Operator bad?

[vanaukas]

9 minutes ago, 0_The_F00l said:

Too vague. 

"will attempt to do 1 hour solo survival on mot without dying once (or dying max 3 times) using exclusively my operator" is a better objective, has clear success criteria and has a location with mix of enemies - you can make up your own of course. 

Additional sub objectives:

Don't use any life support towers, 

Keep life support above 50% at all times

Don't let kubrow be downed. 

 

Again just examples , but you get the idea. 

That is a pretty nice idea indeed, I didn't thought about it.. I was pretty sad because I was trying to do it on Arbi - Random PUB just to add comparison but then I realized there are too much things added due the composition (as an example, a mag appeared on a random def arbi grineer and then they don't have armor at all). I have 3 videos but they are so different (they have 3 diferents configs for each one) that I can't call it a test really. I'm going to take your idea and do similar test in different kind of missions. Thank you.

[Mr.Ghrin]

This guy repeating himself over and over is annoying, first off

 

Secondly, operators are seen as bad because they're squishy and they need to rely on dashing/invisibility to not die. If you were running around with no invis, Amp only and no dashing, I would respect you completely and even give you plat (jk, plat is expensive S#&$) 

 

Thirdly, the fact that you didn't know umbra's damage stacks to yours makes me think you're not really the type of player that cares about how the game works rather than just big numbers 

 

Maybe learn the game before you come to the forums like "I do damage and I'm better than these people that don't have what I have lol" 

[vanaukas]

3 hours ago, Phoenix42Lord42 said:

This guy repeating himself over and over is annoying, first off

 

Secondly, operators are seen as bad because they're squishy and they need to rely on dashing/invisibility to not die. If you were running around with no invis, Amp only and no dashing, I would respect you completely and even give you plat (jk, plat is expensive S#&$) 

 

Thirdly, the fact that you didn't know umbra's damage stacks to yours makes me think you're not really the type of player that cares about how the game works rather than just big numbers 

 

Maybe learn the game before you come to the forums like "I do damage and I'm better than these people that don't have what I have lol" 

So, warframes shouldnt rely on their abilities based on your "reasoning", neither mods nor weapons. I didnt know because I've tested it long ago, things werent tracked and, as you may noticed, I didnt know that things had changed. Forgive for my sins, overlord.

Also, having more dmg or better statics doesnt make me "good than the others", Ive never stated that. Ive stated "operator bad? Not at all". I didnt die because i have self regen and we were able to reach that point because our defensive abilities, thas why im saying tere was a frost and 2 khoras and didnt say "hey was me who carried the entire thing". Dont reflect your issues on me.

Edited September 10, 2019 by xHeretic

[(PSN)Kakurine2]

As a casual person that doesn't regularly fight 200 plus enemies but has collected most of the games items at this point.  And most of my operater trees are maxed and i have 5 solid amps built for different functions.

Operater mode is just ok compared to playing my warframe. And visually operaters are not as good as warframes.

Maybe the paradox will overhaul them to be better.

I mainly just use the operater for healing or specific boss mechanics.

Edited September 10, 2019 by (PS4)Kakurine2

[(PSN)Dishinshoryuken]

It ain't my slice of pie to be proud of the Void Demon. It's not my way to use them as more than a healing tool that gets the things they were made for done.

I always wonder what would we do if there were no Void Demons and the Eidolons were around. What weapons could we use to break them down? None, right......which means DE put in the Eidolons as the ONLY way to stop them is Void Demons. We can beat Sentinels without them. We can topple Orb mother's without them. But Eidolons....gotta have em for that.

I detest them as I gotta extra click to get past them and to my Warframe abilities. And yet there are those who adore them and dress them up for prom and all that other junk.

Congratz on using it.

Next time do this without your Warframe moving from the beginning spot and not being Umbra. That will be something.

[vanaukas]

14 minutes ago, (PS4)Dishinshoryuken said:

Next time do this without your Warframe moving from the beginning spot and not being Umbra. That will be something.

That would ruin the spawn of enemies, sadly. So, will be something? Yes... Somehting bad for the mission.

[vanaukas]

3 hours ago, (PS4)Kakurine2 said:

Operater mode is just ok compared to playing my warframe. And visually operaters are not as good as warframes.

Maybe the paradox will overhaul them to be better.

Yeah, operator can't be compared to frames, frames are much better, but visually is a matter of taste imo, I like the way my operator looks, even more than most frames.
And I'm pretty sure there will be an operator overhaul on duviri, changing some mechanics are something DE has said in the past (iirc the melee system they wanna put on them) and because the lack of operator stuff related sicne the sacrifice i'm expecting to hear something when duvivi arrives

[(PSN)Kakurine2]

I'll like operator mode more if the creator gets overhauled with proper sliders when we do the duviri paradox.

No more face blend bs.  Select gender.  Then choose age range. Then give me sliders to customize every pixel.

Absolute freedom for all i say.

No more child tenno please. Transference should literally let the tenno take whatever form they wish at will.

My current tenno is ok visually but would be better as an adult.  And mechanically they are just not mobile enough compared to the warframes.

Edited September 11, 2019 by (PS4)Kakurine2

[vanaukas]

1 hour ago, (PS4)Kakurine2 said:

I'll like operator mode more if the creator gets overhauled with proper sliders when we do the duviri paradox.

No more face blend bs.  Select gender.  Then choose age range. Then give me sliders to customize every pixel.

Absolute freedom for all i say.

No more child tenno please. Transference should literally let the tenno take whatever form they wish at will.

My current tenno is ok visually but would be better as an adult.  And mechanically they are just not mobile enough compared to the warframes.

I doubt if DE would do something like that but i've read so many request for a customization like skyrim that maybe they'll think about it.

I don't get at all the hate for using a teen, that break the sense of "overpower beign" that a space ninja gives? I couldn't care less about it tbh, a child, teen, adult ro elder, it's the operator and that's the gameplay that I love (i'm speaking for me, to be clear).

________

I've just finished 3 endurance runs in Mot with 3 setups that I liked, I'm gonna upload the results in a new thread because this has so many pages but i'm gonna post it here too (the new thread) if someone it's interested. Magus Lockdown r3 was the absolute winner if someone is wondering about that, both damage and range of CC are invaluable to make the operator what he is, but I really don't mind if they nerf the damage done vs mantaining the same range and same lockdown time tbh.

Edited September 11, 2019 by xHeretic

[vanaukas]

First endurance test: 

 

[SneakyErvin]

OP you are missing several things in your tests.

1. Poor mission choice for such a test. Excal is a S#&$ frame for excav where the real point is just keeping the extractors safe.

2. You played in a group where the other 3 very likely did the actual mission at hand instead of goofing around as operator. 1300 kills isnt really alot during 1.5 hours if your intent is going as damage.

3. There is a chance they've gotten more kills than you and had their charts roll over.

Edited September 11, 2019 by SneakyErvin

[vanaukas]

1 minute ago, SneakyErvin said:

OP you are missing several things in your tests.

1. Poor mission choice for such a test. Excal is a S#&$ frame for excav where the real point is just keeping the extractors safe.

2. You played in a group where the other 3 very likely did the actual mission at hand instead of goofing around as operator. 1300 kills isnt really alot during 1.5 hours if your intent is going as damage.

3. There is a chance they've gotten more kills than you and had their charts roll over.

Check my excal build, 50 m of 30 secs of full blind, plus the vectis, plus im vazarin I HEAL the excavators. Also, I've started to do new test, mayeb you can check them out 

[SneakyErvin]

5 minutes ago, xHeretic said:

Check my excal build, 50 m of 30 secs of full blind, plus the vectis, plus im vazarin I HEAL the excavators. Also, I've started to do new test, mayeb you can check them out 

He is still a bad frame for it. 50m blind just means alot of fuzzing around to find battery carriers, which in turn means leaving the extractor. 

[vanaukas]

1 minute ago, SneakyErvin said:

He is still a bad frame for it. 50m blind just means alot of fuzzing around to find battery carriers, which in turn means leaving the extractor. 

Isn't, but ok, you probably know it better as an operator/umbra player. 

[SneakyErvin]

Just now, xHeretic said:

Isn't, but ok, you probably know it better as an operator/umbra player. 

Anything with a 50m 30sec shutdown is bad since it takes the mission down to a crawl. You can achieve the same shutdown with Loki without slowing the game down or being forced to go seek out carriers.

Excal, like most frame is a middle of the pack frame for excav. Vauban, Loki, Limbo, Nyx, Khora, Frost and Gara just do it all so much better. Especially if you join with randoms where every frame counts far more incase someone brings a bad pick.

[vanaukas]

Just now, SneakyErvin said:

Anything with a 50m 30sec shutdown is bad since it takes the mission down to a crawl. You can achieve the same shutdown with Loki without slowing the game down or being forced to go seek out carriers.

Excal, like most frame is a middle of the pack frame for excav. Vauban, Loki, Limbo, Nyx, Khora, Frost and Gara just do it all so much better. Especially if you join with randoms where every frame counts far more incase someone brings a bad pick.

I dont agree with you, but ok, i'll take note next time... Maybe tag you when I try excavation as a solo operator with videos of proof? Would be good for you?
And, like if infested arbitration wasn't full of mobes every second haha, even if I was spaming 2 (and umbra alone too) they kept coming in hordes. Do you have any proof of better performance in a arbie exca with a similar time? Or any proof on "how I slowed down things"? Would be nice data to improve myself

[SneakyErvin]

4 minutes ago, xHeretic said:

I dont agree with you, but ok, i'll take note next time... Maybe tag you when I try excavation as a solo operator with videos of proof? Would be good for you?
And, like if infested arbitration wasn't full of mobes every second haha, even if I was spaming 2 (and umbra alone too) they kept coming in hordes. Do you have any proof of better performance in a arbie exca with a similar time? Or any proof on "how I slowed down things"? Would be nice data to improve myself

That makes me question your choice even more when it was infested you faced. Why not just bring an actual dps frame to wipe them out? Like Saryn, Mesa, Volt or Enox? The operator+umbra combo just wont perform on the level of actual frames outside of possibly the index. 

Any proof? No I dont save such thing for just-in-case situations. As for proof for slowing it down? Anytime your Umbra auto-casts a howl when it isnt needed.

[vanaukas]

1 minute ago, SneakyErvin said:

That makes me question your choice even more when it was infested you faced. Why not just bring an actual dps frame to wipe them out? Like Saryn, Mesa, Volt or Enox? The operator+umbra combo just wont perform on the level of actual frames outside of possibly the index. 

Any proof? No I dont save such thing for just-in-case situations. As for proof for slowing it down? Anytime your Umbra auto-casts a howl when it isnt needed.

Because I wanted to play as operator with umbra, that's why, the option is there, if you wanna go full meta, go ahead, but please, if you don't what are you talking about, at least read. Magus lockdown + virtuos spike + umbra with a good vectis and paracesis + big radio + vazarin is more than enough to run excavations, but I can see you are the kind of people who thinks "The operator+umbra combo just wont perform on the level of actual frames outside of possibly the index. ". I can do pretty much everything as umbra/operator, almsot everyone in the thread knows the potential of the combo and how much damage can be done. When you have something more than assumptions on gameplay you'll never tried, hit me up and maybe we can have a decent conversation based on data, not just "I just know and I said so".

[White_Matter]

On 2019-09-09 at 1:17 AM, (XB1)GearsMatrix301 said:

So how much time, effort, and focus farming was required to reach this? Because honestly the biggest problem with Operators is that they require far more investment than frames. And they aren’t exactly the most rewarding for that investment.

What this man said. I mean I have most mandatory things for my operators(way bound passives and maybe some more) but I'm pretty skeptic about investing more than that, because you play 99% of the game with a frame. That 1% can become significant at times, but again, it is just 1%.

[844448]

14 hours ago, (PS4)Kakurine2 said:

As a casual person that doesn't regularly fight 200 plus enemies but has collected most of the games items at this point.  And most of my operater trees are maxed and i have 5 solid amps built for different functions.

Operater mode is just ok compared to playing my warframe. And visually operaters are not as good as warframes.

Maybe the paradox will overhaul them to be better.

I mainly just use the operater for healing or specific boss mechanics.

I disagree, I'm sort of loving my operator to the point I see her as my "digital daughter", dressing her with cool outfits, making her look beautiful (They're good looking enough at the moment if you know how to make them look good), making equipments for her to be a stronger tenno

[Mazzuco_]

3 hours ago, xHeretic said:

Nice so you have some kind of psychic power to see things that you couldn't because you werent there? Frost even lost some points because he was rushing at first, later we go  2and 2 and later was imposible for me heal all the excavators (because yes, in arbitration frost buble sometimes doesnt work at all, as all warframe abilities because the arbitration osprey), so we went together until the end when I wasnt able to heal anyone but the excavator itself. That's why I survived while the rest couldnt, I was the only healer. I don't care of "the rage of the community" if they are people like you, what you are going to do, writting on me on caps locks trying to indimidate me or full my comments with "haha" reacts? Trying to insult me like a child? I'll keep playing as operator as much as I want and you can't do anything about it. Rage what you want.

2 Khora + 1 Frost
But ... did you make the defense alone? OK....
The prints clearly show that they carried you. Why are you bragging? You're just embarrassing, lol.
Be less arrogant.

[SneakyErvin]

6 hours ago, xHeretic said:

Because I wanted to play as operator with umbra, that's why, the option is there, if you wanna go full meta, go ahead, but please, if you don't what are you talking about, at least read. Magus lockdown + virtuos spike + umbra with a good vectis and paracesis + big radio + vazarin is more than enough to run excavations, but I can see you are the kind of people who thinks "The operator+umbra combo just wont perform on the level of actual frames outside of possibly the index. ". I can do pretty much everything as umbra/operator, almsot everyone in the thread knows the potential of the combo and how much damage can be done. When you have something more than assumptions on gameplay you'll never tried, hit me up and maybe we can have a decent conversation based on data, not just "I just know and I said so".

There is no data to be discussed. Even what you posted in the OP is low when it comes to doing a pure dps job in something as crowded as excav, even more so in infested. Parts of the group have already called you out on your participation. If you would have brought an actual dps frame to wipe things out effectively for your team you wouldnt be sitting at a measly 1300 kills after one and a half hour. You would also be able to stick perfectly well with your team while still blowing things up effectively.

To make it really clear for you. You took a dps setup, brought it to a very defensive game mode, ended up with 3 actual defense frames fitting for the mode and then you go to the forums and base your "data" on that. And your "data" isnt even very impressive for something that is supposed to simply do the killing.

And after looking at your answer to the guy who had you in his group it looks like you screwed the group over. Yet you somehow manage to blame the solo Frost when it looks like the rest of the group couldnt keep the pace.

 

 

[vanaukas]

6 hours ago, White_Matter said:

What this man said. I mean I have most mandatory things for my operators(way bound passives and maybe some more) but I'm pretty skeptic about investing more than that, because you play 99% of the game with a frame. That 1% can become significant at times, but again, it is just 1%.

I mean, you can do almost most content as operator but yeah, warframes are much stronger and easier to get and build with weapons on mind and everything. The only things I don't do as operator are the orbs and eidolon fights, I even do defection as operator but to be honest i'm 90% of the time in the umbra/operator combo, I jump to the frame and kill on melee the most ptoblematic foes and hop again as operator to continuea providing support as vazarin (my main school to play as umbra/operator)

5 hours ago, 844448 said:

I disagree, I'm sort of loving my operator to the point I see her as my "digital daughter", dressing her with cool outfits, making her look beautiful (They're good looking enough at the moment if you know how to make them look good), making equipments for her to be a stronger tenno

Almost the same, i'm just attached to the operator because the years playing... The sacrifice was the moment I fell in love with excal too

[vanaukas]

4 minutes ago, Mazzuco_ said:

2 Khora + 1 Frost
But ... did you make the defense alone? OK....
The prints clearly show that they carried you. Why are you bragging? You're just embarrassing, lol.
Be less arrogant.

Where I've stated I do the defense alone? The last excavator I was full alone, they died on that point, if you can't believe it is on you. I'm not bragging, I'm just saying the truth, that's why i'm gonna do a video of arbie excavation with this combo, to give data and proof that i'm very far from useless with that combo (i can even carry 2 canister at the same time while umbra is still shooting vectis like a maniac). My mystake was not taking on account the power of umbra and maybe don't glorify my teammates, but you are already do that so whatever.
 

2 minutes ago, SneakyErvin said:

There is no data to be discussed. Even what you posted in the OP is low when it comes to doing a pure dps job in something as crowded as excav, even more so in infested. Parts of the group have already called you out on your participation. If you would have brought an actual dps frame to wipe things out effectively for your team you wouldnt be sitting at a measly 1300 kills after one and a half hour. You would also be able to stick perfectly well with your team while still blowing things up effectively.

To make it really clear for you. You took a dps setup, brought it to a very defensive game mode, ended up with 3 actual defense frames fitting for the mode and then you go to the forums and base your "data" on that. And your "data" isnt even very impressive for something that is supposed to simply do the killing.

And after looking at your answer to the guy who had you in his group it looks like you screwed the group over. Yet you somehow manage to blame the solo Frost when it looks like the rest of the group couldnt keep the pace.

Because I was not trying to get dps, my role is provide support first, I do that with huge CC radius (both umbra and operator), provide heal and carrying canister as fast as I could. I don't want to just blow things, I wanna provide support (heals to be specific) to the excavator, and that is only achieved as vazarin, because there is no warframe created that heal excavators, just vazarin. If you know about one that can heal things like that (deffense artifacts) rather than just teammates or operatives, please, point it out.

And for the guy, I didn't know it was him on the group, he was one of the khora, Frost losing some points wasn't bad an i'm not blaming him in any case, losing excavators (we lose something like 3 iirc)

I really don't get because thsio is considered bragging, i've never said I carried the thing, i've never said i've done alone this thing, i've just said: I played as opertor, providades support, was able to kill thins on 300+ lvl, was the only survivor and that is the true, if you (or everyone else) wanna do assumptions on my usefulness, go ahead, I'll still do better test to prove things like this: Operator + Umbra can do amazing things and Operator without Umbra maybe isn't that powerfull, but still can do high tier content.

[vanaukas]

Here are the screenshots properly censored again, if anyone carried the match was the god khora, she had almost all the match the higher dmg

The Duviri Paradox should be called "The Schrödinger's Operator Paradox": Beign usless for the community and at the same time beign too op because lockdown for the same community

Spoiler