Stalker is Very Poor Design

[limorkil]

For new players he just plain sucks. 

- You can’t avoid getting marked

- You can’t predict when he will show up

- He is perms-invisible 

- Chances are the first few times you die without knowing what is happening. 

- You cannot run away

I know the argument that he is meant to be someone you aspire to kill when you get more powerful, but this doesn’t excuse the fact that this is poor design.   He used to be aggravating and deadly, but killable.  Now, with the perma-invis, one shot and pull powers he just sucks all the fun out of pre-operator play.   If I am down to one or two lives in a mission and stalker shows, I just power off the game in annoyance.

I am not suggesting he be made much easier.  I think it would be less annoying for new players if:

1.  He was not perms-invisible

2. You could escape him.

I think being able to escape him by completing the mission or fleeing would retain exactly the intended motivation of generating the aspiration to beat him without anywhere as much frustration.   Currently, DE might as well pop up a text box on screen that reads “Stalker appears. You die”   That would actually be less annoying than trying to fight an invisible foe who is near impervious to your damage and who can one shot you.

 

[Golineth]

Eh, he isn't permanently invisible. He only has an ability that makes him invisible for a few seconds.

[trunks013]

Well some of those points seems totaly wrong to me

first He is not perma invisible at all . Wait do you mean invincible ? is it the basic stalker or the upgraded one. Have you done the second dream ?

second you can totaly escape him. Not only that you can nope and NPC can end up killing him.

I have a funny story how a friendly tenno actualy did the elevator trick on me! They all noped and left me around with him !

you know the stalker will jsut kill you ONCE in a mission and leave so if you have 2 lives left why do you power off ?

Edited July 19, 2018 by trunks013

[fadingtheory]

He's not perma-invisible, and if you're frequently losing 2-3 lives before he shows up in a mission, I think you may want to re-think what/where you're running missions. I think you may just be stretching yourself to far. Eatting a death and moving on after he leaves should always be an option.

[FenricFox]

The early game stalker was a minor speedbump, really. He scared me the *first* time, and after that I just waited for him to get it over with: you lose the mark when you "die". It was less trouble than a hopeless fight, and I never had him make me fail a mission (I can certainly see it being possible, but it never happened). There were a bunch of times where that wasn't even a conscious choice: he sniped me with the Dread and I was down without ever even seeing him. "Stalker appears, I die" was absolutely exactly how it went for my first six months or so.

But by the time I was actively farming bosses for frames, I was at the point where I could kill him and the attitude switches from one of apprehension to one of gently annoyed impatience - "Will he show up already? I want my Hate BP!". 

And then you finish The Second Dream.

[Athnamos]

You can avoid getting marked, stop killing map bosses.
 

[Robolaser]

I remember how each stalker's appearance used to panic me. How i hated him! Good times.

There should be more deadly surprises in this game imo. That said, as a beginner i wouldn't have minded a way to temporarily hide from him. Maybe in lockers? 🙂

 

[trunks013]

11 minutes ago, Athnamos said:

You can avoid getting marked, stop killing map bosses.
 

Thats an hilarious solution tenno ^.^ 

[Loza03]

8 minutes ago, Robolaser said:

I remember how each stalker's appearance used to panic me. How i hated him! Good times.

There should be more deadly surprises in this game imo. That said, as a beginner i wouldn't have minded a way to temporarily hide from him. Maybe in lockers? 🙂

 

Ooh, that'd be cool. DE's shown they're not afraid to go into horror with Chains of Harrow. They could have Stalker, Zanuka and the Grustrags pull an 'Alien: Isolation' and have them stalk you if you hide. They could find you if, say, you fail to hide in time or if you leave indicators you were there, or just by chance. And they could show up later in the mission, forcing you to hide again. That'd certainly up the ante on early or unprepared Stalker encounters. And make things even more satisfying when you can take him down.

Of course, this would also not remove a death mark since you've neither bested the enemy or been struck down. It's an impermanent solution. Maybe hiding even increases the chance of them finding you? 

[Robolaser]

I was semi joking, nevertheless being able to hide in our environment sounds like a classic ninja technique to me.

If we could do something like that with any frame though, imo it should be for an increasingly shorter time per mission to prevent abuse (especially afking)

[Athnamos]

14 minutes ago, Robolaser said:

I was semi joking, nevertheless being able to hide in our environment sounds like a classic ninja technique to me.

If we could do something like that with any frame though, imo it should be for an increasingly shorter time per mission to prevent abuse (especially afking)

I did play hide and seek with regular stalker using Loki. One shotting him through the back using Cernos.

[Thundervision]

Well. At least you didn't die to him after unloading mags into his Absorb while also standing 2 meters away like many people do.

Losing is totally fine. Happens to everyone before Stalker becomes their b-ch. And trust me losing your revives and defeating him in the end will worth it: be it your satisfaction, his weapon BPs, or their XP if you don't like some of them.

 

Here's your regular Edgelord's 'what to expect' powerkit:

Absorb: creates a bubble around him absorbing any incoming damage and then releasing it back at attackers when he has low HP. Stop shooting/melee-ing him and pull back preparing to strike back when he becomes vulnerable again.

Pull: drags the players towards him.

Reckoning (not sure if he even uses it against his target): lifts caught players in the air and keeps them in that state for ~2 seconds.

Slash Dash: just don't stand still on its way, otherwise it will probably be you getting one-shotted.

 

When using Dread (Primary) and Despair (Secondary):

Shuriken: throws one with a guaranteed slash proc on successful hit. If you're not confident in your parkour skills, use covers along with right shoulder advantage to shoot him back.

• Dread is dangerous at mid-long range if you get distracted, it's pretty easy to dodge it when you're focused.

 

When using Hate:

Smoke Screen: your, well, his invisible ability which grants him that for just a couple of seconds. Just keep in mind that he will most likely use the next power to drag you into CQ

Teleport: I don't think it causes any stagger, and him appearing behind you gives enough time to bullet jump/roll away

• avoid being hit by his scythe. Although the damage isn't high compared to Dread or even Despair, it will stagger you on hit.

 

Your success simply relies on your adaptation to combat, well, and your mods if you just started. He's still an Artificial Imbecile

[n8thegr8mst]

Honestly I love a good Warframe failure. The fact that something is "hard" and shouldn't be is a ridiculous misnomer that the gaming community has developed over the years. Can't do it? Get better. Still can't do it? Keep practicing. Sometimes stalker appears when I'm solo farming with some crappy gear on my last revive and I lose my run.  That's MY fault for FAILING not the game having bad design. I didn't properly provision myself to secure my run. Let me say it again. I firmly believe that is MY FAULT for failing, not the design of the stalker. I honestly agree with a lot of the other posts and wish there was more risk in runs like this.  What's the point of the game if progression doesn't enable you to do things that you couldn't before.

I do however really like the concept posted above about being able to successfully hide. That being said, if yo stay mobile I've solo finished an entire mission with the stalker after me in really bad gear just by continually moving and running. Obviously this is not possible in some mission types but the game offers you the Ninja tools to at least give you a shot.

[FlusteredFerret]

1 hour ago, fadingtheory said:

He's not perma-invisible, and if you're frequently losing 2-3 lives before he shows up in a mission, I think you may want to re-think what/where you're running missions. I think you may just be stretching yourself to far. Eatting a death and moving on after he leaves should always be an option.

Usually what happens to me.

I was able to kill Stalker (with some difficulty) the first time he showed up. Only encountered him one time after that and he killed me pretty easily.

[Rakosta_Kai]

Stalker is dangerous to the unprepared or the unwary.

The best plan (especially for Stalker and G3), is to actually have a plan beforehand and then work it. 

Always carry at least one fully ranked properly modded weapon, at all times (ideally modded for anti-armor)...Something you are comfortable and proficient using.

Know that if you are marked by any assassin and you are carrying un-ranked/low ranked gear, they are likely to show...Is that empirically true? No clue—But it is something that I and others have noticed.

And just like any other boss you have to read his tells and be prepared to move...You used to have the option of fleeing him but I don't think that's an option nowadays.

I personally prefer old Stalker encounters in melee as Dread is a beast and I am a melee-guard prone fighter that uses tanky frames.

...Your mileage may vary.

 

 

 

 

[Yukielle]

Before I begin typing about this, I want to point out that I really hate invincible bosses and bullet sponges.

Fortunately the Stalker is neither of those, and he has limitations. The Stalker's abilities are mostly Ash's (Shuriken, Smokescreen and Teleport). He's not permanently invisible, it just has a long duration.

You can also escape him if you've completed your mission objective, just run to extraction before he catches you. Personally I believe the mission objective itself should change to "Tenno, get out the f*** out of there!" the moment he shows up, but that's my only real complaint.

 

That being said, I feel like it's incorrect to call him "poorly designed" when both issues you seem to have with him aren't true.

 

[-AiLuoLi-]

Everyone is ignoring the invisible part. 1 quick look at op's history and this comes up.

IF he is indeed permanently invisible as several others have claimed, then perhaps record a video and report it as a bug the next time it happens.

Edited July 19, 2018 by -AiLuoLi-

[Bigamo]

and you can run away, i did it yesterday. (was leveling frame and weapons, nothing to fight him with) 

[limorkil]

3 hours ago, -AiLuoLi- said:

Everyone is ignoring the invisible part. 1 quick look at op's history and this comes up.

IF he is indeed permanently invisible as several others have claimed, then perhaps record a video and report it as a bug the next time it happens.

Thanks for noticing that.  Yes I must apologize because it seems I am one of the people for whom Stalker is bugged.  I used to think this was a bug but it has gone on so long and I keep reading about stalker being invisible so I assumed it was an intended difficulty boost.  

For me, Stalker is always permanently invisible except for 1 second after he first stands up. He also can prevent me escaping - I always teleport back to him if I try to run away.  Missions will not complete - I cannot extract - when Stalker is present.  This is on PS4.  

I thought I had reported this as a bug long ago, but I will do so again.  

Strangely, I feel better knowing it IS a bug based on people here saying that he is not perma-invisible.