ECCHOSIERRA

Im just not seeing the great plague of AOE spam that seems to so terribly inflict some forum users. The one where you cant even do anything because everyone else has already done everything (or killed everything). This leads me to believe some forum users are just being dramatic. Seems to me like the aoe nerfs got the point across just fine. I barely touch aoe weapons, ever, since those changes. When we move on from "lets maybe nerf aoe weapons again by adding self damage and self stagger" to "grouping/chaining/punch through/etc too" we're talking about a significant number of frames and weapons, a significant amount of the game being overhauled or made irrelevant with the nerf bat. Id rather have 10 viable options than 3, and ive seen devs play the wack a mole meta nerf game before. I know exactly what would happen, after the dust settles and people who get angry either decide to deal with it and keep playing or just stop playing the survivors would just move on to the next meta, which would probably be melee. Then the same people complaining about this would complain about that.

When i was very new to the game and didn't know how to mod properly the stalker used to be more intimidating. Some of the sentients used to be rediculous too lol.

1) Launching enemies into orbit at relativistic speed with Rhino's Iron Shrapnel augment. 2) Original pre nerfed Wolf wrecking people in hydron because they were just trying to level MR fodder. 3) the bugged out level 300+ steel path netracell missions that briefly existed if host had "steel path" selected when starting it. 4) feeling like the stalker was an actual threat. 5) seeing bugged out planet sized pets in railjack. The funniest thing about 1) for me was back when that was a thing i barely new how to play this game and would often run into enemies in the plains that i had found difficult or impossible to kill. But i could send them to the moon. And then they werent my problem.

Id like to at least try what if they actually gave bosses a stupid high amount of hp balanced around the idea wed be doing stupid cheeseball damage.

Also this is a hilarious attempt at splitting hairs to try and defend your initial claim that "warframe isnt p2p". This thread should have been locked days ago i dont know why it hasnt been. Boy we sure are playing antics with semantics now arent we. "Peer to peer" games cannot be said that they are not peer to peer and anyone who says they are, lacks intelligence, just because some aspect of the game involves servers. "No you dont understand this isnt a BURRITO because it has LETTUCE in it and SALADS have lettuce". And. You literally flat out said "i want that" when i talked about a fire and forget auction house being a bad idea. This is *another* goal post move. We've gone from "i want an auction house where every single person can put everything in their inventory in a list abd then people can buy it without any effort or involvement on my part" which is a terrible idea for several reasons tob"no no i just want minor QOL fixes? Look. Sitting there in trade chat waiting for the message cooldown to reset over and over spamming "wts whatever" hoping you get hits is often not fun. Waiting for hits on Warframe market is also often not fun. But that's the thing. If youre trying to sell a mesa set at 11:00pm on a friday night you only have to compete with whoever else has one for sale and is also wading through it just like you. But the moment the effort required to sell anything goes from what it is now to zero guess what, youre not gonna be competing with just whoever else is staring at chat/market at 11:00pm on a friday night hoping to make a sale anymore. No. Youre competing with every single person who has the same items as you period. Doesn't matter if theyre offline. Doesnt matter if theyre looking at chat or in a mission. Instead of 10 sellers there might be 100 or more. Meanwhile the demand will not change because why would it. You gotta be online to even use anything anyway. All i gotta do is undercut you by 1p and guess what. Someone's just gonna see the same mesa sets (or whatever) on the list and look for whoever has the cheapest price. Why buy from you. If warframe was *entirely* a free market ecosystem maybe it would even out somehow. Maybe plat would be harder to make from sales but prices would be lower. Maybe. But meanwhile we have the in game market for everything from forma bundles to color palletes to skins and those prices are not dynamic. Free to players would be screwed.

In your original comment, you didnt say "trading". You said *warframe*. If you're gonna be rude and condescending at least be correct. This is still a goal post move. And "auction house" is still a bad idea.

I mean sure i get that. Its just a preference thing on my part. I could absolutely bring something like kuva bramma and a secondary that has little to no ammo issues and of course whatever melee weapon, but im more likely to just not bring a weapon with ammo issues period. I wasnt happy anout the nerfs when it happened but i get why they did it. Personally i wish they'd give us back the ammo buff on merciless *for non aoe weapons*. That was nice on some weapons, like say twin kohmak.

You had the gall to insult someone for saying warframe isnt peer to peer when it factually is, now you wanna claim (without evidence) that *well one particular feature isnt peer to peer* like it even matters. You put your foot in your mouth and now wanna move the goalposts like nobody will notice to try and protect yourself from the embarrassment.

First you wanna be rudely condescending to another user for not knowing something, only to be *wrong*, then you wanna claim you being wrong about what you said isnt relevant? Jesus.

Its especially good if youre using nourish with decent duration because it multiplies the energy regen.

No

>be me >go to walmart >see so many things for so many prices >no idea what anything is worth >go home and rage about not knowing what anything is worth and call the whole thing a scam >we should hold auctions for groceries instead

>warframe is not peer to peer. https://warframe.fandom.com/wiki/Host_Migration#:~:text=Multiplayer sessions in WARFRAME are,to the host player's machine.

Self stagger ignoring primed sure footed (or a similar nerf) would be an automatic do not ever use aoe again for me. Do not pass go, do not collect 200$, no. Would not equip. Ever. I barely use AOE weapons at all since the changes as ive always hated "worrying about running out of ammo" in games.

Yeah, and aside from how lazy and entitled that is joke would be on you when instead of "only" having to compete with whoever is online and in trade chat at the specific moment you want to sell something, youd have to compete with *everyone* who has whatever youre trying to sell period, online or not, on wf market or not. It would be *harder*, not easier, for you to get "free" plat.

Being able to color warframe parts seperately might be interesting. Idk how difficult it would be to implement. Multi relic refinement would be a nice QOL change. Theres some good ideas in that list. Personally a change to riven rolling would be nice.

My in game account seems fine but my forum account seems to think its brand new.

Dear mister condescending over a (probable) bug. I mean let's start with the fact my glyph is from mesa prime access, which dropped december 18th 2018. I suppose a devil's advocate could argue that with prime resurgence being a thing, that *maybe* that doesnt prove i was around at least that far back, but come on. I have thousands of hours on this game. I have alot more than 7 posts. And i joined alot earlier than december 2022. Im guessing something involving cross save is bugged with the forum. So good job being condescending about assumptions that aren't even true. But even if they were true, that's irrelevant. You dont need thousands of hours of time in the game or however many forum posts to realize basic principles of economics apply to the game just like they would anywhere else. My points arent wrong, and you did absolutely nothing to even *try* to actually address them. Also. If warframe market is "already an auction house" then we already have an auction house and there's no point in adding one is there? Unless of course, you mean to tell me, that warframe market isnt the same thing afterall. "I wanna be able to use an in game auction house to dump all my things in and then come back to free plat without effort on my part" is a seductive pipe dream.

No but there should be a way to do something. Especially now that 3 new colors exist but you need to combine 2 and the only way to get a tau of the new colors is to combine 2 tau yet despite that huge investment ask, the new shards arent necessarily "better", just side grades/new options. Not direct upgrades. Idk what the tau chance is for netracells. I know theres no pity system and ive gotten 1 since release though.

Yet another auction house thread. No, for the same reasons stated in every other auction house thread. No, warframe doesn't "need" this. No, you dont want this.

Id actually rather we have multiple viable options to choose from depending on playstyle, build, weapon, and personal preference than 1 or 2 single "correct" choices for melee arcanes that you should just be using all the time no matter what.

What is that mesa clip trying to prove? Like what does my glyph have to do with this? Look man im not trying to attack you here, but i really dont see what that has to do with anything. You know what this conversation reminds me of? When a car guy says something like, "Honda civics are slow". But somebody somewhere took a honda civic and they replaced the whole engine, and then they added a twin turbo system, and then they added nos, and then they did a weight reduction, and then they took the entire engine down to practically its natural elements and re built it using different internals and components so it can run like 80psi of boost at 20,000 RPM. So somebody gets offended by the statement "honda civics are slow" and and shoves this example in everyones face like "aha! Well heres a honda civic and it isnt slow! So youre wrong!". Like bruh. So you group a bunch of enemies together with ensnare which effectively turns the ai completely off and gives you a stealth damage bonus and you prime everything with whatever secondary built for priming everything. Its like you think nobody else knows what priming is or stealth damage is or has any understanding of how melee damage calculation works. If your point is "melee is still good post nerfs" i can easily point out as good as that is, *its still nerfed*. And then we can have the obvious conversation about what damage output and game balance should or shouldnt be and whether or not it was really in the best interest of the game for condition overload to scale multiplicatively off of itself and for blood rush to scale multiplicatively off of other crit chance mods, But the key point in this thread that i agree with more than anything is that alot of stances feel wonky. Specifically because alot of melee stances have involuntary forced movement built into them that will make you feel like youre "randomly" (i know its not random) leap past your target and then have to potentially turn around just to attack them again, But at the same time you have stances like blind justice that will happily let you stand in one spot and keep hitting the same enemy as many times as you need to without that problem. Hell i still feel like its silly that there are certain weapons with certain stances that can be swung around freely in a full sprint without affecting movement at all, you just keep swinging, but others cant. There are *alot* of melee weapons that i dont like using not just because the stats are bad (they arent), or the weapon isnt "cool", but just because the stances feel wonky. Looking at you rapiers. Looking at you reaper prime. Truthfully, i actually think warframe is generally in a better place now. Im glad that it feels like so many options are viable now, vs feeling like you *have to* do things a certain way or youre just doing it wrong. I just think animations could use some tweaks related to movement.

I agree with your assessment that the video he showed amounts to cherry picking. Kinda set yourself up on this one. Let's start with the fact that level cap content is irrelevant to the vast majority of players. You know dang well you gotta be in a mission for quite awhile just to even get those enemies to spawn, and you also know there's no real compelling reason to bother with that. So most people dont. Level 100-200 steel path enemies are a much more relevant metric to more people because thats something that players are far more likely to realistically encounter. Yes, min maxed melee builds could absolutely get somebody across the finish line. But especially during the AOE meta so could other things for alot less effort. "Effort" both in terms of "skill" and gear check. I really dont think you can objectively say the nerfs to melee were "irrelevant" when the overal differences in DPS were/are significant. I remember this well. Literally why bother shooting enemies with a primer and then meleeing them when you could just spam kuva bramma or something and just blow everything up at once. *could you*? Sure! But there wasnt really a point. Just like it was why bother using single target weapons like tiberon prime. Because even if tiberon prime could be a 1 shot instant kill you're still shooting enemies 1 at a time instead of clearing a whole group at once.

I do think some frames/abilities could use a touch up because they're either outdated or just not relevant, but going as far as to say "most frames dont scale well" i think is a strong choice of words. Most frames are viable, imo. And no i dont just mean the "well technically it CAN viable" i mean "good enough that theres a point to using it even if its not strictly the most optimal. If i were to make a tier list on a scale of 1-10, with 1 being "this frame brings absolutely nothing to the table, and 10 being the absolute best, i actually think most frames are in the 7-10 range. Probably concentrated more around the 8 mark. Theres some pretty subjective opinion in there, but i think we can all agree that at least its more stratified than warframe *used to be*.

Are you suggesting that frames do not already have scaling and/or are not relevant in steel path? Those arent entitely seperable concepts. Exactly this. I mean seriously, basically every loot based game ever is built around the principle of "higher level activities have the best loot" and "earn stuff to make the higher activities doable/easier".