We are too OP... OP is not fun.

[venon23]

1 hour ago, markus230 said:

Men, that just sad. I mean... how can someone be happy just because they see big yellow/red number? Just play with calculator or something, it requires same ammount of effort. Games were always been based around challenge that rewards you. Levels were getting harder and harder, so you felt like you are getting more powerfull. Its even the same in sports, you play with better opponents to prove that you can play. For this reason playing lets say Forza with 2 year old kid that can't even hold gamepad doesn't satisfy you. Ancient healer aura was added to make you focus on them first, but whats the point if you can just blast everything at the same time with Tonkor, this way cool game mechanics go to waste

 

Whats the difference between one shotting lvl 1 enemy and lvl 1000 enemy? All that has changed is number next to their name. Thats why I use weapons like Mutalist Quanta, Paracyst or Braton. But even then I can't really play online since I can't even shoot anything before someone blasts its with Tonkor or slashes with Exalted Blade. Why do you think that Veterans play only when game updates? Because when you get whats new there is no point in playing, there is no challenge. So most of the time I just play solo, I don't use Draco or Sechura and I think thats the only reason I play this game for so long (over 3 years)

 

Thats just my opinion and noone has to agree ofcourse

Veteran life so true tonkor  are destroying this game 
have been soloing the game since december rarly play with players because that weapon 

[(PSN)tknowles]

the problem is not that you can build stuff to be op, the problem is that everything is to easy, even the sorties which are suppose to be end game can usually be done very easy

To actually get to the point were your weapons struggle to kill you have to go 2hrs + in a t4 survival but most people will go 20 - 40 mins so they can get there rewards.

[egregiousRac]

3 minutes ago, (PS4)WINDMILEYNO said:

Nerfers like to take away everyone's options. You have the option to make yourself weaker, but once you nerf something we no longer have the option to be op. Now we all know you were the children that didn't know how to share toys or play with others without throwing a fit if things didn't go how you wanted them. Change the whole game so that I can be scared to go up against level 40 enemies, when I can just do it myself by taking unmodded weak gear. Yay...

On the contrary, currently there is no choice but to deal with broken unbalanced garbage when doing Sorties and Trials. DE made it very obvious early on that they had a certain balance target, and they balanced everything around that point (level 40-50, the end of 20-minute starchart runs). This is still the point at which player survivability is well balanced to (most) enemy damage output.

By not properly thinking changes through, two of the three main avenues of player effectiveness have had massive power gains since then, leaving that one behind. At this point both weapon and ability power go far past that balance point while leaving survivability the way it was. This allows players to CC everything forever, kill rooms over and over with AoE abilities, and generally murder everyone for hundreds of levels with weapons. Instead of solving the systemic issues that caused this (as OP suggests albeit somewhat crudely), DE has added uncommon enemies and elements that do not match up at all with the rest of the game. These counteract specific issues, but end up hurting other things far more. When that wasn't enough, they started gating significant content behind level 120+ missions, by which point nearly everything one-shots players. The fact that anyone defends that as good design is astounding.

Going even earlier, all of the random junk in void drop tables is also a result of the lack of balance. It isn't that DE wants to make you kill yourself in despair over the inability to get what you want, or as a dastardly scheme to make you buy stuff with platinum. It is simply too easy to speedrun the singular missions and go for many, many reward cycles in the endless missions. Survival and defence need junk when you can get more than a dozen rewards from a single mission without trouble.

[Omnimorph]

Or you could just not stick 5 or 6 forma in your Tonkor.

IOW, you are as OP in this game as you put the effort into it.  If you put the effort into making yourself OP, you can't complain that you are OP. 

The USP of the game is in fact the reward of eventually being OP after slogging through the star map as a no-catalyst, no-forma dweeb, and it's quite rare for developers to embrace OP-ness. 

Warframe is the game for stylish, OP mob killing.  And yet it still has challenge if you want it (Sorties, later T4 stuff).  Long may it continue.

Edited March 8, 2016 by Omnimorph

[chofranc]

This thread is really pointless, you mention what weapons you use but, with which warframes? Is clearly that in your screenshot those enemies were blinded or something, a boltor prime can't do that lol, try to use a boltor prime or any other weapon that you think that are op and use them with oberon or any other frame that doesn't blind enemies or buff your stuff.

[Dark5eiD]

[(XBOX)Skode]

MR 20 all the OP weapons... the forums would riot lol

[egregiousRac]

Here, have a helpful graphic:

Note: Due to the nature of exponential scaling, I have utilized a logarithmic scale here in order to condense the imagery.

Edited March 8, 2016 by egregiousRac

[Dawn11715]

1 hour ago, sushidubya said:

I fully agree that we need some kind of "horde" mode.  

However, continually scaling enemies higher vs. us getting more powerful will only create a larger delta between new players and the most powerful ones.  I'm not saying we don't have that now already, but the situation would get worse if Warframe keeps scaling enemies up, then releasing more and more powerful mods, weapons, warframes to counter that.  This is important, because for instance there will be quite a few times when advanced players will be in squad with newer players like during a nitain extract alert, etc.

I feel the current spread of power between the new players and the advanced players is ok and a sense of progression is there.

A new player doesnt NEED to be able to do all missions right away.

Keeping these ememys in special areas, would be the best solution.

[(PSN)JT-Come-Lately]

3 hours ago, TheHun7er said:

Exactly! I do not find killing each enemy in one shot being fun. I've literally "nerfed" many of my weapons, to enjoy game a bit more. For example I really love to use my Braton Prime, because (presumably) it's not OP. (I do not use absurdly hilarious weapons such as Synoid Simulor, Tonkor, Boltor Prime, Soma Prime etc. Hell! I hate it when people in my team use them! Especially Synoid Simulor...) So yeah, of course I was wrong. Modded correctly Braton Prime easily kills each enemy, no matter if it's Sortie or 40+ waves on T4 Survival. (And I know, Prime... slightly better version)  So what I did?  I removed all of buffing mods (excluding Serration) to enjoy this weapon. To feel the fun! Now my current build is: Maxed Serration, Speed Trigger, Rifle Ammo Mutation, Fast Hands + Vital Sense. And it's awesome! Finally most enemies are challenging. Now when I see enemy (Rank 45+) I'm scared as f*ck! What's more interesting, DE is adding a lot of new weapons that are even more powerful.

Something needs to be changed. Some people may like it to be OP (for whatever reason). Some people think they are the best in the world by killing thousands of AI, that can't even shoot them back, because everything we use is so powerful. And I know I'm not alone in such thinking. Now, I know the solution for this might be very difficult, but here's what i think could help. Obviously, nerfing all the weapons and mods would be very very dumb move. Do not touch them! :P However, "buffing" enemies could help in this situation. Maybe add a lot more armor? A lot more health and shields? This might help. You can also add overheating system to weapons, so you'll have to either switch or use your melee more often. 'Cause let's be honest, we only use secondary when we ran out of ammo in our primary. :'D 

 

This is my opinion. 

 

Yes, your enjoyment of this game most definitely warrants nerfing all of the weapons I have worked very hard to make OP in the first place. 

But seriously go play Destiny. Their light levels ensure that your gear will always be low-tier and you will never be OP in any stage that matters, that is the game you are asking for and it does indeed exist already. Let Warfarme be Warframe and allow people to build however they want without you demanding for a sweeping nerf to accommodate YOUR  playstyle. 

[(PSN)WINDMILEYNO]

24 minutes ago, Lord_Impaler said:

Just why? :D

[Alcatraz]

3 hours ago, TheHun7er said:

You're in the simulacrum using butchers to win your argument. Likely level 1 butchers at that too. You think you're OP? Spawn a Juggernaut Behemoth and tell him you're OP.  They spawn as level 500 no matter what level it is you select, so you tell us if you're so high and mighty after he kicks your tenno butt.

Edited March 8, 2016 by AIcatraz

[(PSN)shadowraith_666]

In most games your supposed to become stronger and more powerful as you progress through the game.

• levelling up/improving your equipment allows more powerful builds which in turn allows you to progress through harder content.
• levelling up your MR/character level allows more powerful weapons and equipment to become available and also access to other features/game modes that also lead to acquiring better equipment.
• Progressing through the star-map/quest-lines/zones etc gives access to better resources and item drops.

 

WF is no different in this respect.

With enemy variants becoming more difficult to combat, we need to become stronger to overcome this problem, however our enemies are becoming stronger and more resistant to our attacks, to the point where scaling and balance seems to have been thrown out the airlock in favour of the enemy were fighting.

[SilentCircle]

4 hours ago, TheHun7er said:

 Hell! I hate it when people in my team use them!

That tells me everything I need to know.

[Ahcruna]

Now don't you go taking this too serious. ;)

I do want some more endgame stuff though hehe.



___________________________________________________
There was a hole here, now it's gone. I guess...  (╯°Д°）╯︵ ┻━┻

Edited March 8, 2016 by Ahcruna

[Umbra-]

2 hours ago, Lord_Datastorm said:

Your pic above looks like from the place on the relay, what level were the enemy, level 1? How about a pic from in game ... say sortie part 3 vs corpus and the supercharged bursa corps.

 

2 hours ago, carnaga said:

I have no idea what is happening on Simulacrum screenshot but I believe that isn't braton prime you blaze on your post. And between the lines you can read my point.

And I see your opinion lacks some vital info. More constructive would be something like this: "I run this frame and this weapon in a squad with this setup and I find it OP".

So basically you say that you fight low lvl enemies with high tier gear & frame and find it boring. I find it boring too. It's like taking unmodded frame and a weapon and fight against lvl 1 enemies. I do sorties and high tier endless missions with saryn + rakta + dual ichors + Brakk combination -- In a PUB game with random frames and random people who have random skills. And sometimes I find it quite challenging. The runs that are a joke are for eg. Sortie MD missions (conditions don't matter) with EV trinny and Blind Mirage.

 

2 hours ago, xcynderx said:

and the simulacrum IS NOT a good defense for saying we are OP.....go do high level content where your surrounded by randomized enemies and not just one type you prepared for with the same setup you used in the Sim....and THEN see how OP you are.

I took this picture from google to show how ridiculous it sometimes can be...

[Leavith]

4 hours ago, TheHun7er said:

-snip

Now your argument I can agree with we are OP but their is no need to buff enemy or to nerf us...We need to rework Nightmare mode that is all.

SO far nightmare mode is joke to Nightmare mode itself only thing that changes enemy level scale-Which that hasn't stop anyone and THeir are effects going on in the background-Which are joke to all tenno ANd lastly they just aren't challenging specially with 4 tennos.

Suggestion rework nightmare mode

Enemy level should no scale higher but their Ai Should get smarter

The background effect should be constant and multiple  example defense nightmare mode should be energy reduction and something else

The number of tenno per nightmare mission cut down to 2 tenno per mission

In as an addition of mine since enemy will not be getting harder put conclave maximum requirement the lower the planet the lower the maximum conclave

This should maintain a healthy Nightmare mode that is both good and interesting while we are at it throw in rare hard to get stances their and make nightmare mode half the warframe power stats.such as 200 duration % is now 100% that 200 strength is now 100%

New nightmare mode mods-Such as faster Holster speed and faster reload and faster fire rate(something that encourages since multy shot will be getting changed)

New Weapon boss drops-Vor drops seer pistol part-Bosses should drops part of their own weapon as well(minus corpus robots and Infested)

New Item Support-Infested and Robot bosses can drop specter mini version of themselves to work with you in battle as well as repellents such as an items that those the lower spawn of enemy or make enemy unalarmed even if the alarms....in addition special enemy hacking devises allowing you to hack or control certain enemies

New Tile set-Call terror set meant to be hard to navigate such as being extremely dark/foggy/over lighted

New enemy or More special enemy-Such as manic or new enemies

 

[venon23]

49 minutes ago, egregiousRac said:

Here, have a helpful graphic:

Note: Due to the nature of exponential scaling, I have utilized a logarithmic scale here in order to condense the imagery.

yea  so true

[Xennocide420]

OP doesn't like to be OP ? x}

 

 

 

[(PSN)WINDMILEYNO]

Hey, here's a question: how are warframe powers too op o.o but syndicate weapons aren't? I have never seen a nerf thread about syndicate weapons. Why do people feel it is justified to walk around killing stuff in aoe discharges just for gaining xp, but I can't use my abilities to kill things, because that makes the game not fun? 

Edited March 8, 2016 by (PS4)WINDMILEYNO

[ThePredicament]

This game gives you a blade and the enemies are the whetstone you grind it into, until your blade is sharp and everything around you is dead.

[TyrantAres]

As I see it, I enjoy being able to slaughter hordes of enemies, the problem is not how easy it is to kill, but how few enemies spawn. We should be SWARMED, surrounded by all times, so that no matter how much damage you deal, you constantly have to move.

[armedpoop]

4 hours ago, TheHun7er said:

Now, I know the solution for this might be very difficult, but here's what i think could help. Obviously, nerfing all the weapons and mods would be very very dumb move. Do not touch them! :P However, "buffing" enemies could help in this situation. Maybe add a lot more armor? A lot more health and shields? This might help. You can also add overheating system to weapons, so you'll have to either switch or use your melee more often. 'Cause let's be honest, we only use secondary when we ran out of ammo in our primary. :'D 

 

This is my opinion. 

Bullet sponge enemies are not fun. If you want bullet sponges, go play Destiny. You say you have over 980 hrs? Well guess what: you have probably everything for the good core builds, thus making the game easy. Its not a problem of the game being too easy, its a problem of having a poor difficulty curve.

Coming up and leveling mastery rank was fun (and difficult) because at the time, you were building up your mod collection and struggling with an under-leveled serration and probably bad gear (as you should be) but as you finally came to max out your mods/collect more the game became easier and easier. The game was fun when you felt like you were progressing and didnt have access to being able to one shot things. 

 

But seriously, enemy scaling is already way out of control in this game, we dont need them to have higher BASE stats to scale off of. You say you have 1000 hrs (basically) and are bored already? I raise you my 2697 and me NOT being bored. Ill tell you why: theres always something new to learn, and always a new build out there to try. Its not about gimping yourself, but just having fun. If one shotting things isnt fun to you, then play something else, or start an alt account and find out what made warframe fun for you again.

[(PSN)sew310]

INB4 lock

[sekushiiandee]

5 hours ago, TheHun7er said:

 

 

This is my opinion. 

^ is there context for this photo? because it helps if we knew the levels and what youre actually doing to achieve these numbers

nova can achieve high dmg but requires a lot of build up with AM drop......or maybe even MP + AM drop....or MP + tonkor?  even then I dont see these numbers being achievable unless youre exploiting weaknesses as well as abilities....and if these mobs were level 1....then iono what youre talking about

even then.....have you even seen the amount of health some mobs have? just because we are OP at lower levels.....certainly does not mean we are OP in the long run....i have not seen anyone fight against a level 100+ or even 150+ that achieves this high of a damage unless they were using specific abilities....such as absorb

as someone else as stated....how OP we are really gauges how long we are going to last in this game

with the rate that DE is going with their drop tables and ridiculous farming tactics.....we better stay OP....otherwise all this hardwork is worth nothing in the end

if you want balance then you better make sure they balance out rewards and drop tables