2000 Endo enough to motivate veterans to do the sorties ?

[ElocFreidon]

Sorties drop rewards other than 2k endo? I'm being serious. The rng is unfathomable.

[Chewarette]

2 hours ago, Vicious_Vipa said:

maybe not ONLY for veterans.      But if the Sorties weren't designed for veterans,  please show me the other missions which are considered "endgame" where the veterans should go.  

....

 

I am listening ;)

Nearly all endless missions become more difficult than Sorties once you reach a certain amount of waves/cryo/minute.

[Vicious_Vipa]

yes, of course.  
But I am talking about missions that are designed for veterans.

Do you really think that they designed low level missions for veterans because in theory you could stay there for 2 hours ?

[Olematon.Mies]

Sorties and Trials are a good step into the direction of "end-game" but Sorties alone are not enough.

Reason being that Warframe has no clear direction of what it wants to be, and as such it is nearly impossible to define any sort of "end-game" content. High level missions are a start, but again, not enouigh. The very definition of "end-game" content in any form of game that has grindy aspects to it means that even with the best gear possible they would be not only challenging, but they also have some incentive to do them. Special titles or items, unique cosmetics, small stat boosts, bragging rights. Warframe, as of right now, has none of those things. All skins and cosmetics are either purchasable by plat, bought from Baro'Ki'S--tface or found in randomly popping alerts. Occasionally there is a skin or two in an event or tactical alert, which is nice, but that's it.

As of right now, the only incentive to do sorties (at least from a veterans perspective) is the focus lenses. But even those are becoming more of a side-aspect once the player has 3 of each lens, meaning that even that little incentive is easily lost and sorties turn into chores with a "chance" getting a legendary core, which I am fairly certain nobody has ever gotten. The one actual incentive to do Trials on the other hand are Arcanes. That is a much better way to go about it, reason being that none of the Arcane effects are necessary - none of them are absolutely needed. Yes, they do help. Yes, they are nice. But they are not Needed. And without trading it will take ages to get a full set of Arcanes all the way maxed - that is an actual end-game goal. An incentive. Some take to it more than others, but it's there.

Another problem that makes Warframe defy the very concept of "end-game content" is not only the heavy cheese tactics involving heavy CC, but also the ever increasing problem that is Power creep. What this means is that the more and more better and stronger things DE throws at us, the high level content that is supposed to be challenging becomes less and less of a threat by default, which leads to DE having basically 2 options --- either they intentionally let the Power creep grow rampantly and constantly make new content to accommodate that which leads to a vast majority of all previously existing content obsolete by default - or they have start adjusting all the levels of power and draw a base-line for everything in order to keep things in check without risking the loss of old content while at the sime time keeping Power creep at acceptable levels.

 

A bit of a ramble, but that's my two cents on the matter.

Edited October 13, 2016 by maikkeli31

[marelooke]

3 hours ago, maikkeli31 said:

Sorties and Trials are a good step into the direction of "end-game" but Sorties alone are not enough.

Reason being that Warframe has no clear direction of what it wants to be, and as such it is nearly impossible to define any sort of "end-game" content. High level missions are a start, but again, not enouigh. The very definition of "end-game" content in any form of game that has grindy aspects to it means that even with the best gear possible they would be not only challenging, but they also have some incentive to do them. Special titles or items, unique cosmetics, small stat boosts, bragging rights. Warframe, as of right now, has none of those things. All skins and cosmetics are either purchasable by plat, bought from Baro'Ki'S--tface or found in randomly popping alerts. Occasionally there is a skin or two in an event or tactical alert, which is nice, but that's it.

As of right now, the only incentive to do sorties (at least from a veterans perspective) is the focus lenses. But even those are becoming more of a side-aspect once the player has 3 of each lens, meaning that even that little incentive is easily lost and sorties turn into chores with a "chance" getting a legendary core, which I am fairly certain nobody has ever gotten. The one actual incentive to do Trials on the other hand are Arcanes. That is a much better way to go about it, reason being that none of the Arcane effects are necessary - none of them are absolutely needed. Yes, they do help. Yes, they are nice. But they are not Needed. And without trading it will take ages to get a full set of Arcanes all the way maxed - that is an actual end-game goal. An incentive. Some take to it more than others, but it's there.

Another problem that makes Warframe defy the very concept of "end-game content" is not only the heavy cheese tactics involving heavy CC, but also the ever increasing problem that is Power creep. What this means is that the more and more better and stronger things DE throws at us, the high level content that is supposed to be challenging becomes less and less of a threat by default, which leads to DE having basically 2 options --- either they intentionally let the Power creep grow rampantly and constantly make new content to accommodate that which leads to a vast majority of all previously existing content obsolete by default - or they have start adjusting all the levels of power and draw a base-line for everything in order to keep things in check without risking the loss of old content while at the sime time keeping Power creep at acceptable levels.

 

A bit of a ramble, but that's my two cents on the matter.

Braindump mode on:

I don't feel that locking rewards behind game modes that people might not enjoy (eg. Conclave and Trials) would be a great way to go. What most players want is a reason to do harder versions of what we already do normally, not "special" game modes that have little in common with the "normal" gameplay (this, imho is one of the reasons why Trials failed). I feel it's also part of the complaints about Sorties, the higher level enemies might be fun (insofar they're not just plain annoying due to broken scaling, but I digress) but the modifiers are often, well, a chore.

A good step in the right direction would be having rewards scale with mission difficulty (this is sort of the case already, but see my next point), but also scale while the mission is already in progress, meaning quite simply that the longer you play an endless mission the better the rewards should be. It might of course be sensible to put an upper limit to this after which rewards stop scaling to avoid ridiculous situations (or avoid accidental bugs getting out of hand before DE has a chance to fix them) but at least it'd give staying longer than the minimum required time in endless missions a point again.

It would also be nice to have actual high level versions of various mission types. I have no access to the game atm but I'm quite sure that outside Sorties there's no non-endless missions with, say, lvl100 enemies...

Of course, all of this ties is subject to your observations about power creep. Level 100-ish enemies might be hard-ish now, but who knows how things will be a year from now, maybe you need lvl200 enemies then to provide any sort of challenge...

Edited October 13, 2016 by marelooke

[(XBOX)Englands Own]

I probably enjoy the sorties and endless type missions the most on Warframe.Re the sorties it's the tiny hope of a second legendary,but Endo for me is much better than Nezha parts/most lenses and the bulk of the weapons which have come along with the seasons.

[(XBOX)Black Mouse]

As a vet the endo is worth it,  plus the fun of having a challenge. When you face level 9999's then go back to the solar map it feels too easy. I actually started to feel bad for the enemies because they have no chance. With over 1.5 million kills this quote sums it up "I am death, the mighty destroyer of the world, out to destroy. Even without your participation all the warriors standing arrayed in the opposing armies shall cease to exist" Bhagavad Gita. So now as a challenge I kill myself till one revive then run the missions. Back to the old school of video gaming you die you start all over again.   

[Chipputer]

6 minutes ago, (XB1)Black Mouse said:

So now as a challenge I kill myself till one revive then run the missions. Back to the old school of video gaming you die you start all over again.   

Why not just... abort if you die?

[marelooke]

1 minute ago, Chipputer said:

Why not just... abort if you die?

Why do something simple when a way can be found to make it complex and beautiful... ;-)

[Chipputer]

Just now, marelooke said:

Why do something simple when a way can be found to make it complex and beautiful... ;-)

Ah yes. Silly me. :P

[(XBOX)Black Mouse]

Just now, Chipputer said:

Why not just... abort if you die?

Something about running around knowing I have 1 life left motivates me.  Plus I'm lazy would rather the system take me back to orbiter then press buttons.  

[marelooke]

5 minutes ago, (XB1)Black Mouse said:

Something about running around knowing I have 1 life left motivates me.  Plus I'm lazy would rather the system take me back to orbiter then press buttons.  

Hmm, would be a nice option to have in the game itself actually. Then you wouldn't even have to kill yourself first (err, that sounds...weird)

[(XBOX)Black Mouse]

20 minutes ago, marelooke said:

Hmm, would be a nice option to have in the game itself actually. Then you wouldn't even have to kill yourself first (err, that sounds...weird)

That would be a nice option. Hard mode settings.

[RistN]

I don't mind getting endo even I have lots of it but once in a while we could get something else like a reactor or catalyst.Let them also be a part of rewards that you get if you got a reward that you already have(bottom ones checked)

[GreenVajene]

On 10/10/2016 at 3:30 AM, Vicious_Vipa said:

2000 Endo enough to motivate veterans to do the sorties ?

No.

 

Also,

8 minutes ago, RistN said:

I don't mind getting endo even I have lots of it but once in a while we could get something else like a reactor or catalyst.Let them also be a part of rewards that you get if you got a reward that you already have(bottom ones checked)

[RistN]

8 minutes ago, GreenVajene said:

No.

 

Also,

Yeah,I know that, but I rarely get even 1 reactor and catalyst in whole season.Exilus adapter also.Make them drop more often.That's my point.

Oh I see why you quoteed me.Bad english.Did not say it right.

Edited October 14, 2016 by RistN

[CrisFenix]

Endo is useless for veterans, they already have a bunch of endo and all primed mods

I would say: they should give relics instead of endo

but the game is so boring right now with the fissures that I cant play it anymore

so, whatever

 

 

 

Edited October 14, 2016 by CrisFenix

[Chipputer]

4 minutes ago, CrisFenix said:

Endo is useless for veterans,

Endo is literally never useless as long as there are new mods being worked on, new primed mods being released, or I decide I want to rank up a second copy of any mod to sell, use on my sentinel, etc, etc.

Just because you can't use it right this very second doesn't make it useless.

[CrisFenix]

26 minutes ago, Chipputer said:

Endo is literally never useless as long as there are new mods being worked on, new primed mods being released, or I decide I want to rank up a second copy of any mod to sell, use on my sentinel, etc, etc.

Just because you can't use it right this very second doesn't make it useless.

What can I do with the 134.771 endo I have?

I have all the primed mods and Baro only repeats the same old thing

As I said, useless for veterans (1800+ hours here)