Can we please nerf Mirage + Simulor?

[(PSN)Coyote_x_Starrk]

12 minutes ago, (XB1)Knight Raime said:

The lengths you and others go to justify other nukes over this one is astounding. no weve both added nothing to the discussion. wee.

I could give half a turd about the other "nukes" people are talking about. If they break the game then nerf them too. 

 

This one is the one I run into more than any other and its the only one that completely ruins my gaming experience. 

 

(Added nothing to the discussion? I STARTED THE DISCUSSION) 

Edited December 5, 2016 by (PS4)Coyote_x_Starrk

[schilds]

I hope they fix Mirage, she needs a rework. It's not (just) about S. Simulor. There are lots of things that outdamage Mirage.

The problem is her gameplay is uninteresting at the moment. You hit 1 and 3 (both essentially used as straight buffs to damage) then you run around smacking things. Who uses 2? Nobody uses 4 anymore. She's a one trick pony. As annoying as it is for the rest of the squad - and I find the images getting in the way all the time far more annoying than simulor spam - she's not that fun for the Mirage player either, after a couple of runs you get bored when you realise she's a one trick pony with no variety in her gameplay.

Her current gameplay doesn't even fit her aesthetic as a trickster and illusionist.

[(XBOX)Knight Raime]

4 minutes ago, Midrib said:

Saryn that again requires more brain power then mirage could handle.

I never said Loki is fine, yet you assume that I did.

Rhino and Ember can CC but they don't destroy entire tilesets with 1 ability and LMB. Even then Ember isn't even close to how strong Mirage+Simulor is nor is Range rhino.

All that you are doing is pointing at other stuff to try and salvage a brainless combo. None of the methods you posted are even close to mirage simulor, not even irradiating disarm.

Call it vendetta or whatever at least im not blind.

I'm fine with Mirage, but that combo is literally brainless.

And even the stuff you are pointing at... are @(*()$ ultimates... almost every single one is an ultimate. which cost 100 energy at base or high maintenance toggle ults.

You're just downplaying again. gg.

im blind how? you're the on hiding behind semantices and subective statements.

There is literally no difference between CC the enemies forever while they die versus this combo. both are achieving the same end result. and none of what i mentioned is quantifably harder to manage than the combo of this topic.

further justification here. High energy or up keep is a shallow rebuttle when you know people will run the setups to nullify the cos and/or run pads.

[Pro3Display]

31 minutes ago, (PS4)SageHeed said:

Mirage/Simulor noobs don't have 200 anything.

pffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffff

[(XBOX)Knight Raime]

2 minutes ago, (PS4)Coyote_x_Starrk said:

I could give half a turd about the other "nukes" people are talking about. If they break the game then nerf them too. 

 

This one is the one I run into more than any other and its the only one that completely ruins my gaming experience. 

you're gaming experience isn't more important than anyone elses. You're not forced to deal with this so it's entirely on you. nether the s simulor or mirage are a problem.

[(PSN)Coyote_x_Starrk]

1 minute ago, (XB1)Knight Raime said:

you're gaming experience isn't more important than anyone elses. You're not forced to deal with this so it's entirely on you. nether the s simulor or mirage are a problem.

And your combo that breaks the game and trivializes content is not exempt from being adjusted. 

You know as well as I do that its not going to be left the way it is with the way that DE is cracking down on win buttons (Bladestorm for example) 

[traybong111]

It's the same situation with Miasma-rush Saryn of old. Mirage/Synoid Simulor combo is getting some kind of nerf just like any other cheese of the past, and the community will find some other efficient and lazy method. This is neither the only cheese nor final cheese you'll ever get in Warframe, children, do calm down. 

[UncaIroh]

How about decreasing fire rate on the holograms? only 1 in 5 shots is real, the rest are illusions or something like that (1 in 5 might be too much, but run with the idea instead first)

To balance it out, the illusions get a damage buff. The idea here is that you have less explosions but keep similar damage when using any other weapon. So a run-n-gun simulor mirage will have less detonations but if it does it explodes for more damage. 

Alternatively, each shot from the holograms uses energy to fire and when you have none the holograms don't shoot/dissipate.

The idea here is to prevent Mirage from monopolizing entire maps/missions to give a chance to team mates.

Properly modded, a Mirage can still pretty much clear an entire mission by herself even with the idea above. (efficiency mods and primed flow)

I don't run a mirage/simulor combo myself. It's boring, TBH.

Edited December 5, 2016 by TonyWong

[Tuxie]

No. If you nerf this then there's twenty other room clear gears that players will use.

 

Go play solo, with your friends, or form your own squad. You're also more than free to leave a game if someone is using something you don't like.

[(XBOX)Knight Raime]

2 minutes ago, (PS4)Coyote_x_Starrk said:

And your combo that breaks the game and trivializes content is not exempt from being adjusted. 

You know as well as I do that its not going to be left the way it is with the way that DE is cracking down on win buttons (Bladestorm for example) 

If they adjust it I won't complain. I just think its silly that people would attack this combo but ignore or defend other combos that achieve the same end result with basically the same effort put forth.

[(PSN)SageHeed]

33 minutes ago, ensignvidiot said:

I really wish these threads would cease to exist

 

This is what NERFED trinity to uselessness, nerfed ember from endgame potential. it's what caused shotgun damage falloff to creep up.

It's what's driven thousands of players away from their favorite frames and out of the game.

You bring up these changes as if they where a bad thing. These were improvements that made the game better.

It's improvements like these that - while making thousands of players rage-quit - have made millions of players fall in love with this game and its development.

[(PSN)Coyote_x_Starrk]

3 minutes ago, Tuxie said:

No. If you nerf this then there's twenty other room clear gears that players will use.

 

Go play solo, with your friends, or form your own squad. You're also more than free to leave a game if someone is using something you don't like.

Good. 

Once they get done with this one they can start working on those then. 

[Midrib]

13 minutes ago, (XB1)Knight Raime said:

You're just downplaying again. gg.

im blind how? you're the on hiding behind semantices and subective statements.

There is literally no difference between CC the enemies forever while they die versus this combo. both are achieving the same end result. and none of what i mentioned is quantifably harder to manage than the combo of this topic.

further justification here. High energy or up keep is a shallow rebuttle when you know people will run the setups to nullify the cos and/or run pads.

If you can't see how effortlessly powerful that combo is then yes, you are blind.

What is subjective about what im saying.. Is mirage combo completely effortless yet grants great results?...Yes.

Does it trivalize content? yes.

What justification? that an ultimate is supposed to be somewhat strong?

all the combos you complained about cost more to maintain and have a larger deficit then mirage and mirage still does just as good as those combos with little to no effort or cost.

[(PSN)SageHeed]

17 minutes ago, Gelkor said:

I just wish I didn't have to see and hear it every time a Mirage+Simulor shows up in my mission, I don't care about the damage, I can usually compete, it's just the visual effect and THAT NOISE. 20 straight minutes of this:

  Hide contents

Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!Bwang!

Drives me nuts.

Exactly this. Which is why the ammo pool should be limited to 35. Keep it strong, but force some semblance of aiming.

[megastorm]

I see some of the same people asking for ash 4 to be changed are here defending mirage...smh. Whats good for the goose is good for the gander.

[(PSN)SageHeed]

21 minutes ago, ChuckMaverick said:

That wouldn't make any difference as it uses the most common ammo drop in the game. Even if you changed it to use sniper ammo, carrier + vacuum + ammo case would keep it fed just fine.

I believe an ammo pool of 35 would make a difference, 35 shots go off quickly. I believe it would discourage the constant non-stop brainless spamming, which is the real problem in my opinion. It would still be OP, it would still please it's "fans", but they would have to at least check if there were any enemies around. Now they don't.

[Sir_Alex_Traffo]

It can be quite annoying, but honestly a nerf is not really a solution, especially since this is not an exploit, they're just playing the game as it is supposed to be. 

I can always leave if I feel like I'm not in the mood to deal with a Mirage+Simulor; actually, the only thing that drives me mad is when the spam is quite brainless in Corpus tilesets, breaking every window and causing a lockdown every minute or so: but that's the player's fault, not the frame nor the weapon. 

[Tuxie]

10 minutes ago, (PS4)Coyote_x_Starrk said:

Good. 

Once they get done with this one they can start working on those then. 

Yeah nerf everything to the ground right? This is too powerful? Cry enough till they nerf it, and when they do that, you can cry about the next thing! Brilliant!

[(PSN)Coyote_x_Starrk]

1 minute ago, Tuxie said:

Yeah nerf everything to the ground right? This is too powerful? Cry enough till they nerf it, and when they do that, you can cry about the next thing! Brilliant!

Welcome to the world of balancing games. 

 

Your solution of leaving it alone because why not is even more ignorant. 

[onieyez]

it's not that powerful, just great at clearing trash mobs and star chart stuff which is why people are complaining so much

it still has trouble killing heavy units, which is where most mirage's will die to

[Tuxie]

2 minutes ago, (PS4)Coyote_x_Starrk said:

Welcome to the world of balancing games. 

 

Your solution of leaving it alone because why not is even more ignorant. 

Well in my opinion the combo is legitimate and not even all that powerful outside of clearing low to mid level enemies. Just because you don't like this combo you think it's right to take the fun away from anyone else who actually likes it. "Stop playing the game in ways I don't like, play the game like I want you to!", it's an extremely childish mindset.

[MopUpCrewman]

I like how all the people who don't want to lose their cheese mechanic have the argument of:

Go Solo

Why don't you go solo instead? You're doing all the killing anyways. You don't need a team Why should everyone else go solo because you don't want to? Or are you that unconfident in yourself that even with cheese tactics you need a team?

[(XBOX)Oussii]

1 hour ago, (PS4)SageHeed said:

Mirage/Simulor noobs don't have 200 anything.

Noobs don't have synoid, so we do not need to nerf it for them

[schilds]

Maybe her images run around by themselves. Playfully annoying the enemies in a "catch me if you can" and "behind you, boo!" kind of way. Maybe have her 4 affect enemy behaviour. Instead of attracting enemies like Titania's lantern does, have them programmed to stay out of LoS of the floating prism, ducking around corners and behind cover, possibly flushing them into view of our frames - which they're not paying any attention to while hiding from the prism :P. If you still want to blind things you can explode it straight away.

She feels like she should be more playful than a frame that just goes around smacking stuff with 2 buffs activated.

[Betorh]

My favorites frames are Vauban and Inaros and I really don't mind if someone is having fun with Mirage/simulor, most of the time what im looking for is the loot, I don't care if someone is the top killer in the team, I don't have anything to prove. After a while the mirage/simulor combo gets boring for most people, but who am i to cut their fun? My advice is play and embrace diversity. _{By the way english is not my first language.}