People not killing lich when it spawns

[Navarc]

Didn't see this thread until now, but I actually made a thread with a few options on what could be added to counter people doing this which is sabotaging other players progress & completions of their own kuva liches if you're interested

 

[DoomFruit]

2 hours ago, ChilliPepperCatfish said:

I agree with you too on this. Just throw us into bleedout or something 😞

It's not even the "go straight to revive, do not pass go, do not collect $200" thing, it's the fact that you get killed in a cutscene after you've already won the fight. Cutscene incompetence in video games is something which fills me with seething violent rage.

[ChilliPepperCatfish]

20 hours ago, Navarchus said:

Didn't see this thread until now, but I actually made a thread with a few options on what could be added to counter people doing this which is sabotaging other players progress & completions of their own kuva liches if you're interested

Thanks, will add as I experience more!

[Tsukinoki]

On 2019-11-08 at 8:41 AM, tekmansam said:

not wanting to pointlessly level him up, making him harder for no good reason. 

I see this, and can understand this to a large degree.
Especially for some of the players who are only MR5 or 6 and already have a level 3 lich.  They can barely deal with the enemies at levels 70 to 80, how are they supposed to deal with a level 110+ lich if they just rushed them to level 5?

Especially since even though people in pubs go "Kill your lich!!!!11!!" (even if its actually the person yelling about it that owns the lich) they rarely actually help in that...and depending on the MR of the person they may just not be able to deal with a level 110 lich that they can barely tickle with their weapons.

Thing that some people need to remember is that all you need to start getting liches is complete War Within at MR5.  That's it.  And for an MR5 the lich system can be very hard, if not impossible, to actually be able to deal damage, let alone survive in.
There are tons of newer players that got a lich and now can't do anything about it.

[ChilliPepperCatfish]

1 minute ago, Tsukinoki said:

There are tons of newer players that got a lich and now can't do anything about it.

Very good point. That was actually my first thought when I stepped into the lich missions and enemies were almost Lvl 100.

However, the people I met who refused to kill their lich were all MR20+ 🤣 

Just thought about it, since most planet have boss node, maybe the lich can chill out there until it is really really mad (from us killing thralls). If they want to attempt the kill first, then go over to the boss node. Otherwise if the meter fills up, the lich will have a chance to randomly appear in the owned planet area. Kind of how like when we assassinate a boss, the stalker gets mad at us. But this time its lich rage meter. ?

It does not solve the level/damage/hp issue, but at least it would be a way to mitigate the (relatively forced) encounters for them if they play solo. That way, if they play public instead, other people can help kill the lich that spawns anyway.

[akots]

37 minutes ago, ChilliPepperCatfish said:

However, the people I met who refused to kill their lich were all MR20+ 🤣 

And the people who actively demand that you should immediately try to stab your lich are MR 10-15. This may tell something to somebody, not sure what and to whom. 😉

[Steel_Rook]

I personally believe that the "guessing" part of the Kuva Lich system is the flawed part. Personally, I'd rather the game evaluated all three of my Requiem mods at the same time and told me if I got any right - even if it didn't tell me WHICH Requiem mods I got right. That turns the guessing game into more of a "game" as you have to experiment and try to deduce which of the mods were the correct ones, and it could potentially cut it down to as few as 5-6 guesses with no additional info.

[ciTiger]

Just checking in to this.

Can't be sure cause the sample is low but I'm pretty sure DE stealth nerfed the Lich spawn rate, can't find this in any patch notes please correct me If I'm wrong.

It means they acknowledge the problem and provide a temporary band aid but I hope they have a real solution in the next patch!

Fingers crossed

[Champagne]

On 2019-11-08 at 5:49 AM, Aesthier said:

Very simple solution to this.

If a Kuva Lich spawns and is not killed or does not kill its target (within some variable time limit) then it simply poofs completely. This means that it no longer exists for that player and they will have to kill a Kuva Larvling again to spawn another Lich.

I'd love this if the weapon resets too so I don't get any more dupes lol

[Hyohakusha]

I'm a broken record at this point, but whatever. Here we go again...

If you leave your lich alone for a bit before stabbing it, it will actively convert standard grineer into thralls. Converted thralls and thralls that spawn normally have separate caps for how many of them can spawn in mission. The cap for both has already been reduced, and since the shared stab bonus no longer exists, letting liches turn grineer into thralls is the best way for everyone on the team to get their murmurs figured out faster. Your lich also stays angrier longer the more thralls you kill. By stabbing them the second they show up, you're constantly resetting their angry meter to zero, making the chance of them spawn go way down, which stops you from getting the bonus converted thralls, which makes the grind take even longer to complete, and so on, in a vicious cycle of more grind and rng.

The stab bonus isn't always 10 thralls worth, it averages out to around 4-8. You can either get 5-10 spawned thralls, plus 5-10 converted thralls and 4-8 from the lich, or you can get 5-10 spawned thralls and 4-8 from the lich.

Players yelling at people to stab their liches immediately are costing themselves and everyone else murmurs. Not only that, they have no one to blame but themselves. If you run on pub, you've given yourself a 1/4 chance for your lich to spawn, if any lich spawns at all. They could have gone solo and made it a guarantee that their lich would be the only one that can spawn, but they didn't. And then they took it out on the rest of the squad, even though they caused the problem for themselves. On top of that, since they immediately stab their lich, they're reducing the chance for them to spawn, again, creating their own problem.

The only players sabotaging anyone are the players demanding that people stab their lich immediately. If, instead of freaking out on people, they would cooperate with their team to get liches to convert as many grineer as possible BEFORE stabbing, everyone would get their murmurs done faster and their lich lists would look like mine.



Liches are puzzles, not arm-wrestling contests. If someone doesn't want to stab their lich, the only thing that's going to happen is that lich is going to convert grineer into more thralls for everyone. If you know your combination, run solo so your lich is the only lich that can spawn. This isn't directed at anyone in this thread in particular, I'm just trying to help out anyone who will actually listen and think. Use your brains, don't smash your head against a wall. And don't take your lack of understanding of lich mechanics out on other people.

[(PSN)ChaoticForce1977]

On 2019-11-12 at 3:41 PM, Hyohakusha said:

I'm a broken record at this point, but whatever. Here we go again...

If you leave your lich alone for a bit before stabbing it, it will actively convert standard grineer into thralls. Converted thralls and thralls that spawn normally have separate caps for how many of them can spawn in mission. The cap for both has already been reduced, and since the shared stab bonus no longer exists, letting liches turn grineer into thralls is the best way for everyone on the team to get their murmurs figured out faster. Your lich also stays angrier longer the more thralls you kill. By stabbing them the second they show up, you're constantly resetting their angry meter to zero, making the chance of them spawn go way down, which stops you from getting the bonus converted thralls, which makes the grind take even longer to complete, and so on, in a vicious cycle of more grind and rng.

The stab bonus isn't always 10 thralls worth, it averages out to around 4-8. You can either get 5-10 spawned thralls, plus 5-10 converted thralls and 4-8 from the lich, or you can get 5-10 spawned thralls and 4-8 from the lich.

Players yelling at people to stab their liches immediately are costing themselves and everyone else murmurs. Not only that, they have no one to blame but themselves. If you run on pub, you've given yourself a 1/4 chance for your lich to spawn, if any lich spawns at all. They could have gone solo and made it a guarantee that their lich would be the only one that can spawn, but they didn't. And then they took it out on the rest of the squad, even though they caused the problem for themselves. On top of that, since they immediately stab their lich, they're reducing the chance for them to spawn, again, creating their own problem.

The only players sabotaging anyone are the players demanding that people stab their lich immediately. If, instead of freaking out on people, they would cooperate with their team to get liches to convert as many grineer as possible BEFORE stabbing, everyone would get their murmurs done faster and their lich lists would look like mine.



Liches are puzzles, not arm-wrestling contests. If someone doesn't want to stab their lich, the only thing that's going to happen is that lich is going to convert grineer into more thralls for everyone. If you know your combination, run solo so your lich is the only lich that can spawn. This isn't directed at anyone in this thread in particular, I'm just trying to help out anyone who will actually listen and think. Use your brains, don't smash your head against a wall. And don't take your lack of understanding of lich mechanics out on other people.

Hyohakusha this has to be the best posted on this forum. I am by far thrilled with the lich system but DE said they model after Shadow of War. But the one thing DE left Is that in Shadow of War you had to go to the head nemesis lair to fight them. Why is it not set up that way for WarFrame. I damn near cursed a player out last night because he came into my game and got mad that I didn’t want to stab my lich. Which wasn’t my plan because I was Murmur farming.
 

As you said if you want to kill your lich do it solo don’t try to use a random team to help you  kill your lich. Specially if you have not made that clear in chat. No one is held to randomly stabbing their lich. By design this system is developed for another grind fest to keep us occupied. Get out there and thrall hunt till you gather all the necessary murmurs. 

Edited November 27, 2019 by (PS4)ChaoticForce1977