tigris is a shotgun with godly damage, fast reload with 2 shots, hitscan bullets and no forced wind up

You make strange comparisons for someone complaining about meta weaponry

The tigris series are all status weapons that you basically have to reload after every shot.  It happens to do high damage.  

Now when you look at it as it really is, it's very similar to the Daikyu.  With the major differences being the later is better at range and requires you to actually aim to hit stuff.  

So to say one is weak while saying the other is strong is funny to me.  But then again I can understand how some people might find aiming to be difficult and would prefer the tigris series.  

Which makes me wonder why you even want a weapon that is basically is nothing more than a hitscan Daikyu/Dread hybrid.  That what the OP is requesting in this topic.  

Nevermind, I don't really want to know.  

[spirit_of_76]

19 minutes ago, DatDarkOne said:

The tigris series are all status weapons that you basically have to reload after every shot.  It happens to do high damage.  

Now when you look at it as it really is, it's very similar to the Daikyu.  With the major differences being the later is better at range and requires you to actually aim to hit stuff.  

So to say one is weak while saying the other is strong is funny to me.  But then again I can understand how some people might find aiming to be difficult and would prefer the tigris series.  

 Which makes me wonder why you even want a weapon that is basically is nothing more than a hitscan Daikyu/Dread hybrid.  That what the OP is requesting in this topic.  

Nevermind, I don't really want to know.

5

this is inherently wrong

while both are slow firing high damage weapons with the potential for 100% status.  the Tigris is slash based while the daikyu is puncture based (barely)
the biggest difference is projectiles per unit time.  the Tigris is a SHOTGUN and fires BUCKSHOT the daikyu is a bow (and a slow one at that).  
this means that the Tigris can apply multiple statuses per shot the daikyu can only apply one.  even assuming the same fire rate the Tigris will apply more status that the daikyu because it is a shotgun that uses buckshot. 
there is a reason that most slow firing single shot weapons are only good if they have a lot of crit.  take the rubrico it has 180 base damage the second lowest of all snipers but has the best crit of all snipers with one of the best scope modifiers in the game.  it is one of the most meta snipers after the vectice Prime for it's reliability.  the daikyu lacks the reliability there is a reason that the vulcar wraith is not considered that good and that is the abysmal crit chance that it has with 50% after point strike the second lowest of all snipers only the lanka has a lower crit chance but that is because it has additive crit on the scope giving the highest crit at full zoom.  

TLDR status only works if it is done in a large volume crit is just more damage

[DatDarkOne]

29 minutes ago, spirit_of_76 said:

this is inherently wrong

I made that post to show how the specific description that was given actually fit both weapons.  

If someone is going to use such a broad general description and not go into the details, then I'm going to call them on it by using that same general description.  

29 minutes ago, spirit_of_76 said:

this means that the Tigris can apply multiple statuses per shot the daikyu can only apply one.  even assuming the same fire rate the Tigris will apply more status that the daikyu because it is a shotgun that uses buckshot. 

Not that I disagree with the logic of your full post.  I just have to inform you of something you might not have known.  The Daikyu actually gets 3 status procs per shot.  Two normally and 3 with added multishot all with it's easy to get to 100% status.  It innately always procs Stun as a special ability, and that's how it ends up with 3 procs.  

29 minutes ago, spirit_of_76 said:

TLDR status only works if it is done in a large volume crit is just more damage

I know exactly how it works.  It's the main reason I do more hybrid builds, aim for headshots, and crit multipliers.  People that follow the "meta" of corrosive don't usually realize how crit damage effects statuses like bleed, toxin, and gas.  It's how I can use a single Gas Daikyu headshot to kill groups of enemies.  😁 

Edited October 28, 2018 by DatDarkOne
slight corrections

[spirit_of_76]

3 minutes ago, DatDarkOne said:

Not that I disagree with your logic of you full post.  I just have to inform you of something you might not have known.  The Daikyu actually gets 3 status procs per shot.  Two normally and 3 with added multishot all with it's easy to get to 100% status.  It innately always procs Stun as a special ability, and that's how it ends up with 3 procs.  

this is an up to 3 rounds unlike the 270% pelets that the tigus gets.  I know that damage affects some of the statuses but not all.  while gas might be good against the corpus it is not armor immune nor it the Diakyu slash based.  also for single target I would recommend viral

[DatDarkOne]

16 minutes ago, spirit_of_76 said:

this is an up to 3 rounds unlike the 270% pelets that the tigus gets.  I know that damage affects some of the statuses but not all.  while gas might be good against the corpus it is not armor immune nor it the Diakyu slash based.  also for single target I would recommend viral

Your recommendation is noted, but wouldn't achieve the goal I was going for.  Which the AoE of Gas allows, and does Toxin procs for damage over time.  Most forget that aspect of it.    .  Just like how putting Argon Scope on the Daikyu or any other slower RoF fire weapon isn't as good in actual practice as Warframe Builder and the "Meta" lead most to think.    Testing things in missions is the key to really understanding why certain things work.  

 

Edit: I keep referring to the Daikyu, because it's the closest thing we have in game to what OP is requesting with a few exceptions of course.  😄

Edited October 28, 2018 by DatDarkOne

[Zeclem]

crossbows arent good for endgame content? yeah sure, if you are a failure at building them properly. both of those weapons are very much meta worthy lol. 

[spirit_of_76]

kinda but what he said is more like a vectice 

[DatDarkOne]

1 minute ago, Zeclem said:

crossbows arent good for endgame content? yeah sure, if you are a failure at building them properly.

That's the thing.  Some don't.  They tend to build them like they would a Soma Prime type and then wonder why they underperform.  LOL.  For example, I've seen Dread builds that had Hunter's Munitions in them when it's redundant on that weapon.  

[LupisV0lk]

12 hours ago, Nesodos said:

Daikyu is trash because of the low crit chance and horrendous rof

LOL of course it has a low crit chance, it's a clemming Status bow you simpleton.

[Greenshockclaw]

On 2018-10-26 at 4:41 PM, (XB1)Kuljack said:

I thought the most requested weapon was a semi-auto launcher gun that fired replicated spinning copies of your equipped melee.

 

It'd be really cool to have something like the black ops 2 crossbow, explosive bolts with innate punchthrough and a 3 bolt spread shot as an alt fire

[Nesodos]

Its hillarious to see a bunch of people who don't read the comments carefully and then go about how i am bound to the meta because I said we need a crossbow that can be used with meta stuff.

If you want to reread it:

20 hours ago, Nesodos said:

We don't have a good crossbow yet, its time for one that can be used along meta builds

Same as I wrote later that I actually like to use crossbows and bows in general and never said I hug the meta.(because asking for a top tier weapon is considered a sin now?)

14 hours ago, JellalOuma said:

@Nesodos  thats your opinion on things, everyone has a different playstyle, not everything needs to be meta, just something to enjoy and have fun, its that enough??

 

There is a clear difference between a duplex shotgun with fast reload that easily shreds endgame content without a good build and a bow with long wind up that needs a very specific build to work in appropiate manner against the same content.

9 hours ago, DatDarkOne said:

So to say one is weak while saying the other is strong is funny to me.  But then again I can understand how some people might find aiming to be difficult and would prefer the tigris series. 

 

If you would have read the discussion then you would have seen that I already said that its a status weapon...(Its on the same page, genius)

7 hours ago, LupisV0lk said:

LOL of course it has a low crit chance, it's a clemming Status bow you simpleton.

 

If you would have done the same then you would have found my most used frame being zephyr, the old zephyr and my most forma'd weapon is a mara detron with 4(because its fun), followed up by sicarus p (without riven) and attica with 2 fromas each

13 hours ago, Padre_Akais said:

If you decided to go poking around in my profile, you'd have found my most used frame being Rhino...What you wouldn't see is that my most forma'd weapon is the Strun.

Not the Strun Wraith...The Strun.

_{Hint: I don't follow Metas.}

Btw, Rhino was survival/cc meta for quite a while and is now pretty common in eidolon hunts for the dmg buff

[Rakosta_Kai]

2 hours ago, Nesodos said:

Btw, Rhino was survival/cc meta for quite a while and is now pretty common in eidolon hunts for the dmg buff

I don't follow metas so I wouldn't know bud....But I'll defer to you on that piece because you, clearly, do.

...Hearing that Rhino defines metas is news to me.

Here's some advice:

If you aren't someone that follows metas, then stop keyboard thugging like you are....It's pretentious.

If you feel that you need the crutch of a weapon with top tier stats to complete what you feel is the meta for content....You may need to learn how to mod.

Understand that if you have such a knowledge gap you very well might not see it (evidenced in your most recent response)

There are, at least, 2 people in this thread, I can think of, who've discussed builds in the past that weren't meta and made use of all kinds of combinations (with and without arcanes) that the average Meta player could never make sense of because random youtuber didn't build it that way.

So If you need help...Just ask for it and someone will help.

Slinging around terms like Trash. MR Fodder, etc is certainly an opinion you have every right to, and suggests that it's an informed opinion, even if it isn't correct.

...Then everybody has to work to correct mis-information as opposed to actually help you.

That wastes time and obscures from the point of the thread.

...OP wants them to add a single shot x-bow.

Not an unreasonable request, all things being equal...Physics exist for it. I have no doubt they have crossbow design iterations squirreled away for their next inspiration.

Given the number of available blandishments for bows, It can be middle of the road stat wise and will do endgame...If the player is good.

If they gave it sniper scope functions and bonuses, even middle of the road stats for bows would likely make it one of the stronger snipers in the game.

 

 

[Zeclem]

12 hours ago, DatDarkOne said:

That's the thing.  Some don't.  They tend to build them like they would a Soma Prime type and then wonder why they underperform.  LOL.  For example, I've seen Dread builds that had Hunter's Munitions in them when it's redundant on that weapon.  

but its not even hard to get a proper build for zhuge. 🤦‍♂️

but then ive seen this community do dumber things quite often.

Edited October 28, 2018 by Zeclem

[Nesodos]

1 hour ago, Padre_Akais said:

If you aren't someone that follows metas, then stop keyboard thugging like you are....It's pretentious.

Some advice from me; stop slinging around assumptions and the stereotypes next time, it makes you look like a giant #$&(%.

 

1 hour ago, Padre_Akais said:

If you feel that you need the crutch of a weapon with top tier stats to complete what you feel is the meta for content....You may need to learn how to mod.

Understand that if you have such a knowledge gap you very well might not see it (evidenced in your most recent response)

Don't worry, I know how to mod but without the "meta" mods (your rejection for meta stuff is well evidenced in this thread btw) you seem to hate so much they are always falling behind other weapons that are easier to use and grant more benefit.
While this might be the bane of most unique weapons we have right now its still bad to kill any ideas of improvement or new additions that offer greater variation for endgame content.
Guess what, the world isn't just black or white. Some people enjoy to use niche weapons on high level content, why can't we have one that can compete with the meta?

 

1 hour ago, Padre_Akais said:

There are, at least, 2 people in this thread, I can think of, who've discussed builds in the past that weren't meta and made use of all kinds of combinations (with and without arcanes) that the average Meta player could never make sense of because random youtuber didn't build it that way.

They didn't discuss builds, they only mentioned that different weapons need different builds(duh) and that these weapons get very good with a warframe synergy (like all the other weapons that perform even better with synergies...)
I don't follow these youtube idiots because 1) they aren't very smart and 2) I have better things to do than watch people on youtube

 

Reading the thread again, it looks like that at the beginning of this discussion you immediately jumped to the conclusion that I am a Meta hugger while your passive aggressive tone did the rest. Now, Mister "Everybody I don't agree with is edgy" I only have one last thing to say:
I never believed the newbies that said the veterans of this game are pretty aggressive in terms of topics they don't agree with, now I know better

Edited October 28, 2018 by Nesodos

[Rakosta_Kai]

 

1 hour ago, Nesodos said:

Don't worry, I know how to mod but without the "meta" mods

...All evidence to the contrary based on your comments to date regarding modding.

See? ↓

1 hour ago, Nesodos said:

Guess what, the world isn't just black or white. Some people enjoy to use niche weapons on high level content, why can't we have one that can compete with the meta?

↑→ Knowledge Gap.

1 hour ago, Nesodos said:

They didn't discuss builds

...You mean they didn't discuss builds here.

Even that wouldn't be entirely true though as @DatDarkOne definitely dropped some food for thought....Instead, what you had was insults.

1 hour ago, Nesodos said:

Reading the thread again, it looks like that at the beginning of this discussion you immediately jumped to the conclusion that I am a Meta hugger while your passive aggressive tone did the rest. Now, Mister "Everybody I don't agree with is edgy" I only have one last thing to say:
I never believed the newbies that said the veterans of this game are pretty aggressive in terms of topics they don't agree with, now I know better

I've already shown in detail why there has been no need for me to "jump" to anything bud.

So you are a newbie?...That explains so much!.

Welcome (back?) to the game!

...Imma guess all that edgy commentary was just you trying to not look new.

It's OK to be new bud...Try not to keep your cup so full you can't learn stuff though.

If you have anything else to say to me...Send it to me privately please.

That way you don't keep derailing a relevant thread.

[Nesodos]

4 minutes ago, Padre_Akais said:

 

...All evidence to the contrary based on your comments to date regarding modding.

See? ↓

↑→ Knowledge Gap.

...You mean they didn't discuss builds here.

Even that wouldn't be entirely true though as @DatDarkOne definitely dropped some food for thought....Instead, what you had was insults.

I've already shown in detail why there has been no need for me to "jump" to anything bud.

So you are a newbie?...That explains so much!.

Welcome (back?) to the game!

...Imma guess all that edgy commentary was just you trying to not look new.

It's OK to be new bud...Try not to keep your cup so full you can't learn stuff though.

If you have anything else to say to me...Send it to me privately please.

That way you don't keep derailing a relevant thread.

Now please stop cherrypicking your "evidence" and come down from your imaginary high horse.

First thing; just because they discussed builds somewhere out there in the ether doesn't mean its relevant for this discussion. Its right that they talked about some damage types here but not about builds.

Secondly your "evidence" shows nothing more than you either can't read or refuse to and where in the comment is the insult you mentioned?(don't answer, I don't care anymore)

Third: I am constantly playing since Gradivus and your derogatory tone in this conversation is a clear evidence that YOU are the one who tries to derail.

I won't write anything more on this thread because you will most likely pull more irrelevant nonsense full of your "i am best" attitude out of your uranus and, ofc, to let this "relevant thread" (that popped up in Fan concepts countless of times in similar forms already) run without further interventions.