Cc Negatively Impacts The Game. (900 Words?)

[Sygnano]

1- How many players are able to do that?

2- How many players actually do it?

3- Why does it matter if some people actually gets there?

You talk as if they were cheating or something. Like texrei said, that's just a very well organized group of people going as far as they can. You're showing it yourself with that screenshot, they are all MR21. They have played a lot, so what's the problem if they want to see how far can they go? They are making their own end-game content, their own challenges, etc. The problem here is that people complaining about CC thinks everyone plays the game like that, like a perfectly organized machine and that doesn't happen as often as you think.

I, for example, have never used Draco, Viver, or anything like that to level up, get syndicate rep, focus or anything because I find it boring. That why after 2 years I'm still MR17, because I like to test each weapon, level them by myself, taking my time to do it.

Not everyone wants to go that far, because it's not fun, because it requires a lot of time, etc. And certainly not everyone can do that, not new players anyway. It's called progression, in order to reach that level of understanding of the game you have to had played the game for a long time, got all frames, all weapons, all mods, and used them a lot. 

 

the problem is that the current cc cater to those types of people which result in obliteration of early rounds

[KuroNekoXlll]

"The game is too hard without CC" I love how it has contradicted what I've been saying so far about "not needing CC" yet reaches the same conclusion that CC needs a rework.

The game is balanced around CC forcing you to have it or have a bad time. Hmm I should throw that into my OP somewhere.

[dmirtygorachyov]

Tell it to them pls.. maybe they stop one hitting everything that comes in their way then

 

You know why void defence rewards is terrible? Because garbage like this exists in the game and players call it strategy. Hope you have fun with your 4th forma bp after 2 hours.

Edited January 17, 2016 by dmirtygorachyov

[SicSlaver]

Oh man, it seems you're not the only one feeling this. In the general feedback section there's a 24 page thread about removing "cheese" from the game. I largely agree with the OP of that thread and have always wanted Trinity to be nerfed even further. High end content can become boring as hell when you try to be "efficient" and there are ways to completely cheat in this game. I had the misfortune to do a Sortie Interception where a Mirage just blinds the whole map and the Trinity just spams EV. At least I could just alt-tab and ignore them, lol, but those two poor souls had to endure that boredom? Strangely, they seemed to enjoy it....

 

And these "Trials" are balanced around this S#&$ style of gameplay. It's the worst. It's not about movement or dodging because they want you to stand on pads? WTF? Yeah, that's some extreme action right there. Standing still is quite ninja.

 

Off topic gripe: Not only that, they cheesed out what it meant to be ninja. They removed any skill needed for movement. Now we can just fly everywhere without actually trying to wallrun there.

Edited January 17, 2016 by SicSlaver

[Arenzo4]

Oh man, it seems you're not the only one feeling this. In the general feedback section there's a 24 page thread about removing "cheese" from the game. I largely agree with the OP of that thread and have always wanted Trinity to be nerfed even further. High end content can become boring as hell when you try to be "efficient" and there are ways to completely cheat in this game. I had the misfortune to do a Sortie Interception where a Mirage just blinds the whole map and the Trinity just spams EV. At least I could just alt-tab and ignore them, lol, but those two poor souls had to endure that boredom? Strangely, they seemed to enjoy it....

 

And these "Trials" are balanced around this S#&$ style of gameplay. It's the worst. It's not about movement or dodging because they want you to stand on pads? WTF? Yeah, that's some extreme action right there.

i haven't worked on my mirage, but id love using a blind build, tho id be moving, i do find standing on pads boring

[SicSlaver]

i haven't worked on my mirage, but id love using a blind build, tho id be moving, i do find standing on pads boring

The problem is that, if you don't stand on those pads, you fail the objective of the "Trial".

[Aurene]

you know what would be great? a love child of Nova and Vauban with 4 insane CC so people like you would finally press that uninstall button

[Pavelord]

Sorry but I don't see how nerfing or removing crowd control helps anything? If you want this to be more like bf or cod, then play those games instead. Warframe isn't meant to be like them at all, and whining to make it into one is rude not just to the rest of the players, but to DE as well. I know it said a lot but it holds true, Don't like it, Don't play it. No one forcing you to play a game you clearly don't like, so why are you even here whining to get one game turned into a clone of a totally different game? Well Warframe has it ups and downs, I wouldn't want it to be anything like bf or cod, I would want it to be Warframe. I'm not playing Warframe to play a space version of cod/bf, I'm playing Warframe because it is Warframe. You clearly want to be playing cod/bf, so go play them instead, as what you are whining for will destroy Warframe as a whole because removing/nerfing cc will mean DE will have to remake the game from the ground up and it has over two years of content in it as it. So maybe just maybe instead of whining for a game to be a clone of cod/bf, you go play them instead, Warframe will be better off without someone whining to have it changed into something it isn't.

It could conversely be said, that if someone thinks that this game is one where you want to be a murderous god, and that the game is there to anihilate mobs likes those musous games someone mention early, you can just as easily go spam powers in Apollodorus and stop polluting endgame with cheese tactics. What is the difference between a level 1 enemy that is perma cc'ed and one shotted froma level 100 that is also perma cc'ed and one shoted?, practically none. But that is not what this thread is about, is not about taking your power, nor cloning other games; everybody here loves warframe; but discussing this artificial progression that has brought about heavier grind

 

I think it is even more insulting when people chew in a week or quicker DE's hard work, of weeks or months and then go on saying there is nothing to do or that it was too easy and equipment is trash.

 

First we had void, then nightmare missions, then void 4 and trial and now sorties, and every time people came back saying those were easy, is as if people want this game to be like Destiny, where every update should bring completely new equipment and mods you have to grind for and render obsolete all your previous one.

 

So the game is not yours, and is not mine and figuratively not DE's, because we are all shaping the game, and power fantasy play is not desired a gameplay as you imagine it to be, and should not be the stick that measures the content and rewards that are given, and we are way past damage 2.0, mods 2.0 and parkour 2.0 and near damage 3.0 and starchart 2.0, the game is not strange to overhauls, the game would be fine.

[SicSlaver]

you know what would be great? a love child of Nova and Vauban with 4 insane CC so people like you would finally press that uninstall button

You think that's actually fun and desirable?

[Arenzo4]

The problem is that, if you don't stand on those pads, you fail the objective of the "Trial".

oh, your talking about raids, thought you meant energy pads, sorry for the misunderstanding

[texrei]

It's ok. People failing to repeatingly mashing 1 button sometimes. It just happens.

You know why your friend thought the game was hard? Because he didn't have CC.

 

Eh, this is something not relevant to what i said.

 

For this people who say CC-gaming is more rewarding: how? You don't get resources, mods and experience points (and focus and syndicate).

 

I have a strong feeling that all who wants general nerfs are playing a wrong game. Don't like it - don't play it. What you don't like is a base of the game.

And if you don't want to press one button only - press more, damn you. Honestly i don't see any people playing as efficient as they could, no one just presses one button staying inside a snowglobe with a spamming 2 Trinity near.

 

I often do Triton. And i move like crazy, picking up loot and dealing with nulls in melee, whichever warframe i play.

[ClinkzEastwood]

Eh, this is something not relevant to what i said.

 

For this people who say CC-gaming is more rewarding: how? You don't get resources, mods and experience points (and focus and syndicate).

 

I have a strong feeling that all who wants general nerfs are playing a wrong game. Don't like it - don't play it. What you don't like is a base of the game.

And if you don't want to press one button only - press more, damn you. Honestly i don't see any people playing as efficient as they could, no one just presses one button staying inside a snowglobe with a spamming 2 Trinity near.

 

I often do Triton. And i move like crazy, picking up loot and dealing with nulls in melee, whichever warframe i play.

CC is more rewarding because you can just leave a macro and go afk doing something else in the mean time. 

And do you aware that the people who play this game stick aroud on their first impression that this game is a fast paced shooter? Just watch big youtuber's impression on this game. All of them think that this game has solid gunplay, movement and skills.

The problem is, CC does not improve the fast paced shooter. It actually slow it down and reduce the game into 1 button mash until the timer run out.

 

 

 

Edited January 20, 2016 by [DE]Danielle
Removed hidden post

[Rakosta_Kai]

Yeah, but the problem is that when they put new content and items behind these "endgame" designs is the issue. The game is being designed and balanced around this S#&$ playstyle.

 It's been trending that way for a long, long time now.

And numerous complaints have been posted on these forums arguing that CC and CC based frames cheapen the challenge.

 

Likewise, DE has managed to employ Diminishing Returns on CC in one event.

 

So the fact remains that if the mobs in question don't have DR and players want the additional challenge... They need to practice restraint.

It is just that simple.

Asking that the game be changed because you can't keep yourself from pressing a button is patently stupid.

 

 

 

You have made yourself clear that you don't give a F*** about other people's thought. Then why do you even bother posting in a thread about player's perspective on the game?

 

You haven't figured that out?

 

Because the perspective in question is selfish, silly, and patently dumb.

It speaks of either:

an underlying lack of restraint on the part of the people requesting

an inherent laziness in not forming groups that conform to your expectations

...I really don't know how else to put that.

 

No matter how you slice it; it's wrong headed.

 

 

I'm not one to call players out, but since you are spewing garbage may aswell take it to the next step.  bleh bleh bleh

 

Oh, I think you attempted to do that last time and I made you look silly in the process.

I don't really have to take a conversation with you any further... You already proved my point.

 

Your opinions have no place in a balance discussion because you have no inkling on what balance is.

Saying, "I raid so my opinion has weight." is untrue. The percentage of players that raid in any game is only slightly higher than the percentage that pvp's.

Arguing that changes should be made to the whole game to convenience your raiding endeavors is dumb.

Couching that assertion inside a balance argument is incredibly dumb.

 

The fact that you think your opinion has more merit because you recruit a group and play a 30-ish minute game of Twister daily doesn't make you elite.

...It makes you elitist.

 

FWIW, Raiding ain't endgame... It's just raiding.

[texrei]

CC is more rewarding because you can just leave a macro and go afk doing something else in the mean time.

 

Another invalid argument. Tricky punishable methods can hardly be called a reword.

[-dicht.Amducias-]

So... what is endgame?

 

[Krion112]

-snip-

I Can't play the way I want because of the meta, as the game get's mechanics to fight meta which just ultimately hurts players who don't meta. Can't play the way I want because players like you feel threatened, and then fight with me about implementing change to bring my play-style to light.

 

You are the selfish one here, demanding the game never change. You are the selfish one here getting in the way of my play-style, when the way I want to change the game doesn't harm yours.

 

You're telling me to accept the game as-is, when my play-style is going without when it shouldn't be. I can't play the way I want. I'm gated by Sorties and Trials to get things like weapon variants, lenses, and arcanes, because those game-modes depend on the meta, they were designed to fight and slow down the meta-players. 

 

You're not against my play-style, when you're against the way I think the game should be? What I think the game should be is cater to all play-styles within the reason of what play-styles already exist, or the play-styles that should exist based upon existing mechanics, which it clearly doesn't right now, but you argue it shouldn't be that way, that is shouldn't cater to everyone? How is that not selfish and impeding to players who don't play like you?

 

I only expressed my system as an alternative to what the OP wanted, as he wanted to nerf CC powers, and my solution wouldn't necessitate that. I never said it was great, I only spoke of how it could potentially solve the issue without hurting anyone but the people who commit the meta that ruins the game for the rest of us. I'm not here looking for feedback on it, I was throwing it out there in opposition to the OP because I believe what he's aiming at changing would lead to unnecessary community uproar.

 

By your logic, that the game should never have this level of change, we would still be playing the same game Warframe was in closed beta. Warframe changes all the time; Parkour 2.0, Starchart 2.0, Mods 2.0, Damage 2.0, etc. There were inevitably people who were happy with all of those systems before they were changed, and yet they were changed anyway in an attempt to create a better game-play experience for as many people as possible.

As far as I can tell, those drastic changes didn't drive away any significant number of players, if any at all. If DE wants to change, they will, especially if there's a compelling way to do it.

 

 

-meow-

I already do intend to post my system in its own thread, once I've completed it, but I only brought it up here as, first, an argument against the OP, and second, because in an earlier argument I was asked how I would fix what I believe was wrong, and I therefore elaborated.

 

I also was using it in argument against you, because you seem to believe I want Warframe to be an entirely different game, but the change I'm asking for doesn't result in a different game altogether, it furthers my want for Warframe to cater to multiple play-styles like it's already supposed to.

[(PSN)horridhal]

I Can't play the way I want because of the meta, as the game get's mechanics to fight meta which just ultimately hurts players who don't meta. Can't play the way I want because players like you feel threatened, and then fight with me about implementing change to bring my play-style to light.

 

Actually, yes, you can.  You simply don't want to take the necessary steps required, exactly like the others in this thread, of using the tools at our disposal to form a group and make a non-meta group.  What is especially funny about these complaints is that I rarely run the meta and, yet, can keep up with players who do fairly easily.

 

Any gun can be powerful with multiple forma and a Potato.  Any frame can be viable (aside from the obvious Limbo) in any Tier mission and even Limbo has his uses in the late game.

 

 

The real issue is, again, people like you asking for the choice to be taken away from other players and forcing them into your playstyle instead of you actively making the choice to play your way now when both options are available and viable.  Of course you'll continue pretending such a thing is impossible when, in reality, it is entirely within the sphere of possibilities. 

Edited January 17, 2016 by (PS4)horridhal

[Krion112]

-snip-

Nope, can't play Sorties because it is designed to provide difficulty to players who enact the meta, and I can't play Trials because it's not allowed to be solo'd and the alternative is being matched up with the players who enact meta, because it is also designed to provide difficulty to the meta.

 

And I shouldn't have to hamper my builds in order to run content in a way that challenges me, because even doing that doesn't present challenge, it just presents tedium.

 

And the longer the meta goes on, the more game-play elements are going to be built to fight it. That's the only play-style I'm against, because it hurts all others, even when they avoid it.

 

Where have I said, at all, that I wanted to take choice from other players, forcing my play-style? Neither the system I proposed earlier on, nor the sentiment I have expressed have ever suggested I wanted to take away from other players. I don't want what the OP wants. I don't think nerfing CC will do us any good.

[-dicht.Amducias-]

Whats that -snip- btw? xD

[(PSN)horridhal]

Nope, can't play Sorties because it is designed to provide difficulty to players who enact the meta, and I can't play Trials because it's not allowed to be solo'd and the alternative is being matched up with the players who enact meta, because it is also designed to provide difficulty to the meta.

 

 

I solo'd almost every sortie that's come up on the PS4.  Haven't used anything of remarkable note.  It doesn't require the meta, it requires you to know how to play your frame.  Nyx can do extremely well in sorties but isn't considered part of the current "meta".  If it was required, she wouldn't work.  As for the trials, as stated, make your own group of like minded individuals.

 

 

 

And I shouldn't have to hamper my builds in order to run content in a way that challenges me, because even doing that doesn't present challenge, it just presents tedium.

 

 

So you are complaining because your 6 forma frames and weapons are actually powerful?  Amazing.  Again, the ability to make the game challenging is there, your decision to choose not to do so is just that, your decision.  Instead you are attempting to force your decision onto everyone else via coding in the game.

 

 

Again, there is viability in this game for multiple play styles.  You are ignoring that because you "don't think you should have to use it."

[Krion112]

-snip-

You misinterpret what I mean by it 'provides difficulty to meta'. I don't mean that it is even in the slightest difficulty for me, I mean that it is the same, tedious difficulty that does not express challenge to me. It does not cater to my play-style, it caters to the meta. Sorties and Trials don't exist for players like me, they exist for the meta. It doesn't require the meta, but it is still the same tedium.

Hence why I don't play it. I've only played two, full sorties, the first people stormed through it with meta, the second I beat it solo. Both times it was so dreadfully boring, and all I wanted was game-play that was challenging.

 

And hampering my builds isn't going to be challenging; if you play with a hampered build, the game is tedious, not challenging. I shouldn't have to make the game challenging anyway, it should present a challenge. Not necessarily to all players, but to players like me who want a challenge and not this tedium. There is no outlet for it at present, because the majority of the difficulty in Warframe is tedium, not challenge. Hence why my play-style goes without; my play-style depends on challenge.

 

I don't think I ever said it wasn't viable to play any other way but the meta, the meta just makes it easier, but it also adds mechanics that hurt normal players. A player like me didn't need things like Argon, Nitain, Nullifiers, etc shoved down my throat like it was because my play-style doesn't burn through content with a mindless tactic.

But meta players and complacent players demand that the entire game be kept mindless, so then my play-style goes without, and DE keeps adding more and more meta-combating mechanics that continue to hurt my play-style, by not adding any more content or by adding resources and caps on things I don't abuse.

[Otaiken]

It's never balanced let alone easily balanced. DR is a band aid solution for having either too strong of CC or too much CC in a game.

It's a crappy thing Blizzard started cuz they had no understanding of PvP in an MMO at the time.

 

What if there are two Nyx players? Right now they just separately tag with Chaos, with DR they cause the group to wipe. Prism Mirage and Excal: Mirage uses her Prism blind for CC, Excal mostly uses blind for damage bonus. Besides the Obv Slow & Stop what else goes into each category, Volt's 1 is technically a hard CC, Atlas 1 stagger is too, equinox aura, Valkyr 1 and 3 are hard CC, Fire quake, Stomp, Reckoning, Miasma, sonic boom, sound quake, the list goes on forever and many of these can be spammed, some are AoE. there's too much CC in this game to do DR and it's not a PvP game you'll only end up killing a group role.

 

Why is there a need for 2 frames spamming the same CC type at once? Why is that kind of thing being detrimental a bad thing? Either they're staying in the same place and hence only one needs to spam the CC (Excal will still get bonus agianst blinded enemies, just maybe not finishers) or they're in two separate spots in which case enemies they fight will not get affected CC resist. Having to think a bit more about ability spam is supposed to be a good thing, isn't it? You know... teamplay instead of having two Nyx's both spamming till their fingers fall off.

 

Secondly, I treat procs separately from ability CC. Volt's 1 is actually just a forced proc and hence doesn't scale with duration and since it doesn't  scale it doesn't need to be capped on enemies. Staggers are the same thing, melee staggers with every hit, that is not hard CC imho and again it doesn't scale so it wouldn't be affected. So is the case with Reckoning (short knockdown proc, DOESN'T SCALE... see the pattern here?). Valkyr's paralysis... proc, doesn't scale and on and on and on. If anything those abilities would become more valuable as it would be beneficial to mix the hard ability CC with some of the softer procced CC to avoid making enemies resistant, yay for teamplay!

 

Also, why is Oberon pretty much never used? Especially not as a CC frame? Because that kind of weak CC is laughable compared to what other frames can do. Again, capping the ability CC would at least give abilities like this some value on the CC market.

 

It's you who throws all CC into the same category here, not me. I said it could work if you properly separated the CC types so there's interplay between them. Capped hard CC? Throw in the slow, keep the pressure down with some procced CC here and there. It would require more thought, yes, but that is what would make it more interesting.

 

Lastly the CC resistance would simply scale with the CC intended duration. So a CC that lasts 30 seconds would affect the resistance more than a CC that lasts 7 seconds. This is to avoid Rhino spamming Stomp draining the resistance faster for the stronger CC abilities. 30 seconds stomp spam would result in the same CC resistance as one 30 second Chaos would.

 

This could work in Warframe pretty well. You keep citing Blizzard games, but do you honestly think we have the same character archetype dynamic here? Warframe is much simpler game. Again, the problem with CC chaining is that it makes every other role obsolete. You don't need competent DPS wehn all enemies are frozen, you have all the time in the world! You don't need a tank when enemies can't fight back. Scaling the CC down doesn't make CC role obsolete, it makes other roles actually matter.

Edited January 17, 2016 by LocoWithGun

[TangyBlueBerry]

I Can't play the way I want because of the meta, as the game get's mechanics to fight meta which just ultimately hurts players who don't meta. Can't play the way I want because players like you feel threatened, and then fight with me about implementing change to bring my play-style to light.

 

You are the selfish one here, demanding the game never change. You are the selfish one here getting in the way of my play-style, when the way I want to change the game doesn't harm yours.

 

You're telling me to accept the game as-is, when my play-style is going without when it shouldn't be. I can't play the way I want. I'm gated by Sorties and Trials to get things like weapon variants, lenses, and arcanes, because those game-modes depend on the meta, they were designed to fight and slow down the meta-players. 

 

You're not against my play-style, when you're against the way I think the game should be? What I think the game should be is cater to all play-styles within the reason of what play-styles already exist, or the play-styles that should exist based upon existing mechanics, which it clearly doesn't right now, but you argue it shouldn't be that way, that is shouldn't cater to everyone? How is that not selfish and impeding to players who don't play like you?

 

I only expressed my system as an alternative to what the OP wanted, as he wanted to nerf CC powers, and my solution wouldn't necessitate that. I never said it was great, I only spoke of how it could potentially solve the issue without hurting anyone but the people who commit the meta that ruins the game for the rest of us. I'm not here looking for feedback on it, I was throwing it out there in opposition to the OP because I believe what he's aiming at changing would lead to unnecessary community uproar.

 

By your logic, that the game should never have this level of change, we would still be playing the same game Warframe was in closed beta. Warframe changes all the time; Parkour 2.0, Starchart 2.0, Mods 2.0, Damage 2.0, etc. There were inevitably people who were happy with all of those systems before they were changed, and yet they were changed anyway in an attempt to create a better game-play experience for as many people as possible.

As far as I can tell, those drastic changes didn't drive away any significant number of players, if any at all. If DE wants to change, they will, especially if there's a compelling way to do it.

 

I feel like we came full circle here. Did I not already explained to you how I don't play meta? Or was that someone else who also attacked me personally? Not once have I felt threatened by any of you, however 3 people now have come on and directly made assumptions about me, you have judged how I play and you are wrong. I don't defend meta, not once have I said the meta should stay. Hell my main frame is Nyx, she isn't even part of any true meta team comp, but I still bring her everywhere.

 

Also yes you can play however you want regardless of meta, I do it all the time. Sorties can be done with any team comp, so can trials. There are videos of people doing trials with nothing but Hydroids, Embers, Oberons, Ash, etc. People doing "end game" content with the exact opposite of end game gear. Do not excuse yourself and pretend you are unable to enjoy the game because of others. The one holding you back is yourself. You can always play however you like, all it would take is a bit more effort on your part.

 

And I never said I wanted the game to never change. Read back, I explained how the game can still use improvements, but no need for any drastic changes like the ones you seem to hint too. Don't put words into my mouth (posts).

 

I will say, sorties are indeed difficult to solo without meta cheese, without meta cheese you would likely need friends which some people say it hard to do. At its hear this is a game meant to be fun with buddies in a squad, so this shouldn't be an issue. Personally I see nothing wrong with certain content designed to be impossible for single players. After all, promoting team play and rewarding co op is essential, this is a co op game not a single player game, at heart.

 

And stop calling me selfish, your just being rude. I honestly feel like the one threatened is you with your direct attacks.

[ROSING]

That's the other thing I forgot to say, people wanting nerfs forget how new players see the game. You, me and many others have been playing for years and as a result we all have lots of mods, almost every frame and weapon, so our perspective is completely different than what it was when we started.

New players won't have those super CC builds, they won't have those one-shot weapons multi-formaed and modded to the fullest for quite a long time (because the more content the game has, the more time it will take a new player to get everything needed for those builds).

When I started there was already quite a lot of content, and it took me a lot of time to get there (and there are some things that I still don't have), new players today have it a lot worse, as there is tons and tons of content there that they don't even understand at first, much less have access to.

That what progression is, I played for 2 years to get where I am now, it's not as if every new player can just start the game and take -insert x frame- already maxed and start playing the lvl 100 sorties...

Like I said, I understand not everyone sees the game in the same way, but changing now every CC means having to rework everything from the ground up, and I personally don't think it's something DE can do (and I hope they don't, as I enjoy the game as it is now. I don't want another generic Third Person Shooter with some powers on the side).

 

I don't think that any of the changes to CC proposed here will affect the new player experience that much...in fact, I would propose it would change it for the better. Lowered CC would mean faster paced and more challenging content, less grindwalls since farming isn't so ridiculously easy, and I don't really see core abilities being affected too much. It's things like the nightmare mods with min/maxing that are some of the things that really make the CC super-cheesed here, which isn't something new players would normally have.

 

Addressing the people who are defending the current state of the game, one of the more important points of the OP is that the ridiculous grindfest that Warframe is turning into is here primarily because of rampant cheesed CC. If CC is toned down and the grind is accordingly toned down with it, then I assure you that stances, mods and resources would require less tedium to acquire and more fun. The reason why all of these new stances are being made rare is because the units who have them are slaughtered with such alarming frequency using a CC spam team that if it was any lower than you would burn through half the content in a day. 

 

I don't CC spam, I play normally like some of you are advocating for. I don't instaquit when I join a group with rampant spamming, but all I want to do is get that rare mod. But by the time I get here, DE has made it the rarest tier with the rarest unit in order to counter the ridiculous cheesing of CC farming. And everyone suffers, because if these things weren't so able to be abused and things were easier to get, the spammers wouldn't have to grind so much,  I wouldn't have to grind so much, you wouldn't have to grind so much, we'd spend more time actually playing the game than turning it into Joe's button factory minigame on the same map for 3 straight hours a day.

 

 

I don't mean to sound like a mod, but both sides should keep discussion civil and attack the arguments, not the posters. Saying posts sound like a joke or arguing who is more hypocritical/self-entitled do nothing to further this discussion.

Edited January 17, 2016 by ROSING

[LeaserResael]

-Post-

I said it in a post before, if any of you think that DE will balance the drop tables according to the difficulty in a proportional way...  Let's just say you're being a bit innocent. DE's whole bussiness is making people to buy stuff, if you think for a second they will make content easier to obtain I'm sorry but that's not gonna happen (they've been saying they wanted to reduce the grind for years now...).

 

That's why I choose to be able to complete missions over and over until I get the part while having fun (I don't stay on one place pressing 1 button, but that doesn't mean I want CC nerfed to the ground) instead of having missions be "more challenging" (I'm honestly tired of people using that word, If you want challenge go play Dark Souls or Bloodborne, Warframe is a enjoy-being-a-killing-machine kind of game) while the drop tables get 1-2% better at most.

And again, it seems to me a lot of people in this thread clearly forgot how new players see the game and how much time it's required to get to a point where you can start feeling powerful (without spending money or having friends with everything already unlocked to "help" you speed up the process).

But whatever, people here are going in circles over and over and over again. It's pointless to keep posting, you all made your point already multiple times, so this is my last post here.

You want CC nerfed (or "re-balanced", ignoring that the whole game needs to change for that and a lot of people don't want that). A lot of people, me included, like the game how it is, and no "super idea of rebalance", no "super designed system" like some people claim, will change how I like to play. 

You have the option to play the game in a harder way if you want, the option is there. Changing the game will make a lot of people to stop enjoying the game with -no- options to keep playing the way they want.

In the end, like I already said, it all comes down to what benefits DE more. And they are the ones that will decide and quite frankly, I don't see them changing the whole game.

And if they do, I'll play it and see if I still enjoy it. If I do, good. If I don't I will probably post about it once or twice and then leave the game. I won't continuously fight or insult others to get what I want (like some posters on this thread).

 

I'm out.

Edited January 17, 2016 by LeaserResael