Limbo to be nerfed now?

[Cat__Nap]

It is a little strong, I will admit. But I also think we need MORE abilities that scale to high levels, not to nerf the few that do. I don't think a straight up damage decrease would be a good thing - it's one of his viable builds now, and Lotus knows he's needed versatility. Taking some of his options away would be a step back...and decreasing the damage to the point where it's no longer useful at higher levels would basically put him in Ember's position; powerful at low levels, useless for damage at high levels. We don't need more of that. Abilities that scale are GOOD - it lets people play those frames the way they're built to be played, not having to either refrain from taking said frames or by using weaker or less-preferred builds to high level things.

Saryn, for instance, had a ridiculously spammable AoE, like Limbo does currently. There was no mechanic to it. It was straight up OP. They changed the mechanic, and now that particular ability is not the same anymore (still useful, but not a spammable nuke like it was), but she can still AoE with her revamped Spore. She's still one of the (if not the) top DPS frames in the game, but they made her slightly more complex. Mirage also had a slightly overpowered AoE - they nerfed LoS on it, but you can still cast-and-forget about it. Downside and upside. 

I think it could use a change in mechanic, without reducing the damage. Longer cast, maybe, or some other downside that would balance it out while keeping him strong. The last thing I want to see is another frame neutered for no good reason...especially since he's spent years being the worst frame in the game. Scaleable abilities are not a bad thing - more DPS skills should scale past level 20-30.

[Evanescent]

Eh, Ember's WoF is still around. What they could do is tweak he damage but then I don't use him as a nuker so I wouldn't care.

Sure, you can use him like that, but in most places where it counts that's gong to struggle. I'd rather have CC!

 

I would also like to ask that we stop confusing scaling abilities with OP abilities. We had the same issue with Nidus. 

Edited March 31, 2017 by Evanescent

[SeaUrchins]

3 minutes ago, Evanescent said:

in most places where it counts that's gong to struggle

What are those most places?

[Evanescent]

2 minutes ago, SeaUrchins said:

What are those most places?

Gametypes like spy, survival, defense, mobile defense, etc. Exterminates, it shines. But those, with objectives that need to be protected? You would be better off supporting the team and yourself with CC. 

You could argue that killing is the best type of CC, and that for most content he kills fine enough. Eh, you would have a point. But you would also sacrifice most of what makes him unique. And when enemies become resillient you would struggle. Limbo doesn't have much survivability, and his cast times are long.

[Ivan_Rid]

3 hours ago, Evanescent said:

Eh, Ember's WoF is still around. What they could do is tweak he damage but then I don't use him as a nuker so I wouldn't care.

Sure, you can use him like that, but in most places where it counts that's gong to struggle. I'd rather have CC!

 

I would also like to ask that we stop confusing scaling abilities with OP abilities. We had the same issue with Nidus. 

What does WoF have to do with it? It has no scaling to speak of. Now if it had at least a guaranteed 1%-2.5% of enemy health per tick we would be talking.

And current iteration of Cataclyzm is more akin to old Mag Polarize, except that now it works of hp+shields and not just shields.

edit: In my experience all it takes is a single event ruined by ability, with exploiters getting unreacheable score. Thats what happened with Polarize and Rathuum. So Cataclyzm nuke is on the clock, enjoy it while you can.

Edited March 31, 2017 by Ivan_Rid

[SeaUrchins]

3 hours ago, Evanescent said:

But those, with objectives that need to be protected?

What does it have to do with protection? We are talking about infinitely scaling damage ability. It doesn't protect the cryopod, does it deals less damage because of it? It doesn't, how do you even link the objectives that need to be protected here?

Currently we have utterly broken overpowered team of EV+Maimquinox+Frost who can sit inside an infinitely invulnerable globe and unleash infinitely scaling damage, Limbo can go 4th there now, because he'll power up the bass cannon Equinox faster than Trin with his mass nuke.

It's like parrying "Frost's invulnerable globe is OP" with "well, there's Atlas and he can build a wall".

Edited March 31, 2017 by SeaUrchins

[samuelx43a]

Can't believe you guys.This is limbo we're talking about.He is s glass cannon. Decently powerful, but squshy and very easy to kill.

I've yet to see limbos going around, which would be fantastic and more frame variety.The actual darn 4th ability he has gives FREE energy regen(not much, but a decent amount)

So please, leave him alone, and don't be such a wuss about one ability that so happens to scale with hp

(Jat kitagg has the vulcan blitz mod, which does 60% of the enemy hp as damage when it kills something, and it's an aoe.I'm not seeing anyone winging about that)

[SeaUrchins]

1 minute ago, samuelx43a said:

(Jat kitagg has the vulcan blitz mod, which does 60% of the enemy hp as damage when it kills something, and it's an aoe.I'm not seeing anyone winging about that)

Except that to get that 60% of enemy hp you need to kill the enemy with your regular hits first, which means as soon as you are unable to kill enemies with your swings you can kiss the 60% damage from enemy's hp goodbye.

Paired with a Huras he can stay permanently invisible while continuing to nuke with his Cataclysm. You can't get any harder to kill than going invisible, because most enemies don't attack invisible targets (unless they are mutalist carrier drones or Grineer guardians).

[samuelx43a]

Dont we all just hate those mutalist carriers eh?

[Ironlixivium]

You should know there's no reason to ever go strength on limbo right now, unless you're using rift torrent. Cataclysm's 10% damage is not based on power strength, and the damage it does effect is hopeless to try to kill anything worthwhile with.

[Darkmoone1]

I don't care if they nerf the nuking aspect of Cataclysm, but it would feel unwarrented. It currently has the niche use of clearing adds that are overwhelming Limbo or the group. In a way it works as a clever mechanic for Limbo as a "contingency" plan. The real strength of this frame rests in the combination of his abilities, with the Mod "Rift Torrent" and his second ability "Stasis" taking the spotlight. 

They should be gentle with the balancing of this frame though. This is the first time in a long while that Limbo is in a decent position when compared to many other frames.

 

Edited March 31, 2017 by Darkmoone1
clarifying

[SeaUrchins]

56 minutes ago, Darkmoone1 said:

 The real strength of this frame rests in the combination of his abilities, with the Mod "Rift Torrent" and his second ability "Stasis" taking the spotlight. 

And yet stasis+cataclysm doesn't stop enemies if they initiated capturing a tower in interception, unlike the pre-rework cast of cataclysm alone, which was an efficient combo breaker for a tower being captured.

[(PSN)CastAwayOrb]

Limbo doesnt need to be nerfed he's fine. 

[SeaUrchins]

I know, right, nothing Ember's WoF or Banshee's Sounquake couldn't achieve.

Spoiler

 

Nope, nothing overpowered here.

[Urquiora]

55 minutes ago, SeaUrchins said:

I know, right, nothing Ember's WoF or Banshee's Sounquake couldn't achieve.

  Reveal hidden contents

 

Nope, nothing overpowered here.

As if Corpus were ever hard to kill

[SeaUrchins]

28 minutes ago, Urquiora said:

As if Corpus were ever hard to kill

I hope you are not trying to assume the result would have been different with grineer or infested.

[MattM01]

Limbo is still quite vulnerable when at mid tier to higher levels. He can still be taken down quite easily. Listen Limbo has been the laughing stock of Warframe since release, for God's sake's give him some time in the sun. Limbo is much more useful to use now, I can either be Spy/Rescue Limbo or I can be an SS30 MIRV Nuke The World Frame and laugh in the face of other frames that used to outclass me 10 to 1 so if you break my legs once more I might even bother getting back up.  Something like that.

[(XBOX)ReadingFire229]

He just got a rework and some people on the forums already want a nerf what a surprise some people just have too much time on their hands

[Urquiora]

2 hours ago, SeaUrchins said:

I hope you are not trying to assume the result would have been different with grineer or infested.

Don't give me that sass. It damn well is with Grineer. You would know that if you tried. Before you say it, 4x Corrosive Projection makes everything meaningless anyway. Haven't tested with Infested but they aren't a problem either so it really doesn't matter if there's one more ability that makes them redundant.

Edited April 4, 2017 by Urquiora

[SeaUrchins]

2 minutes ago, Urquiora said:

so it really doesn't matter if there's one more ability that makes them redundant.

So your point is: they are easy to kill, so why not let us kill them by pressing 1 button, right?

[Urquiora]

14 minutes ago, SeaUrchins said:

So your point is: they are easy to kill, so why not let us kill them by pressing 1 button, right?

No. My point is there are already abilities and combinations that work this easily. I don't know why you're so adamant on this one. There are more important things to attend to when it comes to problems with this game. Did someone out kill you on a public match with it?

Edited April 4, 2017 by Urquiora

[jfhsanseiIII]

Could be interesting if they based the damage off of damage done before it collapses.   

[SeaUrchins]

Just now, Urquiora said:

My point is there are already abilities and combinations that work this easily.

You are being misguided then, there are no abilities matching the current Cataclysm in terms of dps output on groups of enemies (except for Maimquinox and EV combo).

[Urquiora]

1 minute ago, SeaUrchins said:

You are being misguided then, there are no abilities matching the current Cataclysm in terms of dps output on groups of enemies (except for Maimquinox and EV combo).

I'm definitely not. We could go on and on, you realize? Just because you're not aware of them/don't know how to use them doesn't mean they don't exist. Perhaps some take slightly more effort, but its really odd that you're hung up on this one specifically.

Edited April 4, 2017 by Urquiora

[SeaUrchins]

2 minutes ago, Urquiora said:

Just because you're not aware of them/don't know how to use them doesn't mean they don't exist.

Just because you can't mention any doesn't mean they do exist. Of course if you can provide any example of a frame capable of wiping out a group of, let us say, lvl 100+ infested ancients with a single ability cast I will be more than happy to admit my being wrong.

Go ahead and impress me ^_^