KIREEK Posted March 12, 2015 Share Posted March 12, 2015 TL:DR - No method is going to be shared, even if it was no one would actually do it due to it's annoying nature After the nerf, i did 2 runs just to test how was the new mission, on the 2nd test however i noticed something in particular that cause enemies to spawn and today i decided to do a full team and test this properly as a pos-nerf farming solution. The team setup is pretty much the same, one kills, one creates more loot and one collects the loot, the 4th player (me) and as the only one who knew what to do, did something that is considered by ingame mechanics as "mission progress" Only when "progressing" will enemies spawn, however and despite figuring out the method, i can say it is beyond insane especially with the afk detector affecting more things than just exp and energy, i kid you not, this 10 (+-) minute run was more troublesome and anoying than a 50 minute run pre nerf. Not only this, but preparing the game in the squad chat takes some time, especially when you have to teach MR18 players or close that they need to move so that the afk timer resets and they can pick up energy again. Even when expalining this basic concept (moving around, rolling and other "very difficult" moves) i still had to deal with complains in chat that they weren't getting energy as if i could solve the problem. I have to bypass the afk system to gather either exp or something else (not going to mention it obviously), so i still had to move, do my thing and chat and explain that only they can move the characthers. Explaining causes enemies to stop spawning, that leads to more complaining. In other words, this new method, you can't go trully afk, far from it, the 4th player that needs to do something specific can't even blink or use a macro, so while everyone is jumping around once every 2 minutes, you have to do something every freaking second, jumping and explaing how to use the WASD keys, making the entire gameplay repetitive and anything else far more appealing. Worst case cenario, the tactic i shared with some players get's leaked (because some ppl lack common sense) and then no one will ever take the 4th role, you can try the recruit chat for hours, you may see banshees, mags and nekros all ready, but no one will ever do what i just did. That happens because many don't know basic concepts of warframe mechanics, asking that very large majority to do this is simply asking for a ragequit as the role requires heavy responsibility, if you fail, nothing else works. The afk detection system is not great, it only made active players more annoyed, especially me. Maybe, just maybe there will be a team that will try and do this for an hour or so, perfectly possible i guess and you may get around 600 mods maybe, i've seen many ppl fight boredom in survivals, so i wonder if there is actually a team that can get this done. Does Egate need another nerf? not really as this won't be abused, there are not that many competent players out there so to you DE, relax, you won't be seeing players do this mission to farm, raids are likely easier to do than this and they might be less stressfull for all the players involved. Is Egate dead? For the majority, obviously yes If you happen to be one of those who missed Egate (and other excavation locations) for months and now you're complaining that other players gained an unfair advantage then you still have an opportunity to reduce the gap, it depends on your persistance or motivation as egate can still provide plenty of loot while keeping the enemy level really low, but remember that one thing is knowing how to do it, another is doing it. Egate is still a viable solution for farming, but it is out of the reach for the majority of the players, if you are the minority then you likely found out the same thing i did and you already know what i'm talking about. Asking someone who knows will not help you if you can't make it happen. In short, what makes egate bad atm? (for farming that is) - Longer recruiting and tactic explanation on squad chat - General player skill level and knowledge on game mechanics - afk detection system - less efficient and irregular spawn rates, creating less loot than before - high degree of responsibity and focus on all team members (especially on the 4th role) - the ammount of effort is far higher Don't get me wrong, i didn't hate the experience afterall we did go for a few minutes, i mainly did it because i kinda wanted to show the power that low MR players have, as a MR9 player i felt pretty good to teach these high MR players how to do things, finding out the method to do it was also great, egate today was a totaly new experience and i was amazed that i was still able to farm. Nothing impressive i guess, but we didn't go for very long either. http://s22.postimg.org/ot59866gf/Warframe_2015_03_12_16_01_24_42_changed.png There will always be a Loot Cave DE, but this one you have to dig pretty deep. 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VirtualJunky Posted March 12, 2015 Share Posted March 12, 2015 (edited) Start an extractor close to the farm spot, dont finish it, but no mobs kill it because nothing gets close to it. Objective is still 'active' in the eyes of the game, there for mobs endlessly spawn. Move every 120 seconds to avoid AFK timer. Can't afk but still &!$$ easy to do. Yesterdays patch did nothing but stop people from afking it really. But I think 15.16.2.1 today will fix that. Edit: /thread Edited March 12, 2015 by VirtualJunky Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Llyssa Posted March 12, 2015 Share Posted March 12, 2015 Oh the horrors. Seriously, if you guys want to improve the game, you should be yelling about iron skin, not going "oh, but we can still farm!" Farming(especially something silly like e gate farming) has no real effect on other players. Iron skin being broken screws over the whole community through how badly it effs up meta. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZackNeutron Posted March 12, 2015 Share Posted March 12, 2015 Oh the horrors. Seriously, if you guys want to improve the game, you should be yelling about iron skin, not going "oh, but we can still farm!" Farming(especially something silly like e gate farming) has no real effect on other players. Iron skin being broken screws over the whole community through how badly it effs up meta. This ^ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Habba Posted March 12, 2015 Share Posted March 12, 2015 Start an extractor close to the farm spot, dont finish it, but no mobs kill it because nothing gets close to it. Objective is still 'active' in the eyes of the game, there for mobs endlessly spawn. Move every 120 seconds to avoid AFK timer. Can't afk but still &!$$ easy to do. Yesterdays patch did nothing but stop people from afking it really. But I think 15.16.2.1 today will fix that. Edit: /thread Well , no ... tried that , when the excav runs out of energy the mobs abruptly stop spawning . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SquirmyBurrito Posted March 12, 2015 Share Posted March 12, 2015 Oh the horrors. Seriously, if you guys want to improve the game, you should be yelling about iron skin, not going "oh, but we can still farm!" Farming(especially something silly like e gate farming) has no real effect on other players. Iron skin being broken screws over the whole community through how badly it effs up meta. What happened to iron skin? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VirtualJunky Posted March 12, 2015 Share Posted March 12, 2015 Well , no ... tried that , when the excav runs out of energy the mobs abruptly stop spawning . Eh worked for me last night. But who knows, it's not really needed anymore. No one wants to do it anymore because they can't afk it for 45 minutes+ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Azure.M Posted March 12, 2015 Share Posted March 12, 2015 Well , no ... tried that , when the excav runs out of energy the mobs abruptly stop spawning . If power carriers stop spawning when you run out of power where are you meant to get power from? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
(PSN)Onder6099 Posted March 12, 2015 Share Posted March 12, 2015 Hmmm, looks like girls below are more important then your picture. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Valiant Posted March 12, 2015 Share Posted March 12, 2015 If power carriers stop spawning when you run out of power where are you meant to get power from? This is the problem I was concerned about but assumed DE wouldn't be thick enough to stop spawns from spawning whilst the extractor is awaiting power after being deployed. Sincerely hope this is not true. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KIREEK Posted March 12, 2015 Author Share Posted March 12, 2015 Can this be moved to general discussion, i posted in the wrong subforums by mistake Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Demonfr34k Posted March 12, 2015 Share Posted March 12, 2015 Oooooooou. This E-Gate fix is going to make Excavtion quests like Limbo alot easier to Solo >:3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KIREEK Posted March 12, 2015 Author Share Posted March 12, 2015 If power carriers stop spawning when you run out of power where are you meant to get power from? It's impossible to run out of energy, trust me, i know. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Azure.M Posted March 12, 2015 Share Posted March 12, 2015 It's impossible to run out of energy, trust me, i know. It's definitely possible. I've had games (before this patch) on both Earth and Europa tilesets where the enemies just don't want to spawn properly, only occasionally sending in a small group of troops and the extractor was just sitting there out of power because we couldn't find any power carriers. Usually it sorts itself out eventually but if it stops spawning completely now then what can you do except abort the mission? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KIREEK Posted March 12, 2015 Author Share Posted March 12, 2015 What can you do? You can find energy. ;) Even when enemies stop spawning, there is energy, trust me. Best i can tell you without giving to much information is that enemies will spawn if you progress in the mission. If you think about what makes a sucessfull extractor and you fragment the goal into tiny steps, you will figure out why you always have energy. It's probably so obvious your not even considering it, but it's the reason why the mission keeps going forward and if it keeps going forward, enemies will spawn. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Valar.Morghulis Posted March 12, 2015 Share Posted March 12, 2015 Oh the horrors. Seriously, if you guys want to improve the game, you should be yelling about iron skin, not going "oh, but we can still farm!" Farming(especially something silly like e gate farming) has no real effect on other players. Iron skin being broken screws over the whole community through how badly it effs up meta. Iron Skin being broken only affects players that choose to relies on it instead of playing the game, this is similar to the problems with Snow Globe and Hysteria. Any skill that makes the player invulnerable to damage for a period of time needs to be rebalanced. I suspect the reason these abilities have been ignored because the fix would up set players more then just leaving them in a somewhat crippled state. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LascarCapable Posted March 12, 2015 Share Posted March 12, 2015 Moved to general discussion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darkholde Posted March 12, 2015 Share Posted March 12, 2015 I was going to guess that the 4rth person runs to start an excavator and let it get destroyed. Then run to next excavator to repeat. Eventually though you will also have to run to power the scanner. This way it keeps the mission going but since your not actually completing any extractors the enemy levels won't rise, but by starting news ones to get destroyed you are technically continuing the objective. So that fourth person will have to be running around like a mad man to keep everything started / scanned and as he is running back and forth, stop by the Mag to get loot. This is also why no one will want to play the linch pin fourth person that has to do the running. I haven't tried this, but I suspect this will work. DE's fix though is successful, because as the OP said, no one would want to do the 4rth man's job. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kartumterek Posted March 12, 2015 Share Posted March 12, 2015 TL:DR - No method is going to be shared, even if it was no one would actually do it due to it's annoying nature After the nerf, i did 2 runs just to test how was the new mission, on the 2nd test however i noticed something in particular that cause enemies to spawn and today i decided to do a full team and test this properly as a pos-nerf farming solution. The team setup is pretty much the same, one kills, one creates more loot and one collects the loot, the 4th player (me) and as the only one who knew what to do, did something that is considered by ingame mechanics as "mission progress" Only when "progressing" will enemies spawn, however and despite figuring out the method, i can say it is beyond insane especially with the afk detector affecting more things than just exp and energy, i kid you not, this 10 (+-) minute run was more troublesome and anoying than a 50 minute run pre nerf. Not only this, but preparing the game in the squad chat takes some time, especially when you have to teach MR18 players or close that they need to move so that the afk timer resets and they can pick up energy again. Even when expalining this basic concept (moving around, rolling and other "very difficult" moves) i still had to deal with complains in chat that they weren't getting energy as if i could solve the problem. I have to bypass the afk system to gather either exp or something else (not going to mention it obviously), so i still had to move, do my thing and chat and explain that only they can move the characthers. Explaining causes enemies to stop spawning, that leads to more complaining. In other words, this new method, you can't go trully afk, far from it, the 4th player that needs to do something specific can't even blink or use a macro, so while everyone is jumping around once every 2 minutes, you have to do something every freaking second, jumping and explaing how to use the WASD keys, making the entire gameplay repetitive and anything else far more appealing. Worst case cenario, the tactic i shared with some players get's leaked (because some ppl lack common sense) and then no one will ever take the 4th role, you can try the recruit chat for hours, you may see banshees, mags and nekros all ready, but no one will ever do what i just did. That happens because many don't know basic concepts of warframe mechanics, asking that very large majority to do this is simply asking for a ragequit as the role requires heavy responsibility, if you fail, nothing else works. The afk detection system is not great, it only made active players more annoyed, especially me. Maybe, just maybe there will be a team that will try and do this for an hour or so, perfectly possible i guess and you may get around 600 mods maybe, i've seen many ppl fight boredom in survivals, so i wonder if there is actually a team that can get this done. Does Egate need another nerf? not really as this won't be abused, there are not that many competent players out there so to you DE, relax, you won't be seeing players do this mission to farm, raids are likely easier to do than this and they might be less stressfull for all the players involved. Is Egate dead? For the majority, obviously yes If you happen to be one of those who missed Egate (and other excavation locations) for months and now you're complaining that other players gained an unfair advantage then you still have an opportunity to reduce the gap, it depends on your persistance or motivation as egate can still provide plenty of loot while keeping the enemy level really low, but remember that one thing is knowing how to do it, another is doing it. Egate is still a viable solution for farming, but it is out of the reach for the majority of the players, if you are the minority then you likely found out the same thing i did and you already know what i'm talking about. Asking someone who knows will not help you if you can't make it happen. In short, what makes egate bad atm? (for farming that is) - Longer recruiting and tactic explanation on squad chat - General player skill level and knowledge on game mechanics - afk detection system - less efficient and irregular spawn rates, creating less loot than before - high degree of responsibity and focus on all team members (especially on the 4th role) - the ammount of effort is far higher Don't get me wrong, i didn't hate the experience afterall we did go for a few minutes, i mainly did it because i kinda wanted to show the power that low MR players have, as a MR9 player i felt pretty good to teach these high MR players how to do things, finding out the method to do it was also great, egate today was a totaly new experience and i was amazed that i was still able to farm. Nothing impressive i guess, but we didn't go for very long either. http://s22.postimg.org/ot59866gf/Warframe_2015_03_12_16_01_24_42_changed.png There will always be a Loot Cave DE, but this one you have to dig pretty deep. so instead of doing the honorable thing and submitting this to DE for investigation and proper implementation of a fix, you come here just to /point a finger at DE and say that you can still do it? is that the point of your post? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
(PSN)Pengu_Imperialus Posted March 12, 2015 Share Posted March 12, 2015 I was going to guess that the 4rth person runs to start an excavator and let it get destroyed. Then run to next excavator to repeat. Eventually though you will also have to run to power the scanner. This way it keeps the mission going but since your not actually completing any extractors the enemy levels won't rise, but by starting news ones to get destroyed you are technically continuing the objective. So that fourth person will have to be running around like a mad man to keep everything started / scanned and as he is running back and forth, stop by the Mag to get loot. This is also why no one will want to play the linch pin fourth person that has to do the running. I haven't tried this, but I suspect this will work. DE's fix though is successful, because as the OP said, no one would want to do the 4rth man's job. I can't help but laugh when they change something for a farm. i'd rather goof around and casually picking up stuff. Ya know enjoying the game. And the quick fix to what your saying is for DE to make enemy level increase per destroyed extractor, or that's what I'd do in there place. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tutzdes Posted March 12, 2015 Share Posted March 12, 2015 And the quick fix to what your saying is for DE to make enemy level increase per destroyed extractor, or that's what I'd do in there place. It will totally ruin the mode for players who could barely defend extractors on some easier tiles/locations. Considering, the excavation is already very hard for a new players... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darkholde Posted March 12, 2015 Share Posted March 12, 2015 (edited) I can't help but laugh when they change something for a farm. i'd rather goof around and casually picking up stuff. Ya know enjoying the game. And the quick fix to what your saying is for DE to make enemy level increase per destroyed extractor, or that's what I'd do in there place. Very true, but I suspect they won't need to as they will find no one is farming it anymore because no one wants to do the 4rth mans job. Overall it just won't be an issue anymore because the people that wrecked it and caused the patch in the first place were the afk farmers. Now though if you want to farm it your whole group will have to be active to achieve that, which to me leaves this in just the right spot because it will be boring active farming that few will have the patience / determination to do which most definitely won't be the afk farmers. And if they were to make it so enemy level increases per extractor (destroyed or not) that would make excavations harder with much less reward which would also decrease player desire to run those missions. It would be counter productive to encouraging players to play the star map. Edited March 12, 2015 by Darkholde Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KIREEK Posted March 12, 2015 Author Share Posted March 12, 2015 (edited) so instead of doing the honorable thing and submitting this to DE for investigation and proper implementation of a fix, you come here just to /point a finger at DE and say that you can still do it? is that the point of your post? No, that i added at the end but that isn't the main goal. You see, everyone is complaining even those who only know about the issue recently, but the place is still farmable, you just need a decent amount of effort, in fact, if someone came out of there with 1000 mods you could say for sure that they worked hard to get those mods, a change would make no sense. But i also do not want a change, i just want to be accurate on the entire egate farming, but that doesn't mean i will post a guide or record a video telling it, that is obviously left for players without common sense. You can still farm it, but that is only for those who really want to. If however i find players of equal dedication and the afk timer gets a change then hell yeah, i will head there again, right now i'm tired. The programer that made these changes knows exactly what is considered "progression", a change would be pointless and could compromise the actual mission progress, least we want is a mission that stalls. In the end the mission is balanced, not everyone can do it. I was going to guess *stuff* The hints are there in the 1st post, but you have to read it. If i suffered with the afk timer, why would i suffer when going to extractors or scanners? True those are considered "mission progress", but i still did mission progress whithout those. But like you said, no one will try it, it's an unintentional balance, the farming spot is still there but many won't bother. Edited March 12, 2015 by KIREEKPSO Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KIREEK Posted March 12, 2015 Author Share Posted March 12, 2015 (edited) No one should tell others how to play the game. It's a personal experience, each person plays the way they want and it's irrelevant if others like it or not. I'm not telling you how to play warframe am i? then why don't you do the same? Edited March 12, 2015 by KIREEKPSO Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
--MZez-- Posted March 18, 2015 Share Posted March 18, 2015 I just lold Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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