Sick of Nitain?

[Arenzo4]

Just now, Tesseract7777 said:

 

Your luck is pretty standard. Some people I've talked to have horrendous luck with Argon but it's pretty rare. Usually most people will net at least one (if not more) from 10 minutes of survival or 10 waves of defense even without any loot manipulation. 

then how is a resource you can get 4 of max per day easier to get than one where you can get one in 10 waves or lsee of a T1D/ 10 minutes or less in T1s?

[Mastikator2]

3 minutes ago, Kuestenjung said:

Nitain is way easier to get AND keep then Argon. If any recourse slows down progress then it is Argon and not Nitain.

Do I like the implementation and how DE is handling Nitain lorewise, No.

Is it bad, No.

If you need Nitain and don't have enough you're screwed, if you log in at random hours and play for 1 hour there's a 12.5% chance that you'll see a nitain alert. That's less than 1 per week.

In 1 hour I can get 2-3 argon crystals reliably, even with losing 1 every day that's still a much bigger build up over time. The fact is that Nitain screws over casual players.

[Kuestenjung]

Just now, Arenzo4 said:

I agree on the keep part, but do i have stupidly good luck with argon or something? i go into a defence and usually get an argon in 5 waves if not then definitely 1 or more in 10 waves

And If I play these 10 waves there is usually 1 Nitain alert. Yes you can get more Argon in time then Nitain, but you can´t "farm" it, do Nitain alerts if they are up and you have it when you need it but every time a new weapon/frame needs Argon I have to go to the void, which I personally don´t like.

It´s all about personal preferences and people should stop to cry over so little things.

[Tesseract7777]

4 minutes ago, Arenzo4 said:

then how is a resource you can get 4 of max per day easier to get than one where you can get one in 10 waves or lsee of a T1D/ 10 minutes or less in T1s?

 

I don't know when I said or implied it was easier to get? 

 

My point is that Argon is easy to get, and that originally it was meant to fulfill Nitain's purpose: Be difficult to obtain/build up and timegate things to encourage spending from the whales. 

Then, getting Argon became so obviously easy (you just have to do one void mission most of the time) that they added Nitain to add real timegating. And my point is that the timegating is fair, because they have to make money somehow, and since you can get everything eventually without paying, it isn't P2W. Nitain is also reliable enough to acquire, as it shows up multiple times every day. 

 

However, one almost could argue that Nitain is easier to "get" long term, because you could presumably stockpile a very large amount of Nitain, whereas that is literally impossible with Argon, as it decays over time. 

Edited February 23, 2016 by Tesseract7777

[Arenzo4]

2 minutes ago, Kuestenjung said:

And If I play these 10 waves there is usually 1 Nitain alert. Yes you can get more Argon in time then Nitain, but you can´t "farm" it, do Nitain alerts if they are up and you have it when you need it but every time a new weapon/frame needs Argon I have to go to the void, which I personally don´t like.

It´s all about personal preferences and people should stop to cry over so little things.

while you are right there, imo there is less of a chance of a nitain alert to spawn in the 10 minutes it takes to play those missions

though this is coming from someone who practically lives in the void

[RakuyoExcelsior]

Nitain extract is one of those materials that are slow to get until you actually built what you need. After that you will never need it ever again. I built what I wanted and now I sit at a few tens of nitain extracts (In fact I think I stopped noticing nitain extract alerts as a whole)

[Arenzo4]

13 minutes ago, Tesseract7777 said:

I don't know when I said or implied it was easier to get? 

 

 

OK so this confused me aswell, because you didn't, it was an error on my part that was me assuming something, and not double checking the name of the person i quoted

I responded to someone who wasn't you, and then you responded to my response, I assumed you were the person i responded to and i didn't look at the the name when i quoted, I am sorry

Edited February 23, 2016 by Arenzo4
mistake

[Firetempest]

They time gate it so its slow to collect yet you can horde it. It's different from Argon since it causes reliable log-ins daily tell you have enough. Argon while you cant horde it can be collected in a single day for new items. It's all about log-ins and possibly giving you a discount to encourage spending.

I think they should just have two 12h alerts per day for it. One AM, one PM. Always a chance to get at least 1 a day. All its doing is making the alert menu more chunky with mandatory unique items used for a dozen other items. Can't see it as the last item they make to do this either. Wait tell they make items that not only need daily Nitain, then the every other day Ainian extract from alerts, then the Weekly Inaina extract alerts.

Or just make it a daily quest from a hub as just one more reason to funnel players into them.

[tolivetodie]

Do you even ARGON BRO?

[Naruchico]

Maybe they should add it to extractions drop tables, at least it makes sense since it is an extract, the alerts can stay but at least give us a consistent option, the rate doesn't have to be great, but it would make it so there is a non-time dependent way of obtaining it

[X3Evanescence]

Considering that Nitain Extract is produced by ocean-vent dwelling micro-organisms, wouldn't it be lore friendly to introduce it as a resource in Uranus? Maybe since it is so painstaking to produce, have a mission type where we raid a lab to steal them.

[HalfDarkShadow]

7 hours ago, Naruchico said:

Please tell me I am not the only one who finds nitain a poor stop gap that is simply there to slow progress.

I understand the alerts and I understand that it is not horrid to obtain, but it feels like it was tacked on because DE felt we where progressing too fast and those of us vets who have a ton of resources are being purposely gated behind this resource for nothing more than "hey slow down, or give us your money!".

It just feels like a cheap tactic to me, and I wanna know how you guys feel about it, cause it has been bugging me since all the new frames have had it tacked on it, and I expect mummy-frame to be another 6-12 nitain.

Meh, depends on the circumstance. The only one I think is a bit much is Wukong's research (not sure if it scales with clan size), though I think it's neat to have a nice clan goal to work towards to, like Oxium+Zephyr used to be.

Everything else never had a problem with. It gives me a personal reason to do alerts for once haha. Though I suppose you can replace Nitain with Fieldron, or any chosen-side specific rewards (Invasions) and it's pretty much a parallel situation here other than how much of the reward you can receive per-mission(s).

But honestly, it's just how these things works. As far as I'm concerned it's really not different than any other mod, helmet/skin, materials, and such that you have to earn by doing an alert. It's really only a discussion now since it's relativity new material. But like Oxium (before and after the drop increased) or Cryotic (which is more scarce for things to use it for), it'll work itself just fine, since it's not going anywhere, like any other thing I've mentioned that you have to earn.

Edited February 23, 2016 by HalfDarkShadow

[DrFail]

Nitain alerts lasting an hour or two longer probably wouldn't hurt anybody. It doesn't speed up the max gain rate, but could theoretically bolster the minimum gain rate, creating more of a constant speed between players.

However I propose that there's also another issue changing people's of Nitain's system. When the resource first dropped I hated how my schedule dictated that I could get max one or a day but, while the drop system still isn't necessarily unflawed, I now feel like the real issue is just a magnification of a repeating issue concerning DE and resources.

Often when a new resource comes out, DE massively overdoes it. When Argon came out pretty much every single weapon or frame needed argon. When weapons as crafting components made a comeback most of the new stuff took other weapons. Now, when Nitain has come out, most of the new additions require it. DE doesn't know how to properly pace their resource costs, and them oversaturating the new content with the new resource flavor isn't anything new. It's just more noticeable this time because Nitain can't really be ground out entirely at one's leisure to the same extent as any other resource in the game. In a few months time, Nitain will be much less needed, like Tellurium.

Edited February 23, 2016 by DrFail

[Obviousclone]

I don't see much complaints against Vauban, who, just like Nitain only drops from alerts. But unlike Vauban, Nitain is useful for a crafting bunch of stuff (new stuff), however it drops in far greater abundance than Vauban parts, and for the most part ,even if you don't need to farm Nitain, if you see an alert pop up, you run the alert, collect your loot and store in inventory for the day you do need it. It's a cool business tactic on part of DE where they encourage players to play the game (play the alerts) by having this "rare" and "valued" resource show up in temporary missions which adds re-playability (which is one of the issues DE keeps trying to fix). It creates incentive to play alerts (which is a good thing, alerts are global and this means playing with other players) and play the game in general.

 

Personally (anecdotally) I've never had issues with Nitain, and have a stockpile of like 40 built up. And I've seen Nitain alerts and thought "ya I'm not doing an interception archwing for Nitain" and decided to skip the Nitain alert a few times.

Edited February 23, 2016 by Obviousclone

[Syln]

My only issue with nitain is the fact that it can be needed in clan research, other than that i'm fine with it.

[DeadlyPeanutt]

3 hours ago, (PS4) robotwars7 said:

you need RNGsus to bless you.

void drops are hardly random.  void drops are a tiered system with some drops being very rare, others being common.  The system is programmed into the drop tables, according to veteran players (and my experience).

Please stop referring to drops in WF as random, because they aren't.  

[WrathAscending]

I've had pretty bad luck getting Nitain since I appear to be working, sleeping, or preparing meals for the overwhelming majority of the time Nitain Extract alerts are offered.

I usually only get one a week, maybe two if I'm lucky or playing longer on weekends. As aresult I had to buy Wukong since I'd never be able to finance the research and get enough components to build him in a timely fashion. I'm already dreading Saryn Prime, seems Prime Access will be the least painful way to deal with BP drop rates and Nitain requirements.

I don't mind Nitain as an idea, it's just that the alerts don't favour everyone. Perhaps having three per day available in a system similar to Sorties where you do three linked missions to progress would be better than the random alert wheel of (mis)fortune.

[Kinetos]

11 minutes ago, DeadlyPeanutt said:

void drops are hardly random.  void drops are a tiered system with some drops being very rare, others being common.  The system is programmed into the drop tables, according to veteran players (and my experience).

Please stop referring to drops in WF as random, because they aren't.  

Weighted rng is still rng.

[DeMeritus]

Nitain is the latest 'fad' crafting material.

For a while most new builds introduced will require nitain.

It was like this for oxium, argon crystals, cryotic, and tellurium when they came out, too.

Give it time, until release the next form of 'Grindium' then that will be the new requirement for newly released gear, and the fixation on nitain will fade.

[Silvus-Sol]

I don't mind Nitain. It is a unique and semi-difficult to obtain resource like Argon. I do wish the Alerts lasted a bit longer though, like 2 hours or something.

[MattM01]

12 hours ago, Mastikator2 said:

Should we really be OK with Skinner box mechanics psychologically manipulating us?

This seems to be a common attitude and I do not get it, you guys throw a fit when something gets nerfed but if the actual game mechanics exploit the players, that's totally fine and we should just take it up the wazoo?

 

Pretty much what he said. I think they have Stockholm Syndrome personally.

[IceColdHawk]

9 hours ago, Kuestenjung said:

And If I play these 10 waves there is usually 1 Nitain alert. Yes you can get more Argon in time then Nitain, but you can´t "farm" it, do Nitain alerts if they are up and you have it when you need it but every time a new weapon/frame needs Argon I have to go to the void, which I personally don´t like.

Oh yeah? You don't like going to the void to get some argon...okay...accepted. BUT, you like getting forced to go on an alert all the time when you actually planned doing something else like sorties, high end missions, or simply doing a raid? Too bad you are forced to do it or the alert will expire, void will not!

9 hours ago, Kuestenjung said:

It´s all about personal preferences and people should stop to cry over so little things.

No, we won't stop arguing about bad additions.

Also when people say that argon forces you to do something else, what about nitain then? When an item needs 5 nitain, i got forced to play 5 alerts. Probably long ones like defense or survival. Items that need 2 argons only make me go do a 20 min survival.

And what about people that are in vacation? What about people who've taken a break from warframe and playing something else because of it getting boring? Yeah, let's punish them. Let's FORCE them to play warframe daily to keep up with the nitain. Nitain is the only resource that can't be grinded. Every other resource can be grinded and that at player's will. Nitain was simply an awful and unnecessary addition.

Edited February 23, 2016 by IceColdHawk

[Kinetos]

1 hour ago, IceColdHawk said:

Oh yeah? You don't like going to the void to get some argon...okay...accepted. BUT, you like getting forced to go on an alert all the time when you actually planned doing something else like sorties, high end missions, or simply doing a raid? Too bad you are forced to do it or the alert will expire, void will not!

No, we won't stop arguing about bad additions.

Also when people say that argon forces you to do something else, what about nitain then? When an item needs 5 nitain, i got forced to play 5 alerts. Probably long ones like defense or survival. Items that need 2 argons only make me go do a 20 min survival.

And what about people that are in vacation? What about people who've taken a break from warframe and playing something else because of it getting boring? Yeah, let's punish them. Let's FORCE them to play warframe daily to keep up with the nitain. Nitain is the only resource that can't be grinded. Every other resource can be grinded and that at player's will. Nitain was simply an awful and unnecessary addition.

If people are missing Nitain because they are taking a break from the game, they are also missing out on everything else. Why would you expect to gain Nitain when you aren't even thinking about playing? 

[TheGreatBB]

I'm a little sad at the amount you can get in a day. I do work long hours with a commute, but if you do it consistantly you can get a lot. My problem is doing it often times results in options while playing. "Hey a nitain alert popped. Lets do that quickly." "Naw, I have enough because I play a lot. Lets continue farming x-instance." "Okay..."

Anyways, I think the way they do the resources is kind of silly. Why does some pieces require a massive amount of resources that are hard to get, but the piece isn't that important, while important pieces need very few and vise verse. 

Argon Crystals are easy to get, but they don't last.
Nitain is waiting game.
Neurodes is super easy now with the moon.
Nerosensors is only one location.
Tellurium is used very little.
Gallium is actually easy to get.
Orokin Cells are used in everything to the extent that they are starting to make it cost more for things now. (15 for the nikana? Wut?)

In the end, they need to retink resource distribution and acquisition. Nitain isn't hard to get, but it is a time gate. They really just think most people can do one a day. So if it takes 15. They have you 15 days.

[(PSN)Magician_NG]

Sick of nitain?  No, not really.  I find it mildly annoying, sure.  It's just another means of keeping newer players logged in more often.

The frequency at which I play these days means I only collect two or three a week, and that's fine by me.