So I heard zephyr is good for steel path, how?

[MaxTunnerX]

42 minutes ago, Hexerin said:

>Asks for help on something from the community
>Receives help for that something from the community
>"yOu DiDn'T gIvE mE hElP iN tHe SpEcIfIc WaY i WaNtEd, YoU'rE mEaNiEs!1!!1"

How the hell does a comment like "git gud" or "you should know that" help anyone in any way? It has 0 value.

Edited August 31, 2023 by MaxTunnerX

[MaxTunnerX]

48 minutes ago, 0_The_F00l said:

You can invert the controls , tap for hover and hold for dash , that's what I do and is more intuitive if you want to hover In my opinion. But it can still have the issue you highlighted of accidentally pressing it for too long.

Sounds good but I dont think the other abilitites will be ok after that. Also wont it change for all my warframes?

[drnlmza]

45 minutes ago, MaxTunnerX said:

Sounds good but I dont think the other abilitites will be ok after that. Also wont it change for all my warframes?

You can choose which specific warframes the invert tap/hold option applies to, so it doesn't need to affect any others. You can't limit it to just specific abilities, though, which is a pain point at times.

[MaxTunnerX]

4 minutes ago, drnlmza said:

You can choose which specific warframes the invert tap/hold option applies to, so it doesn't need to affect any others. You can't limit it to just specific abilities, though, which is a pain point at times.

Ah, I see, thanks.

[MaxTunnerX]

So Ive tested the turbulence in SP and it still works flawlessly, pretty revolutionary actually. However, the damage output still sucks (talking about grineer on SP adaro). Zephyr seems to only add that crit chance and like group enemies together but not actually do any damage.

[Skoomaseller]

On 2023-08-31 at 7:11 PM, MaxTunnerX said:

So Ive tested the turbulence in SP and it still works flawlessly, pretty revolutionary actually. However, the damage output still sucks (talking about grineer on SP adaro). Zephyr seems to only add that crit chance and like group enemies together but not actually do any damage.

target fixation augment

play the floor is lava. easy dmg cap dive bomb

[MaxTunnerX]

4 minutes ago, Skoomaseller said:

target fixation augment

play the floor is lava. easy dmg cap dive bomb

Oh nice, forgot about augments, thanks.

Edited September 24, 2023 by MaxTunnerX

[(PSN)slightconfuzzled]

On 2023-08-31 at 11:11 PM, MaxTunnerX said:

So Ive tested the turbulence in SP and it still works flawlessly, pretty revolutionary actually. However, the damage output still sucks (talking about grineer on SP adaro). Zephyr seems to only add that crit chance and like group enemies together but not actually do any damage.

 

Glad to hear you are warming up to Turbulence. I myself also took a while to realise how good it was (I personally blame the visuals, since like... certain tank abilities, make more intuitive sense. You gain armour, like with Rhino, you can see he is more resistant. Or with Revenant, even no visuals, but the idea, you have Mesmer Skin, you see damage hit you and not do anything. Zephyr just has some wind effects... Doesn't sound particularly hardy or effective... lol) It is good though. 

With your damage output, things don't die when you shoot into your Tornados? Generally the good thing about them, well there are a few, they are grouping, so it can turn your single shot weapons, into an AOE, as it will now hit all the enemies within and near the tornado (even those not affected by the CC if they are near it), it has a damage absorption and distribution effect (including status effects), but it also has a critical damage multiplier as well, as in critical damage is multiplied by 200%. It also has damage ticks too, and some other properties. There is some pretty obscure tech with them, that isn't really necessary, and many people don't utilise, I only mention, because the ability can have so much to it. 

So my main thought if its not doing a lot of damage for you, is to wonder what weapons you might be using? Most guns, should generally be getting a buff of sorts to be effective, but some may not be that spectacular for various reasons too. May also be a tile set issue or something like that, if enemies are too spread out. Like maybe you aren't collecting as many of them, some tile sets are better for her than others. Could also be a bug issue. Were you Host or Client? I believe there can be Client side bugs? Oh and were you using the Augment? Apparently you might be doing too much damage which can cause issues, supposedly as well (I don't use the Augment so haven't experienced that) 

Good luck either way! 

[MaxTunnerX]

45 minutes ago, (PSN)slightconfuzzled said:

 

Glad to hear you are warming up to Turbulence. I myself also took a while to realise how good it was (I personally blame the visuals, since like... certain tank abilities, make more intuitive sense. You gain armour, like with Rhino, you can see he is more resistant. Or with Revenant, even no visuals, but the idea, you have Mesmer Skin, you see damage hit you and not do anything. Zephyr just has some wind effects... Doesn't sound particularly hardy or effective... lol) It is good though. 

With your damage output, things don't die when you shoot into your Tornados? Generally the good thing about them, well there are a few, they are grouping, so it can turn your single shot weapons, into an AOE, as it will now hit all the enemies within and near the tornado (even those not affected by the CC if they are near it), it has a damage absorption and distribution effect (including status effects), but it also has a critical damage multiplier as well, as in critical damage is multiplied by 200%. It also has damage ticks too, and some other properties. There is some pretty obscure tech with them, that isn't really necessary, and many people don't utilise, I only mention, because the ability can have so much to it. 

So my main thought if its not doing a lot of damage for you, is to wonder what weapons you might be using? Most guns, should generally be getting a buff of sorts to be effective, but some may not be that spectacular for various reasons too. May also be a tile set issue or something like that, if enemies are too spread out. Like maybe you aren't collecting as many of them, some tile sets are better for her than others. Could also be a bug issue. Were you Host or Client? I believe there can be Client side bugs? Oh and were you using the Augment? Apparently you might be doing too much damage which can cause issues, supposedly as well (I don't use the Augment so haven't experienced that) 

Good luck either way! 

I usually use kuva tonkor and no augments for zephyr. Gonna test the augments today probably.

[MaxTunnerX]

So Ive tried the target fixation, it didnt really work. Technically it did, but to get any effect whatsoever I would have to ram my head into the floor and then jump around constantly like 10+ times or even until the end of the mission. Might as well just use 1 terrify to get better results damage-wise. Then I tried the air bust augment that was pretty neat, but only capped at 500% so not good enough. I also tried the tornadoes without augment and I couldnt see any effect. All this time I also had to keep turbulence on because as soon as it went out I was instantly dead. So far zephyr seems like too much effort and stress for little payout.

Edited September 24, 2023 by MaxTunnerX

[(PSN)slightconfuzzled]

35 minutes ago, MaxTunnerX said:

I usually use kuva tonkor and no augments for zephyr. Gonna test the augments today probably.

 

This potentially may be why.

Not that the combo should under perform, it should still be decently effective, but Kuva Tonkor is already an AOE, and its ammo issues aren't as bad as say Bramma or Zarr, but you still generally want to conserve ammo. The Tornados will turn traditionally single shot weapons into AOE, so you can fire into them a lot, and reap the rewards because they are adding their damage, status and double crits into the whole AOE. So you can dump a whole magazine into them and see good results. 

I am not super familiar with Kuva Tonkor myself though, let alone its synergy with Tornados, so that is just my early guess and assumption. For all I know, with the right elemental combination and build, it could have great synergy. 

I actually don't recommend some of the Augments for Zephyr. Just because, say the Tornado one, not much need. It should do numbers regardless. 

 

19 minutes ago, MaxTunnerX said:

So far zephyr seems like too much effort and stress for little payout.

 

Could be. Sometimes its just an intuition issue as well as a preference. Zephyr aside from Turbulence came pretty easy for me, because in my opinion, she is similar to Mag. Both seem squishy, but in a deceptive way, where you can stay alive forever if you know what you are doing, and both can CC enemies and turn a bunch of different weapons into basically being AOE because they group enemies into a tight space that also can buff certain weapons in certain ways, basically letting you destroy SP enemies casually. That also being said, there are a bunch of powerful Warframes, like Chroma, and a few others i never personally gelled with well. Not every Warframe is for everyone. 

[MaxTunnerX]

11 minutes ago, (PSN)slightconfuzzled said:

This potentially may be why.

As much as I like turning single shot guns into aoe guns, its just an extra step for no reason. I dont even use single shot guns unless its archon hunt where I switch to felarx or something, so maybe there it could benefit me. Otherwise I can just easily use my wukong with 2 tonkors and just terrify grineer in step one, click left mouse button, and go to the next room. No stress of "omg is my invincibility on?" "omg have I stepped on ground for more than 2 seconds?" and stuff like that. Of course I could put terrify on zephyr to get some damage, but all of zephyr abilities are good for something so I would miss out, so not even helminth is really the way. That said, I might have some fun with corpus or infested or maybe some non-SP missions with zephyr when Im bored. Those I could imagine being actually fun, especially now that I know the good stuff.

Edited September 24, 2023 by MaxTunnerX

[(PSN)slightconfuzzled]

23 minutes ago, MaxTunnerX said:

As much as I like turning single shot guns into aoe guns, its just an extra step for no reason. I dont even use single shot guns unless its archon hunt where I switch to felarx or something, so maybe there it could benefit me. Otherwise I can just easily use my wukong with 2 tonkors and just terrify grineer in step one, click left mouse button, and go to the next room. No stress of "omg is my invincibility on?" "omg have I stepped on ground for more than 2 seconds?" and stuff like that. Of course I could put terrify on zephyr to get some damage, but all of zephyr abilities are good for something so I would miss out, so not even helminth is really the way. That said, I might have some fun with corpus or infested or maybe some non-SP missions with zephyr when Im bored. Those I could imagine being actually fun, especially now that I know the good stuff.

 

Thats totally fair and valid.

Like I said, preferences, play styles and intuition and all that. Like for myself, personally, my Zephyr builds easily out DPS and KPM my Wukong builds, and for no extra effort needed. Like its not a chore, nor does it require extra effort... However, I actually don't play Zephyr that much either. Just because, their play style overall isn't one of my favourites, I usually prefer a number of others a bit more, like Mag, Protea, Nidus, Citrine, Vauban, Gauss, Lavos, Gyre, Mesa, etc Zephyr, I do like, but is one of my secondary favourites, along with Saryn, Nezha, Oberon etc

Also not sure why you aren't getting that much damage with her either though. I don't need Terrify to kill big groups of Grineer easy or fast. The equivalent might be someone telling you they are struggling to survive with Wukong, where I imagine you might be puzzled and trying to diagnose the issue. Mind you, a lot of my weapon builds, are designed to kill Steel Path Grineer by themselves fairly efficiently, so even if Zephyr's Tornados just CCed them into a group, they would die fast, but they do more than that as well, via buffs and other benefits so I am not sure what is going on. That being said, if you don't really care either, well thats the main thing here, shouldn't try to force yourself to like something.

I know personally I will probably never like how Caliban plays for example (maybe unless he gets a rework or a really really good Augment). 

[MaxTunnerX]

19 minutes ago, (PSN)slightconfuzzled said:

 

Thats totally fair and valid.

Like I said, preferences, play styles and intuition and all that. Like for myself, personally, my Zephyr builds easily out DPS and KPM my Wukong builds, and for no extra effort needed. Like its not a chore, nor does it require extra effort... However, I actually don't play Zephyr that much either. Just because, their play style overall isn't one of my favourites, I usually prefer a number of others a bit more, like Mag, Protea, Nidus, Citrine, Vauban, Gauss, Lavos, Gyre, Mesa, etc Zephyr, I do like, but is one of my secondary favourites, along with Saryn, Nezha, Oberon etc

Also not sure why you aren't getting that much damage with her either though. I don't need Terrify to kill big groups of Grineer easy or fast. The equivalent might be someone telling you they are struggling to survive with Wukong, where I imagine you might be puzzled and trying to diagnose the issue. Mind you, a lot of my weapon builds, are designed to kill Steel Path Grineer by themselves fairly efficiently, so even if Zephyr's Tornados just CCed them into a group, they would die fast, but they do more than that as well, via buffs and other benefits so I am not sure what is going on. That being said, if you don't really care either, well thats the main thing here, shouldn't try to force yourself to like something.

I know personally I will probably never like how Caliban plays for example (maybe unless he gets a rework or a really really good Augment). 

To be honest I also dont know why Im getting no dmg benefit from zephyr. Do I need a specific build perhaps? Im using an overall build (small + to everything). And of course I agree with the favorites and playstyle and stuff. And yes, Ive seen a person actually struggle with wukong on non SP mission once. Pretty sure it was just about using a trash unmodded MK1 gun so that guy couldnt kill anything even when he had 3 extra lives, it wasnt really a frame problem. Maybe its the same with zephyr for me, tonkor might be incompatible with zeph.

Edited September 24, 2023 by MaxTunnerX

[(PSN)slightconfuzzled]

8 minutes ago, MaxTunnerX said:

To be honest I also dont know why Im getting no dmg benefit from zephyr. Do I need a specific build perhaps? Im using an overall build (small + to everything). And of course I agree with the favorites and playstyle and stuff. And yes, Ive seen a person actually struggle with wukong on non SP mission once. Pretty sure it was just about using a trash unmodded MK1 gun so that guy couldnt kill anything even when he had 3 extra lives, it wasnt really a frame problem. Maybe its the same with zephyr for me, tonkor might be incompatible with zeph.

 

Same really. I wouldn't say force the issue if you don't enjoy playing her, however... if you do have a few more attempts at playing her, I can personally advocate for guns like Tenet Arca Plasma, Trumna, Exergis, Stropha, Kuva Chakkhurr, Synapse, Fulmin, (certain bows like Dread and Daikyu, but of course, you may not like bows). Pretty standard builds, but in my experiences combined with Tornados they kill fast/efficiently. 

A little Viral is pretty good as your Tornado will build up the max stacks fast, even if your weapon doesn't have amazing status, certain elemental combos like Gas and Electricity can be potent, but requires more effort and thought potentially, so I wouldn't recommend just randomly using them on any weapon. 

I also know there are a lot of other forum members who are much more knowledgable about Zephyr than I am, so maybe one of them can chip in with some advice on synergy and why your damage input may seem lacklustre/lacking. Good luck in any case.

[GPrime96]

On 2023-08-30 at 1:36 PM, MaxTunnerX said:

Im very curious about this. Whats the black magic people use for zephyr to be good on SP or even dominate some things there? Unless its just a rumor of course.

She can be good but depends on your loadout, just like Mag, Zephyr enjoys weapon synergies for massive damage with her Tornados for high level runs while being immortal with her 3 and grouping synergy with her 2 for her Tornados. Her passive’s jump can be pretty annoying when you’re not doing “Headshots in a single aim glide” challenge but synergizes with her CC boost in the air. 

[Xamuswing]

>Press 3 for no damage from bullets
>Press 4 to put everyone in a tornado
>Aim Glide
>Shoot tornado

Congratulations, you just won Steel Path.

[(PSN)Joylesstuna]

1 hour ago, Xamuswing said:

>Press 3 for no damage from bullets
>Press 4 to put everyone in a tornado
>Aim Glide
>Shoot tornado

Congratulations, you just won Steel Path.

Gets wrecked by any status effect. As awesome as turbulence is,  a pinky slap and any status will wreck her. Turbulence isn't quite like Mesmer skin.

Edited September 25, 2023 by (PSN)Joylesstuna

[Hexerin]

1 hour ago, (PSN)Joylesstuna said:

Gets wrecked by any status effect. As awesome as turbulence is,  a pinky slap and any status will wreck her. Turbulence isn't quite like Mesmer skin.

The only things that can apply status to you would be melee enemies, at which point it's just a matter of having basic awareness of your surroundings.

EDIT: Well, I suppose Arson eximus could be problematic due to how they can catch you off guard even if you're keeping your head on a swivel. That's easily worked around by quickly dropping to Operator for some seconds, or by using the anti-heat arcane.

Edited September 25, 2023 by Hexerin

[GPrime96]

2 hours ago, Hexerin said:

 

EDIT: Well, I suppose Arson eximus could be problematic due to how they can catch you off guard even if you're keeping your head on a swivel. That's easily worked around by quickly dropping to Operator for some seconds

When i’m not using Rolling Guard or if Rolling Guard is on cooldown, i would do this but press 5 as many times as the heat procs lasting with Magus Elevate, or vazarin dashing for invincibility. 

[Hexerin]

1 hour ago, GPrime96 said:

When i’m not using Rolling Guard or if Rolling Guard is on cooldown, i would do this but press 5 as many times as the heat procs lasting with Magus Elevate, or vazarin dashing for invincibility. 

What you do once you're out is ultimately whatever. The point is that if you get hit with something you know is going to kill you (like an Arsonist's heatwave at high level SP), simply hopping out to Operator resolves the issue (as your frame is now invulnerable).

Although, now that I think about it, this isn't a universal solution. If the frame is currently using a channeling ability (such as Zephyr's Tail Wind in hovering mode), they aren't granted invulnerability. They're granted 90% DR, but in high level SP that doesn't really matter.

[GPrime96]

17 minutes ago, Hexerin said:

What you do once you're out is ultimately whatever. The point is that if you get hit with something you know is going to kill you (like an Arsonist's heatwave at high level SP), simply hopping out to Operator resolves the issue (as your frame is now invulnerable).

Although, now that I think about it, this isn't a universal solution. If the frame is currently using a channeling ability (such as Zephyr's Tail Wind in hovering mode), they aren't granted invulnerability. They're granted 90% DR, but in high level SP that doesn't really matter.

Which is why i said “or vazarin dash” since enemies can kill you in one DoT tick at a certain point (looking at you, level cap Nox😒)

[Hexerin]

1 minute ago, GPrime96 said:

Which is why i said “or vazarin dash” since enemies can kill you in one DoT tick at a certain point (looking at you, level cap Nox😒)

If only Vazarin school was actually worth using though...

[AegidiusF]

Il y a 6 heures, Hexerin a dit :

The only things that can apply status to you would be melee enemies, at which point it's just a matter of having basic awareness of your surroundings.

EDIT: Well, I suppose Arson eximus could be problematic due to how they can catch you off guard even if you're keeping your head on a swivel. That's easily worked around by quickly dropping to Operator for some seconds, or by using the anti-heat arcane.

Some Flame throwers (from Ignis, but not from Hyeka master) and lasers will ignore Turbulence.

There is also one more thing that can hurt Zephyr : her own tornados ! Yes, it's a very confusing bug : sometimes Tornados will make some enemy bullets ignore Turbulence... great synergy...

The biggest problem with Turbulence is its many inconsistencies.

[Hexerin]

9 minutes ago, (NSW)AegisFifi said:

Some Flame throwers (from Ignis, but not from Hyeka master) and lasers will ignore Turbulence.

Once upon a time, maybe? Turbulence has redirected beam weapons for as long as I can remember. It even shows beam redirection in the preview video.

The only things it can't redirect are things that affect a zone/area, such as the blast radius of an explosion. This is why higher than neutral range is important for her, so that enemy weapons that have AoE components on their impact (Grineer Napalms, for example) will detonate away from Zephyr.

Edited September 25, 2023 by Hexerin