Fix T5 cetus bounties.

[Vinceant]

Ok, seriously, why are these the hardest things in the game? Everything hits way way harder, is significantly tougher, and the spawns are so random you can't easily deal with them sometimes, that it makes arbitrations seem relaxing. I've taken Sedna defense to wave 90 before, and T5 bounties are harder to consistently deal with.

First of all, the damage output on the plains at T5 is completely bonkers. Mesa Prime, with 95% damage resistance and  adaptation, struggles to stay alive. Oberon has no hope of doing so. Hildryn even can't take the heat out there. I can tank level 700 enemies, but not level 50 stuff on the plains? That's just broken.

Second of all, fix the damned gunships. You have to kill the stupid turrets, twice, to get them to leave. The turrets are microscopic. And the health bar for them isn't anywhere near where you need to shoot. The fact that these things exist means you literally can't take a shotgun onto the plains, and they shred every single frame in the game regardless of toughness. And, with the way they move, if they make a strafing run and don't allow you to take cover then you just die. Make them less accurate, make the turrets hitbox bigger, and make the turrets die quicker.

Thirdly, normalize the spawns and adjust them for the amount of players. There are times where you have 2 enemies spawning, and it's boring, then there are times when you have 50 appear out of nowhere and you just die. A bit of unpredictability is fine, but sometimes you just get overwhelmed regardless of how well you might have played. Then, sometimes you lose objectives because not enough things spawned. 

T5 cetus bounties maybe shouldn't be easy, but they sure as hell shouldn't be harder than breaking the game on endless defense. Level 700 enemies aren't supposed to be encountered in normal play, T5 bounties are.

[Walkampf]

T5 bounties are hardly the hardest content of Warframe.

vor 4 Minuten schrieb Vinceant:

The fact that these things exist means you literally can't take a shotgun onto the plains,

In fact, you can literally take a shotgun to the plains, sure, it might be a less than ideal weapon, but you literally can.

However, you literally don't now, what the word literally means.

vor 5 Minuten schrieb Vinceant:

I can tank level 700 enemies,

I honestly think you are simply lying in oder to come up with a point.

[(PSN)Hikuro-93]

Improving yourself? Nope.

Make the game easier for you? Yup.

 

Also, on the shotgun point. Damage reduction with range, do you know what it is? They are meant for close range. There's a reason Tigris isn't the best sniper anymore. And that snipers tend to be better there.

Then there's elements and other such stats. This is the kind of mode where you might want to mod for the enemy's weakness if not taking meta "1-shot-the-living-hell-out-of-the-game" weapons.

Edited September 6, 2019 by (PS4)Hikuro-93

[(XBOX)Zweimander]

If you think that T5 cetus bounties are the toughest thing in the game you just suck at the game then. Thats all I gotta say on that. Go to the moantain to train and come back when your less of a scrubba dubba doo XD

[(XBOX)Skippy575]

-Claims they can tank level 700 enemies

-Also claims they can't handle level 50 enemies on the Plains

[kgabor]

5 hours ago, Vinceant said:

First of all, the damage output on the plains at T5 is completely bonkers. Mesa Prime, with 95% damage resistance and  adaptation, struggles to stay alive. Oberon has no hope of doing so. Hildryn even can't take the heat out there. I can tank level 700 enemies, but not level 50 stuff on the plains? That's just broken.

*laughs in Banshee*

The only thing i find somewhat unbalanced in favor of the enemy mobs are the Ogmas that take too many hits to kill without a buffer frame that can hit them with its abilities and even they are avoidable, if hard to avoid. (operators can help you there)

I hit the engines with my sniper/Euphona/bow and it takes barely any damage due to its armor scaling, so i have to bring my Corrosive Akstiletto Prime or something similar every time i want to deal with them. (again, you can ignore them and watch them so you can avoid their rockets with the operator)

On the other hand, frames that already trivialize bounties, like Volt and Chroma can easily oneshot them.

[(PSN)Quantaminum]

What are you going on about?

If you can do long runs in defense, but have a hard time in bounties, that probably means you're experienced in defense, but not in bounties.

Spawns are already adjusted to the amount of players in bounties.

The gunship turrets are small, true, but they are very squishy as well and their HP appear right above them when you shoot them. You can just keep moving to avoid being gunned down.

If you're having such a bad time in the plains, maybe consider using meta frames for bounties.

Zephyr trivializes bounties so much. She just doesn't care about gunships, turrets, missiles.

She depletes it all.

 

The only time I've ever saw a lack of spawns that heavily affected bounties was in Vallis (solo), in one of those where you need to kill a specific unit.

[kgabor]

Btw. I wonder how you built Mesa if it can't survive in Plains bounties.

Shatter Shield+a single EHP mod should be enough to take a few hits at least, from most regular enemies.

Iirc. it should also scale with armor and affect shields, and if you absolutely need it, you can also use Arcane Guardian or Adaptation. (but really, its EHP with just Shatter Shield is broken enough already)

[Kwikwilyaqa]

When you ramble too much people start to pick things to criticize when there is real value behind. This is totally true:

7 hours ago, Vinceant said:

(...)Then, sometimes you lose objectives because not enough things spawned.

I lost way to many bounties just because things stopped working. But bugs need conditions to be reported - so they are able to replicate and finally fix the thing (but the real "fix" to the grineer is when DE finally make a move in 2032 and fix the armor scaling).

Now serious, Mesa, Oberon and Hildryn can't die on the plain no matter how much you try if you have them modded right (and is not facetanking the whole plains). Hildryn can be kinda stupid to keep up with all the slashes and toxin procs (from god knows how many sources) but you can easily clean any status effect with her 2 and a well modded MOA ou sentinel can buff and restore shields when needed (no pets for Hildryn, leave the cat/dogo home).

Now, IF you even know what a grineer lvl 700 is, the plains is trivial AF no matter what frame ur using.

[Vinceant]

I question whether or not people have actually done defense on Hydron to wave 80+. It's not that hard to deal with. First time I did it I was on a Valkyr without umbral mods, and no, you can't face tank up there, but you aren't getting instasplatted either.

8 hours ago, Walkampf said:

T5 bounties are hardly the hardest content of Warframe.

In fact, you can literally take a shotgun to the plains, sure, it might be a less than ideal weapon, but you literally can.

However, you literally don't now, what the word literally means.

I honestly think you are simply lying in oder to come up with a point.

Good luck dealing with gunship strafing runs with only a shotgun. Have fun with your deaths.

2 hours ago, kgabor said:

*laughs in Banshee*

The only thing i find somewhat unbalanced in favor of the enemy mobs are the Ogmas that take too many hits to kill without a buffer frame that can hit them with its abilities and even they are avoidable, if hard to avoid. (operators can help you there)

I hit the engines with my sniper/Euphona/bow and it takes barely any damage due to its armor scaling, so i have to bring my Corrosive Akstiletto Prime or something similar every time i want to deal with them. (again, you can ignore them and watch them so you can avoid their rockets with the operator)

On the other hand, frames that already trivialize bounties, like Volt and Chroma can easily oneshot them.

Can't take a sniper out there alone, you'd never be able to clear the random crowds that spawn with it. Sure I could make a gunship killing build with Vectis or Lanka or Rubico or something, but that sounds painful to try and kill 20+ enemies in <5-10 seconds with.

My Scourge is very effective at everything except it requires luck to deal with the gunships. They have to move in ideal ways to allow the bolts to hit them. I don't know that I could reliably hit the turrets with a pistol ever, because they are only a few pixels large without zoom, and you'd have to be pinpoint accurate.

1 hour ago, (PS4)Quantaminum said:

What are you going on about?

If you can do long runs in defense, but have a hard time in bounties, that probably means you're experienced in defense, but not in bounties.

Spawns are already adjusted to the amount of players in bounties.

The gunship turrets are small, true, but they are very squishy as well and their HP appear right above them when you shoot them. You can just keep moving to avoid being gunned down.

If you're having such a bad time in the plains, maybe consider using meta frames for bounties.

Zephyr trivializes bounties so much. She just doesn't care about gunships, turrets, missiles.

She depletes it all.

 

The only time I've ever saw a lack of spawns that heavily affected bounties was in Vallis (solo), in one of those where you need to kill a specific unit.

The HP bar for the turrets on gunships is bugged. It doesn't appear near the turret. Makes it way harder to hit them. Also, they aren't very squishy at all, and you can't strip their armor.

And I did switch to a meta frame, with a build people gave me. I tried Mesa Prime. It wasn't bad, but she still died pretty regularly to the gunship barrages. Shatter shield apparently doesn't work against aoe. 😞 She was boring anyway.

48 minutes ago, Kwikwilyaqa said:

When you ramble too much people start to pick things to criticize when there is real value behind. This is totally true:

I lost way to many bounties just because things stopped working. But bugs need conditions to be reported - so they are able to replicate and finally fix the thing (but the real "fix" to the grineer is when DE finally make a move in 2032 and fix the armor scaling).

Now serious, Mesa, Oberon and Hildryn can't die on the plain no matter how much you try if you have them modded right (and is not facetanking the whole plains). Hildryn can be kinda stupid to keep up with all the slashes and toxin procs (from god knows how many sources) but you can easily clean any status effect with her 2 and a well modded MOA ou sentinel can buff and restore shields when needed (no pets for Hildryn, leave the cat/dogo home).

Now, IF you even know what a grineer lvl 700 is, the plains is trivial AF no matter what frame ur using.

Last night I did the infested excavation arbitration on my Hildryn. Had a pug group. We went an hour. I did just fine. And infested is the hardest thing to fight against as Hildy. I haven't taken her to wave 80+ on Hydron, only Valkyr, but I have taken my Hildy to level 100-200 stuff and easily survived. Her build is very functional, and I don't even have the god arcanes that make her about twice as tanky.

On the plains though, Hildy can easily get overwhelmed when 1-2 gunships spawn, give you no cover to retreat to, and you have to be able to face tank them to shoot them. Otherwise they never leave until you die.

And yes, her 2 is amazing. It's the thing that makes her work at all. It's almost overpowered.

I don't have a Moa though, haven't reached rank 5 orb vallis yet. I'll get there soon. I do wonder about a pet with link shields though.

Mesa can do the T5 stuff, but she is squishy against all the aoe. And can get bumrushed and instagibbed just like anyone else.

I haven't run Oberon in awhile out there, but he was having the same issues. Oberon is a little underpowered as a healer/tank in the current game, but he does well for most normal content on the starmap and even arbitrations.

Keeping a sentinel alive out there though, is borderline impossible in a lot of situations. It's basically required that you use Djinn with his respawn mod or you will never have vacuum.

[Kwikwilyaqa]

6 minutes ago, Vinceant said:

(...)

Last night I did the infested excavation arbitration on my Hildryn. Had a pug group. We went an hour. I did just fine. And infested is the hardest thing to fight against as Hildy. I haven't taken her to wave 80+ on Hydron, only Valkyr, but I have taken my Hildy to level 100-200 stuff and easily survived. Her build is very functional, and I don't even have the god arcanes that make her about twice as tanky.

(...)

 

Hildryn = Arcane Aegis + Arcane Barrier + Sentinel. And she is not adequate to fight infested. Is almost as like as bringing a fork to a gunfight, you will die. Corpus > Grineer, never infested (the first venomous you can't see and GG bois - and since they are mostly flesh, you don't have armor/shield to pillage what makes all her abilities useless since you can't keep up with the shield drain).

[(PSN)Quantaminum]

4 minutes ago, Vinceant said:

The HP bar for the turrets on gunships is bugged. It doesn't appear near the turret. Makes it way harder to hit them. Also, they aren't very squishy at all, and you can't strip their armor.

And I did switch to a meta frame, with a build people gave me. I tried Mesa Prime. It wasn't bad, but she still died pretty regularly to the gunship barrages. Shatter shield apparently doesn't work against aoe. 😞 She was boring anyway.

They are squishy. At the very least, they aren't as tanky as the gunship. I used to level up guns in the plains for the sake of multitask, and even a 0-forma no-catalyst gun could destroy the turret quickly enough.

Mesa is good, but there are better options. Also, the gunship that drops bomb, you can easily dodge them by just bullet-jumping up and gliding, or void dashing up. The bombs will hit the ground and not deal damage to you.

Try Zephyr.

Taking "no damage" beats "taking damage".

[kgabor]

6 minutes ago, Kwikwilyaqa said:

Is almost as like as bringing a fork to a gunfight, you will die.

Oi, do you have a loicense for that op fork, m8?

[Vinceant]

55 minutes ago, Kwikwilyaqa said:

 

Hildryn = Arcane Aegis + Arcane Barrier + Sentinel. And she is not adequate to fight infested. Is almost as like as bringing a fork to a gunfight, you will die. Corpus > Grineer, never infested (the first venomous you can't see and GG bois - and since they are mostly flesh, you don't have armor/shield to pillage what makes all her abilities useless since you can't keep up with the shield drain).

I wouldn't call constant group wide cleanses useless against infested, but you're not wrong, there's not much to strip, so gaining overshields doesn't happen often. I didn't actually mean to bring Hildy in there, I just queued on the wrong frame and made the best of it. Valk or Oberon would've been far superior.

56 minutes ago, (PS4)Quantaminum said:

They are squishy. At the very least, they aren't as tanky as the gunship. I used to level up guns in the plains for the sake of multitask, and even a 0-forma no-catalyst gun could destroy the turret quickly enough.

Mesa is good, but there are better options. Also, the gunship that drops bomb, you can easily dodge them by just bullet-jumping up and gliding, or void dashing up. The bombs will hit the ground and not deal damage to you.

Try Zephyr.

Taking "no damage" beats "taking damage".

I'll have to try Zephyr. What is it that Zephyr does that makes this easier?

Mesa was good at clearing crowds, so I guess I could take a sniper with her, but the jump and 4 gameplay loop got super boring real fast.

For my other tanks, I guess I need a secondary that is equivalent to a sniper, so I can somehow snipe the 3 pixel wide turret without zoom. -_-

[(PSN)Quantaminum]

24 minutes ago, Vinceant said:

I'll have to try Zephyr. What is it that Zephyr does that makes this easier?

1 is great to move between objectives.

3 depletes enemy fire, both projectiles (missiles, napalms and nox's toxic bubbles) or hitscan (turrets, snipers, among others), regardless of distance. Mod for duration and positive range (for explosive projectile). You simply can't be touched by enemy fire. They need to go melee against you.

4 can be modded for damage, but I prefer CC. Don't forget that the tornadoes will spread the damage you deal to them to the enemies it has caught. Aiming will move the closest tornado to the aim reticle.

Another general tip for you, always destroy the turrets/mortars in enemy encampments.

Enemy encampments can have 3 types of automated machines. 1) Fires missiles against AW; 2) Fires mortars against ground enemies; and 3) Keeps shooting bullets non-stop.

You'd be scared watching people getting bombarded and killed by mortars for 3min+ non-stop, but yet they never decide to kill/destroy whatever is shooting mortars at them.

A great deal of survival in the plains is being aware of your surroundings. That goes from setting priority targets to kill asap (turrets, mortars, napalms, snipers) to paying attention to sound cues of airships spawning or mortars firing.

Edited September 6, 2019 by (PS4)Quantaminum

[Vinceant]

Yeah, I try and kill the turrets whenever possible. The mortar can fire from miles away though. Also those turrets are TOUGH. Take like 5-10 seconds of focused fire and can wreck you if you're not careful. They also cannot be armor stripped by any normal means.

[(NSW)Edcaous]

Hey, I always have a lot more trouble with Cetus bounties, but not with staying alive. Its that one objective where it asks you to "liberate the camp." I can never defeat enough enemies to keep my control level up, unless I'm playing in a group. (or if I'm playing Mesa)

For some reason, that always fails me the bounty whenever I'm doing it solo.

I'm not sure why I'm so bad at Cetus bounties when I can do Fortuna ones just fine.

[(XBOX)Zweimander]

And his post on toxicity is gone now. Not surprising but it was fun to watch them squirm under the pressure of everybody's facts XD

[Vinceant]

Uh, ok mate. "everybody's facts" of what? arguing how uber pro they are and how noobish I am? Right. Go troll somewhere else please.

[Vinceant]

So, for the record, somebody on here had the decency to reach across the aisle of an internet argument and hear me out, and I showed him what I was talking about and guess what?! He now believes me. He watched me trounce Orb Vallis T5, but get instawrecked by gunships on the plains.

He also saw proof positive that I ain't lying about wave 90 Hydron. So the people calling me a liar about that can go eat their own feet.

Pretty sad that my thread about toxicity was removed without comment, but people are allowed to call me a liar and a troll for making verifiable statements.

[Uhkretor]

On 2019-09-06 at 4:28 PM, (XB1)Skippy575 said:

-Claims they can tank level 700 enemies

-Also claims they can't handle level 50 enemies on the Plains

^ This is a fact... I'm just like this gif right now...

On 2019-09-06 at 4:28 PM, (XB1)Skippy575 said:

-Claims they can tank level 700 enemies

-Also claims they can't handle level 50 enemies on the Plains

... Considering that DE already tweaked those, together with Orb Vallis, to match averagely similar units of the same level...

On 2019-09-06 at 4:28 PM, (XB1)Skippy575 said:

^ ... seriously?

Edit: On top of that, its the 2nd topic you've created, as far as I know, about it in the same day... Seriously?

Edited September 8, 2019 by Uhkretor

[Vinceant]

This is the only topic I created on this topic. I have no idea what you’re talking about.

[Uhkretor]

34 minutes ago, Vinceant said:

This is the only topic I created on this topic.

Must've been a topic that was deleted, because I remember telling on it that

... I don't understand how T5 Cetus Bounties are difficult...

Edit: let me check my browser history...

Edit 2: Found the link, but its a deleted/restricted topic now... "toxic portions of this community have really frustrated me lately help me prove that they are the minority" was the topic name. The OP post was pretty much the same one as the one here.

Edited September 8, 2019 by Uhkretor

[Vinceant]

I did start another thread, but not about T5 bounties. It was about the toxicity of the community. And then the toxic trolls invaded and it was removed.

[Uhkretor]

5 minutes ago, Uhkretor said:

The OP post was pretty much the same one in content as the one here.

However, you inserted the toxicity factor... It was bound to be removed...

 

Edit: However, my doubt is still present. I still don't know how T5 Cetus Bounties are hard...

Edited September 8, 2019 by Uhkretor