Petition To Return (Add) 2 Regular Mod Slots To Frames.

[vaugahn]

I had an idea like that once. But someone else pointed out the flaws, even when others thought it was a good idea.

 

It's that you're shoehorning people into using certain mods on certain slots. They become a necessity outright by the system, rather than player choice, all because they have slots that are exclusive to them and limits player choice in that sense. Unless you've got another idea in mind?

 

I was thinking 4 augment slots if we're talking specialization. One per each power, and each augment slot still costing mod points. That way, when more augments come out for each power, we can see players specializing their builds further, but also having cost applied with the mod points. We get diversity of power usage (so long as those augments actually do something useful and different), and players get to specialize more.

 

I think for the dedicated slots idea, it depends on the number of slots for each category and balance among mods in a category. If you have a somewhat-limiting amount of slots in a category with equally-useful mods, it works well. But in the current system, no, it would not work. That's mainly because of the bad balance between mods though.

 

I would like augment slots for each power, though I don't think they should draw from mod points. This next part is just my opinion so take it with a grain of salt, but ideally augments should specialize an ability at the cost of something else. Despoil is my idea of a good augment, in that it could cost zero points and it would still be a tradeoff. 

[shut]

Just for the record, your rarity is out of order: 4-ability builds were very uncommon, and usually it's 1-2 ability builds.

And to that, most buids were 1-trick-pony style:

Desecrate Nekros

Swarm Hydroid

EV Trinity

{RJavlin, RBlind} Excal

Globe Frost

{Invisibility, Disarm} Loki

{Chaos, Absorb} Nyx

MPrime Nova

Miasma Saryn

{Bastille, Vortex} Vauban

Shield Volt

Bladestorm Ash

Sonar Banshee

...

 

Ah, I completely forgot about the standard Desecrate/Globe/MPrime builds! Thanks for correcting me.

[Somi_xD]

What if augment slots GAVE you mod points? like auras?

Would Be to powerfull with 2 slots. 1 Augment slot like the Aura Mod would be not that bad.

 

Lets say you would polarize ALL 8 slots and with (only as an example) pure duration + good efficiency build

would cost around 50-54 points.  But does anybody polarize all slots ?

I think the idea of 2 additional fixed polarity ( Zenurik) slots is better.

[AlphaHorseman]

I think for the dedicated slots idea, it depends on the number of slots for each category and balance among mods in a category. If you have a somewhat-limiting amount of slots in a category with equally-useful mods, it works well. But in the current system, no, it would not work. That's mainly because of the bad balance between mods though.

 

I would like augment slots for each power, though I don't think they should draw from mod points. This next part is just my opinion so take it with a grain of salt, but ideally augments should specialize an ability at the cost of something else. Despoil is my idea of a good augment, in that it could cost zero points and it would still be a tradeoff. 

Haha, what with there being Corrupted, Nightmare, Rare, and Prime mods, balancing them will be one heck of a job by DE.

 

Hmm, sounds interesting. So long as all the powers maintain or increase their level of scale ability, then it could be a system that works. How aumgents are now though, what with them being choatic in terms of usefulness and scale ability, I'd be hard pressed to say it would work.

 

What could help out a lot is if DE makes a balanced system upon release from the get-go. Even if a system is new in its introduction, ensuring that it has balanced characteristics to build off of as a foundation would do wonders for keeping stability in the game. Of course, game design, I would imagine, isn't so simple.

[philsillius]

to address a different focus in the topic.. the fact that people still mod for 1-2 skills even if all skills are now open is probably because theres not much synergy between the warframe powers. with excal 2.0 maybe they'll start looking into improving skill synergy which would also include other warframe mods and not just the abilities themselves (maybe finally do something about saryn's negative duration build not allowing for the other abilities).

 

as for augment mod slots, i think one extra slot might be enough to open those tight tight warframes like chroma and personally, ash.

 

i havent read the other posts so ill edit as needed.

[ShawnV2]

Sorry but missions would become a joke. I could do amazing things with two extra mod slots. So i say no.

[Edgarhighman]

Sorry but missions would become a joke. I could do amazing things with two extra mod slots. So i say no.

Missions sure. But I play t4s for an hour, or wave 60 t4d, or round 18 t4i or 60 wave ODD. 

 

Players that prefer to take things further for more risk/reward, for challenge of play, for the fun of fighting harder enemies, testing your frame/weapons/skill to the limits. ... No point in NOT having 2 more slots. Anyone who doesn't go "further" in the game... why play? lvl 110+ is my goal in most/all wave/endless missions.

[GeoffFromAccounting]

Missions sure. But I play t4s for an hour, or wave 60 t4d, or round 18 t4i or 60 wave ODD. 

 

Players that prefer to take things further for more risk/reward, for challenge of play, for the fun of fighting harder enemies, testing your frame/weapons/skill to the limits. ... No point in NOT having 2 more slots. Anyone who doesn't go "further" in the game... why play? lvl 110+ is my goal in most/all wave/endless missions.

 

DE has stated multiple times that those areas are not balanced for, and never will be balanced for.

[vaugahn]

Haha, what with there being Corrupted, Nightmare, Rare, and Prime mods, balancing them will be one heck of a job by DE.

 

Hmm, sounds interesting. So long as all the powers maintain or increase their level of scale ability, then it could be a system that works. How aumgents are now though, what with them being choatic in terms of usefulness and scale ability, I'd be hard pressed to say it would work.

 

What could help out a lot is if DE makes a balanced system upon release from the get-go. Even if a system is new in its introduction, ensuring that it has balanced characteristics to build off of as a foundation would do wonders for keeping stability in the game. Of course, game design, I would imagine, isn't so simple.

 

Yeah, obviously nothing is ever as easy as it looks.

 

In an ideal world, scaling would be built in to the powers. Something like "3 casts of Shock to kill enemies level 0-50, 4 to kill enemies level 50-100". I just pulled those numbers off the top of my head, but basically it should either be percentage-based or enemy scaling should be brought down by a significant amount. This would not only open up new playstyles, it would also make it a hek of a lot easier to determine balance points for players. 

[CaveCricket48]

DE doesn't want my dream of having Maglev in all of my warframe builds to be realized.

[----Fenrir----]

Nope, slots are fine. Well, there is something I would like to see. Adding a special utility slot that can only be used for utility mods would be nice. You know mods like "treasure hunter", "enemy radar", and similar mods that are utility only and currently basically never get used since they would take up the space of a mod directly influencing your combat effectiveness.

 

Adding a special mod slot only usable for utility mods (and can't be changed with forma) would not lead to power creep or balancing issues while giving poor currently mostly unused mods a change to see some action^^

[H.Katsura_999]

Augment slots would be the best.

 

They are restricted to augment mods only so you can free some slots if your using an augment right now.

 

8 normal mods slots are fine as they are.

 

not to many but at the same time not to short.

 

just balanced enough in that razor thin line between OP and under-powered.

Edited July 4, 2015 by H.Katsura_999

[Edgarhighman]

adding 2 slots would let simpler builds use things like fast deflection, maybe constitution, thiefs wit, you know... mods that don't get a chance because everythings focused on pwr str, range, duration, efficiency, maybe shield/vit/steel fiber in some cases, or even

 

Pflow/Rage/Qt takes 3 right there. add Redir? thats 4. Use vit/steel fiber to boost QT? 6 just for a suitable frame (will use less depending on the frames stats). then u got 2 mod slots for... ? 1 augment and maybe a max BR for pwr str? since just bout every frame needs str

[vaugahn]

adding 2 slots would let simpler builds use things like fast deflection, maybe constitution, thiefs wit, you know... mods that don't get a chance because everythings focused on pwr str, range, duration, efficiency, maybe shield/vit/steel fiber in some cases, or even

 

Adding two slots wouldn't make those mods any better. It would just let people focus on power strength/range/duration/efficiency even more. Simplier builds would get more of the benefits min-max builds get, and min-max builds would get even better. Fast Deflection, Thief's Wit, those mods would all still suck.

 

That's a problem with the mods themselves, not the amount of slots. Again, I think better mod balance and dedicated slots is the way to go here.

Edited July 4, 2015 by vaugahn

[AlphaHorseman]

Yeah, obviously nothing is ever as easy as it looks.

 

In an ideal world, scaling would be built in to the powers. Something like "3 casts of Shock to kill enemies level 0-50, 4 to kill enemies level 50-100". I just pulled those numbers off the top of my head, but basically it should either be percentage-based or enemy scaling should be brought down by a significant amount. This would not only open up new playstyles, it would also make it a hek of a lot easier to determine balance points for players. 

Percentage based sounds like a good route to take, especially in WarFrame for our Damage Frames. It would make them far more scale able and modding for them would result in some interesting combinations.

[blazinvire]

Maybe when we get more augments for each ability, we might get augment-only slots like Auras, but right now it seems kind of unnecessary -especially when they're still building the game.

[vaugahn]

Percentage based sounds like a good route to take, especially in WarFrame for our Damage Frames. It would make them far more scale able and modding for them would result in some interesting combinations.

 

That's what I thought at first, but the more I thought about enemy scaling the more I came to the conclusion that it would really be better if it didn't scale anywhere as fast. You could keep scaling low enough for flat-damage abilities to be relevant, and with enemies staying fixed in a certain range you'd suddenly know exactly how much damage everything was supposed to be dealing. 

[AlphaHorseman]

That's what I thought at first, but the more I thought about enemy scaling the more I came to the conclusion that it would really be better if it didn't scale anywhere as fast. You could keep scaling low enough for flat-damage abilities to be relevant, and with enemies staying fixed in a certain range you'd suddenly know exactly how much damage everything was supposed to be dealing. 

Sounds like a sound solution. I'd imagine maybe 80 would be the max? Since that's where we have our Raids putting enemy units.

[RealPandemonium]

Even with the new "all skills available" - after modding out a frame, you still use only 1-2 powers for the build you've made.

That's highly subjective; I use pretty much all of my frame's powers in a given mission.

 

 

with the Corrupted mods using powerfully negative de-buffs and trying to compete with the debuffs by using counter de-buff mods trying to increase range and power strength AND/or power efficiency, we get a nerfed out frame without enough mod slots.

I disagree with this.  I think people are just mislead about how to mod their frames.  

 

That being said, though, room for defensive and utility mods is scarce, but you could trade one or two of your power mods to make an alternative build work.  It just, you know, requires trade-offs.  I think trade-offs were what DE had in mind in the first place but players aren't really interested in most possibilities, and in most of the game, really.  The trade-offs we do have currently tend to be clunky or straight up unattractive, anyhow.  

[vaugahn]

Sounds like a sound solution. I'd imagine maybe 80 would be the max? Since that's where we have our Raids putting enemy units.

 

Honestly, I'd go even lower. I'd also cap health/armor/shields lower than damage output for normal units, but that's just me.

 

Even capping it at 80 would be better than what we have now. If we knew 80 was as strong as enemies got we could say "okay, this X is decimating level 80s, let's tone it down. Y is in the same range as it but can't kill level 40s, so let's tone it up a little". It would make balancing infinitely easier, especially for weapons.

 

This is starting to get very off-topic though. I think it would be a more appropriate discussion for your enemy changes thread. 

[BladeAsh]

I`d say add 2 augment slots since most builds have at least an augment... it would be a decent game changer.

[OnimaruX]

Two augment slots or riot DE.

[ThePresident777]

+1 OP.

[TheGuyver]

Eight slots are fine with me, it makes the mods you do pick even more important in your builds. While we don't have the same amount of variety as we used to, this feels a lot better to me. I would like an augment slot though regardless.

[S7ORM]

1-2 Augment slots, I can definitely support.

 

With the increasing number of mods available, I can see the argument for two more full slots being added shifting though, and would at least consider it.

I heard a fantastic idea -- allowing players to use Warframe augments in the Aura slots instead of an Aura.

That seems to me, like it would be an excellent option.

Alternative to that, I would also agree on ONE, not two, augment slot.