[Ghouls] RNG lore is NOT acceptable!

[schilds]

There are no duplicates. There was a lot of talk about empty reward slots being the result of getting a duplicate, but I only ever had empty reward slots once, and they all occurred during the same bounty (including the first incursion, which can't even reward fragments). Empty reward slots is a separate issue (likely a bug).

[marelooke]

On 22/12/2017 at 7:29 PM, Mewvg2 said:

For players that did Plague Star, yes. The Lore is pretty much the only thing in the drop table for us, otherwise it's an unrewarding slog. The entire point of new content is to make it fun, ain't it? Getting a pile of garbage and a couple of what you want after a few dozen runs isn't in any way rewarding.

The rest of the drop table is pretty much only for the folks that didn't do that event. Which is cool for those folks, they have a reason to keep doing it. There's your player retention.

If "rewards" are the only reason people keep doing something maybe that something isn't that fun to begin with?

I'm still running Survival missions on low level planets (among others, of course), I got all the rewards that could possible drop there years ago, I have oodles of the materials I can get there (more than I'll likely ever use), but I still do them. Because they're actually fun.

Edited January 25, 2018 by marelooke

[(PSN)wildcats1369my]

5 hours ago, marelooke said:

If "rewards" are the only reason people keep doing something maybe that something isn't that fun to begin with?

I'm still running Survival missions on low level planets (among others, of course), I got all the rewards that could possible drop there years ago, I have oodles of the materials I can get there (more than I'll likely ever use), but I still do them. Because they're actually fun.

Fun factor wont last a long time, it is bound to be a boring axtivity after a while, rewards however are the great motivator to do something over and iver again.

[AVSManfred]

1 hour ago, (PS4)wildcats1369my said:

Fun factor wont last a long time, it is bound to be a boring axtivity after a while, rewards however are the great motivator to do something over and iver again.

Yeah but keep receiving stuff you don't need trying to get what you really want just makes you frustrated...

[marelooke]

2 hours ago, (PS4)wildcats1369my said:

Fun factor wont last a long time, it is bound to be a boring axtivity after a while, rewards however are the great motivator to do something over and iver again.

I've been loving survival for 4 years (I started the week before Survival was introduced, so missed the actual event due to being a rookie). I'd say there's a big difference between "Ugh, that's enough for now, time to go do something else for a little while." and the "Ugh, never again!" that people have after some of the newer game modes (like Defection), especially when they're forced onto them and a big grind to boot.

[Nerfoxbylozajete]

Hello!
I just wanted to adress this particular part of the patch notes:

Quote

Ghoul Bounty Changes:

A couple of weeks after the Ghoul Bounties Debuted, we saw the system begin its life as a recurring set of dynamic Bounties. Their second appearance just wrapped up, and unfortunately we were unable to address the issues the community had with their Rewards (namely sparse RNG Lore).

This Update brings changes that will be visible the next time the Ghouls Appear!
 

Ghoul Lore Fragments are simply way more likely to drop within Bounties now.

Ghoul enemies themselves can now also drop the Lore Fragments (and Ghouls always have a chance to appear outside of Ghoul Bounties!).  

Ghoul Bounty tables have received new items including Nitain, Cetus Wisps, and Breath of the Eidolon! 

As you can see, our collective effort payed off. We once again managed to influence the shape of the game that we all play. Here are some of my thoughts on that topic:

• First of all it's good to see that DE is aware of the feedback. There was a lot of [Hate] about how good it was in the past and how terrible it is now. I hope this changes will at least convince some people that our feedback still matters.
• Making Lore Fragments drop from enemies was a brilliant idea imho. Now ghoul farms are an option and you can always count on a lucky drop when doing something else (fishing, Eidalon hunting etc.).
• I really like Nitain and Cetus Wisps in the bounty table. We finally have a semi-reliable way of farming nitain. That makes bounties a conciderable option for at least some players.
• One thing I'm missing is adressing the issue of bounties in general, this topic isn't about bounties tho so I'll try to battle with bounties elsewhere. :)

[Fihuren]

Il y a 3 heures, Nerfoxbylozajete a dit :

Hello!
I just wanted to adress this particular part of the patch notes:

As you can see, our collective effort payed off. We once again managed to influence the shape of the game that we all play. Here are some of my thoughts on that topic:

• First of all it's good to see that DE is aware of the feedback. There was a lot of [Hate] about how good it was in the past and how terrible it is now. I hope this changes will at least convince some people that our feedback still matters.
• Making Lore Fragments drop from enemies was a brilliant idea imho. Now ghoul farms are an option and you can always count on a lucky drop when doing something else (fishing, Eidalon hunting etc.).
• I really like Nitain and Cetus Wisps in the bounty table. We finally have a semi-reliable way of farming nitain. That makes bounties a conciderable option for at least some players.
• One thing I'm missing is adressing the issue of bounties in general, this topic isn't about bounties tho so I'll try to battle with bounties elsewhere. :)

+1

Yeah, it feels great to be part of something like that and contribute to make a great game even better ^^

Anyways, thx for the changes, i'm eager to see all ghouls fragment and have nitain within bounties now !

[(PSN)UmbraCthulhu]

great just need this to hit ps4

[MirageKnight]

8 hours ago, Nerfoxbylozajete said:

Making Lore Fragments drop from enemies was a brilliant idea imho. Now ghoul farms are an option and you can always count on a lucky drop when doing something else (fishing, Eidalon hunting etc.).

Except a lot of us don't want Lore Fragments as a drop but rather as a discover-able item...like how lore items have always been handled up until now. So no - it was an arguably BAD idea. Have you seen the amount of hate that Lore Fragments got for just being a drop item alone - never mind the crappy drop chance it had?

 

8 hours ago, Nerfoxbylozajete said:

. I hope this changes will at least convince some people that our feedback still matters.

It only matters when it concerns the latest top selling / popular items. Why? Because it affects DE's revenue.

Yet people continuously give feedback about long-standing issues and bugs and that feedback has been continuously ignored and overlooked.

[Nerfoxbylozajete]

31 minutes ago, MirageKnight said:

Except a lot of us don't want Lore Fragments as a drop but rather as a discover-able item...like how lore items have always been handled up until now. So no - it was an arguably BAD idea. Have you seen the amount of hate that Lore Fragments got for just being a drop item alone - never mind the crappy drop chance it had?

 

It only matters when it concerns the latest top selling / popular items. Why? Because it affects DE's revenue.

Yet people continuously give feedback about long-standing issues and bugs and that feedback has been continuously ignored and overlooked.

A lot of us don't want RNG lore and a lot of us don't mind it. I'm with the people that don't like RNG lore at all but let's be honest we won't bring it back. It's like the void keys... I still prefer void keys over fissures but with the help of our feedback we managed to change fissures from terrible to playable.

I'll once again agree with you that long-standing issues mostly aren't resolved, let me just point out some things

• In every patch and hotfix there are couple of bugs fixed so it's not a dead area
• Finding an issue in a part of code you've recently added to the game is way easier than finding and resolving an issue that has been there for ages. 
• When it comes to rebalancing, you move one stone, you launch an avalanche.

I'm not trying to protect the devs, I disagree with lots of stuff they've done with this game, I just empathize with them a bit. They are lazy people like me. :)

[Mach25]

59 minutes ago, MirageKnight said:

...

Yet people continuously give feedback about long-standing issues and bugs and that feedback has been continuously ignored and overlooked.

You know, I don't know. I know the team is strenuously pushing forward towards the future, but if they're handling so much stuff, I have to wonder if these issues are even being forwarded to Steve and the like since there's a mass of issues they are constantly dealing with - business trips, technical hurdles, PR, etc. I would strongly encourage veterans that have posted long-standing issues that seem to go unaddressed to compile forum thread(s) highlighting their concerns into a single, easy-to-read message and sending it via the community inbox now. Or, if you feel that it's not getting through, send the message directly to Rebecca or Megan (though only do this as an absolute last resort, i.e. consider this the nuclear button). Much like resumes, since the community managers or the folks who control the inbox have so much information coming at them, make an interesting title header so they'll know exactly what the message is about and make your message as concise as possible. Make your point(s) and add the forum links to help highlight your idea.

I'm certain you personally know all this, but I say it in an effort to help foment communication between the devs and the players.

Edited January 26, 2018 by Mach25
Clarity

[AVSManfred]

3 minutes ago, Mach25 said:

You know, I don't know. I know the team is strenuously pushing forward towards the future, but if they're handling so much stuff, I have to wonder if these issues are even being forwarded to Steve and the like since there's a mass of issues they are constantly dealing with - business trips, technical hurdles, PR, etc. I would strongly encourage veterans that have posted long-standing issues that seem to go unaddressed to compile forum thread(s) highlighting their concerns into a single, easy-to-read message and sending it via the community inbox now. Or, if you feel that it's not getting through, send the message directly to Rebecca or Megan (though only do this as an absolute last resort, i.e. consider this the nuclear button). Much like resumes, since the community managers or the folks who control the inbox have so much information coming at them, make a concise title header so they'll know exactly what the message is about and try to keep the main body of text brief, yet very full of information. Make your point and add the forum links to help highlight your idea so the team can see the feedback. Keep the messages a reasonable length and if you need to break it up into a couple of messages, that's fine.

kinda good point tbh to sum up al lthese unadressed problems in one big topic owudl be much better than more of them scattered all aorund forums

[AVSManfred]

14 minutes ago, Nerfoxbylozajete said:

A lot of us don't want RNG lore and a lot of us don't mind it. I'm with the people that don't like RNG lore at all but let's be honest we won't bring it back. It's like the void keys... I still prefer void keys over fissures but with the help of our feedback we managed to change fissures from terrible to playable.

I'll once again agree with you that long-standing issues mostly aren't resolved, let me just point out some things

• In every patch and hotfix there are couple of bugs fixed so it's not a dead area
• Finding an issue in a part of code you've recently added to the game is way easier than finding and resolving an issue that has been there for ages. 
• When it comes to rebalancing, you move one stone, you launch an avalanche.

I'm not trying to protect the devs, I disagree with lots of stuff they've done with this game, I just empathize with them a bit. They are lazy people like me. :)

Well yeah i miss coid keys too, especially that only reason for fissures became invalid once DE decided to keep pushing old primes to vaults, i honestly thing this sytem is already so heavy on RNG that it needs some form of RNG bypass, sometihng we can grind for, maybe even more than for relic drops but at least we will have ensured reward (well had n idea for such system but owudl have to quote it form my old topic or simply link it here)

Anyways bakc to Ghouls well it depends how frequent drop these fragments will be but if it'll be even uncommon it means it might speed up collecting it a lot as we always have to kill S#&$ tone of them during bounties also sometimes stepping by accident into a burial gorund that wasn't part of bounty but just was on our way...

Still speaking of rebalancing, ok it'll be avalanche if thye start doing it but i tihn kthis is so requierd for this game to become really fun agian, as so far outdated and terrible design of combat system pulls thig ame so far away form how awesoem it could be