Why are all the frames female?

[(PSN)FrDiabloFr]

3 minutes ago, (PSN)FrDiabloFr said:

 

[(PSN)FrDiabloFr]

2 hours ago, Birdframe_Prime said:

There's no bias due to the staff, what kind of misogynist bull is that?

I do like how you ignored my second paragraph so you could twist what i said to fit your narrative.

[Tsukinoki]

On 2023-09-17 at 6:08 AM, _Anise_ said:

I disagree about too much time, if they wanted they could totally outsource different gendered skins, the recoup the outsource costs selling the new "gender" versions of existing frames as skins,

you probably be surprised how many people will avoid playing a frame due to it's gender/appearance, that said I don't see DE doing this at all even as much as I would like it, its more like one of those low effort gacha things where you *unlock character* you don't get to choose the traits of it even though you can still buy it clothes.

Except you're forgetting all the other skins, especially the deluxe skins and the like.

That would add considerably to the time and money cost of a frame if they had to release both gendered forms of every single skin.
And if they don't then people will just call foul because a specific skin they wanted wasn't released in the gender they prefer.

This would mean that skins as a whole would have to cost more money, after all even with outsourcing a lot more money went into making the skins since they have to do this twice, meaning skins as a whole would get more expensive to cover the additional costs.

[Tsukinoki]

22 minutes ago, (PSN)FrDiabloFr said:

Where did i say there was a bias? Also it’s common knowledge a lot if staff are female so a lot of the frames are female, also it wouldn’t be misogynistic it be sexism at least get that part correct.

Please tell me how it's not biased to look at the population of frames, of which 27 are male, 25 are female, and 1 is non-binary and go "But the people who designed the frames are female, so of course there are lots of female design!!!!"

I mean FFS there are more male frames than female frame currently in the game...and you are clearly trying to harp on "Well the makers are female so of course they design female frames!"

I mean what ratio of frames would it take for you to consider them "balanced" instead of "lots of female design"?  Serious question there where you think the line of balance in male/female/other frames should be?

16 minutes ago, (PSN)FrDiabloFr said:

I do like how you ignored my second paragraph so you could twist what i said to fit your narrative.

Even though you say they "Hey, not trying to be sexist...." that doesn't really change what the other person quoted because they didn't twist your words at all.

They quoted you directly.

10 hours ago, (PSN)FrDiabloFr said:

Well I’ll address the elephant in the room, a whole lot of DE staff are female so a lot of female design is implemented.

hope that didn’t sound sexist, a lot of the designers etc are ladies so it makes sense they brought their ideas into the game saryn, protea, valkyr, wisp, hildryn and more are all fantastically designed frames.

It doesn't matter that you then go on to say "Not trying to be sexist, I love lots of the female frames!", which has a lot of the same energy as the people who go "But I have lots of gay/black/whatever friends!", you obviously think that there are too many female frames in current circulation, at least enough to make the comment on "Well there are lots of women working on warframe, so of course it's going to be female leaning!"....even though that is evidently not the current situation.

[(PSN)FrDiabloFr]

10 minutes ago, Tsukinoki said:

Please tell me how it's not biased to look at the population of frames, of which 27 are male, 25 are female, and 1 is non-binary and go "But the people who designed the frames are female, so of course there are lots of female design!!!!"

I mean FFS there are more male frames than female frame currently in the game...and you are clearly trying to harp on "Well the makers are female so of course they design female frames!"

I mean what ratio of frames would it take for you to consider them "balanced" instead of "lots of female design"?  Serious question there where you think the line of balance in male/female/other frames should be?

Even though you say they "Hey, not trying to be sexist...." that doesn't really change what the other person quoted because they didn't twist your words at all.

They quoted you directly.

It doesn't matter that you then go on to say "Not trying to be sexist, I love lots of the female frames!", which has a lot of the same energy as the people who go "But I have lots of gay/black/whatever friends!", you obviously think that there are too many female frames in current circulation, at least enough to make the comment on "Well there are lots of women working on warframe, so of course it's going to be female leaning!"....even though that is evidently not the current situation.

I don’t think there are to many female frames in circulation, my favourite frames are saryn and protea, and maybe my wording wasn’t the best but i was trying to say because i’ve seen the same sort of post a few times ie why are a lot of frames female, i addressed it simply as a lot of the staff are female so they input their ideas into the game, i said I’ll address the elephant in the room ie have that discussion because like this right now what i say can be misinterpreted.

as you said there are about the same male to female frame ratio, also i said “not trying to sound sexist” for this exact reason

All i simply did was say without being rude to the op was that a lot of females work at DE they implement female characters to the game it’s not a big deal i love the game and the characters, as i said my wording may not have been the best 

[_Anise_]

24 minutes ago, Tsukinoki said:

Except you're forgetting all the other skins, especially the deluxe skins and the like.

That would add considerably to the time and money cost of a frame if they had to release both gendered forms of every single skin.

I wasn't forgetting and they won't have to release it for every single skin, release base female (opposite gender) variant as "the skin" most people would be happy with that option, but this is kinda a moot debate because even if best case it was super easy todo, they outsourced it, cost them almost nothing and only made money they still wouldn't do it!

[(PSN)FunyFlyBoy]

43 minutes ago, (PSN)FrDiabloFr said:

All i simply did was say without being rude to the op was that a lot of females work at DE they implement female characters to the game it’s not a big deal i love the game and the characters, as i said my wording may not have been the best 

There is no confirmed correlation between Female staff being present and number of Female Warframes. Making such a claim is disingenuous, and the entire reason you're being called misogynistic, because it comes off that way. Unless they come out and specifically say, "Hey, we make these because of XYZ wanna be represented" then do not assume such. 

[(PSN)FrDiabloFr]

20 minutes ago, (PSN)FunyFlyBoy said:

There is no confirmed correlation between Female staff being present and number of Female Warframes. Making such a claim is disingenuous, and the entire reason you're being called misogynistic, because it comes off that way. Unless they come out and specifically say, "Hey, we make these because of XYZ wanna be represented" then do not assume such. 

Okie dokie then.

[Hobie-wan]

4 hours ago, (PSN)FrDiabloFr said:

I do like how you ignored my second paragraph so you could twist what i said to fit your narrative.

You're the one who made the post with the misogynist's equivalent of "I'm not racist, I have lots of black friends. But *stream of racist nonsense*".

[(PSN)FrDiabloFr]

2 minutes ago, Hobie-wan said:

You're the one who made the post with the misogynist's equivalent of "I'm not racist, I have lots of black friends. But *stream of racist nonsense*".

Okie dokie then.

[Birdframe_Prime]

4 hours ago, (PSN)FrDiabloFr said:

Where did i say there was a bias? Also it’s common knowledge a lot if staff are female so a lot of the frames are female, also it wouldn’t be misogynistic it be sexism at least get that part correct.

Do you actually read your sentences before you post them?

The assumption that because there are a lot of female staff that equates to a lot of female frames is, by default, misogynistic and directly implies bias.

No, there are a lot of female frames in the game because it's directly equivalent to the amount of male frames in the game so that they're equally distributed.

[(PSN)FrDiabloFr]

2 minutes ago, Birdframe_Prime said:

Do you actually read your sentences before you post them?

The assumption that because there are a lot of female staff that equates to a lot of female frames is, by default, misogynistic and directly implies bias.

No, there are a lot of female frames in the game because it's directly equivalent to the amount of male frames in the game so that they're equally distributed.

Okie dokie then.

[(PSN)slightconfuzzled]

10 hours ago, (PSN)FrDiabloFr said:

as i said my wording may not have been the best 

 

Hello there. I sympathise with this. I think I understand what you were trying to say, and that you were trying to be sincere and respectful. 

Sometimes when we express ourselves, we can create small misunderstandings, which can be partially true or accurate but also carry with it a lot of unintentional and extra baggage and meaning, we don't necessarily intend. That is why, a lot of other people have replied to you, with points and arguments and being a bit critical. 

Just as an example, are you a creative type? When you create characters are they all the same gender as the gender you identify with? It could be true, that when speaking broadly, it may be that many people, some may tend to create characters that are very similar to themselves and so may trend towards more male or female characters respective of their own gender... Yes... but also thats not always the case. I'd even say, generally, the more professional the creator and the more they are operating in a profession catering to large group of people the more skilled and neutral enough to know how to think creatively and diversely with such character traits and ideas. So the conclusion that "more female employees, means they would want to make more female characters" is a bit woefully odd sounding to many. It can carry a few different negative connotations. 

Also, why do you think that about DE's structure? Do you mean because of the public face of DE has quite a lot of woman? Not all people at DE have the same job or input spread out. Like some people just deal with weapons, others sound, others big fixes, others interacting with the community. Are you sure you aren't conflating the DE community managers and stream personalities with the actual Warframe design artists/concept artists? Who, may actually be a majority of woman, but wouldn't make that big a difference in all likelihood as per above. Not to mention collaboration efforts, the fact that there is a large back catalog of yet to be used concepts/designs and so on, 

Anyway, I tried being as polite, and kind with my response above, and hopefully that shows through, but also trying to explain in more detail why some others have replied to your comments too, so perhaps, you could see it from their sides as well? At the heart of the issue, you may simply just have different ideas of what motivates people to create characters and what processes and biases are involved, generally, and thats okay. Such patterns can exist, just not always. 

Hope that makes sense, all the best to you. 

[(PSN)FrDiabloFr]

1 hour ago, (PSN)slightconfuzzled said:

 

Hello there. I sympathise with this. I think I understand what you were trying to say, and that you were trying to be sincere and respectful. 

Sometimes when we express ourselves, we can create small misunderstandings, which can be partially true or accurate but also carry with it a lot of unintentional and extra baggage and meaning, we don't necessarily intend. That is why, a lot of other people have replied to you, with points and arguments and being a bit critical. 

Just as an example, are you a creative type? When you create characters are they all the same gender as the gender you identify with? It could be true, that when speaking broadly, it may be that many people, some may tend to create characters that are very similar to themselves and so may trend towards more male or female characters respective of their own gender... Yes... but also thats not always the case. I'd even say, generally, the more professional the creator and the more they are operating in a profession catering to large group of people the more skilled and neutral enough to know how to think creatively and diversely with such character traits and ideas. So the conclusion that "more female employees, means they would want to make more female characters" is a bit woefully odd sounding to many. It can carry a few different negative connotations. 

Also, why do you think that about DE's structure? Do you mean because of the public face of DE has quite a lot of woman? Not all people at DE have the same job or input spread out. Like some people just deal with weapons, others sound, others big fixes, others interacting with the community. Are you sure you aren't conflating the DE community managers and stream personalities with the actual Warframe design artists/concept artists? Who, may actually be a majority of woman, but wouldn't make that big a difference in all likelihood as per above. Not to mention collaboration efforts, the fact that there is a large back catalog of yet to be used concepts/designs and so on, 

Anyway, I tried being as polite, and kind with my response above, and hopefully that shows through, but also trying to explain in more detail why some others have replied to your comments too, so perhaps, you could see it from their sides as well? At the heart of the issue, you may simply just have different ideas of what motivates people to create characters and what processes and biases are involved, generally, and thats okay. Such patterns can exist, just not always. 

Hope that makes sense, all the best to you. 

Thank you amigo, very respectful response and ye you got pretty much everything i was trying to say, as a black person i’ve been called far worse than misogynistic so it doesn’t really phase me lol.

[(PSN)slightconfuzzled]

18 minutes ago, (PSN)FrDiabloFr said:

Thank you amigo, very respectful response and ye you got pretty much everything i was trying to say, as a black person i’ve been called far worse than misogynistic so it doesn’t really phase me lol.

 

Hey no worries. Thank you for your reply. Ha yeah, I can imagine. Take care! 

[(PSN)FrDiabloFr]

28 minutes ago, (PSN)slightconfuzzled said:

 

Hey no worries. Thank you for your reply. Ha yeah, I can imagine. Take care! 

You too tenno:)

[Venus-Venera]

Am 22.9.2023 um 04:43 schrieb (PSN)FrDiabloFr:

Not sure if you follow any lore, but warframes were once humans who were infected in the helminth and mutated into warframes hence why they have a lot of human characteristics this was the orokins weapon against the sentients.

This is a very brief run down the lore is really deep if you like that kind of thing.

But then it would mean that you still have to provide the body's cells with energy, important substances, etc. because modified organic is still organic. and organic can handle artificial stuff very badly.
And body cells, bacteria and much more don't live forever. So if something comes in, something comes out... they're not a balloon.

And of course you can spin it however you want, but with so many logical gaps it's impossible to establish a connection to reality.
As a fantasy game it's ok. but it has nothing to do with real world.

[(PSN)FrDiabloFr]

2 hours ago, Venus-Venera said:

But then it would mean that you still have to provide the body's cells with energy, important substances, etc. because modified organic is still organic. and organic can handle artificial stuff very badly.
And body cells, bacteria and much more don't live forever. So if something comes in, something comes out... they're not a balloon.

And of course you can spin it however you want, but with so many logical gaps it's impossible to establish a connection to reality.
As a fantasy game it's ok. but it has nothing to do with real world.

Wow, wow not sure how we got onto this my guy, i was simply explaining the ingame lore as to why warframes have human characteristics 

[SneakyErvin]

12 hours ago, Venus-Venera said:

But then it would mean that you still have to provide the body's cells with energy, important substances, etc. because modified organic is still organic. and organic can handle artificial stuff very badly.
And body cells, bacteria and much more don't live forever. So if something comes in, something comes out... they're not a balloon.

And of course you can spin it however you want, but with so many logical gaps it's impossible to establish a connection to reality.
As a fantasy game it's ok. but it has nothing to do with real world.

The Helminth which is based on the infestation takes care of that for the most part. We know through the feeding interactions with it that is can create all needed substances from certain materials to keep it strong and healthy. And since it is part of all frames it very likely does the same function there. It probably also breaks down and converts biproducts of the human body itself and reintroduces it to the system to fill needed functions.

Energy for the frames come from the void, which has been part of them since their creation prior to the involvement of the Tenno. Which possibly replaces the need for regular energy for the body while also powering the abilities of each frame.