New Gyre Augment maybe?

[TrueAbsoluteZero]

Hello fellow Tennos!

So, today I discovered Gyre again.

A frame that is actually very fun to play, but it seems she needs some love. The last time I have seen a Gyre in a mission, was more than a year ago...

Something that came to my mind, what if she gets a Augment for her 3rd ability, that gives her crit damage paired with her crit chance buff? That would make her abilities scale better into lategame content, her weapons would get more damage.

For many weapons, the crit chance alone doesn't really do that much, the only ones that are really benefitting the most are (once again...) incarnons since they have such a high crit chance. For most other weapons you gain like 10 to 30% crit chance, with some outliers. 300% strength gyre gains 150% crit chance, which is the basic crit chance mod. Nice to have, but not really that big of a difference on most weapons.

Or, a augment that changes the crit chance from additive to absolute bonus like arcane avenger? But at the cost of reducing the crit chance down to like 20% (so 300% would give you 60% flat crit chance) This would open up some fun builds!

Just some ideas, but I think she needs some love! Please bring Gyre back into the game!

What do you think?

[French]

Hi, she already got an augment for her 3. Also she is broken af, no reason to give her any augments that would buff her even more IMO.
I dont feel like she is weak at high level too, she got pretty much everything. Exept armor strip ig but you can use tharros or a corrosive weapon.

[WindShadow970]

She's more than fine but she does demand setup from the player, mostly to deal with electricity's worst matchup: armor (Jahu Canticle, Pillage, Tharros strike, Vicious Bond etc. pick your preference). After that is out of the way, you find she is tailor made to optimise the potency of electric procs.

I guess she isn't played as much because:

1. She's fragile as hell (barely above banshee levels of squish)
2. Armor strip setups aren't exactly cheap in the grand scheme of things
3. The grind to get her is abysmal
4. Said grind is in the further stages of the game
5. _{Public perception views her as bad when she isn't but people don't test for themselves.}

[Hexerin]

3 hours ago, WindShadow970 said:

The grind to get her is abysmal

Unless you're someone like me, who loves the Zariman.

[Greysmog]

30 minutes ago, Hexerin said:

Unless you're someone like me, who loves the Zariman.

I do enjoy the Zariman personally as well, I thought I would hate grinding for the Pinions I need in order to get every decoration, but I've actually been enjoying it.

I think the only Warframe farms I literally could not stand was way back in the day with the Pacifism Defect event, and the Citrine farm more recently. 

[TrueAbsoluteZero]

The problem I have with her, is the fact that her numbers feel low. The crit bonus from her 3 is just too low compared with other frames.

Let's compare for example: Dagath

Dagath got 50% Crit damage on her 3. The same as Gyre. But 50% crit damage is way stronger than 50% crit chance. Also, Dagath gets to DOUBLE that if you use her 2. So, Dagath will win the damage battle every time. To be fair, Gyre got the synergy with her 4 especially, but her dmg output will still fall behind.

Then there is someone like Kullervo.

He can give his melee 200% crit chance base. And this is flat crit, so you can get ANY melee to red crits. 300% strength (I go with 300 since this is easily achievable even on "balanced" builds, not just pure strength) kullervo then gets 600% crit chance flat on top. This alone can make you deal billions of damage.

 

Gyre is good in clearing rooms super fast, but then you take her to steel path and she just falls off a cliff in terms of damage output. Then she is super squishy, also pretty bad for SP.

I'm not calling her a bad frame, she is definitely not that weak. But she just falls behind other frames. Other frames do what she does but better...

In my opinions she just needs either a number tweak to make her scale a bit better, or give her a little bonus.

[Hexerin]

9 minutes ago, Greysmog said:

I do enjoy the Zariman personally as well, I thought I would hate grinding for the Pinions I need in order to get every decoration, but I've actually been enjoying it.

I think the only Warframe farms I literally could not stand was way back in the day with the Pacifism Defect event, and the Citrine farm more recently. 

I wasn't around for that event, so I've got no context to say one way or another. Citrine, however, I just bought. I enjoy the node (especially the badass transition zone, the first time I saw an Orowyrm), but the grind itself is just... nah.

[(PSN)robotwars7]

5 hours ago, TrueAbsoluteZero said:

What do you think?

I think you need to spend some time with a dedicated Cathode Current build. I can assure you she really doesn't need any help: it takes a moment to get the momentum going, but once you do, Gyre will literally make Steel Path look like a bad joke: red crit lighting strikes everywhere, insane weapon damage, and enough electric CC to make Volt look like a flat battery; as long as you bring a little armor strip for heavies and keep the kills going, it's basically infinite as well.

I wish Volt could do even half as much damage as Gyre can...

[Hexerin]

20 minutes ago, (PSN)robotwars7 said:

I think you need to spend some time with a dedicated Cathode Current build. I can assure you she really doesn't need any help: it takes a moment to get the momentum going, but once you do, Gyre will literally make Steel Path look like a bad joke: red crit lighting strikes everywhere, insane weapon damage, and enough electric CC to make Volt look like a flat battery; as long as you bring a little armor strip for heavies and keep the kills going, it's basically infinite as well.

I wish Volt could do even half as much damage as Gyre can...

Unless you have armor strip (Pillage being the obvious choice, because it also solves her other issue - survivability), you aren't going to be doing anything of value on SP. She also doesn't scale very well into SPE (although she's far from the worst choice, "viable" is a good term here). The fact that a Helminth injection is literally mandatory for the frame to even function, means she's not in a good place if speaking objectively.

"Red crit" doesn't mean anything unless you also include the damage, because you can red crit for 1 damage or 1 million damage, depending on various factors. Weapon damage is also irrelevant, because anyone could take the same weapons and output the same (or similar) damage, as weapons are their own thing separate from a frame (and thus it's asinine to use them as a "look, this frame is fine!" benchmark).

Edited April 3 by Hexerin

[(PSN)robotwars7]

3 minutes ago, Hexerin said:

Unless you have armor strip (Pillage being the obvious choice, because it also solves her other issue - survivability), you aren't going to be doing anything of value on SP. She also doesn't scale very well into SPE (although she's far from the worst choice, "viable" is a good term here). By virtue of a Helminth injection being literally mandatory for the frame to even function, she's not in a good place.

I will concede she's a glass cannon, and there are other frames that can compare, but I've never had that many issues with her, though I wouldn't say I do long endless runs either. I guess it depends on what you're after exactly, and maybe your own playstyle, but I've never really felt like she needed pillage (it is good on her though).

I did say that I brought armor strip with her though, obviously that makes a difference.. zapping everybody with her is just really fun!

[WindShadow970]

6 hours ago, Hexerin said:

Unless you're someone like me, who loves the Zariman.

Oh I do frequent the Zariman (Void angels are probably sick of me by now), I abhor the bounty reward system there however. I spent near 7 consecutive days of chaining bounties to get her systems.

[WindShadow970]

5 hours ago, Hexerin said:

he fact that a Helminth injection is literally mandatory for the frame to even function, means she's not in a good place if speaking objectively.

It's not absolutely necessary its just the most popular way, I run a Grimoire with Xata Invocation and Jahu Canticle and had a very comfortable time doing Conjuction and Lab survival Steel Path Fissures solo. (I run Helios as well for good measure, there'll be no armor in this house)

[WindShadow970]

6 hours ago, TrueAbsoluteZero said:

So, Dagath will win the damage battle every time.

True but Dagath will always lose the kill rate battle (I play them both). Gyre ends up winning imo because she can lock down 90% of a room with electric procs, the other 10% are passively getting their overguard shredded; Dagath just doesn't have the AoE to match, she's built for murdering singular fools she doesn't get any better the more fools there are like Gyre or Qorvex do.

[crazywolfpusher]

Unless Pillage dependency it's a problem I don't think she needs a new augment. I like the concept of fixing Warframes flaws through the helminth system, 

However, if it were up to me I would give her Rotorswell one of these:

1. Dealing critical damage reduce enemy armor. T1 Yellow 10%, T2 Orange 20%, T3 Red 30%. Halved for crits made by weapons.
2. 3% damage reduction per electric status effect applied in a radius of 30m.

 

[Hexerin]

49 minutes ago, WindShadow970 said:

Dagath just doesn't have the AoE to match, she's built for murdering singular fools

Rakhali's Cavalry says hello.

[WindShadow970]

33 minutes ago, Hexerin said:

Rakhali's Cavalry says hello.

Archsphere, Coil Horizon and Rotorswell send their regards.

[PollexMessier]

I love Gyre but she pretty much needs armor strip and some form of damage reduction to be playeable.
Which basically means... you need to replace one of her abilities with pillage. And I REALLY don't wanna do that, because she's one of the rare few frames I just love every single one of the abilities on.

They are all fun and unique, except for her 2 which is just a pretty standard grouping tool, but since her whole deal is stacking electric damage, and her 4 chains damage to nearby enemies on crit, a grouping tool is pretty important for her. So you can't get rid of it.

A lot of people say subsume off her 1... Her 1 is amazing and a huge damage source if you know how to use it. I'm not getting rid of it.

And her 3 and 4 are straight out. those are the biggest parts of her kit.

so she's stuck in this limbo of literally needing a subsumed ability to be a functional frame, and being difficult to put one on because all of her abilities are good and useful.

Maybe she wouldn't need damage reduction so bad if rotorswell actually had range so it could CC enemies farther away from her than within mele distance. Tho even if it covered the whole map and enemies just couldn't break out of electric CC while in range of it, I'm not sure it'd be enough with how many enemies just ignore CC now.

But yeah she really needs something.

Edited April 4 by PollexMessier

[Hexerin]

26 minutes ago, WindShadow970 said:

Archsphere, Coil Horizon and Rotorswell send their regards.

Which is fine. My point is that Dagath is more than capable of outputting insane area damage, and if properly built, can easily outstrip the combined output of everything in Gyre's kit. Rakhali's Cavalry is hilariously overtuned, dealing a minimum of 60k damage per enemy (and stripping them in the process) with baseline ability strength.

[Lord_Drod]

Somehow I don't see Dagath doing 150-180 KPM in MOT SP like Gyre is capable of...

[Raarsi]

2 hours ago, PollexMessier said:

I love Gyre but she pretty much needs armor strip and some form of damage reduction to be playeable.
Which basically means... you need to replace one of her abilities with pillage.

That just means she's balanced.  Not every frame needs every single tool to get the job done.

Also, you don't necessarily need Pillage.  I run Reave since that's a heal, an i-frame and it allows Rotorswell to hit enemies as I'm zooming past them.  If I need armor strip, I just run at least one corrosive weapon and that usually gets the job done well enough that Rotorswell damage takes them out.