Hema's nonsensical description

[Gweredith]

 Today, after months of having it collect dust in the Orbiter, I picked up my Hema and noticed that it no longer replenishes its ammo pool (not the clip) on reload anymore. I rechecked the description, it still says that it replenishes ammo on each blood drain. I thought it was a bug, but decided to check wiki where it said:

"Despite its in-game description, the weapon does not forge any ammo in any circumstance, as it uses ammo drops to replenish ammo."

 I must have missed the patch notes where this was changed but why the hell was it changed in the first place? The whole point of the health draining mechanic was to gain ammo, it even says so in the description. Having the weapon suck your health just to reload is an uninteresting and useless mechanic since the player gains nothing from. I still have to run around and collect ammo.

 What's more nonsensical is the fact that a weapon which has no socket for a clip and whose reload animation is literal sucking of blood to be converted into ammo requires standard ammo clips. Please revert back the weapon's original unique. The weapon wasn't overpowered with it; in fact, it needs that innate ammo generation.

Corection: The weapon actually never replenished total ammo, my bad. I could've sworn that it did.

Edited November 29, 2017 by Gweredith

[-CM-Hekovashi]

11 minutes ago, Gweredith said:

 Today, after months of having it collect dust in the Orbiter, I picked up my Hema and noticed that it no longer replenishes its ammo pool (not the clip) on reload anymore. I rechecked the description, it still says that it replenishes ammo on each blood drain. I thought it was a bug, but decided to check wiki where it said:

"Despite its in-game description, the weapon does not forge any ammo in any circumstance, as it uses ammo drops to replenish ammo."

 I must have missed the patch notes where this was changed but why the hell was it changed in the first place? The whole point of the health draining mechanic was to gain ammo, it even says so in the description. Having the weapon suck your health just to reload is an uninteresting and useless mechanic since the player gains nothing from. I still have to run around and collect ammo.

 What's more nonsensical is the fact that a weapon which has no socket for a clip and whose reload animation is literal sucking of blood to be converted into ammo requires standard ammo clips. Please revert back the weapon's original unique. The weapon wasn't overpowered with it; in fact, it needs that innate ammo generation.

It NEVER forge or create ammo by using your blood in any way, hema using regular ammo drops from it's release. And yea, it shouldn't have ammo pool at all, but just one clip (just like cycron), that you replenish with your blood.

Edited November 29, 2017 by -CM-Hekovashi

[Gunslinger]

There was a time when Hema wouldn't needed you to pick ammo? And the gun worked as intended? 

[taiiat]

i will note that Hema has always worked that way - whether it should have Infinite Ammo or not is a different matter and not something i'm deciding.

[Aeon94]

I wouldn't mind if it gets these changes ;

• No longer has maximum ammo pool instead it reloads with consuming hp
• Tapping reload consumes some hp ( 10-20hp ? ) to reload
• Holding reload for 1-2sec drains hp ( like Inaros's 4th ) gives damage bonus ( Hema could use some love tho :d )

Then description will be correct with " forges ammo from blood " part.

Edited November 29, 2017 by Aeon94

[Airwolfen]

Did it ever? Because I have the hema since around release and I dont believe it ever having its own ammo regen.

Instead you sacrifice some health in order to gain a lot more back.

[Bibliothekar]

vor 28 Minuten schrieb Void-Gunslinger:

There was a time when Hema wouldn't needed you to pick ammo? And the gun worked as intended? 

Yup, it reloaded by sucking your blood (turned some of your health into ammo).

[-MElHiOR-]

23 минуты назад, Bibliothekar сказал:

Yup, it reloaded by sucking your blood (turned some of your health into ammo).

Nope, never before and especially after. (sorry for language... googletranslate)

[(PSN)CrimsonAxure]

1 hour ago, Aeon94 said:

I wouldn't mind if it gets these changes ;

• No longer has maximum ammo pool instead it reloads with consuming hp
• Tapping reload consumes some hp ( 10-20hp ? ) to reload
• Holding reload for 1-2sec drains hp ( like Inaros's 4th ) gives damage bonus ( Hema could use some love tho :d )

Then description will be correct with " forges ammo from blood " part.

Imagine if it "forged ammo from blood"

(Shoots an enemy)

+Ammo

[Aeon94]

2 minutes ago, (PS4)PS_90210 said:

Imagine if it "forged ammo from blood"

(Shoots an enemy)

+Ammo

forges ammo from blood of wielder *

:d

[MrTitan123]

6 hours ago, Gweredith said:

 

 What's more nonsensical is the fact that a weapon which has no socket for a clip and whose reload animation is literal sucking of blood to be converted into ammo requires standard ammo clips. Please revert back the weapon's original unique. The weapon wasn't overpowered with it; in fact, it needs that innate ammo generation.

BLOOD IS AMMO! AMMO IS BLOOD! NONE OF THIS MAKES ANY SENSE!

[ShiraHagane]

It never had that, it always used ammo pick ups

[LeoLeonardoIII]

While the description is misleading, at least there was something to gain from the HP mechanic.

It does not have anything to do with your ammo, unfortunately, but although it steals some HP on reload, it does give you HP on headshots, do remember that :3

[(PSN)psycofang]

On 11/29/2017 at 4:07 AM, taiiat said:

i will note that Hema has always worked that way - whether it should have Infinite Ammo or not is a different matter and not something i'm deciding.

It honestly should have "infinite" ammo as it uses your hp and doesnt function the way it claims it does.

 

Its not a particularly amazing weapon either and falls behind the Paracyst in terms of status and dps, i honestly feel like Hema is not even worth making anymore after the last balance pass. It needs SOMETHING to be decent again.

Edited November 30, 2017 by (PS4)psycofang

[low1991]

On 11/29/2017 at 4:45 PM, Gweredith said:

 Today, after months of having it collect dust in the Orbiter, I picked up my Hema and noticed that it no longer replenishes its ammo pool (not the clip) on reload anymore. I rechecked the description, it still says that it replenishes ammo on each blood drain. I thought it was a bug, but decided to check wiki where it said:

"Despite its in-game description, the weapon does not forge any ammo in any circumstance, as it uses ammo drops to replenish ammo."

 I must have missed the patch notes where this was changed but why the hell was it changed in the first place? The whole point of the health draining mechanic was to gain ammo, it even says so in the description. Having the weapon suck your health just to reload is an uninteresting and useless mechanic since the player gains nothing from. I still have to run around and collect ammo.

 What's more nonsensical is the fact that a weapon which has no socket for a clip and whose reload animation is literal sucking of blood to be converted into ammo requires standard ammo clips. Please revert back the weapon's original unique. The weapon wasn't overpowered with it; in fact, it needs that innate ammo generation.

Corection: The weapon actually never replenished total ammo, my bad. I could've sworn that it did.

From what i recall, it uses ammo (as per normal guns do) and consume health on reload.

[taiiat]

17 hours ago, (PS4)psycofang said:

Its not a particularly amazing weapon either and falls behind the Paracyst in terms of status and dps, i honestly feel like Hema is not even worth making anymore after the last balance pass. It needs SOMETHING to be decent again.

it has good performance, between being a combined Elemental base (this is a very powerful things) - Viral of all choices which is one of the best it could have. saying it's worthless would be a crass misestimation of things in the game.

i wouldn't complain about Headshots not only Healing but dealing increased Damage over normal Headshots (like 1.25x Damage). all Burst Weapons should have decent Crit Chances to reward Precision, so in accordance to what i'd want for all of them Hema would probably end up with a 12% Crit Chance. 
it doesn't need to be detached from Ammunition Pickups, as it's fairly efficient and it Heals you for FAR, FAR more than it takes away - the goal of that loop absolutely works. even so, maybe it could be detached from Ammunition Pickups. but does it need it? absolutely not.

 

though Paracyst has massive Accuracy issues if you try to use it efficiently (by having Punch-Through). since the Projectiles are fired from a triangular formation they scatter explode out of the targeted point and can't hit anything behind that point.
makes the Weapon have major efficiency issues.

[(PSN)psycofang]

16 hours ago, taiiat said:

it has good performance, between being a combined Elemental base (this is a very powerful things) - Viral of all choices which is one of the best it could have. saying it's worthless would be a crass misestimation of things in the game.

Never said it was worthless i said it wasnt particularly amazing for what it costs.

16 hours ago, taiiat said:

Heals you for FAR, FAR more than it takes away - the goal of that loop absolutely works. even so, maybe it could be detached from Ammunition Pickups. but does it need it? absolutely not.

Youre not understanding, the description states it draws in your hp as ammo despite the mechanic not actually working, at 0 ammo it simply wont reload. The hp leech is pretty much there for no reason and its hp head shot healing isnt on par or even close to other healing options in the game.

That head shot healing on a burst rifle of all things renders it relatively unreliable unless youre close enough and you may as well use a life strike weapon if youre in content thats doing that to you in the first place.

16 hours ago, taiiat said:

though Paracyst has massive Accuracy issues if you try to use it efficiently

Modding it for stripping and heat does wonders also im not seeing these accuracy issues on Limbo as i can literally watch the trajectory.  Im going to need a visual on what youre talking about.

Edit: just tested this in the simul, i think you have heavy caliber on or something because the projectiles DO NOT spread outward, the infact converge on the targets.

Edited December 1, 2017 by (PS4)psycofang

[taiiat]

5 hours ago, (PS4)psycofang said:

Youre not understanding, the description states it draws in your hp as ammo despite the mechanic not actually working, at 0 ammo it simply wont reload. The hp leech is pretty much there for no reason and its hp head shot healing isnt on par or even close to other healing options in the game.

That head shot healing on a burst rifle of all things renders it relatively unreliable unless youre close enough and you may as well use a life strike weapon if youre in content thats doing that to you in the first place.

 

Modding it for stripping and heat does wonders also im not seeing these accuracy issues on Limbo as i can literally watch the trajectory.  Im going to need a visual on what youre talking about.

Edit: just tested this in the simul, i think you have heavy caliber on or something because the projectiles DO NOT spread outward, the infact converge on the targets.

the Description is flavor text, what the thing actually does is what matters. Hema having infinite Ammo is something to consider. 
though i don't get how being a Burst Weapon makes Healing with Hema unreliable? Burst Weapons are a Marksman type of Weapon, so.

just try reading what i said again - because you described that you saw the cause of the problem. 
it wouldn't be a problem if the Projectiles didn't try to converge or it fired from one origin point like a standard Weapon. but since it works the way it does, using the Weapon efficiently has that downside. has nothing to do with Heavy Caliber or the Accuracy of the Weapon, -99% or +99% Accuracy would still do the same thing, just increasing or decreasing the size of the three triangulating cones.

[(PSN)psycofang]

20 hours ago, taiiat said:

the Description is flavor text, what the thing actually does is what matters

Never heard of flavor text that doesnt add to a weapons lore instead of outright saying it does something it doesnt.

 

20 hours ago, taiiat said:

though i don't get how being a Burst Weapon makes Healing with Hema unreliable?

When in high mobiliy situations Hema has a noticeable spread whereas paracyst does not.

20 hours ago, taiiat said:

just try reading what i said again - because you described that you saw the cause of the problem. 
it wouldn't be a problem if the Projectiles didn't try to converge or it fired from one origin point like a standard Weapon. but since it works the way it does, using the Weapon efficiently has that downside

Except it does? It pierces multiple targets just fine and hits targets behind the mob, something you said it could not do. The converging cones stop after a specific point and can pierce multiple targets up to 25m away or more just fine.

20 hours ago, taiiat said:

Burst Weapons are a Marksman type of Weapon, so.

I assume a marksman weapon is a weapon that DOESNT have a noticeable spread at around 22 meter which makes headshots unreliable. Something at 30m+? You are not hitting the head with all the shots.

Sybaris is a marksman weapon, hema definitely is not.

Edited December 2, 2017 by (PS4)psycofang

[taiiat]

2 hours ago, (PS4)psycofang said:

When in high mobiliy situations Hema has a noticeable spread whereas paracyst does not.

Except it does? It pierces multiple targets just fine and hits targets behind the mob

the magic of triangulation.
https://gfycat.com/SilkyFixedElephantbeetle

the three projectile Streams converge on your aim point, and if you have Punch-Through, they will immediately disperse past that point because they converged there.

Edited December 3, 2017 by taiiat

[(PSN)psycofang]

Which doesnt disprove anything, even during the event of dispersion it can still hit a target 8 meters behind the primary and still pierce multiple targets that are clumped together with minimal accuracy issues from a further distance than hema even up to 65 meters.

Sit 20 meters back and fire straight through the first target like so:

By comparison of Hemas spread at 22 meters: 

Youre not hitting the heads of 150s at any safe or relevant distance, the spread at 22m spreads into a vertical line slowly larger as it goes.

 

This is NOT the attributes of a marksmen tier weapon, these are the attributes of a spread burst rifle for suppression not precision.  

 

Unless youre trying to hit a secondary target almost 20 meters behind the primary (which is only possible to do in the simul, open area defense or plains and even THEN youre hard pressed to avoid clumped enemies) the accuracy issues are mininal.