Volt Rework Feedback [Post Update 18.13]

[FitzSimmons]

12 hours ago, YagoXiten said:

Heat damage is amazing against the Grineer at Sortie evels when you run 4x CP. Cold Damage can be paired with Corrosive when you do not have CP to help deal with both types of armor. Toxin damage is bonkers with 4x CP and a status weapon. Electric damage you would never run alone.



 

same for other elements i think :/ as far as i remember

[RealPandemonium]

7 hours ago, YagoXiten said:

You're using Gas for the Status damage, which is going to be dealt as a Toxin proc, and Electric for the CC, and because Magnetic is even worse a damage type than Electric, and you don't gain anything from Cold if you're fighting targets with no armor, nor against shields, because of the Gas procs. You'd still probably be better off running more Gas damage than Electric, at least, in terms of DPS. Though the Electric status stun is nice. But that's the only real benefit Electric has.

I used to run more Toxin damage to bias toward Gas and strengthen its procs, but using a base Electric weapon and/or adding some Electric bias has been equally useful, IMO, especially when armor isn't a factor.  

[Cytobel]

@FitzSimmons:  Thanks for understanding.

I've heard good things about Growing Power, but I really don't see a point to it for Volt.  All you're buffing is Speed and some basically irrelevant ability damage numbers, whereas Corrosive Projection buffs all damage and Energy Siphon lets you recoup energy a bit faster overall (people have sold it short for years, but ES has been the difference for me in many a mission).

I totally get people disagreeing on builds and such; that's to be expected.  I'm happy to see discussion on the subject, because it means the game still has life and growth occurring.

---------------------------------------------------------------

On the subject of elemental combos I've had EXCELLENT luck with Radiation//Toxin or Corrosive//Fire.  Those tend to be my go-tos.  Gas//Electric was underwhelming for me, though I see the benefit against Corpus and Infested (they pack, and I just have better luck with radial splash against them).  Grineer calls for Corrosive//Cold usually, but I mostly go with my fav pair.  Usually one goes on main gun and the other on pistol to cover all bases.  Melee is whatever I want to mess around testing.

EDIT:  The Jat Kittag is in fact the best weapon ever.  This isn't opinion, but simple fact.  I discovered this first day I used it when I ground-slammed to get out of the air faster and accidentally launched a Heavy Gunner 5 stories into the air, from which she fell off a cliff.  I often use other weapons, lest I spend the whole mission playing Grineer Golf and tossing enemy confetti about to celebrate the occasion.  I have failed missions because the objective was far less important than hanging foes from the rafters as festive decorations.

If I recall correctly this was back when the Heavies bull-rushed forward, ignoring EVERYTHING in their MAD quest to punch your shoes.  Remember that crap?

Best.  Weapon.  EVER.

Edited October 1, 2016 by Cytobel
The Jat Kittag

[Toramaru]

I lack the maturity to understand why people come here to say that it is simply a matter of preference, that Volt is in a good place, while implying there's too much fuss over the matter.

I also lack the patience (despite being usually quite patient) to wait for DE's feedback/reply on the matter, considering the 67 pages. Volt is certainly not as good as the majority of other Frames (and since I really like melee I'm sticking with Inaros), having, as @YagoXiten said, a rework that added very little to him.

[Cytobel]

Inaros is a solid pick for melee.  Good choice.

There are enough people claiming Volt is well off that I'm beginning to wonder.  What, I wonder, IS "well off"?  Volt is slow, but Speed fixes that should you build for it.  Volt is squishy, but you can stack shields and health like it's going to save you.  Volt's abilities deal mediocre damage at best (completely because of where electricity is as an element), but they tend to stun things for a moment.  Volt can lock down rooms with Discharge (again, a bit of building is called for to keep it rolling continuously), but enemy positioning can ruin things before you're able to recast.

It seems to me sometimes we're saying Volt is in a good place the same way people might say "you look good today" to someone in a geriatric ward.

On the other hand, Volt IS doing a bit better.  Many things have come out that let us survive far better, inflict (weapon) damage more freely, and utilize our abilities more frequently and effectively.  Where my issue with the rework starts is with the knowledge that most of what you have going for you on a Volt ISN'T VOLT, but rather a lens or a gun.

WARFRAMES ARE THEIR ABILITIES.  This is ALL they do individually.  The mix of base stats either work or it don't, the look is just for looks, and the rest of the frills are frilly, but the abilities are what they bring that no other 'Frame can bring.

I'm going to leave it that for the moment.  I need go study the back of my eyelids for a while.  I'll come back to this after I know where to take this rambling mess.

Edited October 1, 2016 by Cytobel

[(PSN)WINDMILEYNO]

Does anyone know of the broken electric orb in the derelict (you all probably do know).

I want volts discharge to be fun to use, Or at the very least in name of fashion frame given more awesomeness. 

On another note, not that anyone will care, iv started playing infamous again. It feels nice to have real control over electricity (the game is 8 years old and graphics are something you have to adjust to). 

 

 

 

[----Dante----]

4 minutes ago, (PS4)WINDMILEYNO said:

Does anyone know of the broken electric orb in the derelict (you all probably do know).

I want volts discharge to be fun to use, Or at the very least in name of fashion frame given more awesomeness. 

On another note, not that anyone will care, iv started playing infamous again. It feels nice to have real control over electricity (the game is 8 years old and graphics are something you have to adjust to). 

 

 

 

i miss very old overload animation you could see electric wave ;-;

http://imgur.com/zqIB5bs

[Cytobel]

Weird for me to be saying good things about the rework, but the thing that I feel most positively about is Volt's contextual skill interactions.  I'm not a fan of what they DO, mind you, but their existence is something I'm quite happy about.

For any supposedly tactical 'Frame skill interactions and/or contextual uses feels to me like the best possible way forward in the game.  When you have just 4 tools in a toolkit, each MUST have multiple functions if you are to be able to perform in a generalist fashion.  This is one of the most positive aspects of the recent reworks.

However, you need a bit more than most 'Frames tend to offer if you're to fit the "tactical" role.  Both Ivara and Equinox bring this in spades, and Vauban's rework brought him to the same party.  As Volt continues to evolve he needs this sort of flexibility, although I don't think he requires either a bimodal form or skill toggling.  Whatever winds up working is what will have to work, but it's important to state that he needs SOMETHING to further increase his ability to adjust tactics to the situation.  He lacks an essential basic mutiblity, a flexibility of his toolkit, and as such can't be considered a true tactical option.

Maybe he IS the jack-of-all-trades so many people claim him to be , but this is a role Warframe currently does not reward or particularly support.  In a game weighed to favor specialization the generalist falls far short of the mark.

Perhaps my issues and those of others with like minds are less with Volt than they are the game in general.  Then again, the execution of Riot Shield is more punitive than playable, so I'm going to stick with "the rework needs a rework".  At least for now.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

EDIT TO MY PREVIOUS POST:  The points I've seen come up over and over and over AND OVER again are non-prime Volt's too-low armor and energy pool, both Volts' low Sprint speed, Riot Shield's overly-restrictive and expensive nature, and general issues with his skills lacking either focus or power (depending on your viewpoint).

The first point has been mentioned ever since I joined the forums back in 2013.

The second point has been mentioned since then, but is of renewed importance in light of Volt's priming and gameplay trends.

The third point is why this thread is undying.

The fourth point is where I think most of the real troubles lie.  You see, Volt is SUPPOSEDLY to be billed as a "tactical alternative to gunplay" (though I don't know if this has been changed yet), but he doesn't quite have what it takes to carry that torch.  The first and second points should've been addressed by now (at least the energy and sprint speed should've seena bit of love), the third point is now a grudge for a few of us, but this idea of tactical play may be what requires the most work to achieve.  It's certainly what I hope to see the most.

Or at least right after that damn Riot Shield is fixed.

Edited October 3, 2016 by Cytobel
honesty and recollection

[(PSN)WINDMILEYNO]

On 10/1/2016 at 2:27 PM, ----Dante---- said:

i miss very old overload animation you could see electric wave ;-;

http://imgur.com/zqIB5bs

That looks nice too:) i never got to witness it:/

[Cytobel]

I miss the invulnerability attached to that Overload.  I miss it a LOT.

[RealPandemonium]

1 hour ago, Cytobel said:

I miss the invulnerability attached to that Overload.  I miss it a LOT.

That's ancient history now, though.  It was removed before update 11, which was like 3 years ago.  

[Cytobel]

I know.  I'd been playing long enough that the translation was ROUGH.

Sidenote: this last tactical alert vs the Nightwatch was interesting.  I pulled Capacitance in favor of Shocking Speed due to dealing 0 damage whatsoever to anything past the 2nd mission.  I think I've stumbled onto a build I'm really fond of.  I'd forgotten how much I love SS.

[Burnthesteak87]

On 1/10/2016 at 5:09 PM, Toramaru said:

I lack the maturity to understand why people come here to say that it is simply a matter of preference, that Volt is in a good place, while implying there's too much fuss over the matter.

I also lack the patience (despite being usually quite patient) to wait for DE's feedback/reply on the matter, considering the 67 pages. Volt is certainly not as good as the majority of other Frames (and since I really like melee I'm sticking with Inaros), having, as @YagoXiten said, a rework that added very little to him.

67 pages... It's not concentrated feedback.
It's mostly made of chit chats.
No surprise if nobody is going to spend a day lurking inside all of this to find something valuable.

Edited October 4, 2016 by Burnthesteak87

[(PSN)WINDMILEYNO]

On 9/30/2016 at 2:27 AM, Cytobel said:

It would be dead and gone if DE hadn't tried to sweep it under the rug after basically ignoring feedback.  I'm not saying they weren't aware of the feedback either, but that they simply gave not one S#&$ about it.  They weren't particularly wrong to decide what they wanted Volt to do and be.  They just shouldn't have pretended they cared what we thought.

Let's be honest here: not everyone would've been pleased with the simple QoL changes to make Riot Shield more viable than not*, some sort of useful Shock--Discharge interaction, a simple electric proc on a Shock-charged ES, and SOME SORT of method for regaining energy faster.  We could've come up with more we could want, but I am goddamn certain this thread would've died months ago had those basic steps been taken or at least addressed by someone...

We're sitting here chewing the same cud, not because we like it, but because we need more out of this rework than could be gleaned in the first place.  Volt has the most restrictive build needs I've seen, and I've been playing since closed beta too.  He benefits from everything (which is good), but he also feels like he needs more of everything to be successful (which is not).  I've been following the theory of Duration//Efficiency since the rework, but now that I shift back towards Strength//Duration (with Stretch and Streamline of course) I find he just feels so much better.  The price was discarding any hope of using Riot Shield EVER.

That's rather the problem, isn't it?  No matter how you build Volt, he has a dump skill.  I've decided to forget trying to use the new kit and I'm using him like I used to, before this rework.  It seems to me like a terrible waste of time for everyone involved to even try something like this if you're not going to follow through.  That's my beef with DE.

I suppose a decent analogy for the situation would be this:  Volt is like one of those plates of food you might expect to see at a multiple Michelin Star restaurant.  Yes, it may be quite intricate.  Yes, it might be quite good in its way.  Yes, it might be an experience.  Unfortunately, you must be gastronomially experienced to hope to be able to appreciate what boils down to a $50 bite on a plate.  Worse still, it's not going to be a filling bite either.  Much in the same way, what we have may be good, but we don't have enough of it to work with.

I've lost count of the times I've dearly wished for just one more mod slot, or the ability to put an augment into a special slot of its own so I had the space for one more tweak.  I've used the term "overbalanced" to describe the feeling, but "watered-down" or"diluted" would work just as well.  I keep trying to get that last little bit out of the build, but to no avail.  Volt just can't do enough to keep up with the demands, and there isn't any way to take him past limitations I simply don't find in other similar 'Frames.  This might be part of his "uniqueness" to some, but it is also referred to as "poor performance" by others.

I acknowledge that I see things differently from some.  I see Volt as a potent off-DPS/Support that is held back by a lack of both of those things.  He's an Energy Shield dispensor to people I run with, one that sometimes uses abilities to lockdown a room for the few moments before everything dies to gunfire, never getting the chance to regenerate others' shields.  The way we play Warframe marginalizes any skills Volt has due to his dated ability lineup that was designed in a another, different age.

The rework was an opportunity to update Volt to the realities of Warframe today.  By and large, that opportunity wasn't utilized.  The good that came from it was outweighed by silent nerfs of his other skills, and even of the skills reworked.  'Round-and-around we went, to end where we started with the rework merry-go-round.

*(it's an energy tax with another energy tax on top of heavy restrictions for something that doesn't warrent nearly as much coding or headache DE had to go through in the first damn place to make it happen, let alone try to justify with a knockback)

I just saw this...makes me feal better inside.

This game as a whole is lacking a lot, Destiny doesnt look that bad anymore. 

[(PSN)WINDMILEYNO]

I want this...

Goal: Volt can expend the energy at any time to use any of his abilities, with no need to rely on gear or focus schools.

Talking points:

· Being able to choose between cc, or dps would be beneficial to Volt, maybe? With the stun being on the opposite side of the modding spectrum, you would build either for strength or duration, i feel it mostly would balance out, compared to modding options available now...

· Crowd control is not an enjoyable tool in every situation. I hope to give volt the extra he needs to also run and gun just as reliably as he can defend himself and lock things down, possibly even carry the sheild while doing so. Strength builds would pretty much seperate these too, unless you kept all stats in the middle, for the jack of all trades feel.

The best ideas....

·speed recieves "walk or run" opt out/in where recipient can choose to "walk" at their frames current sprint speed or "run" with Volts speed boost. Indication of the speed ability needs to be obvious to the person getting it (but the fov method was not very popular, so that has to be something everyone would approve of), and the backflip can be kept as a mechanic to block any buff to speed to "x" amount of time.

·speed gets a duration of 15 seconds.

·riot sheild loses 2 limitations.

· discharge should be aircast/ or given an updated animation that reduces vulnerability.

. The interaction between shock and coiled obejects needs to be real (Tesla coiled objects will act like grineer arc traps when shocked, overloading, and agressively searvhing out nearby targets. This drains the damage cap off of the enemy, until they "explode", dealing a knock down in a radius - one possible, but unsatisfactory idea....

·discharge coils enemies, but stun is seperate from health/damage cap, and should be on oposite sides of the modding spectrum. Building for damage will reduce the stun, building for the stun will reduce damage.

· Discharge and speed will also electrify electric sheilds, as shock does now.

· Passive gains from coiled targets. Does not all disappear from a single attack.

· Passive does not get used at all from hitting containers. 

· Energy regen "Volts static charge (sliding feet against carpet) will drain into his energy pool even while being used, slowly" - just one idea of how this would work.

The "extra"

1) shock should tesla coil one target. Moddable stun now available.

2) shocking the same target multiple times while coiled will overcharge it, dramatically ramping up the effect between shock/tesla coil (aslo works on discharge) until the target explodes in an a smaller version of overload that does not spread the tesla coil effect.

3) activating speed near coiled objects will "energize the surrounding environment" increasing the speed and range at which the coils target nearby enemies/objects.

4) volt has three types of energy : static, coiled, free flow (void). Energy gained from the environment, stored energy, energy available....loose idea that i can expand on of what we have now and how it will work with mods.

4) volt can tesla coil himself.

5) backflipping out of speed will leave the remaing duration as a set amount of stored damage (tesla coil) that acts like a grineer arc trap.

6) positive and negative charges 

Summary: The best of this rework idea and the problems volt has can actually be summed up in the first few responses between @Insizer and I.

I want the duality of inaros's scarab armor, with/or the modding capability of novas molecular prime, the stun and damage would really benefit from being seperate...if that makes sense.

#stormriders

 

Edited October 11, 2016 by (PS4)WINDMILEYNO
Edited for clarity and conciseness

[(PSN)WINDMILEYNO]

Edited.

Edited October 11, 2016 by (PS4)WINDMILEYNO
Edit

[Insizer]

On 10/6/2016 at 11:53 PM, (PS4)WINDMILEYNO said:

1. Shock gets its animation canceled out by *almost* any and every animation the enemy was currently in.
2. Shock will sometimes arc back to a surface or object behind me if my reticle is not directly on an enemy (sometimes).
3. Shock is an rng ability that will even sometimes affect enemy health differently. No video proof, but shock on lvl 20 lancers would sometimes take off more or less health (just realized it might be elite lancers screwing with me)
4. Shock is a thin, tiny piece of light on my screen. If the animation team would be so kind as to make it bigger, thtd be great. 
5. Speed has a duration of 10 seconds. I have begged and pleaded for months for it to be 15. Recasting it is cool and all, but where is volt supposed to get the energy? Before you laugh, im serious. Saryn was given volts same energy pool, but deemed too energy intensive, so they gave her innate energy regen, but volt is supposed to just magically conjure it out of thin air right?
6. Speed should "route" you around obstacles, the way your frame will automatically latch onto and flip over ledges without any input from yourself.
7. Speed having a backflip opt out is still useless for people who do not wish to have it, specifically because of the ridiculously low duration. As soon as you back flip out of it, i need to recast it to keep goinf. It would work better if it was just directly connected to the sprint button. You could toggle it on and off yourself by sprinting or walking.
8. Sheild is ok. Itd be nice if discharge and speed would also electrify the sheild, like shock does (speed by wiki definition "energizes the surronding area")
9. Riot shield does not need a duration timer, energy drain + plus distance traveled, reduced movement speed, And restriction to secondaries. Pick one, or two if you have to. But energy drain or duration, those two together cant be your two options.
10. Discharge should be aircast.
11. It should have a meaningful interaction with shock, instead of something i have to use my imagination to see.
12. The health cap and stun duration should be seperate. The health cap should be raised.
13. The stun is cheesy.
14. The passive should not be used up all at once, but over multiple attacks.
15. The passive should not be used up at all hitting containers.
16. It would be nice if you saw gains to your static energy while hitting coiled targets 

1. Yes, that is an issue
2. That is a bug, and not a major one at that.
3. I'd check up on that before posting that.
4. I like how Shock is easily visible, yet not distracting.
5. Which is why you mod for duration. I've never had an issue with it being "energy-intensive" and I've been using Volt basically since the start of open beta, before corrupted mods, Volt Prime, Primed Flow, or Zenurik. I never had an issue. The reason why Saryn (Prime) has a (very bad) energy regen capability bootstrapped to her 3rd is because she needs use multiple abilities together in order to make use of them. Her ult for example needs you to use Molt and Spore in order to get the most out of it, and her energy regen requires you to first infect enemies with Spore and then use Toxic Lash. Volt doesn't have that requirement. That's why Volt doesn't need innate energy regen capability.
   1. Also, Saryn's energy regen capability is negligible as you only get 2 energy back per spore after first having to waste 25 energy on Spore and then waste 50 energy equipping Toxic Lash.
6. That is a terrible idea that would screw with controlling Volt a lot. I can easily see your "mapping" causing me, as I'm approaching a box that is located very close to a wall sending me into said wall. The only way to prevent that is for DE to manually map multiple routes throughout every tile for Speed which would make it stupidly annoying as you have control taken away from you. Keep It Simple Stupid. That is the basis of good design. There is too much that can go wrong with your suggestion. Just learn how to use Speed, it really isn't that hard unless you run a Flash build.
7. People don't walk in Warframe, they move while zoomed in, run, or sprint, mostly the later. Furthermore your suggestion would mean that people who don't want the speed boost will be prevented from sprinting and forced to run, making them fall that much more behind.
8. meh, I guess. It really isn't an issue for me at least because enemies shouldn't be getting past your shields in the first place.
9. This I can agree on. Riot Shield doesn't need both energy drain and distance drain (duration is more understandable). It was a bad idea considering Volt is suppose to be mobile and because regular Volt doesn't have the impressive energy pool of Volt Prime.
10. I agree.
11. I like how Shock is right now. It is simple and effective. It doesn't need any type of interaction. I don't know what kind of interaction you want, but if you want Shock to be an equipped ability that is fired using the LMB and such, then all I can say is that you will ruin Shock permanently by forcing a gimmicky annoyance that would rip away the split second utility of an ability that is meant to be easy to spam and be a great panic button as well. Plus, it would always be less effective than just shooting the enemies with guns. I cannot stress just how bad such equippable "force lightning" would be.
12. I don't see how you can separate them. The health cap is there to prevent ridiculousness from having 225 damage (plus any modded damage) being dealt every half second, for 8 seconds. The health cap can be raised with power strength mods.
13. 2 of Volt's abilities can stun (3 if you include Speed's augment), which one are you talking about? Regardless, Volt's stuns are effective and more or less make sense. I don't care what you think of them, they are gold.
14. That would be nice
15. That would also be nice
16. That would be interesting if his ult charged his passive, yes. 

Volt has a couple issues, yes. But he is more or less fine where he is. People just get pissy because they believe his description. I didn't think he needed that much of a rework in the first place, so I'm glad they didn't completely overhaul him. The one thing I wish they would fix was his description from "alternative to gunplay" to "buff to gunplay", because he is a jack of all trades and is built more for utility than anything imo.  

[Cytobel]

Just sort of a straw poll here, but did anyone else use Volt for the recent Nightwatch tac alert?

I found it to be quite funny, except for that Survival where nobody (myself included) was paying attention.  Honestly, I didn't realize the towers had fire-suppression systems in them.  Because oxygen is known...  for....  that.....?  Beh, I forget to discard logic sometimes.

If you DID Volt through it, how did it go for you?

Edited October 8, 2016 by Cytobel

[(PSN)WINDMILEYNO]

1 hour ago, Insizer said:

1. Yes, that is an issue
2. That is a bug, and not a major one at that.
3. I'd check up on that before posting that.
4. I like how Shock is easily visible, yet not distracting.
5. Which is why you mod for duration. I've never had an issue with it being "energy-intensive" and I've been using Volt basically since the start of open beta, before corrupted mods, Volt Prime, Primed Flow, or Zenurik. I never had an issue. The reason why Saryn (Prime) has a (very bad) energy regen capability bootstrapped to her 3rd is because she needs use multiple abilities together in order to make use of them. Her ult for example needs you to use Molt and Spore in order to get the most out of it, and her energy regen requires you to first infect enemies with Spore and then use Toxic Lash. Volt doesn't have that requirement. That's why Volt doesn't need innate energy regen capability.
   1. Also, Saryn's energy regen capability is negligible as you only get 2 energy back per spore after first having to waste 25 energy on Spore and then waste 50 energy equipping Toxic Lash.
6. That is a terrible idea that would screw with controlling Volt a lot. I can easily see your "mapping" causing me, as I'm approaching a box that is located very close to a wall sending me into said wall. The only way to prevent that is for DE to manually map multiple routes throughout every tile for Speed which would make it stupidly annoying as you have control taken away from you. Keep It Simple Stupid. That is the basis of good design. There is too much that can go wrong with your suggestion. Just learn how to use Speed, it really isn't that hard unless you run a Flash build.
7. People don't walk in Warframe, they move while zoomed in, run, or sprint, mostly the later. Furthermore your suggestion would mean that people who don't want the speed boost will be prevented from sprinting and forced to run, making them fall that much more behind.
8. meh, I guess. It really isn't an issue for me at least because enemies shouldn't be getting past your shields in the first place.
9. This I can agree on. Riot Shield doesn't need both energy drain and distance drain (duration is more understandable). It was a bad idea considering Volt is suppose to be mobile and because regular Volt doesn't have the impressive energy pool of Volt Prime.
10. I agree.
11. I like how Shock is right now. It is simple and effective. It doesn't need any type of interaction. I don't know what kind of interaction you want, but if you want Shock to be an equipped ability that is fired using the LMB and such, then all I can say is that you will ruin Shock permanently by forcing a gimmicky annoyance that would rip away the split second utility of an ability that is meant to be easy to spam and be a great panic button as well. Plus, it would always be less effective than just shooting the enemies with guns. I cannot stress just how bad such equippable "force lightning" would be.
12. I don't see how you can separate them. The health cap is there to prevent ridiculousness from having 225 damage (plus any modded damage) being dealt every half second, for 8 seconds. The health cap can be raised with power strength mods.
13. 2 of Volt's abilities can stun (3 if you include Speed's augment), which one are you talking about? Regardless, Volt's stuns are effective and more or less make sense. I don't care what you think of them, they are gold.
14. That would be nice
15. That would also be nice
16. That would be interesting if his ult charged his passive, yes. 

Volt has a couple issues, yes. But he is more or less fine where he is. People just get pissy because they believe his description. I didn't think he needed that much of a rework in the first place, so I'm glad they didn't completely overhaul him. The one thing I wish they would fix was his description from "alternative to gunplay" to "buff to gunplay", because he is a jack of all trades and is built more for utility than anything imo.  

Thank you for replying.

1.ok.

2. Minor bug, i will report it, and still hope it gets fixed. Minor or major shouldnt matter.

3. I will check up on that.

4. Understandable.

5. Volts speed...saying that it is fine as is with the reasons stated is demoralizing to me, to say the least. To completely discredit my issues with speed...by saying what you havnt had an issue with.... 

I didnt have a problem with speed before the rework either, because i wasnt relying on that one ability to make volt fun to play, but it was the one thing they could have tweaked, and things are different with this rework.

Also Saryns energy regen is not worthless, i actually like it. I dont have zenurik, and its not energy vampire, but it helps...how you came to that conclusion and then used it to say the same thing would be worthless on volt, i have no clue....energy regen in volts kit would be a valid reason for riot sheild to be the way it is and for speed to have such a short duration ( i only get 16. Iv heard the best is 28 ish)

Ill reevaluate my life and see if im wrong i guess.

6. "Learn how to use speed".... While the problems of how the ability would interact with the map are glaring, and i appreciate your feedback, this suggestion of mine follows the same thought process that led me to want players receiving speed to be able to sprint or walk. (will explain further).

7.My "walk or run" suggestion is something i didnt take the time to explain. That is on me

The Idea: pre rework volt, you were forced into speed and had no choice or say so on the matter. With this, its pretty much the same thing, except you can choose to "walk" at your frames normal sprint speed, or sprint at max speed fpr the duration of the ability, by toggle. You can even keep the back flip for a 1 minute full dispel to keep the ability off of you. This is for the people who do not like speed and wanted ot to be a drop again (which was bad....)

8. This isnt an issue of enemies getting past my sheild. Its the fact only shock will electrify the sheild (which does not keep anything from walking through even then) when i would find it much easier if speed and discharge also electrified the sheild.

9. Ok.

10. Ok.

11. ......

• "Casting Shock on a Tesla Coil-ed target will result in an overcharge, creating an AoE burst emitted from the target.

This is visually unnoticeable. In order to see anything happen, youd have to slow the frame rate down. Its simply unnecessary.

12. The ability lasts for 4 seconds without dealing damage. So simply split the stun by allowing for this to be moddable. Longer stun means less damage, shorter stun means more damage. In my mind it makes sense, but im willing to concede it may take more work.

13. The diacharge stun against grineer is pure cheese. If you saw what i posted in the volt mega thread, youd know why i say this. Infinite and finite numbers of enemies to kill. Infinite missions replace enemies as fast as you kill them. Why put effort in to a survival risking death, when you have an enemy off switch and an impenetrable sheild? Why not just camp and go for about 8 or 12 hours?

14. Ok.

15. Ok.

16. Ok. 

Anyways, if you made it all the way through, thanks for reading and replying.

Edited October 8, 2016 by (PS4)WINDMILEYNO
New phone doesnt like to be typed on...

[(PSN)WINDMILEYNO]

Ill have to be way more clear in my post, edits coming

[Insizer]

13 hours ago, (PS4)WINDMILEYNO said:

Thank you for replying.

1.ok.

2. Minor bug, i will report it, and still hope it gets fixed. Minor or major shouldnt matter.

3. I will check up on that.

4. Understandable.

5. Volts speed...saying that it is fine as is with the reasons stated is demoralizing to me, to say the least. To completely discredit my issues with speed...by saying what you havnt had an issue with.... 

I didnt have a problem with speed before the rework either, because i wasnt relying on that one ability to make volt fun to play, but it was the one thing they could have tweaked, and things are different with this rework.

Also Saryns energy regen is not worthless, i actually like it. I dont have zenurik, and its not energy vampire, but it helps...how you came to that conclusion and then used it to say the same thing would be worthless on volt, i have no clue....energy regen in volts kit would be a valid reason for riot sheild to be the way it is and for speed to have such a short duration ( i only get 16. Iv heard the best is 28 ish)

Ill reevaluate my life and see if im wrong i guess.

6. "Learn how to use speed".... While the problems of how the ability would interact with the map are glaring, and i appreciate your feedback, this suggestion of mine follows the same thought process that led me to want players receiving speed to be able to sprint or walk. (will explain further).

7.My "walk or run" suggestion is something i didnt take the time to explain. That is on me

The Idea: pre rework volt, you were forced into speed and had no choice or say so on the matter. With this, its pretty much the same thing, except you can choose to "walk" at your frames normal sprint speed, or sprint at max speed fpr the duration of the ability, by toggle. You can even keep the back flip for a 1 minute full dispel to keep the ability off of you. This is for the people who do not like speed and wanted ot to be a drop again (which was bad....)

8. This isnt an issue of enemies getting past my sheild. Its the fact only shock will electrify the sheild (which does not keep anything from walking through even then) when i would find it much easier if speed and discharge also electrified the sheild.

9. Ok.

10. Ok.

11. ......

• "Casting Shock on a Tesla Coil-ed target will result in an overcharge, creating an AoE burst emitted from the target.

This is visually unnoticeable. In order to see anything happen, youd have to slow the frame rate down. Its simply unnecessary.

12. The ability lasts for 4 seconds without dealing damage. So simply split the stun by allowing for this to be moddable. Longer stun means less damage, shorter stun means more damage. In my mind it makes sense, but im willing to concede it may take more work.

13. The diacharge stun against grineer is pure cheese. If you saw what i posted in the volt mega thread, youd know why i say this. Infinite and finite numbers of enemies to kill. Infinite missions replace enemies as fast as you kill them. Why put effort in to a survival risking death, when you have an enemy off switch and an impenetrable sheild? Why not just camp and go for about 8 or 12 hours?

14. Ok.

15. Ok.

16. Ok. 

Anyways, if you made it all the way through, thanks for reading and replying.

No problem. I also apologize for how harsh and such I might have come across... My manner of speech often does that.

5.) I understand what your issue with Speed is, and I'm not trying to just brush it off. You think that it should last longer in order to make its energy cost more worth it. I'm not against raising the base duration of it, but I don't see it a critical fix that is required. You ask where Volt is suppose to get the energy, so all I can say is that I've never had an issue with it. Energy Siphon and Flow is really all you need.

As for your comment on my comment on Saryn (Prime). I just didn't think that your comparison to Saryn (Prime) is fair as their situations are different. That's all I was saying. Saryn (Prime) needs an energy regen mechanic because her energy demands are greater due to the requirement of interplay and . Volt (Prime) doesn't require interplay, and thus isn't as energy hungry (unless you use Riot Shield). I'm not against some type of energy regen mechanic on Volt, as I use energy very liberally, but don't think that it is required and don't think that using Saryn (Prime) as your reasoning is good.

6.) I know that my comment sounded very crude and "get gud", but I truly believe that whatever mechanic would allow such auto object avoidance would create more problems than it solves. It wasn't me looking down on you or your desire, rather an actual concern about the technical solution which would be required to fulfill your desire. Technically speaking, it seems much more complex and open to issues than it sounds. That's why I said simpler is better. Also, the problem of running into things isn't really that glaring nor dire as the worst it does is temporarily slow you down and the problem itself is fairly easy to avoid.

7.) That actually sounds like an excellent idea, no joke. The only thing you'd need on top of that is an indicator of when Speed is active and you are able to regain the boost. The one issue I have is that this trick might not be evident to new players, but my "issue" is negligible considering DE doesn't publish or explain the technical aspects of basically anything in the game to begin with!

8.) I don't have an issue with Speed and Discharge electrifying E.Shield.

11.) I apologize for my misguided reaction there. I didn't know what you meant by "it" so took your comment as "Shock needs to be more interactive". And got really tired of "Force Lightning" and such suggestions during the pre-Volt rework feedback war on the forums so I react rather "unprofessional" lets call it. Yes, the visuals of the interaction should be more evident.

12.) Oh, now I see. Making them both moddable certainly would increase the build moldability. But then you'd have Transient Fortitude increasing damage twice, which may or may not be ok. I'd have to think more about it.

13.) No, I have not read you comments on that thread. Also, again I didn't know which ability's stun you were talking about.

As for the cheesability of Discharge's stun. I understand where you are coming from, but the CC is rather nice. It also plays well with Volt's jack-of-all-trades nature and makes a nice thematic and functional addition to Volt kit. Discharge being able to lock down a room is good for most gameplay. The only time you'd get the camping adventure you speak of is if you have Trinity (Prime) in your squad (due to energy requirements), at which point any talk about unfair cheesing is out of the window because Trinity. Plus Discharge is still better than Overload in every category other than the potential epicness of the visuals, so I'm not really complaining. I don't know, I've not put as much effort into really getting into Discharge as much as I should because I more or less focus on his other 3 abilities. 

[(PSN)WINDMILEYNO]

7 hours ago, Insizer said:

No problem. I also apologize for how harsh and such I might have come across... My manner of speech often does that.

5.) I understand what your issue with Speed is, and I'm not trying to just brush it off. You think that it should last longer in order to make its energy cost more worth it. I'm not against raising the base duration of it, but I don't see it a critical fix that is required. You ask where Volt is suppose to get the energy, so all I can say is that I've never had an issue with it. Energy Siphon and Flow is really all you need.

As for your comment on my comment on Saryn (Prime). I just didn't think that your comparison to Saryn (Prime) is fair as their situations are different. That's all I was saying. Saryn (Prime) needs an energy regen mechanic because her energy demands are greater due to the requirement of interplay and . Volt (Prime) doesn't require interplay, and thus isn't as energy hungry (unless you use Riot Shield). I'm not against some type of energy regen mechanic on Volt, as I use energy very liberally, but don't think that it is required and don't think that using Saryn (Prime) as your reasoning is good.

6.) I know that my comment sounded very crude and "get gud", but I truly believe that whatever mechanic would allow such auto object avoidance would create more problems than it solves. It wasn't me looking down on you or your desire, rather an actual concern about the technical solution which would be required to fulfill your desire. Technically speaking, it seems much more complex and open to issues than it sounds. That's why I said simpler is better. Also, the problem of running into things isn't really that glaring nor dire as the worst it does is temporarily slow you down and the problem itself is fairly easy to avoid.

7.) That actually sounds like an excellent idea, no joke. The only thing you'd need on top of that is an indicator of when Speed is active and you are able to regain the boost. The one issue I have is that this trick might not be evident to new players, but my "issue" is negligible considering DE doesn't publish or explain the technical aspects of basically anything in the game to begin with!

8.) I don't have an issue with Speed and Discharge electrifying E.Shield.

11.) I apologize for my misguided reaction there. I didn't know what you meant by "it" so took your comment as "Shock needs to be more interactive". And got really tired of "Force Lightning" and such suggestions during the pre-Volt rework feedback war on the forums so I react rather "unprofessional" lets call it. Yes, the visuals of the interaction should be more evident.

12.) Oh, now I see. Making them both moddable certainly would increase the build moldability. But then you'd have Transient Fortitude increasing damage twice, which may or may not be ok. I'd have to think more about it.

13.) No, I have not read you comments on that thread. Also, again I didn't know which ability's stun you were talking about.

As for the cheesability of Discharge's stun. I understand where you are coming from, but the CC is rather nice. It also plays well with Volt's jack-of-all-trades nature and makes a nice thematic and functional addition to Volt kit. Discharge being able to lock down a room is good for most gameplay. The only time you'd get the camping adventure you speak of is if you have Trinity (Prime) in your squad (due to energy requirements), at which point any talk about unfair cheesing is out of the window because Trinity. Plus Discharge is still better than Overload in every category other than the potential epicness of the visuals, so I'm not really complaining. I don't know, I've not put as much effort into really getting into Discharge as much as I should because I more or less focus on his other 3 abilities. 

This has been great feedback, to make things easy, ill just edit out everything that wasnt agreed with when i get a chance, but i nned to kick the horse one last time

I dont explain things well, but this helps me see why my other post (and this one) dont get much attention. But when i do explain, walls get built...the main point is in bold, if you read everything else, thats awesome...

My problems with speeds duration, and discharge are probably more personal...this: e sheild/energy pizza/discharge. I like(d) to run and gun, and play actively, but this...

Discharge, on 2 special occasions ( similar though to every other time i play volt) i have had extremely sour experiences with this ability. Is it bad on its own? Probably not.

I used oberon, naramon, energy pizzas to solo up to sortie 3, where i then got murder destroyed by sargus ruk because no hard cc. Came back naramon, energy pizzas, e sheild and discharge to cheese my way in sortie 3 sargus ruk solo again . I sat there for 30 minutes unable to get his health down far enough with my quanta because he would never face my direction, inbetween twitching, and fighting other grineer. Im not deluded enough to believe i would have survived world on fire, but i left on my own free will, from boredom and a youtube video.

I was playing with pubs on moon defense against the grineer, just jumped into their match. I was having fun, trying to pretend like the rework never happened, running with an amprex, when they all started leaving, one by one. Im not going to say that they left for any specific reason, but when i was stuck defending the pod by myself, things got kind of difficult for squishy volt. So i cast e sheild, and was safe, put down energy pizzas and cast discharge. And everything stopped. And stopped. And....stopped. I was alone, in a room, with twitching immobile grineer...what fun?

Do you know how monumentally easier it is to just stand behind a sheild and stun stuff than to put effort into a game and try and run and gun with shock and speed? And substitue trin for energy pizzas, throw nova and frost in....what balance? Where are the nerfers now? Everyones so worried about Embers world on fire....nullifiers for corpus, scaling energy drain fro infested, primed nonsense for corrupted. My personal personal problem is that i hate power denial, so i only play the grineer, and i hate aoe powers, because they are the reason the corpus/ infested/ and corrupted (by proxy) are the way they are. And i hate cc powers, becauser forum users blame damage abilities, and call it face rolling and effortless (when damage abilities arent infinitely scaling!) but claim cc abilities are tactical and require strategy! (When they are infinitely scaling!!!!) and cc abilities take the enemy out of the game (another spawn cannot take its place), when damage abilities will replace the enemy you killed with another. Nyx outlasts Saryn everytime.

------------------------

Speed. I always run out of energy while trying to stay on the move, because my volt cant support a rage build (without equilibrium, as life strike is the opposite of what im trying to acheive) and orbs dont drop nearly as often as they need to, which leads to the old e sheild/energy pizza/discharge combo. I dont have access to the things that will grant me unlimited energy (yet), but recently went to the moon and coaction drift ( i believe) so energy siphon will be worthwile maybe.

What i want, is longer speed duration, a discharge i can mod to get rid of the stun, and energy gain inherent to volts kit so that i can play the way i wish to without ruining others enjoyment. I know there are people out there that have similar veiws on volt, i think these things would only help it feel like camping wasnt the best option for "endgame" volt.

[voltocitygel]

On 10/8/2016 at 2:31 AM, Cytobel said:

Just sort of a straw poll here, but did anyone else use Volt for the recent Nightwatch tac alert?

I found it to be quite funny, except for that Survival where nobody (myself included) was paying attention.  Honestly, I didn't realize the towers had fire-suppression systems in them.  Because oxygen is known...  for....  that.....?  Beh, I forget to discard logic sometimes.

If you DID Volt through it, how did it go for you?

fine, the 2 that i was able to complete (Busy, didn't have the time to do the second 2). I didn't bother switching out capacitance though, mostly because I didn't know that it removed damage. My standard build worked quite well for me. (I was solo, fyi)

[Insizer]

It's interesting, I'm almost the opposite of you. I love CC and hate damage abilities (I'm more of a support guy so yeah), AOEs are fine with me so long as they are not excessive, and while I dislike power denial, I'm not totally against it. That said, I can see where you are coming from your points, and some of them have made me think about things. Indeed, extremely effective CC can trivialize the game, and thinking about it, they are a huge reason why nullies exist. Perhaps only one or two frames should be able to lock down a room for an extended period of time...

I play a flexible playstyle with Volt and love it. I am normally very active, using Shock very liberally to find enemies around corners and to stun them, and using Speed fairly often. But when S#&$ hits the fan or if I need to defend, then I will go into a defense mode, cast E.Shield once or twice. And because of Riot shield I can move around a little, outside of my barrier which my allies are using. I find this fun, because able to dynamically adapt I like Volt having a decent tool for every occasion, that's why I'm more ok with Volt being able to lock down a room. I'm not totally against what you want. Longer Speed, moddable Discharge stun duration, and innate energy regen would all be plusses for my playstyle. I was just unsure the need for some of them, because of the, admittably shortsighted, reason: "I've never had an issue in that department". 

I hold a somewhat different view of your defense anecdote. For one, I think that squishy Volt being able to survive behind E.shield is a testament to his utility and support capability. But I do see where you are coming from, if you were so inclinded to use so many energy pads, then yes Discharge's stun could certainly trivialize things. Perhaps, enemies that were already Discharge'd should have some resistance to following ones.

But the reason why camping is Volt's end-game is because he doesn't have the innate defenses to support very aggressive end-game gameplay, the same goes for most other frames. Volt just has the capability to make his own defenses. The rework did little to deal with Volt's squishiness. Riot Shield would have been great for that, if not for the ridiculous double drain. A drain that was supposed to balance out the fact that he has an invicible shield in front of him while moving. 

It's funny, I was so focued on trying to prevent people wanting to ruin Volt (scrapping his utility to turn him into a glasscannon and such), that I was grateful that his rework didn't change much and failed to see issues he had. I've also developed a chip on my shoulder when it comes to "rework the rework" ideas for similar reasons. The more I look at Volt now the more I'm seeing issues he does have.

I'm also sorry for how my initial post was. It is a terrible habit, but I like to argue and tend to react somewhat harshly at first and then spend too much time backpeddling to my actual position.

[herflik]

I always liked Volt, the lord of lightning and speed - so i will give small feedback about his abilities including passive:

Passive - it give small amount of damage comparing of how long you need to run to charge it, not noticable in my opinion. Would like it to get 3 changes: gain 100-200 charges per ability cast, is used only when on full charge, instead of giving damage make it boost in some way next ability cast (in ex. shock bounce count increase from 5 to 10 and have damage increased by 100%, speed gains additional electric damage buff for the duration, shield area is cast as circle around you, overcharge deal high spike damage on begining etc.).

Shock - stuning tool, completly no damage even with 250%+ power str, waste of energy IMO. Volt should be "mage" class, meaning alternative to gunplay. You could do few things to this ability:

1) First way is to increase its damage, but it would require really high bump to be usefull damage tool.

2) Second option is to make it exception comparing to other frames - make it free to cast and give it cooldown (power efficiency will reduce cooldown), remove quaranted proc rate. This way this will be real alternative to gunplay.

3)Make it channeled ability - as long as you hold the button it will deal damage per second and drain a bit of energy (ex. 5 per second).

Speed: IMO it doesnt need any changes, its alright now.

Shield: Its good ability, though the shield pick up possiblity is rather useless taking into account it radiculously high energy cost. I would rather remove the pick up energy cost and make it tick time 2 or 3 times faster. So for example you have 30 sec stationary shield or 10 sec mobile shield.

Overcharge: Like shock, nothing more than stun tool. Even with high power str % it does super low damage and have really high energy cost with it. It need increased damage and maybe grant some bonus charges to passive.