Since When Did "rush" Become More Important That Decent Survivability?

[zerogear5]

i hope coptering gets nerfed or removed.

[(PSN)theelix]

I only use Rush on specific frames, some are too slow to benefit.

 

But Loki and Rhino Prime ?

Hell yeah, rush train coming through.

 

And using a rush infused sprint then zoren coptering, you will go a lot further than a guy who just spam zorencopter.

I can go faster than just about anyone Zorencoptering by using the Dragon nikana and doing a quarter second wall run. The speed at which you're catapulted gives you enough speed to beat a Loki with Maglev and Rush on. It also instantly activates Heavy Impact on just about anything you touch. 

 

By the quarter second wall run, I run towards the wall and activate the animation that includes you taking a small leap and putting your hand on the wall. If you time it well enough... Which is not hard at all, you will be catapulted very far and very fast. 

[(PSN)theelix]

i hope coptering gets nerfed or removed.

Then all slide attacks wouldn't work properly at all and you may as well remove half of the melee weapons in the game that aren't polearms, staffs, or scythes. And that'd be a huge removal of the game. Why the hell would you even think that? xD

[MeduSalem]

Then all slide attacks wouldn't work properly at all and you may as well remove half of the melee weapons in the game that aren't polearms, staffs, or scythes. And that'd be a huge removal of the game. Why the hell would you even think that? xD

 

I guess they would have to make a more squishy way in determining if your feet are "touching the ground". Then it doesn't interfere with slide attacks and coptering could be removed as it's been an exploit anyways.

 

The problem there is that DE as well as the playerbase seems to be very picky on what is actually an exploit and what's a next-level movement-addition that just needs to be better regulated.

 

The lately fixed Wallrun Glitch is an example for that. DE said it's an exploit but some people argued that they actually liked that. But on the other hand they implemented coptering even it started out as an exploit as a regular feature and even buffed that one with Melee 2.0.

 

So describing this behavior of "picking out what exploits to implement as regular feature and which of them to fix" as being "picky" is suitable in my opinion and some people think when exploits are fixed, then all of them without excuses which includes coptering.

 

But whaterver.. that would nowhere be related to removing any weapons if ever considered. Back to topic.

Edited August 3, 2014 by MeduSalem

[Krymanol]

I use various builds.  It all depends on what my goal is. 

 

1. If I want to just get to the boss and kill it or outrun "the speed boosted" infested, I use rush mods because I'll probably skip everything right to the end.

2. If I want to play defense, I use defensive mods because, well you are defending and being attacked instead of doing the attacking.

3. If I want to do survival, I use damage offensive mods because killing fast is more important than surviving a few more hits.

 

Bottom line though is from level 1 to 40, my weapon can basically 1 shot all but the heavy enemies (which normally take 2 or 3 head shots).   Depending on the weapon, I can get 5+ shots off before most heavy enemies can tear through my base armor, shields and health.   Why?

 

Because I move a lot, use cover, have sentinel mods that restore full shields when they get depleted, use powers that augment the incoming damage enemies can do to me and use powers that render enemies completely helpless....and finally, I am just smarter than any A.I. can ever be.

 

Now once you get into the higher enemy levels, no amount of defensive shields or health will matter because they all 1 shot you even if you have 1,000 shields and 1,000 health....this is when you start needing bastille, vortex, snow globe, blessing, tornado and all those powers that help keep you alive and help you kill enemies.

 

Overall, once you have the experience that a lot of vets around here have, you too will realize that redirection and vitality are not as valuable as you think they are.   If you need redirection and vitality to survive in this game before level 40 enemies, you might need more practice at how to survive.  Relying on 2 defensive type mods to keep you alive in this game just makes you a less effective player....and such people are usually dead weight when it really matters in tough missions.   

 

Just ask yourself, why is that 50 armored frame with 300 shields and 300 health always reviving that 150 armored frame with 1,000 shields and 1,000 health?  You'll realize that it's not the mods that keep you alive, it's your brain.

[brasteir]

Just ask yourself, why is that 50 armored frame with 300 shields and 300 health always reviving that 150 armored frame with 1,000 shields and 1,000 health?  You'll realize that it's not the mods that keep you alive, it's your brain.

 

Note that you will likely never see this happen in pubs. Ever.

[Lizzardtong]

i Don't care how long it takes, i just want to get the $h!t€ done. and if it takes me 1 hour to beat one level, i will finish it. no matter how often i fall down, no matter how slow i am, i get to the end.

 

 

really, i couldn't care less about speed, i am a Mighty Glacier, Slow as F***, but i can take and deal A Lot of damage.

[RoboDoge]

Personally I think it is a waste because it basically makes the weapon…well…not even a weapon.

Depends on a weapon, because Dakra Prime or Ichors can be used for coptering and dish some serious damage at the same time.

[PachTrick]

You're modding it wrong.

Flow and Vitality isn't necessary if you have enough power efficiency to cast abilities.

Fast deflection is ok but I never use it.

 

To me, rush is so @(*()$ important on any frames other than Loki because I got used to that lightening speed, though sometimes I prefer stamina recharge(forgot the name) because you run out of stamina so @(*()$ easily.

 

I'd love to put both rush and stamina recharge on my Loki but I use the disarm build most of the time...

[DFliyerz]

I only use Rush on Valkyr, my looting Loki (Master Thief and Thief's Wit), and Rhino. Additionally, I use shield regen speed mods on Frost and Volt.

[JerZeyCJ]

I mean, I see so many players on low, mid and high levels running like Usain Bolt with Rush mods, but crazy-low survivability. If they don't insta-kill their enemies with their corrupted-mod Abilities and Guns, they get ripped to shreds.

 

I don't think I've seen someone with Redirection and Vitality for months. It seems Vigor or lonesome Redirection is all they think they need to go up against 25-35 enemies. Some however, do use Redirection and Vigor, but this doesn't hold up on high levels if they get hit hard, since they have low health, and more likely to get shoved into bleedout, if they get Slash PROc'd, or Toxin DoT'd.

 

I don't even think I can recall even one occasion I've seen any player use regen speed mods. And Rush is a staple? I just don't get it.

 

/rant

 

If you did wonder how I typically build my Frames:

Redirection

Vitality

All 4 Abilities

Fast Deflection

Flow

Intensify

Continuity/ Fortitude

 

 

~Kylecrafts

Gotta ask, why sign your posts? we can clearly see your name, so why put your name at the end? I see this every once in a while on forums and it just peeves me a little bit and I never understand why people still do it in an age where pretty much all forums have you make an account.

[PachTrick]

Gotta ask, why sign your posts? we can clearly see your name, so why put your name at the end? I see this every once in a while on forums and it just peeves me a little bit and I never understand why people still do it in an age where pretty much all forums have you make an account.

 

They do this so you can ask them "wuts ya name again, CraftKyle?"

[HollowMarthon]

Meh. All builds are viable, really. Some warframes allow for a build that can tank level 40 enemies, like Rhino, or Vlakyr, some warframes allow for speed, Zephyr, Loki, and some warframes are damaged based, and focus on not being fast, or being tanky, but just murder, like Ember, and some warframes do none of the above and are just utility, like Trinity. different frames for different ways to play.

[Sixty5]

The thing is on some frames those defensive mods are not much use. Loki for instance with Max Redirection, Vitality and Vigor will hit 1260 total Health and shields, for the cost of three mod slots. However that Same Loki with a Quick Thinking and Flow will hit 1530 effective health and shields, for the cost of only two mod slots, with one of those slots helping towards the rest of the kit.

 

Though because you are playing Loki you can give yourself and your team much more survivability through your abilities than through mods. By slapping on Rush and going fast you can avoid much of an enemies damage. In addition by using Decoy and Radial Disarm you can cripple the enemies ability to deal damage to your or your team. Finally if you want to be a cheesy little No-ki you can build for invisibility and take no damage whatsoever.

 

This is what I currently run on my Loki, and if you know what you are doing with it, you can be very effective at later levels, regardless of the lack of any real survivability mods

 

unless you are specifically playing a Tanky setup then you shouldn't need to rely on said mods to survive. Not getting shot beats being able to sponge a bit of damage any day of the week. Rush, at least in my opinion makes it easier to not be shot. 

[nitroz76]

Why go slow when you can go fast?

 

and since RNG. 

[(PSN)theelix]

I guess they would have to make a more squishy way in determining if your feet are "touching the ground". Then it doesn't interfere with slide attacks and coptering could be removed as it's been an exploit anyways.

 

The problem there is that DE as well as the playerbase seems to be very picky on what is actually an exploit and what's a next-level movement-addition that just needs to be better regulated.

 

The lately fixed Wallrun Glitch is an example for that. DE said it's an exploit but some people argued that they actually liked that. But on the other hand they implemented coptering even it started out as an exploit as a regular feature and even buffed that one with Melee 2.0.

 

So describing this behavior of "picking out what exploits to implement as regular feature and which of them to fix" as being "picky" is suitable in my opinion and some people think when exploits are fixed, then all of them without excuses which includes coptering.

 

But whaterver.. that would nowhere be related to removing any weapons if ever considered. Back to topic.

I say that there all slide attacks would be broken because there are many times where your feet do not touch the ground. I've activated Heavy Impact by being attacked while AFK. Which means, for me to have Activated HI, I had to have been falling quite fast or been off the ground for quite a long time. 

 

Point being slide attacks would just be broken because half of the time you're in the game, you're probably floating even if it looks like you're touching the ground, so if you'd have to be on the ground to get the momentum, there will be many times where you won't move at all.

 

Also, I didn't mean you'd have to literally remove half of the weapons, it's just that many weapons would in fact because so useless, they'll be unused by anyone. Zorencopters and the original Glaive being two examples. Those are mainly spin damage and if spin damage is as unreliable as say the wall attack which has been barely fixed, there's no point in using it, like no one but really me has actually used the wall attack for more than an elevator.

[(PSN)theelix]

Note that you will likely never see this happen in pubs. Ever.

I've done this. Many times. 

 

Excalibur, Pendragon Helmet, 61 Armor, 700 shields, 300 health. I've revived Rhino, at 1k health and/or 1k shield and 190 armor twenty or more times (I don't play public matches often. I'm a PS4 conclave warrior, lol) and even Valkyrs... And we all know the specs of valkyrs. By that I mean they don't matter because she's freaking invincible.

[(PSN)theelix]

Depends on a weapon, because Dakra Prime or Ichors can be used for coptering and dish some serious damage at the same time.

But their main purpose is to be fast weapons. Not a zorencopter.

[Wyzilla]

Depends on how you see it. Coptering gives you a burst of speed and distance that no other mobility option in the game can give you, and can often save you when things go bad.

 

But you're entitled to your own opinion, of course. I just don't think it's a waste of a slot.

Why use the Zorens when the Dual Ichors exist? You can coptor just as much, only you have a viable high tier melee weapon that's just as good as the dragon nikana, only focusing on elemental damage instead.

[fatpig84]

i hope coptering gets nerfed or removed.

 

DE has already said coptering is here to stay and they already nerfed it with the Fury nerf and reducing Zoren base speed from 2.0 to a mere 1.2. 

 

Why does it need more nerfs when it is a lot weaker compared to it's past iteration ?

 

 

I can go faster than just about anyone Zorencoptering by using the Dragon nikana and doing a quarter second wall run. The speed at which you're catapulted gives you enough speed to beat a Loki with Maglev and Rush on. It also instantly activates Heavy Impact on just about anything you touch. 

 

By the quarter second wall run, I run towards the wall and activate the animation that includes you taking a small leap and putting your hand on the wall. If you time it well enough... Which is not hard at all, you will be catapulted very far and very fast. 

 

Wall running jump is nothing new. Previously it was so fast that DE had to taper it off as it was faster than Zorencopter or even Wave Dashing which was a massive glitch.

 

And you can still pull it off faster with smaller weapons like Dual Ichors and with berzerk ticking, dual ichors still go a lot further. 

Edited August 4, 2014 by fatpig84

[zerogear5]

I find the whole melee to go faster concept to be bad. Now if it was a certain function of come melee weapons like the Jat Kittag which could obviously boost you. This could create sub functions to so many melee weapons like duel swords being used to stick to walls. The zoran copter just makes no sense.

[TheBurritoSlayingTaco]

the Eternal's build. Use this for your frames instead.

 

Rush? i guess because noobs haven't figured out how to copter yet.

SHAMEFUL PROMOTION IS SHAMEFUL.

[KiteoHatto]

I dont care about speed tbh, i slap on redirection or vitality and then go power efficiency, rest is either duration or range and always have equilibrium on as that gets me an extra safety net incase things go south

Edited August 4, 2014 by kiteohatto

[Irkie500]

As a mainly solo player I stack as much survivability on my frame as I can. I tend to play things close to the wire and get myself in some tough spots just to feel like a badass when I come out alive. I play Ash as my main frame right now so power efficency really isnt what I care about, never been much of an ability spammer. I mainly use smoke screen or blade storm just to get out of tough spots, other than that pure weapon.

 

If I do join a pub group and they are moving quickly, Ash's base speed is fast enough where im not terribly far behind. Valkyr on the other hand? sweet jesus its like shes in quicksand all the time.

[SeaUrchins]

Valkyr on the other hand? sweet jesus its like shes in quicksand all the time.

 

Dude who would want to run ahead of the valkyr I mean, ah... nevermind.