This Was Very Poorly Designed Around Players With Arsenal Full Of Mods And Proves That Raids Consisting Of Lvl80 Enemies Isnt A Good Idea.

[Davoodoo]

I think there's generally 2 types of people when an extreme challenge is presented. Type 1 will try a few times, fail miserably, get frustrated and insist that the challenge isn't legitimate. Type 2 will try a few times, fail miserably, take a step back and rethink their tactics to fit the challenge. Type 2 are the people who are wearing the sigils right now.

 

My first reaction to the Alert was surprise - 'holy crap thats hard'. Then, a bit of frustration. But I found a group of regular players and we tried different tactics throughout the night. They all failed until eventually we found one that worked.

 

So that being said, I disagree that this event "isnt promoting skillfull and smart playing". The whole point of putting the enemies that high level (and gimping the players, as well) is to say "brute force isn't gonna work. you need to think your way around this one."

 

If you're getting frustrated, that's normal. Just relax, and come up with a different plan.

 

Good luck!

You forgot about 3rd, ppl who actually playtested this game for 2 years and got some experience with mmos overall already, whatever you throw at these ppl they will clear at 1st or 2nd attempt.

Thats what most veterans are unfortunately.

 

The truth is that gimping us wont do any good. we managed to complete it with 

Boltor2229 DPS 

 

such weapons back in u7, without corrupted mods, without dual mods, without maxed mods.

 

Scindo that hits for 25k with berserker got 10 times as much dps and we can still fit full corrupted and/or primed build on our frames.

This event exactly favores brute force approach, render them harmless before attacking.

Edited February 28, 2015 by Davoodoo

[_FrostPrime_]

Since everybody wants to cry about power creep and "difficulty." I used google for you.

 

dif·fi·cult

ˈdifəkəlt/

adjective

adjective: difficult

1. needing much effort or skill to accomplish, deal with, or understand.

   "she had a difficult decision to make"

   synonyms: hard, strenuous, arduous, laborious, tough, onerous, burdensome, demanding, punishing, grueling, back-breaking, exhausting, tiring, fatiguing, wearisome; More

   informalhellish, killing;

   archaictoilsome

   "a very difficult job"

   hard, complicated, complex, involved, impenetrable, unfathomable, over/above one's head, beyond one, puzzling, baffling, perplexing, confusing, mystifying;

   problematic, intricate, knotty, thorny, ticklish

   "she found math very difficult"

   antonyms: easy, simple, straightforward

   • characterized by or causing hardships or problems.

     "a difficult economic climate"

     synonyms: inconvenient, awkward, inopportune, unfavorable, unfortunate, inappropriate, unsuitable, untimely, ill-timed More

     "you've come at a difficult time"

     bad, tough, grim, dark, black, hard, adverse, distressing;

     straitened

     "the family has been through a difficult year"

     antonyms: convenient, happy
   • (of a person) not easy to please or satisfy.

     "Lily could be difficult"

     synonyms: troublesome, tiresome, trying, exasperating, awkward, demanding, perverse, contrary, recalcitrant, unmanageable, obstreperous, unaccommodating, unhelpful, uncooperative, disobliging; More

     hard to please, fussy, finicky;

     formalrefractory

     "a difficult child"

     antonyms: accommodating

Edited February 28, 2015 by littlewomba

[SmashingGudTime]

This TA was Great fun and contrary to belief can be run with most frames, also this debate on raids is being blown way out of proportion. Who cares about the lvl 80 mobs used to fill the space between the awesome raid puzzles.

 

The escalation was wonderfully fun and skill based, figuring out how to mod frames with the 400cc restriction, the heart pumping action and focus required to not get 1shot. Yes you can CC the lvl150 mobs to a standstill and “easy mode” but the great thing about the game is you can play the way you want to, try thinking out of the box guys. AND THANKS DE GREAT JOB with the TA :D

[_FrostPrime_]

This TA was Great fun and contrary to belief can be run with most frames, also this debate on raids is being blown way out of proportion. Who cares about the lvl 80 mobs used to fill the space between the awesome raid puzzles.

 

The escalation was wonderfully fun and skill based, figuring out how to mod frames with the 400cc restriction, the heart pumping action and focus required to not get 1shot. Yes you can CC the lvl150 mobs to a standstill and “easy mode” but the great thing about the game is you can play the way you want to, try thinking out of the box guys. AND THANKS DE GREAT JOB with the TA :D

 

In this modern day.... whatever is outside the box is 100% incomprehensible for most people. We're in the age of entitlement. Everybody believes they're Gods gift to the universe and they deserve everything, for nothing at all.

 

Shorter version: Everybody has a max ranked Narrow Minded mod permanantly fixated into their brains.

[Basilisk1991]

The challenge in raids is going to be coordinating 8 people to deal with "puzzles" and stuff like that whilst the lvl80 enemies constantly swarm into the room crush your well laid plans, and maybe the boss fights. 

[Tveoh]

-twitches till he has to be tied down-    Alright..  first things first....

 

If you want easy mode then sure use CP to the max or any other thing that makes the enemies easier to kill.   Its always going to be a thing, that someone is going to find something that makes things easy.   Yet the why would you want to make things easy?   Go against the mold, and do things to make challanges even more challanging.  

 

Heck the TA sure would have been useful for CP but didn't run with it.  don't think anyone in the squad i was in had it.  I had EV and think there was at least one other from how energy was recharging.   The thing that made this TA a challange was the use of a heavy Blade, against Grineer.   Which given the damage types.  We needed puncture weapons to do the most damage yet all heavy blades are slash damage.  Not even sure we have a puncture melee anymore.  just slash and impact.     

 

Yet still won the mission, with a forst excal nyx and nova( me that i was leveling up xD).  The TA's are meant to be fun and different to get people to see the game in a different way.  Some are easy some are challanging.   But to compare them with how the raids are going to be is far to premature, and honestly if people running around with only CP on for those raids, is an issue DE could just restrict the number of auras in the missions allowing only like 2-4 of each one.  

 

And to say the TA was poorly designed around players with pretty much all the mods in the game.   Not really.   To truly get the best benefit out of those mods you tend to need to Forma a weapon at least twice (Some do require more, but most of mine i use have been optimized after just 2 forma)    And well I don't use the heavy blades, and none of them have forma.  Did take the scindo prime, but just had default mods on it to increase damage, think it was 800ish slash?   even then was using channeling to help with kills, cause my heavy weapons i don't use.  Haven't found a frame to use them on.  Cause i pair my weapons with frames that look like a good match.

 

But everyone is entiltled to their own opinion on the matter,  Yet when the complaints come in and don't have anything to offer as help to improve things, it doesn't make people take you seriously.  

 

That all being said.   Yes.  Raids in which everyone has CP could defeat the challange to a degree but CP doesn't reduce the amount of damage the enemies will be doing.   And the one Raid mission we did see, is a work in progress it could change, or more could be added.  Yet the best solution i could see that wouldn't be very hard given the equipment restriction code is already there is to restrict the number of aura's allowed to be taken into raid.  that way you can have other aura too to help balance things out.  

[IfritKajiTora]

Enemies need dmg limitation. Their health can be high high and high, but their armor and dmg should be limited. To be abble to survive, and no need to have Corrosive projection aura.

[Dubious.Wisp]

My one little gripe is that if youre a low MMR little guy, with not much behind you.....you are screwed.

 

All frames are viable. The game is fine. Its whats playing it, is what the problem is.

[Dr.Northy]

To make matters worse every thread is filled with 95% of players giving legitimate criticisms and suggestions, then everyone else going "LOL EZ WIN NOOBS GET GUD." 

 

Seriously?

 

We can't raise legitimate concerns without being mocked by some elitists? I've finished the damn event and it was absolutely depressing, I'm not filled with pride or rubbing it in people's faces. I had hundreds of hours of game time and equipment to back me up but it doesn't make me some god among men.

[sanj66]

You uh... you realize that enemies having extreme scaling for this tactical alert was a bug, right? And they turned it into its own thing because people liked it, right?

 

You need to stop taking this stuff so seriously.

you do realize thats what you got Q&A testers for and that is what they are paid to do? how many times has totally bugged content etc been put out, or unfinished stuff rushed out and then the classic oh it was a joke or they simply laugh it off, or they do some crap and fail and laugh it off? almost every time, its getting stale and lame, DE has lost its way, warframe is not what it used to be anymore, like someone else said they are making money and now forget about the quality of content and just focusing on quantity, thus far the year of polish has miserably failed.

[sanj66]

This TA was Great fun and contrary to belief can be run with most frames, also this debate on raids is being blown way out of proportion. Who cares about the lvl 80 mobs used to fill the space between the awesome raid puzzles.

 

The escalation was wonderfully fun and skill based, figuring out how to mod frames with the 400cc restriction, the heart pumping action and focus required to not get 1shot. Yes you can CC the lvl150 mobs to a standstill and “easy mode” but the great thing about the game is you can play the way you want to, try thinking out of the box guys. AND THANKS DE GREAT JOB with the TA :D

using frames that can spam cc skills once you have the energy pool or to avoid damage is not skill based its just pressing a button to win, it does limit frame selection or rather pushes other frames ahead of others, spammable cc would always win, and frame skill usage would be limited to cc skills, why would anyone use their slash dash, shuriken etc, most 1's or even 2's may be almost if not useless, whats the point of creating content for use but then making them useless at challenging content? sure they should not be as they are to lower tiers but making them that useless is just making them baggage with no relevance. all that represents is extremely poor game design, as making enemies stronger via numbers and not stronger through a better ai will always generate a problem like that and then you negate your own content you spent time developing.

[KIREEK]

The smartest AI you could make would be one that runs away from you, there is no AI that can avoid massive AOE attacks.

What's the point of making the best AI with tactics and formations, when they die from javelin attacks?

[Davoodoo]

We actually have something in game that actually somewhat challenging if not that hard.

 

Archwing.

 

-Fast movement speeds allows you to avoid most dmg.

-Shields, hp and armor works if you mod for it.

-Gameplay doesnt revolve around ohko and perma cc.

-All options are viable, melee, guns and powers actually work, though powers were mostly relegated to support and defensive role(no magic space jets)

 

It aint perfectly balanced and it could give players better info about incoming missiles, etc.

But more or less its what skill based gameplay looks like.

 

ATTENTION

I know ill hear something i dont want to hear so inb4 that.

 

no, endgame shouldnt be archwings

 

Usually taking literally what someone else says is bad and ive seen examples of that in this thread already.

But this time take this literally

 

But more or less its what skill based gameplay looks like.

Edited February 28, 2015 by Davoodoo

[(PSN)NearlyDedicated]

So much complaining, this wasn't even that hard, I managed to win with only 3 people. And why is everyone so convinced that this is exactly what raids are going to be like? this was just something DE made for people who want an excessive challenge, calm the hell down.

 

This TA has nothing to do with Raids.

 

Yep./

 

which is why they are being marketed as endgame content

 

in fact. look at what is needed to beat any raid in any game. Check the strats and you'll see that they have reccommened gear, abilities, characters, levels, even where you are suppose to be.

 

Raids arent for new folk.

Or folk that like things easy

 

They, and this TA are geared towards people saying they need and want a challenge. But hey, every challenge is just a puzzle, once you find a solution that works, and you apply it... the challenge is gone, because you defeated it.

 

If you hate it. Dont play it.

Im still having a blast figuring out what works and what doesnt here for escalation.

[Hopakkiin]

I brought Oberon. OP is obviously a scrub.

Play it how you would like to play it, have fun AND win it.

Got the sigil. With Oberon.
4CPs is kinda sad, but still better than rifle Amp.

[---RNGesus---]

I didn't even kill a single enemy in the escalated one yet I did all rounds without having any squad mate down. Difficulty? What are you even talking about, Sir?  Boredom is the second name for this TA! Too lengthy alert for anyone I guess.

Edited February 28, 2015 by ---RNGesus---

[Xardis]

So what endgame do you want? Not hardcore and not casual coz it is endgame, also not normal diff coz it is endgame too. Look at WoW endgame and dont tell me that it is not similar to what you see in the tactical. 1 mistake can lead to wipe, you gotta now the game well and be maxed out to participate. Come on, you sound just like a hypocrite.

Edited February 28, 2015 by Xardis

[Lactamid]

One rhino with max range and duration + energy restores. Enemies flying in air untill the end.

[(PSN)RedChili69]

Never met a bigger bunch of babies before ever joining the Warframe community.

[Davoodoo]

So what endgame do you want? Not hardcore and not casual coz it is endgame, also not normal diff coz it is endgame too. Look at WoW endgame and dont tell me that it is not similar to what you see in the tactical. 1 mistake can lead to wipe, you gotta now the game well and be maxed out to participate. Come on, you sound just like a hypocrite.

What i want for gameplay, idk

 

-managing energy, hp, shields and ammo.

-avoiding getting hit without disabling enemies

-bullet sponge boss which also pose some actual threat

-bringing every frame i might like

-having a choice of pistol, shotgun, sniper, bow, assault rifle, mg and machine pistol which will perform as good as best weapon, after that more choice will be welcome as always.

-no keys

 

These are my 1st thoughts.

 

Seriously you make it sound like boss on wow oneshots tank while tank role is to keep boss permamently stunned to prevent that and healers are there to provide mana for tank so he can continue stunning.

Edited February 28, 2015 by Davoodoo

[Scarabatica]

What i want for gameplay, idk

 

-managing energy, hp, shields and ammo.

-avoiding getting hit without disabling enemies

-bullet sponge boss which also pose some actual threat

-bringing every frame i might like

-having a choice of pistol, shotgun, sniper, bow, assault rifle, mg and machine pistol which will perform as good as best weapon, after that more choice will be welcome as always.

-no keys

 

These are my 1st thoughts.

 

Then perhaps Warframe isn't for you?

 

I personally loved the alert. It forced everyone to think outside of the box, and the number of really cool and unique strategies everyone used has been great to read about. So many different options to win. Some of them have been incredibly clever.

[Davoodoo]

Then perhaps Warframe isn't for you?

 

I personally loved the alert. It forced everyone to think outside of the box, and the number of really cool and unique strategies everyone used has been great to read about. So many different options to win. Some of them have been incredibly clever.

Maybe it forced you to think outside the box, but since open beta started we constantly used the same tricks were using now to fight high lvl enemies.

This alert havent introduced anything new with difficulty, it simply given majority of playerbase a reason to even attempt higher lvl enemies.

 

 

Also this list have 4 principles which are pretty much a benchmark of challenge.

Edited February 28, 2015 by Davoodoo

[Dirty_H4rr1]

easy going with right team

u just have to have to have a modded loki or Nova or Hydroid or oberon or excal or trinity or u can join without any good gear if ur mates are good

the only must have is corrosive projection

 

Not even corrosive projection is needed, I did it with pubs who didn't have it, neither did I, and got it right in the first time.

[PookieNumnums]

End game content is end game

It's more about using your mind than your axe

All the antiraid sentiment boils down to plebbery in my opinion

[Scarabatica]

Maybe it forced you to think outside the box, but since open beta started we constantly used the same tricks were using now to fight high lvl enemies.

This alert havent introduced anything new with difficulty, it simply given majority of playerbase a reason to even attempt higher lvl enemies.

 

So if you're having such a boring/not fun time, why are you still playing?

 

The escalation was set as a fun 'joke' challenge by the DE team following a glitch that spawned mobs at those levels. There's no grand conspiracy behind it around raids, or gauging people's effectiveness at them. You are reading far too much into this.

 

If you have such an easy time rolling through it... congrats, really. Here's your merit badge and round of applause.

 

For a bunch of other people (myself included), it involved a bit of thought around tactics and planning. There were multiple teams and setups that made the alert possible - it encouraged creativity. My team was far from 'an arsenal full of mods' and we were able to get through it with teamwork.