Feedback: Titania rework. (Devstream updated)

[(XBOX)MarakViriPlays]

@zhellon

2 hours ago, zhellon said:

I want archwings to be worthless.

Such hatred for an optional mechanic.

2 hours ago, zhellon said:

Wuclone costs nothing now and there are no problems with it and nobody considers it strong.

Celestial Twin isn't an ultimate ability, it is not an exalted ability, and it does not change any gameplay mechanics. It's basically a Venari, or a Metamorphosis clone. Also, as far as I'm aware, it still costs 25 energy to create him. And, in case you haven't noticed, every exalted ability in the game has a drain cost, but some have no initial cost, such as Balefire Charger. Also, you do have the option of not staying in Razorwing for long periods, which helps mitigate the drain by a substantial amount.

Also, Wuclone is the best AI ability in the game, so a lot of people consider it strong.

@nooneyouknow13 Yes, and the status shedding ability of Spellbind and it's immunities are in Refuge as well.

Razorwing Blitz is a GREAT augment, but not the best in the game. Perhaps the best in your play style, but Desecrate is an amazing augment, Ironclad Charge is an amazing augment, Safeguard is an amazing augment. It all depends on which frame you prefer, and which playstyle you prefer to use them in.

"Most Passives aren't particularly useful"? Are you high?

Ash, Atlas, Banshee, Baruuk, Excalibur, Garuda, Gauss, Grendel, Hildryn, Inaros, Limbo, Mesa, Nekros, Nidus, Octavia, Saryn, Trinity, Valkyr, Vauban, Volt, Wisp, And Wukong.  That's 22 of 43 frames, and they have amazing passives, even if a few could use a bit of tweaking.

Edited November 12, 2019 by (XB1)MarakViriPlays
Because ... Reasons?

[selig_fay]

16 минут назад, (XB1)MarakViriPlays сказал:

Celestial Twin isn't an ultimate ability, it is not an exalted ability, and it does not change any gameplay mechanics. It's basically a Venari, or a Metamorphosis clone. Also, as far as I'm aware, it still costs 25 energy to create him. And, in case you haven't noticed, every exalted ability in the game has a drain cost, but some have no initial cost, such as Balefire Charger. Also, you do have the option of not staying in Razorwing for long periods, which helps mitigate the drain by a substantial amount.

Also, Wuclone is the best AI ability in the game, so a lot of people consider it strong.

The problem is that Wuclone is a full-fledged combat mechanic. You can also control his weapons. Saryn also has powerful mechanics and it costs 25 energy. My hatred is obvious, why should I pay 5 energy / s for a normal flight that yields nothing on a normal mission? Because it's funny? You can argue that Dexteria has high damage, that razorfly have aggression, but revenant has high damage and aggression, and it doesn't have a drain issue. All the more, we conducted DPS tests and Titania far not Queen DPS, because Saryn with use of 3 ability to and augment on first ability to and conventional weapons betrays simply huge figures.

Remove the energy drain and let play with conventional weapons in archwing mode. Is it so hard and OP that can't be implemented? I really don't understand what is the balance of trying to do the players in the background of the passive abilities of invulnerability and invisibility that do not require energy at all.

 

[selig_fay]

20 минут назад, nooneyouknow13 сказал:

I don't see how you can possibly have ~207 hours played on Titania, and not had to dispel multiple status procs from yourself per mission. Or just get into the habit of keeping it up vs infested in general, to deal with toxic ancient auras. Whether you like it or not, Razorwing Blitz is one of the best augments in the game, and Spellbind is both the fastest and most convenient way to stack it. I also don't get the argument that it's poor CC - it's spammable, multi target, and for the Titania player, not exactly hard to track and shoot. It also causes a disarm, so enemies are effectively CC'd even longer than the listed duration, especially if you did send them flying.

It's simple, only magnet and radiation are nasty statuses. The rest can be tolerated.

[(XBOX)MarakViriPlays]

@zhellonIf you want Razorwing to not have an energy drain, then it needs a duration. Because, in every form I've seen provided, it's an exalted weapon. So, either give it a duration, which means you need to recast it in order to maintain, thus still having energy upkeep, or accept that this is how it works. Also, I gave her a 50% Dodge chance. You know, a 59% chance to ignore damage. And you can increase it by keeping your Razorflies alive. You can recover energy REALLY easily too, IF YOU BUILD FOR IT. I have a low efficiency Titania build, and I can manage just fine, because I don't stay in Razorwing indefinitely, but I can probably do it if I had to, and that's with her as she is now. Also, invisibility and invincibility? The only frame that can maintain invisibility with abilities is Ivara, which, you guessed it, has a drain. Both Ash and Loki can stay invisible for a time, but they have to be visible in order to cast the ability, so they can still get killed in those moments. Rhino, the most well known "invincibility" frame, just shunts it off into a separate health pool. Take enough damage and you still die. And hey, can't recast it to maintain it indefinitely either. Valkyr's invincibility, the one that CAN be maintained as long as you have energy, DRAINS energy. That's how abilities work. It either has a duration (whether in time or damage), or drains energy.

11 minutes ago, zhellon said:

It's simple, only magnet and radiation are nasty statuses. The rest can be tolerated

Toxin and Slash are pretty dangerous too, and cold can screw you over if you rely on mobility.

[selig_fay]

2 минуты назад, (XB1)MarakViriPlays сказал:

The only frame that can maintain invisibility with abilities is Ivara, which, you guessed it, has a drain.

Octavia? Wisp?

7 минут назад, (XB1)MarakViriPlays сказал:

Rhino, the most well known "invincibility" frame, just shunts it off into a separate health pool. Take enough damage and you still die. And hey, can't recast it to maintain it indefinitely either. Valkyr's invincibility, the one that CAN be maintained as long as you have energy, DRAINS energy. That's how abilities work. It either has a duration (whether in time or damage), or drains energy.

I was talking about Hildryn. You can give an example with toxin and slash prock, but I solved these problems.

3 минуты назад, (XB1)MarakViriPlays сказал:

Also, I gave her a 50% Dodge chance. You know, a 59% chance to ignore damage.

So what? I'm willing to give it up. It's really not that strong compared to aviator + adaptation, which give invulnerability to a certain type of damage. And at a level above 200, that 59% may or may not work. Either way, it's better to distract enemies with razorfly than take damage and have a 59% chance of not getting oneshot.Personally, I don't want to take a chance. Moreover, I do not want to count on a chance that spends 5 energy/s. How much there baruuk spends?

9 минут назад, (XB1)MarakViriPlays сказал:

That's how abilities work. It either has a duration (whether in time or damage), or drains energy.

Saryn, Wukong, Rhino, Nezha, Baruuk, Wisp. Some of their abilities have no duration and no energy drain. I don't understand the sacred meaning of this. I'm willing to do the mechanics with the meter if needed, but I want the energy drain to go away with the razorwing.

[(XBOX)MarakViriPlays]

46 minutes ago, zhellon said:

Octavia? Wisp?

Octavia's already been admitted, by DE, to be a broken frame, so using her as a comparison is uncounted. But, regardless, she has to cast an ability to do it, and it DOES have a duration. And this is the only invisibility that can be refreshed while already active.

Wisp depends on her being in the air. Although the delay on it allows her to have unlimited invisibility, yes. But she can't shoot, because that makes her visible. Also, if you're unfortunate enough to do a hard landing, you're screwed as well.

46 minutes ago, zhellon said:

I was talking about Hildryn. You can give an example with toxin and slash prock, but I solved these problems.

Umm, Hildryn doesn't receive shield bypassing procs while she has overshields, which she gets with zero trouble, and she has an ability to cancel them. But she can only damage gate once, and then she needs to replenish all of her shields to recharge it. Admittedly, she does this rather easily, and she's near unkillable with Arcane Barriers, but that's build dependant. You know what else is build dependant? Titania's efficiency. But yeah, Magnetic can be a bit of a problem, but you solve it by casting an abilityz so not a big one.

46 minutes ago, zhellon said:

So what? I'm willing to give it up. It's really not that strong compared to aviator + adaptation, which give invulnerability to a certain type of damage. And at a level above 200, that 59% may or may not work. Either way, it's better to distract enemies with razorfly than take damage and have a 59% chance of not getting oneshot.Personally, I don't want to take a chance. Moreover, I do not want to count on a chance that spends 5 energy/s. How much there baruuk spends?

I meant 50, not 59, but ignore that. Yes, it's not as strong as Aviator+Adaptation. Hell, throw on Aerodynamic as well for even more damage reduction. There is a difference between "oh, that hurt less than I thought" and "you missed". At levels where enemies deal 100k+ damage, you want "you missed". And what damage type do they give "invulnerability" to? It gives a very high DR, but you still get 1 shot when enemies deal several hundred thousand damage. And Baruuk spends less, yes. But he doesn't FLY, and he CAN'T ATTACK. Also, consider their design. A magical fairy that casts spells, or a pacifistic monk. 

46 minutes ago, zhellon said:

Saryn, Wukong, Rhino, Nezha, Baruuk, Wisp. Some of their abilities have no duration and no energy drain. I don't understand the sacred meaning of this. I'm willing to do the mechanics with the meter if needed, but I want the energy drain to go away with the razorwing

Saryn : Spores decay if you can't keep enemies infected. Yes, it's easy to do, but it's not, by design, infinite duration. It just has the potential to be.

Wukong : His clone has a health pool, and can die. Yes, you can heal him, but again, that's only potentially infinite duration. And with less potential than Saryn, who maintains it better at higher levels.

Rhino : Iron Skin is a secondary health pool. Nothing more. It can stack to ludicrous levels, giving it ridiculous effective duration, yes, but not infinite. And it's potential for infinite duration is terrible, as it cannot maintain at high levels 

Baruuk : Desolate hands also loses effectiveness of you near enemies, as it disarms them, losing you a dagger. And while it can be recast, thus maintaining it, it gets you swarmed by melee attackers, and you're still very vulnerable to status effects and AoE.

Wisp : A health increase, a speed increase, and a cc, with infinite duration. Yes, this is an infinite duration ability. This is also the ONLY infinite duration ability, and that's dependant on staying near an area. But this is a legitimate point. The only real argument is that this is NOT an exalted ability.

But, excluding ONE ability, all abilities have either duration, or drain. But, since you're against needing efficiency, make the Razorflies following Titania reduce the upkeep cost. Or, for the sake of argument, make it cost a single payment to swap form, but no upkeep, but the energy cost of all other abilities are doubled when in this form.

Edited November 12, 2019 by (XB1)MarakViriPlays
Because ... Reasons?

[selig_fay]

3 минуты назад, (XB1)MarakViriPlays сказал:

But, excluding ONE ability, all abilities have either duration, or drain. But, since you're against needing efficiency, make the Razorflies following Titania reduce the upkeep cost. Or, for the sake of argument, make it cost a single payment to swap form, but no upkeep, but the energy cost of all other abilities are doubled when in this form.

Double the price for the abilities of the razorwing? I really don't worry about it, because if there's no energy drain, I can easily recover my energy. But I really don't understand why it's necessary? 

As I said, Wukong got an ability that costs 25, but actually increases his DPS three times and allows him to do a lot of interesting things. By this I don't understand why I can't get archwing mode without energy with normal weapons and also try to do a lot of interesting things.

Simply, conventional weapons have long been superior to Dex pixia in terms of performance. Here is Titania 155% PS. No rivens were used. I don't want a dps buff, I want a system buff. It's simple. Implement this is not difficult, because it is already in the game. Maybe they run into problems in the form of broken animations, but Titania already has these problems. 

Спойлер

 

 

[(XBOX)MarakViriPlays]

10 minutes ago, zhellon said:

Double the price for the abilities of the razorwing? I really don't worry about it, because if there's no energy drain, I can easily recover my energy. But I really don't understand why it's necessary?

A balancing mechanic. Yes, you can regain your energy, but you need the energy in the first place. Why do most 4th abilities cost 100, since it's easy to regain energy. And yes, it's not a good balancing mechanic, because the good balancing mechanic was the drain that you hate so much. Also, note that Titania effectively gets Archwing in closed-world tilesets. The drain is mostly from the exalted weaponry. Remove those as well and you can probably get rid of the double cost. Heck, give it a duration, but make it recastable, giving effectively infinite duration, with a hold to cast to cancel it. Which is what it seems like you're suggesting now.

10 minutes ago, zhellon said:

As I said, Wukong got an ability that costs 25, but actually increases his DPS three times and allows him to do a lot of interesting things

In Wukong's lore, he shot lasers from his eyes, when he was born, that reached Heaven. He can transform into anything, animate or inanimate, at will. He has several forms of immortality. He pissed on Buddha. His staff reaches the moon.

Considering his lore, that's REALLY tame. But why only complain about him? Mag can multiply her DPS against a single target nearly a thousand fold.

And yes, I think you'll find that Celestial Twin is Wukong's unique mechanic. Just like Titania's is Razorwing, Nidus' is Mutation, Atlas and Rubble, Octavia and Mandachord, Ember and Ignition, Volt and Electric Shield, Equinox' Duality... See where I'm going. Most frames have a unique quirk that gives them an advantage when compared to other frames. I mean, Loki can permanently disarm an entire room. Permanently. There are usually trade offs. Personally, I'm fine with the energy drain, and I quite like the mechanics of Razorwing, though they could do with improvement. Removing the weaponry, and increasing the switch cost to 75 or 100 with a 40 second base duration or something, and making it renewable, would be fine.

[ixidron92]

hace 7 horas, nooneyouknow13 dijo:

Do people not realize you can self cast Spellbind anytime you're near a wall/floor/ceiling for self status immunity?  I just honestly cannot believe I keep seeing feedback that says "No one uses this it doesn't matter lol". It's the go-to for blitz stacking, it's extremely helpful for clearing toxin/bleeds, and prevents a whole crap ton of knockdowns when you have to "carry the thing". Literally any rework of her 1 should keep this effect.

While I'm not fond of tribute currently, I'm also not sure how it "has a high learning curve" - there's no reason to memorize specific units. If it's melee it gives thorns, if it has a gun and isn't a heavy it gives dust, heavies give entable, and pets/robots give full moon.

As far as I would like to see a rework vs just straight buffs:

Passive: It's fine. It's actually very helpful when you have to carry keys and such. Most passives aren't particularly useful anyway.

Spellbind: Rename to Dust, provide the 50% accuracy penalty and status immunity in an aura around Titania.

Tribute: Now causes enemies to drop an item, as if they had been pick pocketed. Collecting the soul/item provides the damage reduction buff from Thorns.

Latern: It still needs better tethering. Otherwise, it's fine.

Razorwing: Ability casts should replace Razorflies.

The myriad of problems with spellbind have already been stated.

First, it overlaps way too much with Lantern. Both are area CC abilities that hurl a small groups of enemies floating.

As a CC ability is pretty bad at what it does compared to well, every other CC ability in Warframe, to the point it's almost counterproductive and a waste of energy.

As a support ability, it's one of the saddest we have. Status effects are incredibly rare. Radiation, Viral and Magnetic are always avoidable, fixed hazards (although the Liches have changed that). Fire is tied to fixed hazards and arson eximus and the only common effects are Toxin from infested gas, slash from grineer weapons and electricity from corpus weapons. Slash and electricity you can avoid, since that's how you play titania, and those are always minor status effects that can be ignored.

Toxin would be the most dangerous one, and even so, you have a built in invulnerability to avoid it by switching to the operator and making your warframe unkillable.

So, we have a very niche ability with a functionality that can be achieved by anyone using an operator and not to mention, you cannot see your allies negative effects, so all you can do is cleanse yours.

That's why my rework idea has this cleanse/immunity thing as a placeable ground area. If allies need cleansing, they can just voluntarily enter there.

Other have also said that spellbind would benefit greatly from being an AoE centered around Titania instead of a targeted spell.

[nooneyouknow13]

1 hour ago, ixidron92 said:

Status effects are incredibly rare.

I feel like we're not even playing the same game. Slash procs are basically a constant at higher levels, and even if Titania doesn't get hit much, almost every time she is hit by grineer a slash proc happens. Status immunity also covers knockdowns, and ragdolls. If you're in razorwing, and have spellbind up, and an Arson Eximus spawns, you get pushed back. If you don't, you get knocked away and have a several second animation where she flails in midair. And while we do have access to operator mode without leaving razorwing now, using it to avoid damage from slash and toxin is time spent not murder pixie-ing things, and damage is only reduced by 90% while a skill is active. Also, you can visually see if your teammates have a slash or toxin proc, but either the blood gushing out of them, or green goo floating around them. Sure, you're not going to be able to dispel every status that comes their way, but you can certainly help. Status immunity also helps with mag procs when ancient disruptors are around, and prevents you from needing to slow down to shoot out sensor bars on doors.

 

1 hour ago, ixidron92 said:

The myriad of problems with spellbind have already been stated.

First, it overlaps way too much with Lantern. Both are area CC abilities that hurl a small groups of enemies floating.

As a CC ability is pretty bad at what it does compared to well, every other CC ability in Warframe, to the point it's almost counterproductive and a waste of energy.

As a support ability, it's one of the saddest we have. Status effects are incredibly rare. Radiation, Viral and Magnetic are always avoidable, fixed hazards (although the Liches have changed that). Fire is tied to fixed hazards and arson eximus and the only common effects are Toxin from infested gas, slash from grineer weapons and electricity from corpus weapons. Slash and electricity you can avoid, since that's how you play titania, and those are always minor status effects that can be ignored.

Toxin would be the most dangerous one, and even so, you have a built in invulnerability to avoid it by switching to the operator and making your warframe unkillable.

So, we have a very niche ability with a functionality that can be achieved by anyone using an operator and not to mention, you cannot see your allies negative effects, so all you can do is cleanse yours.

That's why my rework idea has this cleanse/immunity thing as a placeable ground area. If allies need cleansing, they can just voluntarily enter there.

Other have also said that spellbind would benefit greatly from being an AoE centered around Titania instead of a targeted spell.

Spellbind is for quickly CCIng a target you're more than likely going to kill. Lantern is for blocking a choke point. Lantern's mechanics make it far more niche of a CC skill than spellbind - it only attracts enemies not only in range, but with line of sight to the affected target.

[Aadi880]

10 hours ago, (XB1)MarakViriPlays said:

Ash, Atlas, Banshee, Baruuk, Excalibur, Garuda, Gauss, Grendel, Hildryn, Inaros, Limbo, Mesa, Nekros, Nidus, Octavia, Saryn, Trinity, Valkyr, Vauban, Volt, Wisp, And Wukong.  That's 22 of 43 frames, and they have amazing passives, even if a few could use a bit of tweaking.

I think Titania's passive needs to act like an aura, for it to be helpful. Instead of having your teammates to jump on your trampoline, just by having Titania existing will give everyone a bullet-jump bonus. 

As it stands now, Titania's passive is just a bootleg version of Mirage's passive.

[ixidron92]

hace 1 hora, nooneyouknow13 dijo:

I feel like we're not even playing the same game. Slash procs are basically a constant at higher levels, and even if Titania doesn't get hit much, almost every time she is hit by grineer a slash proc happens. Status immunity also covers knockdowns, and ragdolls. If you're in razorwing, and have spellbind up, and an Arson Eximus spawns, you get pushed back. If you don't, you get knocked away and have a several second animation where she flails in midair. And while we do have access to operator mode without leaving razorwing now, using it to avoid damage from slash and toxin is time spent not murder pixie-ing things, and damage is only reduced by 90% while a skill is active. Also, you can visually see if your teammates have a slash or toxin proc, but either the blood gushing out of them, or green goo floating around them. Sure, you're not going to be able to dispel every status that comes their way, but you can certainly help. Status immunity also helps with mag procs when ancient disruptors are around, and prevents you from needing to slow down to shoot out sensor bars on doors.

 

Spellbind is for quickly CCIng a target you're more than likely going to kill. Lantern is for blocking a choke point. Lantern's mechanics make it far more niche of a CC skill than spellbind - it only attracts enemies not only in range, but with line of sight to the affected target.

I dunno man. Status effects rarely concern me when I'm playing Titania, not even in long arbitrations. The slash proc is barely noticeable. The only truly worrying status effect in game would be the heavy toxin proc from mutalists, and, like I said, I'm more likely than not to swap to the operator to avoid it (and heal with my arcane) than I am to waste energy to dispell it.

I just simply find status immunity very, very niche and almost useless in most real situations. It's fun to theorize on how useful it can be, but on the field, it's meh. I don't think I've ever used it successfully on a teammate (removing a dangerous proc) and, on myself, I just use it to fight Liches (or to trigger razorwing blitz). Other status effects are rare or easily avoidable or simply not worrying enough to think about them.

Those bleeding/toxin visual cues are barely noticeable in a real situation. Specially considering how fast your allies move or how far away they can be from you.

If you're gonna quick CC a heavy target you're about to kill, why not use tribute? I find it way more effective and less wonky. You don't need spellbind when your TTK is barely a second (ffs, a good Dex Pixia build can get up to 140k dps). Just knock the enemy back with tribute and kill them before they can get up. Plus, you get a buff.

Spellbind is just a meh ability that barely does its job.

And before anyone says anything about experience: I have 110 hours played with Titania. She's my second most played frame (although the first one is trinity prime because of early game and I've never used her after I got Titania) and I've done hour long arbitrations with her, long survivals, 40 rounds defenses.... I've also tested her abilities on a variety of situations. Yeah, I'm not talking from ignorance.

Honestly, using spellbind feels like a waste of time, because you could have killed all those enemies you plan to CC by the time it finishes casting. Though I do agree that it's the easiest cheapest way to stack razorwing blitz, but that shouldn't be its true purpose. 

Trying to maintain the status effect immunity on yourself at all times is incredibly taxing and not sustainable. You can't predict when an arson eximus is gonna spawn or when is he gonna cast the fire blast, and if you have enough time to react, like I said, might as well switch to operator, which costs no energy at all, instead of trying to use spellbind.

[Aadi880]

1 hour ago, ixidron92 said:

I dunno man. Status effects rarely concern me when I'm playing Titania, not even in long arbitrations. The slash proc is barely noticeable. The only truly worrying status effect in game would be the heavy toxin proc from mutalists, and, like I said, I'm more likely than not to swap to the operator to avoid it (and heal with my arcane) than I am to waste energy to dispell it.

Don't tell me... *GASP* you never found the DREADED MAGNETIC PROC???

Oh the pain! The HORROR of having no energy!

It is the TRUE misery of the VOID.

On a more serious note. There is one place where spell-bind is useful, that is in the Exploiter orb fights, where the entire first phase is nothing but cold procs.

[Gaxxian]

I just ignore procs... :S

[ixidron92]

hace 31 minutos, Aadi880 dijo:

Don't tell me... *GASP* you never found the DREADED MAGNETIC PROC???

Oh the pain! The HORROR of having no energy!

It is the TRUE misery of the VOID.

On a more serious note. There is one place where spell-bind is useful, that is in the Exploiter orb fights, where the entire first phase is nothing but cold procs.

You mean the one that's only found in low level Grineer missions with the Galleon map and only in certain doors with a clearly visible orange bar you can destroy to avoid the proc? That MAGNETIC proc?! Doesn't ring a bell.

[selig_fay]

2 часа назад, ixidron92 сказал:

Spellbind is just a meh ability that barely does its job.

No, it's useful. It's just not enough.

11 часов назад, (XB1)MarakViriPlays сказал:

Just like Titania's is Razorwing,

Unfortunately, I can't agree. Razorwing has no synergy with the Titania set. That is, if you remove razorwing, something will change?(well except to remove the only fun ability)

I play most of the time now without razorwing. My Titania made in Tank, that all her ability to - this meh, which act only in very very very specific situations. I literally forget about buffs, because they are so insignificant (I would try to forget about the blessing on Trinity and people would start lynching me). Now I just play like Titania because I like the way she looks. But her abilities, including razorwing, do nothing compared to equipment. My operator is more useful than Titania's entire set. 

11 часов назад, (XB1)MarakViriPlays сказал:

Removing the weaponry, and increasing the switch cost to 75 or 100 with a 40 second base duration or something, and making it renewable, would be fine.

I would agree to that. I would have made it to the duration and flown as much as I needed.

But... If your logic is built on the fact that this ability should cost a lot because it 4, then you are wrong, because razorwing can occupy any button, and the usual archwing launcher should not be expensive, because many people will not be able to get much benefit from it, if you do not adjust the abilities for it.If abilities will have synergy with archwing regime, then I even ready to pay double price. But if the ability would cost double the price just because you are using archwing mode, then why do I have to use the archwing mode? Because it's fun. No other reason. The energy drain kills this fun and limits me. Dex Pixia also limits my choice of weapons, which limits the fun.

Here, for example, the passage of missions in skywing mode. Just so you understand why the real archwing is in many ways superior to Titania in mechanics. And it is not Amesha who Op.

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Edited November 12, 2019 by zhellon

[InvictusTyr]

On 2019-10-29 at 12:22 PM, (XB1)GearsMatrix301 said:

We’re already getting a rework with her deluxe.

Thorns gives DR

Razorflies will pick up tribute buffs

1-3 will he upper body animations

Doesn’t address lantern still floating away and taking half a week to return to its original position or spellbinds useless existence all NC with half of Tributes buffs, tho.

I still have not see my Razorflies pick up tributes, I’m still having to  collect them myself 

[Aadi880]

15 minutes ago, ixidron92 said:

You mean the one that's only found in low level Grineer missions with the Galleon map and only in certain doors with a clearly visible orange bar you can destroy to avoid the proc? That MAGNETIC proc?! Doesn't ring a bell.

As well as eidelons. (The scream they do after the synovia break procs magnetic if you are hit by it [void mode helps with that ofc] ), Those tall, thin corpus dudes that skates around (I'm NOT gonna spell their names) that does a magnetic AOE which ignores walls, PoE lakes (and puddles) at night. I think Corpus snipertrons are able to proc magnetic in their shots? (Need confirmation on that one.), and then there's the magnetic anomalies, ofc. I think there is another source of magnetic proc that I'm forgetting though.

6 minutes ago, zhellon said:

Unfortunately, I can't agree. Razorwing has no synergy with the Titania set. That is, if you remove razorwing, something will change?(well except to remove the only fun ability)

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Razorwing synergies with Tribute's Dust, and giving you a total of 75% evasion instead of the usual 50%. Its not a wow factor or anything, just something that's "there"

Edited November 12, 2019 by Aadi880

[selig_fay]

1 минуту назад, Aadi880 сказал:

Razorwing synergies with Tribute's Dust, and giving you a total of 75% evasion instead of the usual 50%.

Dust does not give evasion. It reduces the accuracy of enemies. They work differently and don't add up. 

I'm talking about archwing mode. Evasion does not apply to archwing mode. With the same success, Titania could have received this bonus in normal form and nothing would have changed.

[ixidron92]

Justo ahora, Aadi880 dijo:

As well as eidelons. (The scream they do after the synovia break procs magnetic if you are hit by it [void mode helps with that ofc] ), Those tall, thin corpus dudes that skates around (I'm NOT gonna spell their names) that does a magnetic AOE which ignores walls, PoE lakes (and puddles) at night. I think Corpus snipertrons are able to proc magnetic in their shots? (Need confirmation on that one.), and then there's the magnetic anomalies, ofc. I think there is another source of magnetic proc that I'm forgetting though.

Razorwing synergies with Tribute's Dust, and giving you a total of 75% evasion instead of the usual 50%.

Well, you don't really take Titania to eidolons. She's not built for them. I mean, you can sure, and you can kill them, eventually, but it's not optimal nor the preferred frame. Not to mention most people simply have the magnetic immunity arcanes for that purpose.

Those skate dude do not have a magnetic proc per se, they have a disabling AoE, and tbh I'm not exactly sure if spellbind works for that particular one. They are very rare units anyway, and only one of the 3 variants can affect Titania. As for the PoE lakes, those are easily avoided, and if you fall in one I think spellbind doesn't work (as it removes your buffs). Sure it protects you from gracing it, but so does not touching it, and magnetic anomalies is a rare sortie modifier and easily avoided.

hace 6 minutos, InvictusTyr dijo:

I still have not see my Razorflies pick up tributes, I’m still having to  collect them myself 

Their AI is kind of S#&$ty, and they don't prioritize buffs you already have.

[Aadi880]

1 minute ago, zhellon said:

Dust does not give evasion. It reduces the accuracy of enemies. They work differently and don't add up. 

I mean the same thing, and the fact that "evasion" is a lot easier to say than "reduced enemy accuracy" or "enemy inaccuracy"

[ixidron92]

hace 6 minutos, zhellon dijo:

Dust does not give evasion. It reduces the accuracy of enemies. They work differently and don't add up. 

I'm talking about archwing mode. Evasion does not apply to archwing mode. With the same success, Titania could have received this bonus in normal form and nothing would have changed.

Not to mention enemy accuracy means almost nothing once the enemies are 100+. It's best just to stay as far away as possible so the enemy doesn't target you.

Edited November 12, 2019 by ixidron92

[ixidron92]

hace 7 minutos, Aadi880 dijo:

I mean the same thing, and the fact that "evasion" is a lot easier to say than "reduced enemy accuracy" or "enemy inaccuracy"

Nah, they count as different stats. So in essence, you have 50% chance to avoid the shot, and the enemy has 50% accuracy reduction. Their accuracy increases by level, so the higher their level the more accurate they are and the less effect that 50% reduction has, meanwhile, 50% evasion is flat and independent. If a shot would hit, there's a 50% chance it would not hit.

You can try it in the simulacrum if you wish. Try razorwing static vs high level enemies and then standard form+dust. You'll see how you get hit less in razorwing mode. 

Edited November 12, 2019 by ixidron92

[selig_fay]

7 минут назад, Aadi880 сказал:

I mean the same thing, and the fact that "evasion" is a lot easier to say than "reduced enemy accuracy" or "enemy inaccuracy"

Evasion gives you a chance to ignore direct damage. Reducing the accuracy of enemies causes them to shoot crookedly. You know, when you're standing in the melee of an enemy that has a shotgun, then evasion can work, but reducing accuracy doesn't, because you're close. These are very different mechanics. There's another thing, rockets. Evasion can ignore direct missile damage, but not AOE damage. (Yes, the missile has 2 types of damage). But against the reduction of the accuracy it doesn't work because missiles can get a lock on you. (another thing why archwings are better. They can shoot down missiles.)

And the big problem is that reducing accuracy gets better with distance, but you only have 30 meters where debuff will work.

Edited November 12, 2019 by zhellon

[Aadi880]

13 minutes ago, ixidron92 said:

Well, you don't really take Titania to eidolons. She's not built for them. I mean, you can sure, and you can kill them, eventually, but it's not optimal nor the preferred frame. Not to mention most people simply have the magnetic immunity arcanes for that purpose.

Actually, kinda disagreeing on this one. Titania can well take on eidelons on her own and effectively too. Take around 250% to 300% strength. Screw the ability efficiency, duration and range. You won't be needing those in eidelon hunts, since you only need Razorwing for 2 - 3 seconds anyway. A radiation build on dex pixie and a single cast on Razorwing Blitz results in the eidelon dying in less than a second. Operator and arcanes does the rest for energy and health management.

6 minutes ago, zhellon said:

Evasion gives you a chance to ignore direct damage. Reducing the accuracy of enemies causes them to shoot crookedly. You know, when you're standing in the melee of an enemy that has a shotgun, then evasion can work, but reducing accuracy doesn't, because you're close. These are very different mechanics. There's another thing, rockets. Evasion can ignore direct missile damage, but not AOE damage. (Yes, the missile has 2 types of damage). But against the reduction of the accuracy it doesn't work because missiles can get a lock on you.

And the big problem is that reducing accuracy gets better with distance, but you only have 30 meters where debuff will work.

 

9 minutes ago, ixidron92 said:

Nah, they count as different stats. So in essence, you have 50% chance to avoid the shot, and the enemy has 50% accuracy reduction. Their accuracy increases by level, so the higher their level the more accurate they are and the less effect that 50% reduction has, meanwhile, 50% evasion is flat and independent. If a shot would hit, there's a 50% chance it would not hit.

Thanks for letting me know that the game treats them as different stats.

And yeah, the 30meters debuff radius needs to go.

Edited November 12, 2019 by Aadi880