DeliciousDoob69 Posted February 9, 2018 Share Posted February 9, 2018 (edited) I notice, DE, that you're making a lot of changes, all of which I appreciate. Just wondering though if you have the time could you make a pass over our beloved Mirage. I just have a few suggestions that I think would be balanced and welcomed by all. 1 Hall of Mirrors: This is a great ability, no changes needed after update 21.12, Thank you DE. Although I've heard quite a lot people talking about how projectile weapons don't work properly with this, that might need to be looked at. However, that's more for the bugs section. 2 Sleight of Hand: This is my biggest purposed change. Could you possibly tweak her Sleight of Hand "gem"? Have the gem not just sit on the ground, but float around you providing the opposite lighting effect you just had. The source of light/shadow created by the gem would take priority over environmental light/shadow. This would let you choose between the two Eclipse buffs for a small amount of energy and create a nice synergy between her Sleight of Hand and Eclipse. Obviously make the gem lose the attraction properties it currently has. Keep the gem explosion, but have it only explode if an enemy makes contact with the gem. This would make for a nice CC against would be attackers, blinding them or blowing them away with blast proc. If you have Hall of Mirrors active you create three gems floating around you, if not you only create one. This animation would resemble the Health Conversion's animation. If this seems to complicated just have the gem created by Sleight of Hand create the lighting effect as stated above, without all the other stuff. Mirage needs to be able to to choose her Eclipse buffs more consistently, I think this would give her a nice option of doing so. This is my most recommended change that I believe Mirage needs, especially with the current and future open world content. 3 Eclipse: I have two simple suggestions for this one. Either show us the actual buff we are getting based off the light levels or make the buff be maxed all the time. The biggest problem with this ability is players are uncertain how much of a buff they're actually getting. I could stand in shadows and the buff shows I'm getting 95% damage reduction but actually only be getting 35% based off light levels. Once again show the players the actual numbers or just make the numbers static. 4 Prism: For this ability I just have a few thoughts. First increase the casting speed, even with Natural Talent that casting time is a doozy. Second, get rid of the mechanic that it has two separate damage values, please just make this one constant value regardless of light. Third note, can we do something about the energy drain on this, it seems a little high? Lastly, it would be nice if this got a little Zephyr tornado treatment, how cool would it be if my Prism floated towards where I was aiming. That last one isn't completely needed but I think it would be a nice touch. Please take these changes seriously, I believe Mirage was passed over to quickly during her Priming and needs a little love. Thank you for your time and consideration DE. Edited March 24, 2018 by deliciousdoobmaster69 phrasing and update 22.12 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Entharias Posted February 9, 2018 Share Posted February 9, 2018 1) Sounds too strong. 4) I think prism should count as source of light, so Mirage can benefit from max light exposure for Eclipse and Sleight Of Hand. The damage on the skill is just fine as it works now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheGrimCorsair Posted February 9, 2018 Share Posted February 9, 2018 Only things she's desperately in need of is some CC on her daytime orbs from her 2 (a Blast proc would be perfectly sufficient), and for her buffs from her 3 to either be binary, applying at full strength regardless of total light level (IE: Night is always at your max DR, Day always provides your full damage buff), or for their numbers to reflect the buff you're actually getting due to the current light level. Wouldn't mind an augment for her 4 that gave her the option of using the Prism detonation to invert her buffs (Damage from darkness, defense from standing in light). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EndermanBeast Posted February 9, 2018 Share Posted February 9, 2018 Let me do a review of this then, 1) Hall Of Mirrors sounds too strong IMO, maybe let it be recastable but make it reduce the Hall Of Malevolence buff by half. 2) Sleight Of Hand is the only ability in the entire game that I’ve never used, but this sounds good. 3) Eclipse sounds good, it doesn’t change anything gameplay wise, it’s just a QoL thing. 4) I agree with what you say about wanting Prism to be floating towards the crosshairs, but I don’t agree with the damage. I suggest that the longer the Prism is “up”, the more damage it deals, and the damage is scaled with power strength. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ailyene Posted February 9, 2018 Share Posted February 9, 2018 The suggested changes look good to me. And yeah, I feel they didn't do her justice with her priming too. Major glitches were left unfixed, hidden mechanics were left without any mention in the skill descriptions, a large part of her kit continues to be underwhelming I feel. She's so pretty and has so much potential that its a bit annoying seeing it wasted through bugs and self-crippling hidden mechanics we have no way of finding out in-game. Hall of Mirrors also needs another bug-fix pass, it currently does not work properly (fraction of intended damage) with any weapon that generates a projectile. It would be fine with me even if, in the process of the rework, they changed Eclipse's damage buff from 200% multiplicative to 300% additive like they changed Chroma from 175% multiplicative to 275% additive in the earlier Dev-stream, since they seem to want to avoid stacking multiplicative buffs now. It would still be better than the 2~35% of the displayed damage buff I am currently getting out of it anyways. The almost RNG 10~70% DR we are currently getting from Dark Eclipse is a literal death trap and makes that buff counter-productive as is, change to this is so greatly needed if nothing else in my opinion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jarriaga Posted February 9, 2018 Share Posted February 9, 2018 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kalvorax Posted February 9, 2018 Share Posted February 9, 2018 1 hour ago, Nakrast said: 1) Sounds too strong. and recasting vex armor isnt? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Olianu Posted February 9, 2018 Share Posted February 9, 2018 For the 1, I could care less about Hall of Malevolence because I always use explosive legerdemain personally, but I would *LOVE* this when I get in a mission and I'm lagging a good 30 seconds behinds and I'l be stuck without my protection for a good 10-20 seconds. (wish they would just notice this problem on multiple casters, but Mirage is a good starting point.) Honestly these little tweaks you suggested don't sound too bad. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Soketsu Posted February 9, 2018 Share Posted February 9, 2018 1- ok 2- can't provide accurate review as I didn't look how work the new one 3- agree that it's annoying to be have a complete control if you deal more damage or take less damage 4-I've lost my experience a mirage, before equinox, she was my favorite, I can agree that as a Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
(PSN)Nozomi244 Posted February 9, 2018 Share Posted February 9, 2018 I personally think she needs a way to actually control light levels to switch between buffs whenever she wants. In her current state if i'm to be honest I think mirage is just weak. Sure she can do some really good dmg yes, but much like banshee she has no way to actually survive to deal that dmg vs high levels. Hall of mirrors for example could be a good defensive ability if bullets didn't pass right through them anyway, they werent' on all 4 sides of you making you get caught in crossfire, and if they were not hugging mirage. As many have stated before as well, her ultimate needs a major buff to the cast time. As a light frame that does nothing to actually control light, casting her 4th is usually suicide. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sajochi Posted February 9, 2018 Share Posted February 9, 2018 Latest devstream: Mirage 1 and 3 will be the same duration and recastable. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DeliciousDoob69 Posted February 9, 2018 Author Share Posted February 9, 2018 1 hour ago, Sajochi said: Latest devstream: Mirage 1 and 3 will be the same duration and recastable. Nice, I totally spaced the dev stream, but that's awesome to hear. Well hopefully DE might take these other changes to heart. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maka.Bones Posted February 10, 2018 Share Posted February 10, 2018 Cast animation on her 4th is definitely too slow. I barely use it, because it's gotten me nearly killed too often. 9 hours ago, deliciousdoobmaster69 said: Either show us the actual buff we are getting based off the light levels or make the buff be maxed all the time Is that something new that they just added? I thought that her eclipse buff directly scaled with power str. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ailyene Posted February 10, 2018 Share Posted February 10, 2018 23 minutes ago, Maka.Bones said: Is that something new that they just added? I thought that her eclipse buff directly scaled with power str. I've seen people talking about it all the way back in 2014 on Warframe Wiki, its just not mentioned anywhere in-game so I'm guessing no one ever found out about it without actively testing it out themselves. Mechanics like this should really be written in the skill description rather than hidden away. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maka.Bones Posted February 10, 2018 Share Posted February 10, 2018 2 minutes ago, Ailyene said: I've seen people talking about it all the way back in 2014 on Warframe Wiki, its just not mentioned anywhere in-game so I'm guessing no one ever found out about it without actively testing it out themselves. Mechanics like this should really be written in the skill description rather than hidden away. I can see a static buff on the top right of my screen... When it is DR, I barely get damaged even if the lighting is barely dark Can't really change lights in simulacrum to test this though Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DeliciousDoob69 Posted February 10, 2018 Author Share Posted February 10, 2018 13 minutes ago, Maka.Bones said: Is that something new that they just added? I thought that her eclipse buff directly scaled with power str. I used to think the same thing, but I started reading a few post here in the warframe forums. Also read a few warframe reddit posts. It seems that the number posted at the top of the screen is really just a max buff you can reach. Actual buffs are a direct reflection of the true light levels. This is just what I've been lead to believe though, and it seems to be true in my experience. The way the wiki is worded also supports this idea as well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DeliciousDoob69 Posted February 10, 2018 Author Share Posted February 10, 2018 @Maka.Bones I was the person that liked your post btw. I think that's a really good question, and more players need to test it out for themselves. Forums stated that they could get different numbers within the simulacrum by standing in different spots although it was the same buff. I've never tried it out myself though, in the simulacrum, so I can't confirm. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DeliciousDoob69 Posted February 10, 2018 Author Share Posted February 10, 2018 9 hours ago, EndermanBeast said: 4) I agree with what you say about wanting Prism to be floating towards the crosshairs, but I don’t agree with the damage. I suggest that the longer the Prism is “up”, the more damage it deals, and the damage is scaled with power strength. That doesn't sound like a bad idea considering how high the cost is channel Prism. I believe it's the highest channeled cost ability, or maybe it's Sound Quake, either way it's up there. They would probably have to set a cap for that though or I could see it getting pretty out of hand. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DeliciousDoob69 Posted February 10, 2018 Author Share Posted February 10, 2018 This post is soooooooooo overshadowed by everything else that is going on lol. Will Mirage ever get to stand in the spotlight as she deserves? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DeliciousDoob69 Posted February 12, 2018 Author Share Posted February 12, 2018 No one cares about Mirage Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grimmstyler Posted March 14, 2018 Share Posted March 14, 2018 On 2/9/2018 at 11:33 AM, deliciousdoobmaster69 said: 4 Prism: For this ability I just have a few thoughts. First increase the casting speed, even with Natural Talent that casting time is a doozy. Second, get rid of the mechanic that it has two separate damage values, please just make this one constant value regardless of light. Third note, can we do something about the energy drain on this, it seems a little high? Lastly, it would be nice if this got a little Zephyr tornado treatment, how cool would it be if my Prism floated towards where I was aiming. That last one isn't completely needed but I think it would be a nice touch. I agree on the casting time for Prism (and i do use Natural Talent which takes a mod space).. Mirage is a low armored frame and is vulnerable on the casting time (but Mirrors "can" divert).. Due to Mirage's abilities, my Mirage gameplay only consists of AOE weapons, [Hall of Mirrors], and Eclipse.. They seem to be the most effective abilities to keep up with high pace gameplay.. Prism is more of a melting style Ultimate not CC..Ive seen a Mirage carry 2 leechs and Trinity in Bere XP, So her Prism can be OP (but thats with specific modding).. For me Prism gameplay is a trick and not like other warframe ultimate abilities.. Sleight of Hand is not so useful.. And it destroys resources.. Best thing i seen it for is Spy missions.. But who uses Mirage for Spy? The duration of the ability, without being able to recast, doesnt match Mirrors, Eclipse or Prism duration.. The recast could help with addtional sensors in a Spy.. But id rather see a more defensive ability as not all frames have a spy mission ability, leave the spy missions to the specific spy frames.. I mean there is no series of missions that include a spy mission Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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