Shrine of the Eidolon: Update 22.12.0

[Hellknight3]

this game is slowly turning from awesome to horrible, with all these FORCED pointless nerfs... How about giving players opportunity to choose how they want to play or how certain abilities should work! FREEDOM OF CHOISE means nothing to you DE?....apperantly not...

[Somerlo]

il y a 38 minutes, kikuapple a dit :

First Lets say for Axi Relic.
before update. if you do 1 stage only: for prime vault axi relic you will get 50%
(play solo, use excal range build, use skill 1 to get location in 4sec, finish stage 1, extract or maybe quit mission)
stage1: 50%,  stage1: 50%,  stage1: 50%,  stage1: 50%,  stage1: 50%.

with new update.
to get unvault axi relic, assume your calculation / your source is correct.
Stage1:  0%, Stage2: 33.04%,  Stage3: 33.04%, Stage4: 27.54%, stage5: 43.18%


----
Second. is your source is reliable? I mean. Before update. (again in here I will talk about Bounty Lvl 40-60)
in Stage 5. Before update there are 2 uncommon drop, and 3 rare drop. http://warframe.wikia.com/wiki/Bounty#Level 40-60

- Uncommon: Cetus Wisp     40%
- Uncommon: 300 Kuva        14%
- Rare          : Furax Part      16%
- Rare          : Stance Mods  16%
- Rare          : Eidolon Lens  14%

In New Update, now there are 3 uncommon drop, and 3 rare drop (you can check in game by yourself)
if Uncommon: Axi Relic  43.18% like you said, how about  other reward drop chance?
with additional uncommon, it would be make sense that the chance is smaller.
DE should consider to remove another Uncommon reward.


 

Yeah I realised that the new update hurts Axi farming the most, cos the old rates were just straight out better, 50% at stage 1 is really more than double the other tier relics which were 20% to 26.03%..basically its a definite nerf, DE should just replace all the normal relics in the drop table with a lower tier unvaulted relic, eg bounty 40 - 60 will drop Neo E1 as common and Axi L1 as uncommon.

[Ekzarcun]

5 hours ago, Somerlo said:

Yeah I realised that the new update hurts Axi farming the mos

Well finally you did i hope DE realises it to. It just took the"multiple relics per mission instead of (maybe 1 relic per mission) example for you to get it"

[DarafaySi]

On 2/9/2018 at 5:37 PM, [DE]Megan said:

Attica

• Mastery Rank increased from 0 to 7
• Critical damage increased from 2x to 3x
• Damage decreased from 125 to 80

TL;DR Because of the Attica's 20% crit chance, it's very hard impossible to reach a critical % (+900% crit chance needed with Vital Sense) that allows the Attica to deal the same damage as before, much less surpass it. Regardless of the nice attempt at making it unique, but seeing there are no other real weapon nerfs I doubt it was intentional to make it weaker, could it be slightly tuned up so it's feasible to reach old levels of strength?

At 200% Crit Chance and 4.4(old)/6.6(new) Crit Damage, the Old Attica deals 975 (7.8*125) the New Attica deals 976 (12.2*80). A 1 point damage buff, if we can reach 200% crit and a nerf otherwise. 

I know I'm just adding on to the complaints, but was it your intention to (slightly) nerf the Attica while changing it? It seems odd. To drop damage to .64 while buffing crit damage to 1.5 means that overall Damage will be 96% of what it was before @ 100% crit chance, it will be worse with <100% crit chance and start getting a bit better with >100% chance. 

The problem is that the Attica only has 20% base crit chance, so finding an additional +400% is very very hard unless you get a crazy riven or equip 3 crit chance mods. I suppose it's not that big of a nerf, and the intention was to make the Attica more specialized, but was it necessary to hit it so hard? Couldn't the damage have been nerfed to at least something like 90 instead?

A Few More Details: (Assuming an obligatory Vital Sense mod to buff CD to 4.4 (old) and 6.6 (new))

At the standard Point Strike crit chance of 62.5, the Average damage is 390.625 (old) and 360 (new) @ 62.5% crit chance. A drop of around ~8% damage. Livable, I suppose, but still not as exciting as no change!

@ 100% crit chance the Attica deals 550 old and 528 new. 

To make matter simpler, at 4.4x/125 and 6.6x/80 every extra percent of crit chance adds on 4.25 and 4.48 damage respectively, a difference in favor of the new Attica by .23 damage per crit percent. 45/.23 = 195.65%, a critical chance where both weapons reach around 956.5 damage. You need almost 200% crit to allow the new Attica to outperform the old one.

 

[XaoGarrent]

So I finally got around to testing out Ember... Geez, I thought people were exaggerating, but no, you guys really did trash her. She's a one trick pony, and the range nerf completely ruins her one and only trick. I see absolutely zero logical reason to take her into anything instead of Saryn, and Saryn isn't even considered that great of a frame.

[Ashoka.G]

On 2018/2/10 at 7:37 AM, [DE]Megan said:

 

what happened to the melee critical sound? lol...like a weird little squishy thing??? dont mess up something doesn't need to be changed ok ? Give it back, or at least make it optional...

[Verleriana]

Big update, many changes... And Ember was one of most interested and exciting frame for me. I took her in arsenal with palpitation. Is she still good? Is she one of main choice, how it was early? I checked out on few missions, not very much, and can say now. NO. It's not Ember, which we all loved. It's not frame under our control. She in game, but we don’t play with her. Gamer and frame - we are played separately of each other. Great, yap.

First of all - new fireball. It's set a flame on place of  hitting. And it's very-very-very usefully. Thanks for that. But ability by her own is trash.  At first sight it's interesting, controlling power of ball is interesting, but now this ability is useless. We can't choose moment to shoot. If you want some more power ... you don't choose moment to shoot. It's ridiculous, really! Why we can't press "one", add more power to our fireball and then, choose good moment and - shoot - release the key. Look at this!!! Our first ability is random now and we don't have control on it. How?! Why?!

But there is something more terrible in this "rework". Yap.

Fourth ability. World on fire. Really?! This update almost ruined most of popular strategies and added useless mechanics in primary ability. Why it's so useless, DE? Why you grabbed control on frames and ability from players?! Most of all, if you added adjustment to ability, why you don't add mechanics to control it?

It's life, yap. It's game. We can choose another frame... and remove one of loved frame from our game style... I don't want. I want to play with Ember, It's fun, it was useful! It was manageable. We have three sets in arsenal, and we have (well, some of us) - three different strategy: for example, defense,  survive missions and for fun. Different mods, different styles, different sets - now all of this are ruined.

I have a little hope... We see Ember - but she is not ready. Something missed in this patch - and it is mechanism for control adjustments. And it will be not random, we, players, we will choose moment to shoot by first ability, we will choose power of fourth ability.

On start of missions we don't need much power, we need low energy cost. And we can make it! We press key and release it instantly. Multiplier of strength amount is zero. In half of missions, then we need some more power, we turn off our ability. We press the key and release it after few seconds, as an example - after three seconds. And now multiplier of strength is 30%. We got more power, our ability cost more energy, our range became less. But WE control it, we choose moment, strength, range, energy cost - all of them. We and nobody else. And in very hard missions, we know, we need more power, energy cost and duration are not important, only power is necessary. And we release the key after our multiplier reached 100% score. It is path to play game in many different styles.

It is path to play, control and have fun.

Hope for the best and prepare for the worst...

My hope is still alive. I'll look at game and I'll wait fun with Ember. I'll wait beloved Ember back in my embrace...

[TeEphemeral-EN-]

Because the vaulted relics in bounties weren't hard enough to get already... 

[_sheepy_]

On 10/02/2018 at 4:23 AM, TheImpKing said:

1 ) I argued against removing raids.  I argued against making Arcanes more accessible. 

2 ) I'm arguing against making great Rivens easier to get what you want.

3 ) If you don't want to trade 4 crap Rivens in for a chance to get another Riven that could not be crap, simply don't do it.  That doesn't mean everyone else in the game agrees.

4 ) Economy is important in Warframe and it shouldn't be undermined because you want what you want.  Everyone else who has god-rolled Rivens for the BIS weapons for the meta had to slave away at farming Rivens and Kuva.  You shouldn't get a free ticket to easy Rivens because you're selfish.

5 ) I was talking about the removal of raids and forcing Arcanes onto Eidolons not being comparable to this feature in regards to scale and impact on the market.

6 ) I've never stated that you aren't experienced at the game.  You're the one who's trying to use this as a metric to put your opinion on a pedestal so that I'm not allowed to argue with it.   I have experience with the game.  I wouldn't tell someone with 100 hours of gameplay, "You don't know what you're talking about because you haven't played as long as I have."  Points have merit or they don't, regardless of invested time into the game.  You could play the game for 20 years and still be ignorant about it.   Someone else could play the game for a week and have a better grasp on balance and the economy. 

7 ) You've yet to prove this as a claim.  You've only inferred it.  You can't even keep my position on the topics you're talking about clear.

1) link me your post when you argued against raids and arcanes

2)I did say more than once that i don't think it should be trade 4 crap for 1 great.

3)So it's just me that thinks a reward to turn 4 crap into 1 crap is lame,because you speak for everyone else.

4)I know the economy is important and there you go again making out i said that we should get a god-rolled riven for 4 crap ones,oh and i have slaved away on events for hours on end for weapons that new players like you can now get a free ticket to.

5)Forcing arcanes onto eidolons will have a huge impact on the price of arcanes.

6)I've never stated that you said i was inexperienced,but your opinion may be different had you spent hundreds of hours grinding Rivens and Arcanes,but how much of that have you done in your 8 days?

7)Prove what claim?  You just make it up as you go,Show me one post that i said that you should get a god-rolled riven for 4 crap ones...oh and the use of experience to gauge someone's knowledge of a subject is not exactly a new concept.

[Subteram]

I am a huge fan of the golem archtype and have wanted Atlas to receive some love for as long as I've played the game. The introduction of rubble is a step in the right direction and if changes are made around rubble Atlas will be in a good spot but at the moment is still lacking.

The Petrify buff is a doubled edged sword as of right now. Yes the ability its self is much improved but for as much as Atlas wants to cast it to gather rubble the 75 cost of his 225 base energy pool AND casting his other abilities his energy economy is some of the worst I've seen in Warframe. With the cost of producing rubble, how fast rubble begins to decay, and the speed at which it decays I haven't gathered more than ~400 bonus armor at a time in mission. I know that petrify is now a powerful flash freeze so reducing the cost could make it spamable so I've thought of another option to help with rubble gathering.

Allowing Landslide and Rumbler kills to drop rubble would greatly increase rubble gain. Atlas wants to be using Landslide to attack groups of enemies and wants to summon Rumblers to help in battles but if he's trying to constantly cast Petrify to sustain himself by gathering rubble he can't afford to use his other abilities. This change would increase his kit synergy by filtering all of his abilities (except Tectonics) into fueling rubble and not just Petrify. Petrify would not become obsolete as it still is a potent form of CC. Remove the bonus 25 rubble you get for killing petrified enemies with Landslide and just make Landslide kills always drop 25 so you still can get 75 rubble for killing a petrified enemy but also use the abilities separate if you so desire.

Last thoughts are miscellaneous changes that I would like to see. Allow rubble to be vacuumed or just make the gain automatic as running around looking at the ground for rubble is not fun and distracts from game-play. Removing Atlas's shields in exchange for higher base health would allow Atlas to now sustain his health and energy though combat using rubble and rage/hunter adrenaline in conjunction. Right now at low levels enemies struggle to get through his base shields to get rage working and at high levels Atlas has a strict window between taking health damage to fill up on energy and going down. Also the healing from rubble is not effective enough to full heal the damage taken to restore energy much less gain bonus armor. If rubble is healing a flat amount it should be looked at changing it to a percent health heal, and if it is a percent already it needs to be raised.

As I mentioned I love the golem archtype so I want Atlas to preform well but he will still remain unused by me personally unless further adjustments are made. While I still (currently) consider Atlas the most under performing Warframe, Zephyr is performing FANTASTICALLY both in the Plains and standard tile sets. Huge props on her rework and I see no further adjustments needed for her besides increasing the size of Tornadoes with Airburst seems inconsistent at the moment.

[PrinnyNico]

Le 09/02/2018 à 18:50, Anchenar a dit :

You judge on something that wasnt even final? How can you judge on the new Dark Sector that is not even out yet, like what?!

Because it is final and DE showcased it in the last DevStream. All I can say is it looked lame and boring. It was just an overglorified survival mode.

[ChaoticEdge]

pets can no longer die...orlly DE?

[PrinnyNico]

Le 09/02/2018 à 19:15, SteamlordD a dit :

If you think people are upset about losing mass damage on WoF, you have a fundamental misunderstanding of how it's used. Trashing low level missions can be done with anything, I could build a pull mag and clear the star chart just as easily.

What I'm upset and from what I read it is the same for everyone, her range gets shorter than what the ennemies can attack you from, so no more cc Ember. We will pass the whole mission picking up Ember when she's downed from ennemies fire.

[RavingDragon]

Hey there devs, just wanted to sat nice work on the update! i'm actually really enjoying a lot of the content, especially atlas, and, contrary to what you might expect, i'm enjoying ember a lot more now too. i think the changes you made were really nice balances. 

that being said i would like to inquire about chroma a bit. while i have no gripe with his vex armor calculations finally getting fixed, i still feel like spectral scream is a bit lack luster, even with the addition of the vex armor buff. with so many great first abilities out their adding extremely useful utility to the game, (atlas (CC and damage), harrow(massive cc), nidus(scaling damage), oberon(cc and RADIATION), hydroid(GODLY cc), hell even embers first can actually be really useful now that it has that great napalm effect) it feels like spectral scream still falls short of others in the utility or even damage department. 
 

perhaps if you did something similar to what you did to embers world on fire? so that when first casting it is has a much wider cone of effect but less damage, but holding it longer consumes more energy per tic but focuses the beam for more damage and status chance? something like that would be fun as hell to mess with, plus it would really give more punch to what i (personally) thinks is the main draw of a supposed 'dragon frame' . i want chromas breath to be something i use not just cuz i like the idea of it but becuase it provide some benefit to my myself and my team. whether that more damage or stronger status stacking it doesn't matter, just as long as it has its function in a mission and its one you can rely on in a number of situations

 

that's my two cents on the matter, but again i can't tress how much i actually APPRECIATE virtually all the changes you've made so far, they's all really great and made a lot of the less enjoyable frames a true thrill to revisit.

[straikan]

On 09/02/2018 at 10:11 PM, Zin-Azhsari said:

Offtopic: What Glyph are you using?

Youtuber >El canal de juno 

[Nazdravie]

Since this update went live, I feel like the game is demanding more as far as PC specs go. I'm not going to whine about fps or anything, because I know this game is very well-optimized, but there is something going on specifically with this update, and it's quite upsetting.

In general, I've been trying to avoid doing missions on Grineer Jungle (Earth) tileset, PoE and Ceres. Because my laptop fans start to work harder and start to make an annoying noise specifically when I'm playing in those areas. I know that fans cooling the system is always a good thing, but my system having a hard time running the game in the first place is the problem.

Long story short: this fps decrease & noise were only appearing on the specific areas I mentioned above. But since the Shrine of the Eidolon update was released, this started to appear a lot more, in areas that it wouldn't appear before. My FPS is lower in almost any node. Even when I open a modding screen of a weapon and wait for like 1 minute, cooling fans start doing the annoying noise, and this has never happened before.

I hope this get fixed asap, like, if this was appearing ever since I started the game, I wouldn't complain at all. But it started with this specific update.

 

Btw I'm so happy about the changes to Bladestorm, buffs to raw damage weapons, and a last-minute alt fire addition to Cernos Prime. Only if it wasn't for this performance issue that took it to the next level with the update.

[Leqesai]

18 hours ago, Hellknight3 said:

this game is slowly turning from awesome to horrible, with all these FORCED pointless nerfs... How about giving players opportunity to choose how they want to play or how certain abilities should work! FREEDOM OF CHOISE means nothing to you DE?....apperantly not...

Pardon me sir, do you need a ride on the wahhhhhhmbulance?

 

Seriously though, for the couple of needs there were some really good changes with this update. Take the good with the bad and remember it's just a game. Sometimes rules and balance need to be adjusted if certain aspects of the game lock you into certain choices.

 

Freedom of choice means not requiring a chroma to omgwtf eidolon, or zzz farm because of abilities that literally lock down entire maps.

 

Basher nerf was needed. Ember nerf was needed. Chroma nerf was needed.

Having said that each frame is still fun to play. Ember just needs a little more defense. Wink wink

[Trans_Tomboy]

why wasnt the mutalist quanta buffed at all? just kind of wondering about that, seems like it couldve used it.

[0nyxTheWolf]

On 2/11/2018 at 11:08 AM, Leqesai said:

Due to how shields work even double overshields would not really be that tanky. Like you said, shield gating is needed or at least have it so shields benefit from damage reduction somehow.

well, doubling her over shield cap would at least protect her, even if only momentarily, from damage that doesnt over penetrate shields (slash and toxin procs) and beyond that, for anything that isnt end game (Sorties, Raids, Eidolon Hunting, Etc. Etc.), double the overshield cap is

A: a far better passive than what she has as of current and

B: makes her much more survivable as a starter frame, which is what she is.

And DE seems to have mistaken her role IMHO. her role SHOULD be that of a de-buffer. NOT a damage dealer. they focused too hard on her ability to do damage and balancing that, that they forgot the thing that actually makes mag a good unique warframe (armor/shield stripping) or at least it WOULD if they actually tweaked her abilities to do the things. instead of just saying "Look at all these ways you can do sub par damage" 

I love mag. she is one of my favorite warframes thematically. this is why i complain about her current state. because she DESPERATELY needs to be put into a role that makes her both unique and functional. and all the pieces are there. its just that her stats dont support it completely yet.

 

[0nyxTheWolf]

51 minutes ago, Anti_The_Psycho said:

why wasnt the mutalist quanta buffed at all? just kind of wondering about that, seems like it couldve used it.

because its a beam weapon. DE confirmed Via Dev Workshop that they will work on Beam weapons in a separate update.

 

[Kraitharch]

I'm actualy happy with Ember nerf. Ember 4th ability is only fun for players who use her but it's frustration for other players in squad who want to fight too. I aborted many missions because I simply had no enemies to fight due to Ember insta-killing them all before I can make a single shot. Too huge range for such powerful ability.    

[Demonreaper.]

3 hours ago, Kraitharch said:

I'm actualy happy with Ember nerf. Ember 4th ability is only fun for players who use her but it's frustration for other players in squad who want to fight too. I aborted many missions because I simply had no enemies to fight due to Ember insta-killing them all before I can make a single shot. Too huge range for such powerful ability.    

Your speaking for yourself there, not for players. I personally like having an ember in the squad. Significantly speeds up killing. In exterminate/defense/etc this means completing the mission much faster. In survival/mobile defence/etc this means more enemies dying, which means more affinity/item drops. Yes, the range could be reduced, but i feel it has been reduced too much. When you have to use more than one mod to counter the reduction just to return to base range, it has gone too far in the nerf.

[iNew_Vexx]

How conclave will be affeted for this changes?

[AyaEve]

On 10. 2. 2018 at 1:31 PM, FireSky said:

And what exactly was your problem with not everyone enjoying this game in the same way that you do? Why does everyone have to play with the frames that you like? What exactly do you have against me going into some lower tier missions with ember to relax after a 5-6 hours griend? You think you're so much better than everyone else just because you dont enjoy ember. How about you dont use her if you dont enjoy her and let the rest of us have our fun, in the way we like it. Or you think you're the center of the universe here?

Funny. You say something about the center of the universe, yet you act like one.

I don't give a damn if someone enjoys playing some warframe (that's totally fine actually). The problem is that Ember players used to ruin the experience for other players by abusing the 4th ability.
"Press 4 to win / press 4 and forget" is just lame, cheap and lazy playstyle. How many times I've seen some Ember player in defense mission just being AFK with the 4th ability active. Or in other missions just flying through the map with that ability active, doing nothing else, frying enemies far away with that huge range.

"What exactly do you have against me going into some lower tier missions with ember to relax after a 5-6 hours griend?"

You see? That just shows that you are selfish. "OMG I just want to relax and watch Ember do all the work while I sit with my finger in my bum, and I don't care if I ruin the experience for others with this lazy playstyle!"

I didn't like Ember before, because she was really lame and cheap with her lazy 4th ability that did all the work. But now? Now I actually enjoy her. Now you actually have to play properly as her. The huge range got reduced, which is good. The energy usage was way too low before, they fixed that as well. To be honest, even after this update I barelly run out of energy while i have the 4th ability activate. You just have to actually move now. No more AFK set and forget Ember players on defense missions and other annoying stuff.

And if someone says they are getting shot down now on higher missions after the update when playing as Ember, then they have other problems and the more balanced 4th ability is not one of these problems.

The only people complaining about this ability rework are those people who abused the ability. People with cheap and braindead playstyle. Also it's funny to see people complaining that they cannot defeat high lvl enemies with her 4th lvl ability. It's like you people forget that Ember also has other abilities, and that you also have guns. You are not supposed to press 4 to win, you know? I don't understand the mentality of yours.

Ember is actually now much more enjoyable, because now you actually have to use her properly, while at the same time not ruining the experience for other players.
The only reason you actually cry about this is because now you have to toggle the ability when you need it, that's all. You would rather prefer to have it activated the whole mission as passive... (as you did until now - lazy).

Now excuse me, I'm going to enjoy the new Ember. :)

[Joeshwa]

Ember's new fire blast mechanic boosts operator damage by adding fire, when used with volt shield this causes the operator to do Radiation damage, which eidolons are week to.