Updating Older Prime frame Stats

[DarkSaint_Exile]

Basically after seeing Atlas Prime's stats compared to the Atlas base model, seeing old weapons get a buff, and all the reworks being done on older frames I was hoping we could start talking about reworking Ash Prime, Ember Prime, Frost Prime, Loki Prime, etc.... What other frames need some love? Who else wants to see it get done?

[(XBOX)GearsMatrix301]

Frost prime needs his stats updated something fierce.

[ES-Flinter]

vor 2 Stunden schrieb Dark_Logiq88:

Basically after seeing Atlas Prime's stats compared to the Atlas base model, seeing old weapons get a buff, and all the reworks being done on older frames I was hoping we could start talking about reworking Ash Prime, Ember Prime, Frost Prime, Loki Prime, etc.... What other frames need some love? Who else wants to see it get done?

The normal Ash needs a stat. change, too. He is more tankier than oberon.

[(XBOX)GearsMatrix301]

15 minutes ago, ES-Flinter said:

The normal Ash needs a stat. change, too. He is more tankier than oberon.

Last I checked Oberon can give himself over 400 additional armor and as well as a passive healing overtime. As well as having more armor than Ash. So how is Ash tankier than Oberon.

[Tiltskillet]

Just Frost Prime and Loki Prime, I think.  I don't think Atlas Prime's increases need to be the new standard.

[ES-Flinter]

vor 3 Stunden schrieb (XB1)GearsMatrix301:

Last I checked Oberon can give himself over 400 additional armor and as well as a passive healing overtime. As well as having more armor than Ash. So how is Ash tankier than Oberon.

You're right, Oberon Prime is much more tankier than Ash Prime. But I'm talking about the stats (Armor, life, shield, energy, sprint-speed, Effective health points [short: EHP]) of a frame and not about a complete frame (stats+ Skills).^^

Compare Ash stats with the of Oberon. Theoretically Ash Prime would survive more hits than Oberon Prime. Just look at the following table/ diagram.

(Sorry, was to lazy to translate from german to English.) Rüstung = armor; Schadens-reduktion= damage-reduction; rest sounds similar enough.

Crazy that a frame like Ash Prime who shouldn't get hit has the 11th highest EHP ingame...

Edited October 14, 2019 by ES-Flinter

[Tatann]

Ash's invisibility is a panic button, and since his rework, a way to reduce the cost of his 4.

But otherwise you can play him as a space ninja, so full "in your face" melee, especially with the combo Nikana / Daiku (amalgam mod for life steal)

So it's a good thing you can (but don't have to) build him for decent EHP. 

My most used config usually is Primed Vigor only (to be able to put 3 augments and have some fun), but I also have an Umbra build with Adaptation and Primed Vigor (I get about 1900 HP, 700 shield and 420 armor IIRC) for my melee build

What annoys me the most is indeed the health and energy pool of Frost Prime, he only has double the armor of Ash and the same amount of ExcalUmbra while being slow. He should get at least 350-400 armor and 125 base health (375 at rank 30)

[ES-Flinter]

vor 3 Stunden schrieb Tatann:

Ash's invisibility is a panic button, and since his rework, a way to reduce the cost of his 4.

Small stagger radius/ duration, not recastable and 8 seconds to run to safety. Yep definitely a panic button. And I was so an Idiot to use teleport to avoid the one or the other explosion. And sometimes I even use his fourth ability just because the enemies will target my clones instead of me.

vor 3 Stunden schrieb Tatann:

So it's a good thing you can (but don't have to) build him for decent EHP. 

Yes and no. Because it's always good to have more than just one playstyle. But in Ash situation it's more the question what is he? He have the stats of a tank (11th highest EHP from over 40 warframes) and his primed version look more armored than Oberon (Prime) and Frost (Prime). But he use the typical skills of a ninja (turning invisible, smoke bombs, shurikens, teleport and a very concentrated Assasination skill).

In the end Ash skills work against his stats. Why should he need life points if he can just avoid them? Why is his energy pool so low compared to all other frames who can turn invisible? Why is he slower than a clown, even if ninjas are famous to be faster than their own shadow?

 

@Dark_Logiq88, sorry for drifting to much into Ash problems. ^^

[Tatann]

Like I said, and like you said, it's good to have more than one playstyle. His stats allow you but doesn't force you to invest in tanking.

You can build for a bit of duration (200%) and slap Vitality or Primed Vigor (or 2 Umbra mods) and you get enough survivability of just one mod slot, leaving room for augments. You'll be able to take a few shots before you use his 2.

Or you can go full tank and only use his 2 in rare occasions.

I know Ash is a great assassin, but to me, he definitely looks like the Predator (let's imagine his 4 allows you to mark targets with a red triangle), and you know what, the Predator is kinda tough for a stealth character ;-)